I'm Still Not Sold On Zach Wilson

[jgb]

50 minutes ago, TheAustrian said:

How many TD's for Wilson in the last three regular season games? I can't remember

 

43 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Win rate.  Wow.  

You know you got them when they go to “win rate.” Of course, they won’t concede that any QB with a better “win rate” is better, they’ll just say “oh he had a better supporting cast.”

There just isn’t any intellectual honesty there at all.

[jgb]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Zach single-handedly loses both NE games and the JAX game:  “Guys, it’s a team sport!”

Speaking of JAX, JD must really hate Zach to bench him while inferior, lower-win-rate QBs like Trevor Lawrence make Pro Bowls.

 

[JohnnyLV]

Yet another Zack bashing thread. What the hell is wrong with you al?. He was benched and replaced. NO ONE even the most ardent is "sold" on Zach. Yet it's all you guys want to discuss about how me he sucks (not a take) should have never been drafted is worse than Flacco and White and all the other crap you post over and over and over. Really makes this board suck sometimes

[SoFlaJets]

Unfortunately HE STILL SUCKS! Have at it...

[Bobby816]

9 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Gladly.  Here’s 20, to start with:

 

* Jameis Winston (NO)

* Gardner Minshew (IND)

* Jacoby Brissett (WSH)

* Andy Dalton (CAR)

* Tyrod Taylor (NYG)

* Mitch Trubisky (PIT)

* Davis Mills & Case Keenum (HOU)

* Teddy Bridgewater (DET)

* Tyler Huntley & Josh Johnson (BAL)

* Cooper Rush & Will Grier (DAL)

* Bailey Zappe (NE)

* Taylor Heinicke (ATL)

* Sam Darnold (SF)

* Mike White (MIA)

* PJ Walker (CHI)

* Blaine Gabbert (KC)

* Nick Mullens (MIN)

Your flaw in this is that you're comparing this to the Wilson we saw last year and not the one we've seen this year. 1/2 these names IMO aren't better than the CURRENT Wilson.

[mrcoops]

2 minutes ago, SoFlaJets said:

Unfortunately HE STILL SUCKS! Have at it...

Quality, lightning fast, merge from the mods there - kudos.

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

Zachey is a hackey .

[SoFlaJets]

I've come to the conclusion that the message board forum has become an old, tired way to communicate amongst Jets fans. Sadly, since Jets Insider sold out, all the people who most of us who left there to get away from in the first place are all here now, acting in the same way as they did 20 years ago.

[LIJetsFan]

48 minutes ago, SoFlaJets said:

I've come to the conclusion that the message board forum has become an old, tired way to communicate amongst Jets fans. Sadly, since Jets Insider sold out, all the people who most of us who left there to get away from in the first place are all here now, acting in the same way as they did 20 years ago.

Yeah I hate to say it because this message board was a friend in need for many years but these days I get better content and more entertainment per time spent while viewing (and interacting with in some cases) 3 or 4 you tube Jets fans posters.  On this board I now cherry pick which thread to open and which posted to iggy.  Times they are a  changing.    

(sorry mods)

[jgb]

2 hours ago, JohnnyLV said:

Yet another Zack bashing thread. What the hell is wrong with you al?. He was benched and replaced. NO ONE even the most ardent is "sold" on Zach. Yet it's all you guys want to discuss about how me he sucks (not a take) should have never been drafted is worse than Flacco and White and all the other crap you post over and over and over. Really makes this board suck sometimes

Were you deceived by the thread title? Sure seems like you came in eyes wide open.

[Biggs]

14 hours ago, 65 Toss Power Trap said:

AR loves him and JD loves him. As long as those two have say on the matter, he's the backup. 

The love him like the family dog. They're not going to give the business to the family pet.

[Jetsplayer21]

3 hours ago, JohnnyLV said:

Yet another Zack bashing thread. What the hell is wrong with you al?. He was benched and replaced. NO ONE even the most ardent is "sold" on Zach. Yet it's all you guys want to discuss about how me he sucks (not a take) should have never been drafted is worse than Flacco and White and all the other crap you post over and over and over. Really makes this board suck sometimes

It’s preseason. He will be long forgotten once the season starts. However I think many are a little freaked out he is qb2. May not be important when Aaron is rolling, but on any team, if your starting qb goes down, the backup qb automatically becomes most important player on the team. Boyle hasn’t looked bad, and who knows if he moves to qb2 throughout season. 

[EM31]

23 hours ago, Larz said:

...

Much improved accuracy on all throws. 
....

I am not a Zach basher by any means but he has been air-mailing receivers just like last year or were you referring to him not bouncing 5-yard swing passes? 

[65 Toss Power Trap]

28 minutes ago, Biggs said:

The love him like the family dog. They're not going to give the business to the family pet.

We’re probably attacking two different premises. 

I’m responding to arguments that he is totally done in New York and going to, or needing to, get shipped out.  All I’m saying is he’s sticking around as the backup. They want to keep him around for now. I actually think he’s going to get one more significant chance, at some point, who knows when, to become the starter. 

[Biggs]

10 minutes ago, 65 Toss Power Trap said:

We’re probably attacking two different premises. 

I’m responding to arguments that he is totally done in New York and going to, or needing to, get shipped out.  All I’m saying is he’s sticking around as the backup. They want to keep him around for now. I actually think he’s going to get one more significant chance, at some point, who knows when, to become the starter. 

If Rodgers goes down don't think Boyle may be the next man up and we pick someone off the scrap heep.  

[SoFlaJets]

2 hours ago, LIJetsFan said:

Yeah I hate to say it because this message board was a friend in need for many years but these days I get better content and more entertainment per time spent while viewing (and interacting with in some cases) 3 or 4 you tube Jets fans posters.  On this board I now cherry pick which thread to open and which posted to iggy.  Times they are a  changing.    

(sorry mods)

Agreed LI, this whole anonymous say whatever you want to and about a poster is something that has gotten old. It's also cowardly to throw insults every time at the person who starts the thread-it's so 2007. I like people man. I enjoy watching the YouTube stuff these days much more. Yea there's a few guys with an attitude but for the most part this is a pretty psyched up fanbase

[Jetsfan80]

4 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Your flaw in this is that you're comparing this to the Wilson we saw last year and not the one we've seen this year. 1/2 these names IMO aren't better than the CURRENT Wilson.

Oh right forgot this guy has completely transformed before our very eyes!  He can complete 3-yard throws sometimes!

No.  My list factored in Zach’s rocket up the board from the 68th best QB go the 61st, but thanks for the heads up all the same.  

[Bobby816]

22 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Oh right forgot this guy has completely transformed before our very eyes!  He can complete 3-yard throws sometimes!

No.  My list factored in Zach’s rocket up the board from the 68th best QB go the 61st, but thanks for the heads up all the same.  

Because you on your own had him at 68th. Which most would disagree.

It'd be A LOT easier for you at this stage just to say, you hate Zach Wilson no matter what. Anything good he does or development he does means nothing to you. And leave it at that.

[Biggs]

4 hours ago, JohnnyLV said:

Yet another Zack bashing thread. What the hell is wrong with you al?. He was benched and replaced. NO ONE even the most ardent is "sold" on Zach. Yet it's all you guys want to discuss about how me he sucks (not a take) should have never been drafted is worse than Flacco and White and all the other crap you post over and over and over. Really makes this board suck sometimes

We're just trying to make him mentally tough.  It's a process and Jets fans are here to help.  

[65 Toss Power Trap]

1 hour ago, Biggs said:

If Rodgers goes down don't think Boyle may be the next man up and we pick someone off the scrap heep.  

Really? I don't see that at all. I think AR was dead serious about handing the reigns over to Zach. I think, right or wrong, they view him as a rookie and are giving him a fresh start. You might be right though. After last season, I thought he was done. 

[Biggs]

Just now, 65 Toss Power Trap said:

Really? I don't see that at all. I think AR was dead serious about handing the reigns over to Zach. I think, right or wrong, they view him as a rookie and are giving him a fresh start. You might be right though. After last season, I thought he was done. 

Let's assume Zach isn't the team mascot and is really being reset as a potential future starter.   What makes you think if Rodgers goes down the move is to start Zach for multiple games again?  It goes against the premise of developing him to start in the future and puts him right back in the mess that set him back in the first place. 

Sure if Rodgers comes out for a series or a quarter put him in and hand the ball off.  Start him for multiple games against live bullets?  Bad move and I don't think that's really the plan. 

[65 Toss Power Trap]

2 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Let's assume Zach isn't the team mascot and is really being reset as a potential future starter.   What makes you think if Rodgers goes down the move is to start Zach for multiple games again?  It goes against the premise of developing him to start in the future and puts him right back in the mess that set him back in the first place. 

Sure if Rodgers comes out for a series or a quarter put him in and hand the ball off.  Start him for multiple games against live bullets?  Bad move and I don't think that's really the plan. 

Nothing makes me think the move will be to start Zach for multiple games in the event Rodgers goes down this year. I never alluded to, directly or indirectly, that I thought that.  AR's comments were that he would play multiple years and then hand it over to Zach. If AR gets injured and is out half of the year, who is the QB? I don't know. 

Is Zach on the trade block right now? I don't think so. Is Zach sticking around with the thought he'll develop over the next few years? I think so. 

[Biggs]

2 minutes ago, 65 Toss Power Trap said:

Nothing makes me think the move will be to start Zach for multiple games in the event Rodgers goes down this year. I never alluded to, directly or indirectly, that I thought that.  AR's comments were that he would play multiple years and then hand it over to Zach. If AR gets injured and is out half of the year, who is the QB? I don't know. 

Is Zach on the trade block right now? I don't think so. Is Zach sticking around with the thought he'll develop over the next few years? I think so. 

I actually love Zach's arm and athletic ability.  I got very excited because of the hype about his work ethic.  What they didn't tell me is he's not that bright, doesn't have the leadership skills of an NFL starter and can't process very well.

I think the kid could actually develop.  It's going to take a lot of time.  He's clearly not ready and roster spots in the NFL don't grow on trees.  I'm also not convinced this coaching staff has the goods to develop him until they prove they can win big games when they count.  

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

4 hours ago, SoFlaJets said:

I've come to the conclusion that the message board forum has become an old, tired way to communicate amongst Jets fans. Sadly, since Jets Insider sold out, all the people who most of us who left there to get away from in the first place are all here now, acting in the same way as they did 20 years ago.

Hey, FWIW, I'm not exactly sold on ZW either 🙂

The #2 overall pick is at least learning how to not answer questions in a career-killing fashion.

But if you pay attention even now, there are still some subtle deflections where he's trying to cast blame (on LaFleur, the offense, etc.).

Despite his lack of draft pedigree, you can tell why the guys gravitated towards MW and saw him as a leader.

If Rodgers is an alpha, I don't know what ZW is.  Definitely something way closer to Omega.

With ZW, he looks and acts and talks like a 15-year old.

It's just a really weird dynamic with him.

 

[65 Toss Power Trap]

8 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I actually love Zach's arm and athletic ability.  I got very excited because of the hype about his work ethic.  What they didn't tell me is he's not that bright, doesn't have the leadership skills of an NFL starter and can't process very well.

I think the kid could actually develop.  It's going to take a lot of time.  He's clearly not ready and roster spots in the NFL don't grow on trees.  I'm also not convinced this coaching staff has the goods to develop him until they prove they can win big games when they count.  

The bolded, that's what makes an NFL QB.

I feel the same way. I thought his natural talent and last-guy-in-the-building approach was going to work well for him. But he gets the jitters/yips on the field and seems to be in the back of his head all the time. He completely froze in the NE game. 

The pre-season clips I've seen where he is talking on the sideline reminds me of a excited young kid who's glad to be along for the ride. I think he's glad the spotlight is off of him.  

[bostonmajet]

14 hours ago, Darnold Schwarzenegger said:

mike white averaged 298 ypg 

ZW averaged 187 

MW also had a higher completion percentage. So. Yea. He definitely outperformed him. But don’t let stats get in the way of a bad opinion. 

yep and the Jets didn't resign him because?

Give the very small sample size, do you think the stats includes which D each faced? Or that his stats might be skewed by the one really great game? First rule of statistics is that a very small sample is rarely accurate as I will smooth out such bumps. Yep - Mike White like every other Jets backup (except ZW) is the greatest QB never allowed to start. Except he did start and yet couldn't win the starting job - so I guess I am not the only one who thinks maybe he wasn't as good as ZW.

[bostonmajet]

14 hours ago, jgb said:

one-hint wonder > no-hit blunder 

Clever - so ZW never had a good game? He never had a big win?

[bostonmajet]

14 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Saying Mike White statistically out-produced Wilson (true by basically all available metrics) = Someone saying the “sky is red” to you?

Yikes.  

And again, I ask:  Now find a way to try to nitpick the other 18 guys I listed, eh?  Your vitriol for Mike White is telling here.  

No, I am just saying listing a bunch of guys doesn't make you right. There is also the who would you rather have the struggling youngster as the back up or the has-been (not really meaning it to sound so bad)? Sam Darnold was listed who was just bashed un-merilessly here when he was the starter, but is now just better than ZW as a backup?

And no, I don't hate nor am I overly critical of White. He like every other backup QB for the Jets was treated like an unloved god here. After White failed to deliver here, the love moved to Streveler. What is evident here is the vitriol for ZW. Who will be evaluated against impossible standards until he is shipped out and then will be infinitely better than any QB here at the Jets.

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, bostonmajet said:

No, I am just saying listing a bunch of guys doesn't make you right. There is also the who would you rather have the struggling youngster as the back up or the has-been (not really meaning it to sound so bad)? Sam Darnold was listed who was just bashed un-merilessly here when he was the starter, but is now just better than ZW as a backup?

And no, I don't hate nor am I overly critical of White. He like every other backup QB for the Jets was treated like an unloved god here. After White failed to deliver here, the love moved to Streveler. What is evident here is the vitriol for ZW. Who will be evaluated against impossible standards until he is shipped out and then will be infinitely better than any QB here at the Jets.

Yes, Sam Darnold is better than Wilson these days even though Sam sucks.  That’s how bad Wilson is.  Wilson at his best is extremely boring, and at his worst is the worst QB I’ve ever seen outside of Luke Falk.  

And I have been one of Darnold’s biggest critics here.

[Jetsfan80]

10 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

Clever - so ZW never had a good game? He never had a big win?

You tell us.  He’s had a couple OK games and in all of his wins he was propped up by elite defensive play + a terrific running game.  Make a case otherwise.  

Even Darnold had that shining moment in Lambeau and never had the supporting cast Wilson has had.  

[Jetsfan80]

14 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

yep and the Jets didn't resign him because?

Ooh that’s an easy one.  Maybe it has something to do with Wilson having a $35.5M fully guaranteed contract?  

Rodgers and Wilson are each two of the top 5 highest paid players on the team in ‘23 and ‘24.  Kinda makes it tough to do anything but go super cheap on a 3rd QB spot. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Because you on your own had him at 68th. Which most would disagree.

It'd be A LOT easier for you at this stage just to say, you hate Zach Wilson no matter what. Anything good he does or development he does means nothing to you. And leave it at that.

I hate QBs who suck, yes.  I suppose it’s a character flaw of mine.  

[bostonmajet]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Yes, Sam Darnold is better than Wilson these days even though Sam sucks.  That’s how bad Wilson is.  Wilson at his best is extremely boring, and at his worst is the worst QB I’ve ever seen outside of Luke Falk.  

And I have been one of Darnold’s biggest critics here.

Didn't realize Boring was criteria for a successful QBs. Worst ever - that is what the SOJ fan always says. Goes was worse than Holtz and Kottite. ZW is worse than Bollinger, Foley, Nagel, Miter, and that was just the Jets QBs. But sure...

[bostonmajet]

8 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

You tell us.  He’s had a couple OK games and in all of his wins he was propped up by elite defensive play + a terrific running game.  Make a case otherwise.  

Even Darnold had that shining moment in Lambeau and never had the supporting cast Wilson has had.  

Just responding to the 'no-hit blunder ' comment. Either he is a no-hit blunder or he had some good games - which is it?

[southparkcpa]

3 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

Didn't realize Boring was criteria for a successful QBs. Worst ever - that is what the SOJ fan always says. Goes was worse than Holtz and Kottite. ZW is worse than Bollinger, Foley, Nagel, Miter, and that was just the Jets QBs. But sure...

Jeez.   Talk about picking words.   Zach is very bad.  Simple.