NFL | Jamal Adams overvalued?

[Lil Woody]

.

(USA Today Fantasy Sports) Louisiana State S Jamal Adams isn't a "game changer" and isn't likely to be selected as early in the 2017 NFL Draft as many expect, according to an NFC executive. "If you are going to be a safety who goes inside the top five, you better make a ton of plays," the executive said. "Look where Landon Collins went. Adams isn't better than Collins."

[AFJF]

Every year somebody falls...we'll know in a few weeks if it's Adams or not.

[thadude]

Can't Wait still says we should draft him over a dozen better players

[varjet]

This is baloney.  

[Mo Lew]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000798217/article/mts-notebook-jamal-adams-is-top-prospect-in-2017-nfl-draft

this...

[bitonti]

i agree with the original opinion. He's fast but not all that physically impressive. And his game of tackling and hard hits that's not the league anymore really. Hooker is taller and more relevant to the modern game. Jamal Adams top 10-15 but not top 5 wouldn't be all that shocking 

[Dinamite]

22 minutes ago, bitonti said:

i agree with the original opinion. He's fast but not all that physically impressive. And his game of tackling and hard hits that's not the league anymore really. Hooker is taller and more relevant to the modern game. Jamal Adams top 10-15 but not top 5 wouldn't be all that shocking 

Quick question regarding Adams style in your opinion.  is Adams' evaluation similar to Calvin Pryor when he was coming out? Hard hitting safety, leader, etc? I realize Adams has been consistently talked about in top 10 while Pryor was first round but not at the same level as Adams.   I am more trying to compare their styles in college and when they were in the draft.

[bitonti]

1 minute ago, Dinamite said:

Quick question regarding Adams style in your opinion.  is Adams' evaluation similar to Calvin Pryor when he was coming out? Hard hitting safety, leader, etc? I realize Adams has been consistently talked about in top 10 while Pryor was first round but not at the same level as Adams.   I am more trying to compare their styles in college and when they were in the draft.

 

in theory, yes. the comp everyone makes is Brian Dawkins. Which is awesome but Dawk was a 2nd rounder. 

[long suffering jets fan]

Every highlight film I watch with Adams shows him acting as an in the box safety, that's not what we need.  We need a free safety that can provide deep coverage, shrink the windows that an opposing QB has to throw into and can opportunistically pick off some passes.  That's Hooker.   Adams is a better version of Pryor and to be honest I have no idea if he will take better angles than Pryor.  So what's the point, to save a few mil?  Doesn't matter how fast he is, if he takes sh*tty angles.

[Sarge4Tide]

It'll be interesting to see, I'd be very surprised if he doesn't go Top 10 at least

 

[RESNewYork]

I'd rather go Josh Jones than hooker. If you watch his game highlights he lines up everywhere from box to slot to single high

[bitonti]

a different question is Would the Jets pick Adams at 6? It might be hard for them to pass. He certainly fits Mac's style of taking someone who should have gone higher.

But in terms of the roster, it is somewhat of a sideways move, trading out Pryor for Adams. The Jets don't really need a SS but need hasn't stopped Mac before. 

[thadude]

14 hours ago, bitonti said:

i agree with the original opinion. He's fast but not all that physically impressive. And his game of tackling and hard hits that's not the league anymore really. Hooker is taller and more relevant to the modern game. Jamal Adams top 10-15 but not top 5 wouldn't be all that shocking 

Great post bit

 

I wouldn't take either at 6 but if I had to choose it would be hooker

[BCJet]

14 hours ago, bitonti said:

i agree with the original opinion. He's fast but not all that physically impressive. And his game of tackling and hard hits that's not the league anymore really. Hooker is taller and more relevant to the modern game. Jamal Adams top 10-15 but not top 5 wouldn't be all that shocking 

While the "Box safety" debate is legitimate, what do you mean he isnt physically impressive?  On the field, hes been a 3 year starter who also excelled on special teams.

In shorts he is 6'0 214 (combine numbers) which is bigger than Earl Thomas (5'10 208) and almost identical to eric berry (6'0 211) and ran an avg 40 in the 4.45 area (between his 4.33 and 4.56) - what is not impressive about that size/speed ratio, especially when it is backed up with on the field play?

[Fantasy Island]

If he sucks, we will pick him.  

[bitonti]

On 4/8/2017 at 8:47 AM, BCJet said:

While the "Box safety" debate is legitimate, what do you mean he isnt physically impressive?  On the field, hes been a 3 year starter who also excelled on special teams.

In shorts he is 6'0 214 (combine numbers) which is bigger than Earl Thomas (5'10 208) and almost identical to eric berry (6'0 211) and ran an avg 40 in the 4.45 area (between his 4.33 and 4.56) - what is not impressive about that size/speed ratio, especially when it is backed up with on the field play?

 

you make a sound point I guess it depends which 40 number, the one at the combine or the one at the LSU pro day are more real. 

But yes if we forget about the 4.56 in Feb and only use the 4.38 in April he's awesome. I wonder how much of that improvement is just sprint training though. 

[SickJetFan]

9 minutes ago, bitonti said:

you make a sound point I guess it depends which 40 number, the one at the combine or the one at the LSU pro day are more real. 

But yes if we forget about the 4.56 in Feb and only use the 4.38 in April he's awesome. I wonder how much of that improvement is just sprint training though. 

Maybe that was by design...him and his agent...maybe he put the brakes on during combine wanting to run a faster time closer to draft to make more of a buzz 

[Fantasy Island]

Please don't draft Calvin Pryor the 2nd.

[NYJCAP2]

12 minutes ago, SickJetFan said:

Maybe that was by design...him and his agent...maybe he put the brakes on during combine wanting to run a faster time closer to draft to make more of a buzz 

Why even run at the combine then?

Everyone knows the pro-day 40s are always friendly times.

4.56 - 4.38 is a huge jump

[bitonti]

12 minutes ago, SickJetFan said:

Maybe that was by design...him and his agent...maybe he put the brakes on during combine wanting to run a faster time closer to draft to make more of a buzz 

The combine is in late Feb the Pro days are 6 weeks later.

Take any of these combine athletes and spend 5 figures train them in specialty gyms doing nothing but sprint training for 6 weeks, they are probably gonna get a better number after the training. 

 

[pointman]

Pryor sucks. We need a safety. Adams doesn't cover though. And his 40 time wasn't so quick until he had a pro day with his own people clocking him.

[detectivekimble]

On April 7, 2017 at 1:29 PM, varjet said:

This is baloney.  

I really, really doubt that this guy goes in the top 5.

[detectivekimble]

On April 7, 2017 at 6:32 PM, long suffering jets fan said:

Every highlight film I watch with Adams shows him acting as an in the box safety, that's not what we need.  We need a free safety that can provide deep coverage, shrink the windows that an opposing QB has to throw into and can opportunistically pick off some passes.  That's Hooker.   Adams is a better version of Pryor and to be honest I have no idea if he will take better angles than Pryor.  So what's the point, to save a few mil?  Doesn't matter how fast he is, if he takes sh*tty angles.

And in-the-box safety who runs in the 4.5s is not going in the top 5.  No ******* way.

[thadude]

On April 9, 2017 at 11:17 AM, pointman said:

Pryor sucks. We need a safety. Adams doesn't cover though. And his 40 time wasn't so quick until he had a pro day with his own people clocking him.

I wouldn't say Adams can't cover but his cover skills are not great

 

A top 6 draft pick safety better be great in coverage or its another Jets joke of a draft pick

[varjet]

8 minutes ago, thadude said:

I wouldn't say Adams can't cover but his cover skills are not great

https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft-pff-scouting-report-jamal-adams-s-lsu/

Can we really say that his cover skills are not great?  They appear to be pretty decent.

if the Jets stay at 6 they are going to commit to paying someone over $20mm for 4 years, plus an option.  They need a player that they feel is highly likely to be worth that money.

[HessStation]

On 4/7/2017 at 6:21 PM, Dinamite said:

Quick question regarding Adams style in your opinion.  is Adams' evaluation similar to Calvin Pryor when he was coming out? Hard hitting safety, leader, etc? I realize Adams has been consistently talked about in top 10 while Pryor was first round but not at the same level as Adams.   I am more trying to compare their styles in college and when they were in the draft.

Reminder Pryor was pretty much a consensus 2nd round pick by most leading up to the draft. 

[thadude]

21 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Reminder Pryor was pretty much a consensus 2nd round pick by most leading up to the draft. 

What makes Pryor a really bad bust was how many good offensive players we took over him  

[thadude]

29 minutes ago, varjet said:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft-pff-scouting-report-jamal-adams-s-lsu/

Can we really say that his cover skills are not great?  They appear to be pretty decent.

if the Jets stay at 6 they are going to commit to paying someone over $20mm for 4 years, plus an option.  They need a player that they feel is highly likely to be worth that money.

Adams can't effectively turn 180 degrees facing forward while backpedaling at full speed

 

That's what's going to get him burned in the pros

[varjet]

23 minutes ago, thadude said:

Adams can't effectively turn 180 degrees facing forward while backpedaling at full speed

 

That's what's going to get him burned in the pros

And Hooker supposedly is not a great tackler.

I think when you look at the various reports, and considering the NFL is a passing league, I think Davis, Adams and Allen slip, and Williams, Davis and Howard ascend.

The key to the top 10 is Trubisky, and who breaks down to trade with the Jets for the right to pick him.

Houston and Cleveland are the frontrunners.

[PepPep]

I am starting to think Peppers may be more what the Jets need than Hooker or Adams. Peppers, unlike either of them is a legit cover guy. He is like a Safety with a CBs cover skills. Not the greatest tackler. But that's fine if he can cover TEs and RBs and make plays in the secondary. 

Trade down with the Browns, grab Peppers at 12.  

[jetsons]

On 4/7/2017 at 6:32 PM, long suffering jets fan said:

Every highlight film I watch with Adams shows him acting as an in the box safety, that's not what we need.  We need a free safety that can provide deep coverage, shrink the windows that an opposing QB has to throw into and can opportunistically pick off some passes.  That's Hooker.   Adams is a better version of Pryor and to be honest I have no idea if he will take better angles than Pryor.  So what's the point, to save a few mil?  Doesn't matter how fast he is, if he takes sh*tty angles.

I prefer Hooker over Adams as well... we already have a semi-Adams in Pryor.

[Lil Woody]

23 minutes ago, PepPep said:

I am starting to think Peppers may be more what the Jets need than Hooker or Adams. Peppers, unlike either of them is a legit cover guy. He is like a Safety with a CBs cover skills. Not the greatest tackler. But that's fine if he can cover TEs and RBs and make plays in the secondary. 

Trade down with the Browns, grab Peppers at 12.  

Peppers at 12? How about at 45? Or not at all? I'd much rather take actual safeties like Josh Jones or Eddie Jackson or John Johnson before I take a LB/S hybrid and try to shoehorn him into a position he doesn't have all that much familiarity with. Kid can cover well, but he's still just 5'11 and while he's going to be good initially at taking away receivers out of the backfield, but are you really going to put him up against Gronk or Greg Olson or Jimmy Graham? No he'll be a nice role player vs HBacks and RBs and may even work as a nickel.  But no thanks to spending a high pick on a role player during a rebuild. By the time he refines his game well enough to handle being a FS full time, you will be discussing if he's worth the money he will be looking for on a second contract.

Just focus on the critical positions for our team. On offense, LT, QB, WR, TE. On defense - OLB, CB

[long suffering jets fan]

3 hours ago, jetsons said:

I prefer Hooker over Adams as well... we already have a semi-Adams in Pryor.

I mean if we didn't have Pryor and so many other needs I might consider.  He may have terrific coverage skills and could be our answer to Gronk, but based on his highlight films I've seen he seems to be strictly played as an in the box safety.  Terrific tackler and great athlete, but haven't seen his coverage skills. 

[thadude]

6 hours ago, varjet said:

And Hooker supposedly is not a great tackler.

I think when you look at the various reports, and considering the NFL is a passing league, I think Davis, Adams and Allen slip, and Williams, Davis and Howard ascend.

The key to the top 10 is Trubisky, and who breaks down to trade with the Jets for the right to pick him.

Houston and Cleveland are the frontrunners.

I don't want Hooker either.  The ironic thing is either or both Peppers and Melifonwu will be there at 39 so why use the 6 pick on a strong safety?

 

 

I guess we could draft Trubisky at 6 and dangle him as trade bait.  If I'm Cleveland at 12 I'd rather just stay put and draft Kizer or Watson

[PepPep]

15 hours ago, Lil Woody said:

Peppers at 12? How about at 45? Or not at all? I'd much rather take actual safeties like Josh Jones or Eddie Jackson or John Johnson before I take a LB/S hybrid and try to shoehorn him into a position he doesn't have all that much familiarity with. Kid can cover well, but he's still just 5'11 and while he's going to be good initially at taking away receivers out of the backfield, but are you really going to put him up against Gronk or Greg Olson or Jimmy Graham? No he'll be a nice role player vs HBacks and RBs and may even work as a nickel.  But no thanks to spending a high pick on a role player during a rebuild. By the time he refines his game well enough to handle being a FS full time, you will be discussing if he's worth the money he will be looking for on a second contract.

Just focus on the critical positions for our team. On offense, LT, QB, WR, TE. On defense - OLB, CB

Fair enough. I guess you are right. I was looking at Peppers as strictly a SS to replace Pryor. One that could cover and be used as a returner.