Villain The Foe Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 5 hours ago, Lupz27 said: The problem is at the time he needed to declare for the draft is so early that you can't get a real feel of where teams would like to draft a player. Geno Smith was the consensus #1 pick at the declare for draft deadline the year he came out, 3 months later not so much, and Cardale would have went from darling 2nd rounder to **** that he is toxic in those 3 months. Solid point, but you mean could have, and not would have. That wasnt guaranteed to happen. Also, you dont go from being a darling 2nd rounder to undrafted unless you're in a situation like La'el Collins last year or you're related to Aaron Hernandez lol. Someone could have picked him up in like the 4th thinking that they're getting value. He could literally go undrafted this year. As I said, it would have taken only one of the 32 teams not to see him as toxic (why even "toxic"?) The fact that he arrived on the scene and was immediately successful, the possibility of a team taking a chance on a guy who has very little footage to review but the footage available shows a guy with a big arm, built like a linebacker and just won a championship is legit. You honestly can't think that his stock is somehow the same today as it was 12 months ago. It sure as hell isnt better. The mystery of the unknown was totally in his favor until he put up the season he just had. It was a flat out bad decision he made based on advice that wasnt good. The reason why I felt like the situations were comparable is because its possible that most of the people in Cardale's ear was probably telling him not to declare because he'll most likely end up being a day 2, possibly day 3 pick. Forgo that money now, play another season in order to raise your stock, never telling him that he could also hurt his stock. (Glennon's agent telling him to throw away 7 million today for the shot at 10-15 million tomorrow, all he has to do is "ride the bench" for another season and wait for free agency). Back to Cardale, When you're playing college football a.k.a. free football, you leave as soon as the opportunity comes about, especially if you're a QB in this generation. And when you get a shot to start (Mike Glennon), make more money per season than you've made your entire career, have the best group of talent around you with a legendary QB coach....you dont forgo that opportunity in order to ride the bench for a 2nd year in a row in the hopes of making bank in free agency. The bank was the 7 million, matter of fact, the true bank was the opportunity that came with the 7 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 If the Jets were going to trade for Glennon, they would have already. /endthread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 5 minutes ago, Paradis said: If the Jets were going to trade for Glennon, they would have already. /endthread If this was after the draft, I might agree with you, but as it gets closer you'll see a lot more trades go down. Nothing is happening until Kaepernick is or isn't moved and that will be figured out by Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 6 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said: If this was after the draft, I might agree with you, but as it gets closer you'll see a lot more trades go down. Nothing is happening until Kaepernick is or isn't moved and that will be figured out by Friday. That is Friday he is due for that big chunk of bonus, yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 14 minutes ago, Paradis said: If the Jets were going to trade for Glennon, they would have already. /endthread Nonsense. You can't say that before the draft. lots of transactions can go down right before, during and at the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 1 minute ago, whodeawhodat said: That is Friday he is due for that big chunk of bonus, yes? His contract for like 12 million becomes guaranteed on Friday. It makes it much more difficult to be traded for at that point. In theory, he could still be cut as well to save SF some money. Not likely, but could happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 1 minute ago, CrazyCarl40 said: His contract for like 12 million becomes guaranteed on Friday. It makes it much more difficult to be traded for at that point. In theory, he could still be cut as well to save SF some money. Not likely, but could happen. Oh okay, i thought it was a roster bonus but yeah, makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Nonsense. You can't say that before the draft. lots of transactions can go down right before, during and at the draft. If this was after the draft, I might agree with you, but as it gets closer you'll see a lot more trades go down. Nothing is happening until Kaepernick is or isn't moved and that will be figured out by Friday. Yaaa at running back maybe. Or guard. Not your QB... Not in this situation Cmon. Wake up you guys. A front office like Mike in his 2nd year, isn't BUMBLING his way through March with no QB and no plan. There's a plan. And if Glennon was part of that plan, then he'd already be here. Mike Glennon is not worth 30 freaking pages either btw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 1 minute ago, CrazyCarl40 said: His contract for like 12 million becomes guaranteed on Friday. It makes it much more difficult to be traded for at that point. In theory, he could still be cut as well to save SF some money. Not likely, but could happen. Isn't he still considered injured, which makes his contract guaranteed? i thought only way He could be released without them having to pay is if He passes a physical by friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 1 minute ago, Paradis said: Yaaa at running back maybe. Or guard. Not your QB... Not one that would be as pricey as him with our empty roster. Cmon. Wake up you guys. A front office like Mike in his 2nd year, isn't BUMBLING his way through March with no QB and no plan. There's a plan. And if Glennon was part of that plan, the. He'd already be here. Mike Glennon is not worth 10 freaking pages either btw Until the Kaepernick and Fitzpatrick shoes drop, you can't rule out anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 7 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said: His contract for like 12 million becomes guaranteed on Friday. It makes it much more difficult to be traded for at that point. In theory, he could still be cut as well to save SF some money. Not likely, but could happen. There is an article today that says the April 1 deadline for the guaranty can't be used if he is injured (which, technically Kaep still is). If they cut him before that date, the money is still guaranteed due to his injury guarantee. Can't find the link. and I just read it somewhere this morning too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 1 minute ago, section314 said: Isn't he still considered injured, which makes his contract guaranteed? i thought only way He could be released without them having to pay is if He passes a physical by friday. Looks like you could be right, if you believe Florio: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/03/27/49ers-may-already-be-stuck-with-kaepernicks-2016-salary/ April Fool’s Day may have no relevance to the 49ers and Colin Kaepernick, after all. The trio of offseason surgeries to Kaepernick (including a left shoulder procedure that landed him on IR in November) may have already tied the team’s hands as to the $11.9 million in salary owed to Kaepernick in 2016. Technically guaranteed for injury only until April 1, if the 49ers were to cut him while still injured they likely would owe him the money — even if Kaepernick later becomes healthy. Per a source with knowledge of the NFL Players Association’s position on the matter, the union would argue that cutting Kaepernick before April 1, if he’s still injured, results in the salary becoming fully guaranteed and unavoidable, absent whatever offset the 49ers would receive if/when Kaepernick signs with another team in 2016. But he could take a one-year, minimum-salary deal elsewhere if he wanted, with the 49ers on the hook for the difference between what he gets in a new city and the $11.9 million. Common sense would suggest that cutting Kaepernick before the salary becomes fully guaranteed would keep the team on the hook only if he’s still injured when the regular season arrives, since the money was guaranteed for injury only prior to April 1. But Article 44 of the Collective Bargaining Agreement, which sets forth the procedure for an injury grievance, generally defines the term broadly to encompass any situation in which a player contract is terminated at a time when the player “was physically unable to perform the services required of him by that contract because of an injury incurred in the performance of his services under that contract.” In other words, if a player is injured at the time a payment becomes due or an existing obligation becomes fully guaranteed, he can’t be cut. If he is, he gets whatever money he would have earned if he hadn’t been cut. On the surface, it’s irrelevant because the 49ers continue to say that they’re keeping Kaepernick beyond April 1. Which isn’t simply puffing, as one source with knowledge of the situation told PFT. But the truth is that the 49ers, who aspire to “win with class,” apparently won’t be rolling the dice on the nothing-to-lose argument that ditching an injured Kaepernick before his salary becomes fully guaranteed avoids the obligation. It doesn’t mean he can’t later be traded, but whoever would acquire his services would be stuck with the full salary. And once the full salary becomes fully guaranteed, Kaepernick has far less of a reason to take less in order to facilitate a trade. To summarize, the 49ers can dump Kaepernick and avoid the $11.9 million in guaranteed 2016 salary only if he passes a physical before Friday. Currently, there’s no indication that he’s able to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 6 minutes ago, Dcat said: There is an article today that says the April 1 deadline for the guaranty can't be used if he is injured (which, technically Kaep still is). If they cut him before that date, the money is still guaranteed due to his injury guarantee. Can't find the link. and I just read it somewhere this morning too. Profootballtalk.com 49ers may already be stuck with Kaepernick’s 2016 salary Posted by Mike Florio on March 27, 2016, 9:14 AM EDT Getty Images April Fool’s Day may have no relevance to the 49ers and Colin Kaepernick, after all. The trio of offseason surgeries to Kaepernick (including a left shoulder procedure that landed him on IR in November) may have already tied the team’s hands as to the $11.9 million in salary owed to Kaepernick in 2016. Technically guaranteed for injury only until April 1, if the 49ers were to cut him while still injured they likely would owe him the money — even if Kaepernick later becomes healthy. Per a source with knowledge of the NFL Players Association’s position on the matter, the union would argue that cutting Kaepernick before April 1, if he’s still injured, results in the salary becoming fully guaranteed and unavoidable, absent whatever offset the 49ers would receive if/when Kaepernick signs with another team in 2016. But he could take a one-year, minimum-salary deal elsewhere if he wanted, with the 49ers on the hook for the difference between what he gets in a new city and the $11.9 million. Common sense would suggest that cutting Kaepernick before the salary becomes fully guaranteed would keep the team on the hook only if he’s still injured when the regular season arrives, since the money was guaranteed for injury only prior to April 1. But Article 44 of the Collective Bargaining Agreement, which sets forth the procedure for an injury grievance, generally defines the term broadly to encompass any situation in which a player contract is terminated at a time when the player “was physically unable to perform the services required of him by that contract because of an injury incurred in the performance of his services under that contract.” In other words, if a player is injured at the time a payment becomes due or an existing obligation becomes fully guaranteed, he can’t be cut. If he is, he gets whatever money he would have earned if he hadn’t been cut. On the surface, it’s irrelevant because the 49ers continue to say that they’re keeping Kaepernick beyond April 1. Which isn’t simply puffing, as one source with knowledge of the situation told PFT. But the truth is that the 49ers, who aspire to “win with class,” apparently won’t be rolling the dice on the nothing-to-lose argument that ditching an injured Kaepernick before his salary becomes fully guaranteed avoids the obligation. It doesn’t mean he can’t later be traded, but whoever would acquire his services would be stuck with the full salary. And once the full salary becomes fully guaranteed, Kaepernick has far less of a reason to take less in order to facilitate a trade. To summarize, the 49ers can dump Kaepernick and avoid the $11.9 million in guaranteed 2016 salary only if he passes a physical before Friday. Currently, there’s no indication that he’s able to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 4 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said: Looks like you could be right, if you believe Florio: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/03/27/49ers-may-already-be-stuck-with-kaepernicks-2016-salary/ April Fool’s Day may have no relevance to the 49ers and Colin Kaepernick, after all. The trio of offseason surgeries to Kaepernick (including a left shoulder procedure that landed him on IR in November) may have already tied the team’s hands as to the $11.9 million in salary owed to Kaepernick in 2016. Technically guaranteed for injury only until April 1, if the 49ers were to cut him while still injured they likely would owe him the money — even if Kaepernick later becomes healthy. Per a source with knowledge of the NFL Players Association’s position on the matter, the union would argue that cutting Kaepernick before April 1, if he’s still injured, results in the salary becoming fully guaranteed and unavoidable, absent whatever offset the 49ers would receive if/when Kaepernick signs with another team in 2016. But he could take a one-year, minimum-salary deal elsewhere if he wanted, with the 49ers on the hook for the difference between what he gets in a new city and the $11.9 million. Common sense would suggest that cutting Kaepernick before the salary becomes fully guaranteed would keep the team on the hook only if he’s still injured when the regular season arrives, since the money was guaranteed for injury only prior to April 1. But Article 44 of the Collective Bargaining Agreement, which sets forth the procedure for an injury grievance, generally defines the term broadly to encompass any situation in which a player contract is terminated at a time when the player “was physically unable to perform the services required of him by that contract because of an injury incurred in the performance of his services under that contract.” In other words, if a player is injured at the time a payment becomes due or an existing obligation becomes fully guaranteed, he can’t be cut. If he is, he gets whatever money he would have earned if he hadn’t been cut. On the surface, it’s irrelevant because the 49ers continue to say that they’re keeping Kaepernick beyond April 1. Which isn’t simply puffing, as one source with knowledge of the situation told PFT. But the truth is that the 49ers, who aspire to “win with class,” apparently won’t be rolling the dice on the nothing-to-lose argument that ditching an injured Kaepernick before his salary becomes fully guaranteed avoids the obligation. It doesn’t mean he can’t later be traded, but whoever would acquire his services would be stuck with the full salary. And once the full salary becomes fully guaranteed, Kaepernick has far less of a reason to take less in order to facilitate a trade. To summarize, the 49ers can dump Kaepernick and avoid the $11.9 million in guaranteed 2016 salary only if he passes a physical before Friday. Currently, there’s no indication that he’s able to do so. there it is. I should have looked at Kelly's cut and paste posts. It was right there. Every once in a while his posts come in handy. er... her posts? Oh WTF? Whatever gender he feels like being today, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 12 minutes ago, Paradis said: Yaaa at running back maybe. Or guard. Not your QB... Not in this situation Cmon. Wake up you guys. A front office like Mike in his 2nd year, isn't BUMBLING his way through March with no QB and no plan. There's a plan. And if Glennon was part of that plan, then he'd already be here. Mike Glennon is not worth 30 freaking pages either btw completely agree with the bolded text. But on draft day, Glennon could easily be dealt by the Bucs to anyone for picks. That includes the Jets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 36 minutes ago, Paradis said: Yaaa at running back maybe. Or guard. Not your QB... Not in this situation Cmon. Wake up you guys. A front office like Mike in his 2nd year, isn't BUMBLING his way through March with no QB and no plan. There's a plan. And if Glennon was part of that plan, then he'd already be here. Mike Glennon is not worth 30 freaking pages either btw Glennon could still be a part of their plans at QB; he could be the fallback option if they fail to draft a guy they like in the first or second rounds. Lack of a deal to date doesn't necessarily mean there's a lack of interest. It could just mean that either he's a plan C or D, or the Bucs' asking price is still too high - for instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Glennon could still be a part of their plans at QB; he could be the fallback option if they fail to draft a guy they like in the first or second rounds. Lack of a deal to date doesn't necessarily mean there's a lack of interest. It could just mean that either he's a plan C or D, or the Bucs' asking price is still too high - for instance. So we're spending 30 pages talking about a contingency plan?... I doubt it. McCown is a contingency plan. Glennon is an investment. One this team isn't interested in. This energy is better used talking about lynch, Jones, cook, Allen, etc. Not wasting any more real estate posting on Mike fuggin Glennon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 50 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said: His contract for like 12 million becomes guaranteed on Friday. It makes it much more difficult to be traded for at that point. In theory, he could still be cut as well to save SF some money. Not likely, but could happen. I was just reading last night that there's a good chance he can't be cut. Certainly that the players union would have something to say on the matter. I should just look it up again (rotoworld?) but off the top of my head, Kaepernick's salary is guaranteed for injury but not for skill. What complicates that is he had offseason shoulder surgery and is still less than 100% recovered (and this is not expected to change by April 1). Therefore, since he sustained that injury while playing for the 49ers, it could be a problem if the try to cut him. That we all know they'd be cutting him for skill, and not because of any lingering injury, may not matter. On paper they'd be cutting an injured player who has an injury guarantee in his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 3 minutes ago, Paradis said: So we're spending 30 pages talking about a contingency plan?... I doubt it. McCown is a contingency plan. Glennon is an investment. One this team isn't interested in. This energy is better used talking about lynch, Jones, cook, Allen, etc. Not wasting any more real estate posting on Mike fuggin Glennon So then why keep adding to thread to complain about it's length? Lol. Never suggested it should be the dominant topic of conversation, just said I wouldn't discount their interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 25 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: I was just reading last night that there's a good chance he can't be cut. Certainly that the players union would have something to say on the matter. I should just look it up again (rotoworld?) but off the top of my head, Kaepernick's salary is guaranteed for injury but not for skill. What complicates that is he had offseason shoulder surgery and is still less than 100% recovered (and this is not expected to change by April 1). Therefore, since he sustained that injury while playing for the 49ers, it could be a problem if the try to cut him. That we all know they'd be cutting him for skill, and not because of any lingering injury, may not matter. On paper they'd be cutting an injured player who has an injury guarantee in his contract. the link and article is right here in Kelly's latest post on Kaep. The thought is that if they cut him, the injury guarantee applies anyway, so the 4/1 "deadline" has no effect. Technically, I'm not sure how cutting him means they are cutting him based on injury, but they'd be crazy to cut him and still be liable for the $11.9 mill. I got a feeling that Kaep will be starting for SFO next year unless some other team wants to take on that miserable contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenwichjetfan Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 On 3/20/2016 at 0:08 PM, Scott Dierking said: And, Fitzgerald also said the Jets are the team he would like to play for. Larry to the Jets?!?! Make it happen TANNY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 I hope we can actually get this thread to 30 pages and beyond. Piss off some more people lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage69 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 4 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: I hope we can actually get this thread to 30 pages and beyond. Piss off some more people lol. Your doing a better job for MG then his agent is.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 6 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: I hope we can actually get this thread to 30 pages and beyond. Piss off some more people lol. I'm happy to help in any way I can. Like saying "Just say no to failed backup QB's 2016". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 1 minute ago, Savage69 said: Your doing a better job for MG then his agent is.. I'll make sure to save your comment when its time to receive my share of Glennon's contract. lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 3 minutes ago, Warfish said: I'm happy to help in any way I can. Like saying "Just say no to failed backup QB's 2016". lmao! Bet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 9 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: lmao! Bet! You know, as long winded as both you and I can be, 30 should be rather easy tbqh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 10 minutes ago, Warfish said: You know, as long winded as both you and I can be, 30 should be rather easy tbqh. I rather argue with you guys about Glennon back and forth instead of ending up with Geno as our starter. Everyone of us are staring our our computer screens like: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 14 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: I rather argue with you guys about Glennon back and forth instead of ending up with Geno as our starter. Everyone of us are staring our our computer screens like: I prefer any other vaguely qualified person to play QB over Geno Smith. so with that said, it appears we agree. Glennon, as a member of the class of "any other vaguely qualified person" > Geno Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFJF Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 6 hours ago, Paradis said: Yaaa at running back maybe. Or guard. Not your QB... Not in this situation Cmon. Wake up you guys. A front office like Mike in his 2nd year, isn't BUMBLING his way through March with no QB and no plan. There's a plan. And if Glennon was part of that plan, then he'd already be here. Mike Glennon is not worth 30 freaking pages either btw Much like Fitz's value, the free agent market will dictate. If Glennon thread reaches or surpasses 30 pages then he was worth that. If Glennon only generates 2 pages, then that's all he was worth. The board decides what any one thread is worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Much like Fitz's value, the free agent market will dictate. If Glennon thread reaches or surpasses 30 pages then he was worth that. If Glennon only generates 2 pages, then that's all he was worth. The board decides what any one thread is worth. How about no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFJF Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Just now, Paradis said: How about no. I guess when you look at it that way. BTW...page 28. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted April 10, 2016 Share Posted April 10, 2016 The Tampa Bay Buccaneers have said repeatedly that they're talking to teams about possibly trading Mike Glennon, but no one knows how close they are to making that a reality. We are getting more and more hints that it's a serious possibility, though. There's the fact that they kept a third quarterback on the roster for all of last season in Ryan Griffin, something very few teams do these days. And now reports are coming in that they're working out quarterbacks as well. Stanford's Kevin Hogan told Sirius XM that the Bucs worked him out, while they've also worked out Arkansas quarterback Brandon Allen, per Greg Auman. Some of this may be just your generic due diligence that any team does, but it fits with all the Glennon trade rumor rumblings -- which have, incidentally, died down a little in recent weeks. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Bucs trade Glennon for a pick, and then draft a quarterback to replace him just a little later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted April 10, 2016 Share Posted April 10, 2016 On 3/28/2016 at 6:14 PM, Paradis said: How about no. + 10,000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeJet22 Posted April 10, 2016 Share Posted April 10, 2016 Alot of peeps here have convinced themselves that he's the answer, when in reality he may be no better than our own Geno Smith. Pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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