NIGHT STALKER Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 That was the score that we whipped the Peyton Manning led Colts in the playoffs several years ago. They went on to win the SB last season and we became the "same old Jets"...if you had to pinpoint a couple of things, what would you say happened to us? And yes, it goes beyond Pennington. And it also helps that the Colts have the same HC and same system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Chad Pennington was found human the next week in Oakland. That is all. Honestly, the team from 2002 just wasn't that good. It was a magical run that was cut short in Oakland. We didn't get the breaks like the 2005 Pittsburgh Steelers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Richie Anderson left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Colts have Peyton Manning, we have Chad Pennington. That's the difference. The Colts simply had to upgrade their defense to respectability to be a SB contender. With Chad at QB, we have to assemble one of the fiercest defenses the league has ever seen. Edge-Manning and the Colts by a mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 The Colts were not that good is a big difference-their defense was pitiful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn306 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 The Colts D was really bad in 02. There are a couple of things missing 1) Anderson: Max was probably joking but I think the Jets miss his production, he caught 49 balls that years. 2) John Abraham: Love or hate him the guy could play when healthy. He has been gone for two years now and the Jets still haven't replaced him. 3) OL became crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT STALKER Posted December 18, 2007 Author Share Posted December 18, 2007 We all know Chad's limitations...it's well documented. But, I think it helps to keep the same flow of coaches/system for the players. Some of us are calling for the heads of Shotty and Sutton...even some for Mangini which I think is nuts. You can't be consistent in winning when you have a revolving door of coaches. I'm willing to bet that our team is near the top in changing HC's through the years. That's the root of our problems...players can't get settled in one system for too long around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Richie Anderson left. ahh yes, I remember the days when we had a fullback on the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Bad personnel decisions and drafting happened to the New York Jets. Look at some of the the drafts of 2001-2004. These are the players that should be the nucleus of this team right now, but most are gone, and many never panned out. Bradway liked unusual fitting players that presented unique physical gifts. His draft board is littered with them-Santana Moss, Bryan Thomas, Dewayne Robertson, Jon McGraw, BJ Askew, Derrick Strait. These are all high round picks that have difficulty fitting into many systems. Bradway is one of those personnel guys that likes to make the obscure fit firt into teh wrong system. Classic square peg round hole guy. I sometimes wonder what team he was drafting for. It wasn't one that was on the field at the time he was picking. He panicked when he had a particular hole on a team, and felt that he always needed to pick and fill that hole as early as he could. He didn't trust his ability to pick out gems later on. Maybe he knew something in not trusting himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.I.MikeBleedsGreen Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 The Colts Offense stayed the same ,But they revamped the D The Jets have to revamp the Offense,Lines,RB..etc oh and Chads arm has been torn off twice That is the difference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slowmoe57 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Manning is no where near as fragile as Chad is -- 5 straight 12 win seasons and we are nothing but a yo-yo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 John Abraham: Love or hate him the guy could play when healthy. He has been gone for two years now and the Jets still haven't replaced him. What do you mean? We signed Bryan Thomas to an extension! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeniorFlaJet Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Yes, that game was a great win for us. But I have always said that if they didn't take the Colts out of the AFC East we may not have gotten into the playoffs as many times as we did with Herm and Mangini. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMaynard Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 3) OL became crap True, and it raises an interesting hypothesis. What o-line would you rather have: The Jets current o-line or: RT - Kareem McKenzie (Giants) RG - Randy Thomas (Skins) C - Kevin Mawae (Titans) LG - Pete Kendall (Skins) LT - Jason Fabini (Cowboys) I know all of these situations had their own considerations at the time, and I am not blaming either Jet regime per se, but isn't it funny how our "castoffs" would make a much better o-line than we have now? And we just spent 2 #1s on the line last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Many Reasons why we suck: Terrible coaching and front office work. Couldn't replace Curtis Martin Couldn't upgrade the O-Line Injuries to key players (Chad says hello) Traded John Abraham Too many undersized players for our system The Colts on the other hand: Great work by the coach and front office Did replace Edgerin James Did upgrade the O-line Very few injuries to key players (Manning says hello) Kept Dwight Freeney Many undersized players suited there sytem, (what they didn't have in size, they made up for in speed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Many Reasons why we suck: Terrible coaching and front office work. Couldn't replace Curtis Martin Couldn't upgrade the O-Line Injuries to key players (Chad says hello) Traded John Abraham Too many undersized players for our system The Colts on the other hand: Great work by the coach and front office Did replace Edgerin James Did upgrade the O-line Very few injuries to key players (Manning says hello) Kept Dwight Freeney Many undersized players suited there sytem, (what they didn't have in size, they made up for in speed) I pretty much dissagree with all of you're assessnments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I pretty much dissagree with all of you're assessnments Ok, then please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 True, and it raises an interesting hypothesis. What o-line would you rather have: The Jets current o-line or: RT - Kareem McKenzie (Giants) RG - Randy Thomas (Skins) C - Kevin Mawae (Titans) LG - Pete Kendall (Skins) LT - Jason Fabini (Cowboys) I know all of these situations had their own considerations at the time, and I am not blaming either Jet regime per se, but isn't it funny how our "castoffs" would make a much better o-line than we have now? And we just spent 2 #1s on the line last year. How about a mix up? LT - D'Brickashaw Ferguson LG - Pete Kendall C - Nick Mangold RG - Randy Thomas / Brandon Moore RT - Kareem McKenzie That is what our line should look like today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonCorleone Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Many Reasons why we suck: Terrible coaching and front office work. Couldn't replace Curtis Martin Couldn't upgrade the O-Line Injuries to key players (Chad says hello) Traded John Abraham Too many undersized players for our system The Colts on the other hand: Great work by the coach and front office Did replace Edgerin James Did upgrade the O-line Very few injuries to key players (Manning says hello) Kept Dwight Freeney Many undersized players suited there sytem, (what they didn't have in size, they made up for in speed) I agree completely........ Great post. The only thing that I would like to say is that IMO when you have a real owner, one who tries to win, he usually hires a real GM, a real coach, and all the other things fall in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I pretty much dissagree with all of you're assessnments I'm still waiting, why???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn306 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 True, and it raises an interesting hypothesis. What o-line would you rather have: The Jets current o-line or: RT - Kareem McKenzie (Giants) RG - Randy Thomas (Skins) C - Kevin Mawae (Titans) LG - Pete Kendall (Skins) LT - Jason Fabini (Cowboys) I know all of these situations had their own considerations at the time, and I am not blaming either Jet regime per se, but isn't it funny how our "castoffs" would make a much better o-line than we have now? And we just spent 2 #1s on the line last year. You would have to go with the Mawae line. It boggles my mind that Fabini is even still in the league. It looked like this guy was done and now here he is not only still in the league but starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 You would have to go with the Mawae line. It boggles my mind that Fabini is even still in the league. It looked like this guy was done and now here he is not only still in the league but starting. Left Tackle was not a great spot for Fabini and as he aged they had to move him. He could've played some Right Tackle, infact I think he did with Dallas, but is doing a stand up job in Washington at Right Guard. I too thought he would be way out of the league by now. Amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMaynard Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 How about a mix up? LT - D'Brickashaw Ferguson LG - Pete Kendall C - Nick Mangold RG - Randy Thomas / Brandon Moore RT - Kareem McKenzie That is what our line should look like today. That's even better. And it was doable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 True, and it raises an interesting hypothesis. What o-line would you rather have: The Jets current o-line or: RT - Kareem McKenzie (Giants) RG - Randy Thomas (Skins) C - Kevin Mawae (Titans) LG - Pete Kendall (Skins) LT - Jason Fabini (Cowboys) I know all of these situations had their own considerations at the time, and I am not blaming either Jet regime per se, but isn't it funny how our "castoffs" would make a much better o-line than we have now? And we just spent 2 #1s on the line last year. Fabini has declined. He's a bit player in Dallas. But the Mckenzie and Thomas salary dumps, while Edwards signed 157 overpriced DBs, was a disgrace. It was like they really beleived they could fortify the OL with guys off the street and the Marko Cvakas in the 7th round on draft day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 Our grass field. Seriously. The Colts could barely move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 That was the score that we whipped the Peyton Manning led Colts in the playoffs several years ago. They went on to win the SB last season and we became the "same old Jets"...if you had to pinpoint a couple of things, what would you say happened to us? And yes, it goes beyond Pennington. And it also helps that the Colts have the same HC and same system. What happened? 1) OL got old or left via free agency 2) The Dewayne Robertson Disaster of 2003 3) The Doug Jolley/Mike Nugent Disaster of 2005 4) Weasel coach starts job hunting in the middle of the 2005 season 5) New Coach wants to run 3-4 defense with 4-3 players 6) Mediocre 2006 draft 7) Chad Pennington breaks his shoulder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjam76 Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 The Colts Offense stayed the same ,But they revamped the D The Jets have to revamp the Offense,Lines,RB..etc oh and Chads arm has been torn off twice That is the difference Not exactly true... Edge wasn't the RB when they won a SB. And a few of their OL were gone... It's really not about having the same 11 guys for years it's more about replacing players every year. Look at the Colts this year. At one point they had 4 new OL starting compared to last season yet they still only lost 2 games. While the Jets couldn't even replace Pete Kendall. I think good teams learn how to replace good talent while bad teams might get lucky one year and make the playoffs but the next season they suck. That's why the Jets are 9-7 one year and 6-10 the next. They never seem to have a clue how to replace players or improve the team. Herm didn't have a clue and so far neither does Mangini. Dump JA, never replace him. Dump Kendall, never replace him. What are they doing to do next season? Dump Vilma, Coles, and Pennington and never replace them? If they used Harris and Vilma for their strengths next year, it might improve the defense. It might not, but you never know. But instead I imagine Vilma will be gone and they start all over.. Some teams seem great at replacing vets and good players while teams like the Jets can't even replace Pete Kendall. That's why the Pats and Colts are where they are. It's not because they kept the same team since 2001. It's because they had a clue how to replace players, good or avg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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