Darrelle Revis Holdout: MERGED

[Irish Jet]

Yeah...this is the elephant in the room no one wants to talk about it seems. Woody is far from the good guy here.

I really don't see what Woody has done wrong at all.

He's not going to let Revis kill the Jets future, which he would. The deal Revis is demanding would cripple the franchise.

[Matt39]

Well thats just too damn bad, we're stuck with Woody. Can't do anything about it.

And not for nothing, he's done a pretty damn good job of making this team better over the last few years. And while I completely disagree with anything PSL, its just the way it is now.

True. Similar to the Yankees and the new stadium. I was pretty vocal about Yankees management treatment of the fanbase....no difference with Woody.

I expect the new Meadowlands to be quiet with empty lower level seats unfortunately like the legends seats at the New Yankee Stadium....but hopefully the Jets can bring home a championship like the Yanks did.

[Matt39]

I really don't see what Woody has done wrong at all.

He's not going to let Revis kill the Jets future, which he would. The deal Revis is demanding would cripple the franchise.

Pricing out good fans from the lower level to bring in the corporate stiffs was wrong. Look at the New Yankee Stadium...stiffs sit in the lower level. Most of the time, that part of the stadium isnt close to full- which is what the new Meadowlands will look like.

[The Crusher]

If we trade Revis, not only do we not get good value for him, but we make another team significantly better. Are we in the position to make another team significantly better in with the hope of our new draft picks panning out?

Let him miss the rest of his career. Ownership makes the rules here.

Bingo. He either plays for the Jets or he plays in 4 years. End of it. **** him.

[Irish Jet]

Well thats just too damn bad, we're stuck with Woody. Can't do anything about it.

And not for nothing, he's done a pretty damn good job of making this team better over the last few years. And while I completely disagree with anything PSL, its just the way it is now.

This. Say what you want about Woody, I think it's obvious that he cares about winning. Which is more than I can say about a lot of owners in sports.

[T0mShane]

I really don't see what Woody has done wrong at all.

He's not going to let Revis kill the Jets future, which he would. The deal Revis is demanding would cripple the franchise.

What "cripples" a franchise is consistently trading up into the first and second round to pick up more high-value players. At some point, assuming those players hit, you have to pay the piper. It's not Revis' fault that Tannenbaum likes to wheel and deal all the time and now has to figure out how to pay Mangold AND Brick AND Harris AND Revis and then Sanchez, etc. etc. Why should Revis pay because of the Jets' drafting practices?

[Irish Jet]

Pricing out good fans from the lower level to bring in the corporate stiffs was wrong. Look at the New Yankee Stadium...stiffs sit in the lower level. Most of the time, that part of the stadium isnt close to full- which is what the new Meadowlands will look like.

I don't see how this could be any less relevant to what I just posted.

I'm talking about what Woody has done in regard to Revis.

[ZachEY]

Bingo. He either plays for the Jets or he plays in 4 years. End of it. **** him.

We hold his rights as long as there's an NFL if he never shows up. 4 years is only if he reports Wednesday or later.

[Irish Jet]

What "cripples" a franchise is consistently trading up into the first and second round to pick up more high-value players. At some point, assuming those players hit, you have to pay the piper. It's not Revis' fault that Tannenbaum likes to wheel and deal all the time and now has to figure out how to pay Mangold AND Brick AND Harris AND Revis and then Sanchez, etc. etc. Why should Revis pay because of the Jets' drafting practices?

This makes no sense at all. Where we drafted Revis is completely irrelevant to what is currently going on.

Mangold, Brick, Harris, Revis could all be 4th rounders, their PERFORMANCE has demenaded the money, not their draft slot. Sanchez, the QB, is the obvious exception.

The only solution to what you're suggesting is our problem, is that we draft worse players.

[Larz]

Because you're getting the best DB in the game. Draft picks are nothing but hope. Not that I like agreeing with Bit, but what did the Saints get in return for Ricky Williams.

What great players do you think we're getting in this deal? And do you plan on giving them new deals? How will that affect the rest of the unsigned players who are upset that the Jets 'don't take care of their guys'.

The last thing this team needs is to tie up more guaranteed money in unproven 1st round picks. 1 per year is more than enough for me.

You're also sending the message that a holdout gets you out. F-that. Send a message that, you sign a contract, you play for us, or you don't play.

Everything about trading Darrelle Revis is wrong.

the other team would be getting the best DB, but also a cap killing 16 million dollar deal, and giving up two starters and probably at least 3 picks.

I can't see the jets doing a deal without getting a DB in return, so the other team would certainly upgrade the #1 CB, but would then have to promote their #3 to the #2, because I'm assuming the jets would get the #2 corner to go alongside cro, and then promote the #4 DB to the nickel, so teams just throw away from revis and pick on your nickel on third down situations because he's a scrub

look, I don't want to trade revis, I want to wake up to the news he is signed, (duh) but from a business perspective, do you wait until every GM knows you have to trade him after he sits out a year, or trade him now and get something in return for this run this year ?

they already sent that message with pete kendall, and the jets really don't take care of their guys anyway

draft picks are chips. we're gonna need a DE and the good ones go top 10, so we could trade into that neighbor hood if tanny wanted to.

revis is forcing the issue here, not tanny, I'm saying trade him before the lockout, before the season is a loss, before GM's see blood in the water, and get someone here who will actually go out and play for us, don't let him hold us captive for a year, what does that get us ?

If he doesn't show up a week before the opener, you can bet trade rumors will be flying, and I wouldn't blame tanny for pulling the trigger

[JoeWillie]

I don't hate him. I think he's a terrific player and I'll support him as such if and when he comes back to the Jets.

And like the Jets, I also think he's outplayed his contract and think he deserves a raise.

That said, I've lost a lot of respect for him as a person because of the way he's handled himself throughout this whole ordeal. Signing a contract, taking bonus money upfront, and then not carrying out the services you signed for is dishonorable in any language. Throw on top of that the BS drama during OTA's.

In life, as well as business, a man is only as good as his word and the example he sets.

He has now proved that his word is crap, he's set a terrible example, has shown himself to be a terrible teammate, and he is in obvious "breach of contract" no matter how you slice it. And at the end of the day, the Jets are justified in not wanting to give him alot of "upfront" money because he has proven to be untrustworthy by holding out.

If I wanted my son to look at a Jet as an example of how to conduct himself, it would not be Darrelle Mevi$.

That guy would be Nick Mangold and I just hope the Jets reward the attitude and behavior of the guy who is living up to his word and is in camp before the selfish primadonna who isn't.

If the Jets are smart, they'll lock up Mangold and Harris before they do anything with the drama queen CB.

That would be the best message they could send for the future.

[T0mShane]

should woody just pay him 16 mil a year for the next 6 years??????? ( ps...I just pi$$ed on yer shoes a lil bit while i stood up and asked you this btw)

What's up, bud?!

Supposedly the issue is now "total dollars" and not guaranteed money, which is stupid because the guaranteed money is the only thing that should scare a team. Give him his guarantee ($35-$40 mil?) and then deal with the non-guaranteed portion down the road. The Jets are being minor-leaguers here.

[Jbro22]

What "cripples" a franchise is consistently trading up into the first and second round to pick up more high-value players. At some point, assuming those players hit, you have to pay the piper. It's not Revis' fault that Tannenbaum likes to wheel and deal all the time and now has to figure out how to pay Mangold AND Brick AND Harris AND Revis and then Sanchez, etc. etc. Why should Revis pay because of the Jets' drafting practices?

You really think he deserves Aso money?

We all know he deserves more money, as do the Jets. Its his refusal to negotiate that gets me.

[Matt39]

I don't see how this could be any less relevant to what I just posted.

I'm talking about what Woody has done in regard to Revis.

I didnt realize you were talking strictly about the Revis situation. I thought the thread was trying to paint Woody as the good guy here...when he's cleary done some things motivated by $$$$ paying no mind to the fans opinion. Hell...Woody had fans signs confiscated that were PSL related.

[Jetsfan80]

If he doesn't show up a week before the opener, you can bet trade rumors will be flying, and I wouldn't blame tanny for pulling the trigger

I sure as hell would blame him. You will NEVER get equal value for a true shutdown corner. Other than an elite QB, that's the most valuable piece you can have on an NFL roster.

[T0mShane]

This makes no sense at all. Where we drafted Revis is completely irrelevant to what is currently going on.

Mangold, Brick, Harris, Revis could all be 4th rounders, their PERFORMANCE has demenaded the money, not their draft slot. Sanchez, the QB, is the obvious exception.

The only solution to what you're suggesting is our problem, is that we draft worse players.

If you draft a player in a lower round, you lock them up at a lower price for a potentially longer term. When their deals come due, THEN you pay them premium dollars as opposed to paying them top-dollar from the jump as the Jets are wont to do. If the Jets can't pay Revis because all of these big-ticket deals are coming due at the same time, it's their own fault that situation exists.

[Irish Jet]

I didnt realize you were talking strictly about the Revis situation. I thought the thread was trying to paint Woody as the good guy here...when he's cleary done some things motivated by $$$$ paying no mind to the fans opinion. Hell...Woody had fans signs confiscated that were PSL related.

Fair enough.

I don't really know too much about Woody or PSL's. Doubt it's going to affect me personally anytime and I've avoided most of the stuff being posted about it. I'll assume he's a dick, just from the general vibe I get from most posters. lol

[ZachEY]

the other team would be getting the best DB, but also a cap killing 16 million dollar deal, and giving up two starters and probably at least 3 picks.

I can't see the jets doing a deal without getting a DB in return, so the other team would certainly upgrade the #1 CB, but would then have to promote their #3 to the #2, because I'm assuming the jets would get the #2 corner to go alongside cro, and then promote the #4 DB to the nickel, so teams just throw away from revis and pick on your nickel on third down situations because he's a scrub

look, I don't want to trade revis, I want to wake up to the news he is signed, (duh) but from a business perspective, do you wait until every GM knows you have to trade him after he sits out a year, or trade him now and get something in return for this run this year ?

they already sent that message with pete kendall, and the jets really don't take care of their guys anyway

draft picks are chips. we're gonna need a DE and the good ones go top 10, so we could trade into that neighbor hood if tanny wanted to.

revis is forcing the issue here, not tanny, I'm saying trade him before the lockout, before the season is a loss, before GM's see blood in the water, and get someone here who will actually go out and play for us, don't let him hold us captive for a year, what does that get us ?

If he doesn't show up a week before the opener, you can bet trade rumors will be flying, and I wouldn't blame tanny for pulling the trigger

1st, we had the #1 pass defense in the league with Revis and a Scrub, so clearly that argument isn't winning much favor.

2nd, I propose you don't trade him ever. Eat the value to strengthen your position in future negotiations and not allow another team to improve, even if it's an NFC team. And, what team is going to give up 2 high level starters at this point, and those starters are in positions where we need improvement? What do you want, a DE? Who? We don't need LBs, we don't need WR, we don't need RBs, who's out there that you really want that helps this team win this year?

We're already trading from a position of weakness due to his contract demands and the fear that he'll hold out... I say, strengthen your position for the future and allow one DB to go to waste. You signed a former #1, and you drafted a 1st rounder this year. Without Revis, our CB situation is pretty solid. Not great... but pretty solid.

Pete Kendall was an older guy, and the only mistake was not having his replacement... fortunately, we've got Revis's replacement.

[joewilly]

What's up, bud?!

Supposedly the issue is now "total dollars" and not guaranteed money, which is stupid because the guaranteed money is the only thing that should scare a team. Give him his guarantee ($35-$40 mil?) and then deal with the non-guaranteed portion down the road. The Jets are being minor-leaguers here.

i'm great but it's stinkin hot bein this close to the equator. not rochester hot but hot none the less. Without knowing what was said exactly at roscoe's, i'm just gonna wait til the 2 sides begin to talk again. right now i can't be totally pi$$ed at either side.I see both sides of this dispute. It's gonna be cat & mouse for a while i'm afraid

[Irish Jet]

If you draft a player in a lower round, you lock them up at a lower price for a potentially longer term. When their deals come due, THEN you pay them premium dollars as opposed to paying them top-dollar from the jump as the Jets are wont to do. If the Jets can't pay Revis because all of these big-ticket deals are coming due at the same time, it's their own fault that situation exists.

Regardless of what other contracts are coming up, you can't give Revis what he wants. It's too much, and it wouldn't have mattered where we drafted him, he'd still want it.

[T0mShane]

You really think he deserves Aso money?

We all know he deserves more money, as do the Jets. Its his refusal to negotiate that gets me.

I think he deserves huge money. After QB, there may not be a more critical position on the field that CB, and Revis happens to be the best in the league right now. Now, obviously, structuring contracts based on what Al Davis does is absurd, but it is what it is and the Jets have to deal with it. If you cut Revis tomorrow, how long do you think it would take him to get the contract he wants as a FA? Ten minutes? You don't think Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder and--hell--Robert Kraft wouldn't line up to give him $45 mil guaranteed?

[joewilly]

well it's past this ole man's bedtime. goodnight Mr Shane. great typin at you again

[T0mShane]

i'm great but it's stinkin hot bein this close to the equator. not rochester hot but hot none the less. Without knowing what was said exactly at roscoe's, i'm just gonna wait til the 2 sides begin to talk again. right now i can't be totally pi$$ed at either side.I see both sides of this dispute. It's gonna be cat & mouse for a while i'm afraid

Ah, we've seen this before. He'll sign before the third pre-season game and everyone will kiss and make up. Life as usual.

[Larz]

If you draft a player in a lower round, you lock them up at a lower price for a potentially longer term. When their deals come due, THEN you pay them premium dollars as opposed to paying them top-dollar from the jump as the Jets are wont to do. If the Jets can't pay Revis because all of these big-ticket deals are coming due at the same time, it's their own fault that situation exists.

the problem here is the aso contract(15.1 million) which is about 60% higher than the tag number of the top 5 contracts which is around 9.5 million or something like that

so not giving a 60% raise over the average of the top 5 salaries is minor league ?

you listen to too much fransesca

[Integrity28]

I don't care about this hold out at all.

As of right now, the following things are true:

- Revis is holding out.

- No progress is being made.

- The press is talking about this daily.

- HBO is filming Hard Knocks and centering all of their promotion of this season's show around this holdout.

- Hard Knocks begins on 8/11.

- The plot line for the show will be Revis' return to the field.

Scripted Drama = Publicity = Reality TV = Ratings = $$$

I'll worry, if he's not in the lineup for the preseason week 3 game.

[T0mShane]

the problem here is the aso contract(15.1 million) which is about 60% higher than the tag number of the top 5 contracts which is around 9.5 million or something like that

so not giving a 60% raise over the average of the top 5 salaries is minor league ?

you listen to too much fransesca

The market is the market. The Jets look minor league because they spent all last season telling the world that they had the best player in the league, and then they turn around and act shocked--SHOCKED, I TELL YOU!--when he wants to be paid like one. And then to have your owner, whom everyone in the NFL thinks is a dipsh*t anyway, come out today and act like the sky is falling? Woody should just go ahead and ask Isiah Thomas to come in and handle the negotiations.

[Irish Jet]

Ah, we've seen this before. He'll sign before the third pre-season game and everyone will kiss and make up. Life as usual.

I, as much as anyone want to see him rot away into irrelevance if he dares to holdout over the season, but if he doesn't I'll be the first to welcome him back.

[T0mShane]

I don't care about this hold out at all.

As of right now, the following things are true:

- Revis is holding out.

- No progress is being made.

- The press is talking about this daily.

- HBO is filming Hard Knocks and centering all of their promotion of this season's show around this holdout.

- Hard Knocks begins on 8/11.

- The plot line for the show will be Revis' return to the field.

Scripted Drama = Publicity = Reality TV = Ratings = $$$

I'll worry, if he's not in the lineup for the preseason week 3 game.

Word. Well scripted!

[Irish Jet]

The market is the market. The Jets look minor league because they spent all last season telling the world that they had the best player in the league, and then they turn around and act shocked--SHOCKED, I TELL YOU!--when he wants to be paid like one. And then to have your owner, whom everyone in the NFL thinks is a dipsh*t anyway, come out today and act like the sky is falling? Woody should just go ahead and ask Isiah Thomas to come in and handle the negotiations.

He wants to be paid like one 3 years before the contract he himself signed, is up. That is the difference and it's a big one.

He making this demands without the leverage to back it up.

[T0mShane]

I, as much as anyone want to see him rot away into irrelevance if he dares to holdout over the season, but if he doesn't I'll be the first to welcome him back.

If Revis isn't in uniform when the season starts, it's because your owner is dumber than he looks.

[Larz]

1st, we had the #1 pass defense in the league with Revis and a Scrub, so clearly that argument isn't winning much favor.

2nd, I propose you don't trade him ever. Eat the value to strengthen your position in future negotiations and not allow another team to improve, even if it's an NFC team. And, what team is going to give up 2 high level starters at this point, and those starters are in positions where we need improvement? What do you want, a DE? Who? We don't need LBs, we don't need WR, we don't need RBs, who's out there that you really want that helps this team win this year?

We're already trading from a position of weakness due to his contract demands and the fear that he'll hold out... I say, strengthen your position for the future and allow one DB to go to waste. You signed a former #1, and you drafted a 1st rounder this year. Without Revis, our CB situation is pretty solid. Not great... but pretty solid.

Pete Kendall was an older guy, and the only mistake was not having his replacement... fortunately, we've got Revis's replacement.

I was "speaking" to your point that the other team would automatically be significantly better as a whole.

it seems to me like you want to punish revis, I want to get bodies for a run this year because I think there will be a lock out, and revis doesn't want to play, then yes, I want a DE and a CB in return and 3 picks. btw, Ellis is playing in the final year of his deal, which is never discussed here, and will probably get the heave ho next year so DE will be a huge need next year

I'm sure if I name a DE, you'll reply that I'm nuts to want him in return for revis, but understand my basic position is I expect a year long hold out, then the lock out, so I'm saying getting a DB who will go out and play, and a DE to bolster the rotation in the hand is better than a revis on his island

[Irish Jet]

If Revis isn't in uniform when the season starts, it's because your owner is dumber than he looks.

No it's not. It's because Revis has literally commited NFL suicide.

[T0mShane]

He wants to be paid like one 3 years before the contract he himself signed, is up. That is the difference and it's a big one.

He making this demands without the leverage to back it up.

His leverage is that he's the best CB in the game and in his prime and he isn't in uniform just as his franchise is embarking on their most hyped season in decades. That's a lot of leverage, imo. We both know the NFL contract is only as good as the paper it's written on (ask Leon or Alan Faneca). Any way you paint it, Revis is doing the smart thing. Might not be the popular thing, but it's the smart thing.

[Vudu]

I don't hate him,however I'm highly annoyed by this entire situation. Get a reasonable deal done and get in camp. I won't forgive him for ruining the most anticipated season in franchise history.

[Irish Jet]

His leverage is that he's the best CB in the game and in his prime and he isn't in uniform just as his franchise is embarking on their most hyped season in decades. That's a lot of leverage, imo. We both know the NFL contract is only as good as the paper it's written on (ask Leon or Alan Faneca). Any way you paint it, Revis is doing the smart thing. Might not be the popular thing, but it's the smart thing.

It's not that much leverage when you consider the Jets have his career in their hands. It's a power struggle right now and if Revis genuinely believes that he has the right to sit on the sofa this season then you show him just how wrong he is. You don't trade him, you effectively end him.

Now tell me that's the smart thing.