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Inside Mike Maccagnan's Process


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8 hours ago, peebag said:

So it's not a "win now" team but a team in rebuild mode...hhhmmmm.

 

So why did we bring back Fitzy?

Because there just weren't any legitimate alternatives at QB this past offseason. The Jets have been picking QBs in the draft for the past decade or so hoping that they land a 4th-rounder-turned-Tom-Brady miracle, which is like trying to find a scientific way to win lotto. Let's face reality, Petty will never be anything more than another version of Kellen Clemens, and I don't think Hack is ready to put on an NFL jock strap, let alone start. We've all seen what happens when Geno Smith steps onto the field, although I still would be curious to see what he can do with Brandon Marshall and Decker if they were healthy. 

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4 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

There is no doubt this team had playoffs written all over it.

We were supposed to have a monster DL

We signed and drafted fast LB's which has been a weakness for quite some time.

Rebuilding teams do not sign 30+ year old players teams that think they can win now do. Unfortunately our Head Coach is a moron and has no clue how to deal with the personnel he's been given and it glaringly obvious. I really think this guy is getting close to losing this locker room as well as the players on the field

Mauldin and Lee can be classified as speed rushers if used correctly but Mauldin does not see the field much as of late and Lee is still getting comfortable in this crappy ass defense we run. After 5 games Bowles still can not see that his corners need some help over top since teams are burning us weekly and they are doing it the exact same way with no adjustment from the Jets.

Physically and talent wise this team was in every game this year but when you cant coach and adjust you simply cant win

The 4 DT DL is an abortion. The Jets are too slow off the edges to get to the QB. They have a 3/4 LB Corps. So most times this group is playing out of position. 

The loss of Snacks has hurt this team. The signing of another DT who now starts has compounded the issue. I just don't see how the HC or DC can be held accountable for that.

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7 hours ago, JiF said:

The facts are obvious and completely support my claim.  Mac spent a fortune on a vet secondary, traded for a vet WR, traded vet QB, signed a LT, DT and RB.  His draft was nothing but supplemental picks to fill holes. See no further than reaching for an ILB in the first round as they couldnt land one in FA and had to fill the loss of Davis.  And he dumped nearly all the young talent from the other regime to make way for this veteran led playoff bound team.

Everything Mac has done is a win now approach.  Everything.

I think Mac could be scouting any number of players from ND and Clemson.  I also think he was held hostage by Ryan Fitzpatrick and drafted the least NFL ready QB in the draft in the 2nd round and is currently carrying 4 sh*tty QB's.  So there is a great chance he has no ******* clue how to handle the QB position.

 

I don't agree with the bolded, wasn't Erin Henderson signed before the draft to be the starter?

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6 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

Better college career not necessarily a far better prospect.

In all honesty,  It is hard to imagine a more inaccurate passer than Hackenberg. I think CC will be ready and far more quickly. I saw Hack in his last year and while his team was of no help at all, Hack was downright brutal most times.  Missed receivers by 5 or more yards. Tools do not a quarterback make.

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4 hours ago, PatsFanTX said:

 


Sheldon is untradable, just like Revis.

Mac needs to eat that mess, and just move on.
 

 

Actually, he's not untradable. $8mil next year. Someone would pay up if he has a big year. You won't get a 1st for him but maybe like a conditional 3rd or so. 

Mo was at like $15 mil tag n was looking for a 100 mil deal. Sheldon would be at $8mil. Having said that, it wouldn't be wise to trade away Sheldon. 

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9 hours ago, Matt39 said:

@Sperm Edwards did we lose a comp pick on Snacks because we signed Jenkins from the Bears?

Short answer or long answer? Short answer is yes, but more "yes and no" depending upon how you look at it. Also since I have something of an allergy to giving short answers:

We lost 3 UFAs (remember players cut don't count, nor do players signed elsewhere for the league minimum, like Douzable, Allen, Walls, etc.)

  1. Snacks (likely 4th round comp pick)
  2. Ivory (likely 5th round)
  3. D.Davis (likely 6th round)

We signed 3 UFAs from other teams:

  1. Forte
  2. McLendon
  3. Jenkins

We also re-signed 3 of our own UFAs in Powell, Fitzpatrick, and in the strictest sense, Mo. Had we not signed any of them, we'd have been due a comp pick for any/all of them as well (up to a maximum of 4 cumulatively for the year). The formula doesn't really care if you're adding one that is so much less valuable than you lost, if the totals are equal. Like you brought up, Jenkins vs. Snacks. However if that number is not equal (i.e. we lost one more than we gained) the formula will try to match up lost and gained ones.

So:

Lost Ivory $7M: signed Forte $4M. Lost Davis $4M, signed McLendon $3M. That leaves us with lost Snacks $9M...signed Jenkins $3M. Even though Snacks got $9M per on a long deal and Jenkins $3M per on a short deal, yes they'd cancel each other out because there's no one else less valuable for Jenkins to cancel.

The reason I say "yes and no" is merely because it wasn't Jenkins specifically that cancelled out Snacks. More like we lost 3 and picked up 3. Up to you how you want to claim who was cancelled out by whom. But the reason I say short answer is yes is because Forte and McLendon are starters so it could be better argued they were "worth" losing the pick. Adding Jenkins ended up being just idiotic, so my short answer is yes Jenkins cancelled out Snacks. Therefore, indirectly, we gave up a 4th round pick next year to sign Jenkins on a 1 yr $3M deal plus a 1 yr $3M team option. If/when we don't re-sign Jenkins, we'd recoup a comp pick as long as someone forks over more than the league minimum, but it won't be worth nearly a 4th rounder in 2017. Best realistic hope is a 7th rounder in 2018 or 2019, but even that would require Maccagnan to let it happen, and he's as bad as Tannenbaum at throwing away comp picks on backup scrubs, so forget it. Also a 7th rd comp pick rarely has any tangible value anyway.

If one wanted to be fair to MM, which I personally don't want to be right now, he was desperately trying to trade Mo (and failed). The idea was (presumably) after he'd traded Mo then we'd need depth behind Sheldon and Williams. I'm guessing Jenkins was brought in to be that depth. Then on top of that, it wasn't yet known how many games Sheldon would be suspended back in the early spring when we signed Jenkins. That's the best case to be made for signing Jenkins. Frankly it's still a sucky answer. One doesn't trade a 4th rounder to rent a meh player to maybe start for somewhere between 1-8 games at $3M (if he doesn't get injured himself). We could have just brought back Douzable and it wouldn't have cost us a pick at all. Just mindless.

Little things like this are why I don't think much of Maccagnan as a GM. Give up a pick here, give up a pick there, and before you know it we've surrendered a handful of picks in 2 offseasons, from a guy who's supposed to know what to do with them when we're on the clock. Honestly it's one of the things Idzik did very well (unfortunately he then botched the picks themselves, making it moot in the end). Re-signing Douzable for $800K and no pick, instead of Jenkins at over 3x that amount plus a 4th rounder, was a no-brainer move. It only makes it worse that we're now short another 4th rounder next year because we traded it for a 5th rounder this year to draft Shell. 

Any other short questions for me? lol

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NY Jets: An Open Letter to Mike Maccagnan on the State of His Team

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8 hours ago, j4jets said:

Actually, he's not untradable. $8mil next year. Someone would pay up if he has a big year. You won't get a 1st for him but maybe like a conditional 3rd or so. 

Mo was at like $15 mil tag n was looking for a 100 mil deal. Sheldon would be at $8mil. Having said that, it wouldn't be wise to trade away Sheldon. 

Why wouldn't it be wise? He's got no position here and he's a redundant asset. There's no need for him on this team and he's also a strike away from a real long suspension. Get what you can for him and move on. 

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1 hour ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Why wouldn't it be wise? He's got no position here and he's a redundant asset. There's no need for him on this team and he's also a strike away from a real long suspension. Get what you can for him and move on. 

Exactly. You pick two.

  • If you want Mo and Sheldon, you don't pick Williams. 
  • If you pick Williams, you choose between Mo and Sheldon. 

What you don't do is keep all 3 and either out two of them out of position in a nickel base, or one of them out of position when going back to a 3-4 base. 

After having extended Mo, there is only one answer. Maybe if one wanted to see if all 3 of them (and McLendon) could work 4 across, in more than just run defense, one could rationalize keeping Sheldon for 2016 because they're all so talented. Now that it's shown it's one DT body too many, no matter how talented Sheldon is, at $8M it points to only one answer. 

 

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6 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Short answer or long answer? Short answer is yes, but more "yes and no" depending upon how you look at it. Also since I have something of an allergy to giving short answers:

We lost 3 UFAs (remember players cut don't count, nor do players signed elsewhere for the league minimum, like Douzable, Allen, Walls, etc.)

  1. Snacks (likely 4th round comp pick)
  2. Ivory (likely 5th round)
  3. D.Davis (likely 6th round)

We signed 3 UFAs from other teams:

  1. Forte
  2. McLendon
  3. Jenkins

We also re-signed 3 of our own UFAs in Powell, Fitzpatrick, and in the strictest sense, Mo. Had we not signed any of them, we'd have been due a comp pick for any/all of them as well (up to a maximum of 4 cumulatively for the year). The formula doesn't really care if you're adding one that is so much less valuable than you lost, if the totals are equal. Like you brought up, Jenkins vs. Snacks. However if that number is not equal (i.e. we lost one more than we gained) the formula will try to match up lost and gained ones.

So:

Lost Ivory $7M: signed Forte $4M. Lost Davis $4M, signed McLendon $3M. That leaves us with lost Snacks $9M...signed Jenkins $3M. Even though Snacks got $9M per on a long deal and Jenkins $3M per on a short deal, yes they'd cancel each other out because there's no one else less valuable for Jenkins to cancel.

The reason I say "yes and no" is merely because it wasn't Jenkins specifically that cancelled out Snacks. More like we lost 3 and picked up 3. Up to you how you want to claim who was cancelled out by whom. But the reason I say short answer is yes is because Forte and McLendon are starters so it could be better argued they were "worth" losing the pick. Adding Jenkins ended up being just idiotic, so my short answer is yes Jenkins cancelled out Snacks. Therefore, indirectly, we gave up a 4th round pick next year to sign Jenkins on a 1 yr $3M deal plus a 1 yr $3M team option. If/when we don't re-sign Jenkins, we'd recoup a comp pick as long as someone forks over more than the league minimum, but it won't be worth nearly a 4th rounder in 2017. Best realistic hope is a 7th rounder in 2018 or 2019, but even that would require Maccagnan to let it happen, and he's as bad as Tannenbaum at throwing away comp picks on backup scrubs, so forget it. Also a 7th rd comp pick rarely has any tangible value anyway.

If one wanted to be fair to MM, which I personally don't want to be right now, he was desperately trying to trade Mo (and failed). The idea was (presumably) after he'd traded Mo then we'd need depth behind Sheldon and Williams. I'm guessing Jenkins was brought in to be that depth. Then on top of that, it wasn't yet known how many games Sheldon would be suspended back in the early spring when we signed Jenkins. That's the best case to be made for signing Jenkins. Frankly it's still a sucky answer. One doesn't trade a 4th rounder to rent a meh player to maybe start for somewhere between 1-8 games at $3M (if he doesn't get injured himself). We could have just brought back Douzable and it wouldn't have cost us a pick at all. Just mindless.

Little things like this are why I don't think much of Maccagnan as a GM. Give up a pick here, give up a pick there, and before you know it we've surrendered a handful of picks in 2 offseasons, from a guy who's supposed to know what to do with them when we're on the clock. Honestly it's one of the things Idzik did very well (unfortunately he then botched the picks themselves, making it moot in the end). Re-signing Douzable for $800K and no pick, instead of Jenkins at over 3x that amount plus a 4th rounder, was a no-brainer move. It only makes it worse that we're now short another 4th rounder next year because we traded it for a 5th rounder this year to draft Shell. 

Any other short questions for me? lol

All you needed was Jason's Comp Pick explanation and cancellation chart.  No need to write a treatise.

 this:  http://overthecap.com/compensatory-draft-picks-cancellation-chart/

  • AFC East

    • Buffalo Bills
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Nigel Bradham 6 $3,500,000 Zach Brown 7 $1,250,000
      Ron Brooks 7 $1,833,333 Lorenzo Alexander 7 $885,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Corey White 7 $840,000
        Robert Blanton 7 $840,000
        Colt Anderson 7 $840,000
    • New England Patriots
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Akiem Hicks 6 $5,000,000  
      Tavon Wilson 7 $1,100,000 Shea McClellin 7 $2,816,666
    • Miami Dolphins
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 4 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Olivier Vernon 3 $16,750,000  
      Lamar Miller 5 $6,500,000  
      Rishard Matthews 6 $5,000,000 Isa Abdul-Quddus 6 $4,250,000
      Derrick Shelby 6 $4,450,000 Andre Branch 7 $2,703,125
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Kelvin Sheppard 7 $840,000 Sam Young 7 $910,000
    • New York Jets
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Damon Harrison 4 $9,000,000 Matt Forte 6 $4,000,000
      Chris Ivory 5 $6,400,000 Steve McLendon 6 $3,500,000
      Demario Davis 6 $3,900,000 Jarvis Jenkins 7 $2,250,000
  • AFC North

    • Baltimore Ravens
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Kelechi Osemele 3 $11,200,000  
      Matt Schaub 7 $1,750,000 Eric Weddle 4 $6,500,000
      Courtney Upshaw 7 $1,250,000 Ben Watson 7 $3,500,000
    • Cleveland Browns
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 6 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Alex Mack 3 $9,000,000  
      Tashaun Gipson 4 $7,106,250  
      Mitchell Schwartz 4 $6,512,000  
      Travis Benjamin 5 $6,000,000  
      Johnson Bademosi 7 $2,250,000 Demario Davis 6 $3,900,000
      Craig Robertson 7 $1,333,333  
    • Cincinnati Bengals
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 6 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Marvin Jones 4 $8,000,000  
      Mohamed Sanu 5 $6,500,000  
      Reggie Nelson 6 $4,000,000  
      Andre Smith 6 $3,218,750  
      Emmanuel Lamur 7 $2,700,000  
      Wallace Gilberry 7 $1,225,000  
    • Pittsburgh Steelers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 5 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Kelvin Beachum 5 $5,375,000  
      Steve McLendon 6 $3,500,000 Ladarius Green 6 $5,000,000
      Sean Spence 7 $2,468,750 Ryan Harris 7 $1,950,000
      Antwon Blake 7 $1,500,000  
      Will Johnson 7 $1,150,000  
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Byron Stingily 7 $780,000 Steven Johnson 7 $840,000
      Jordan Todman 7 $760,000 Ricardo Mathews 7 $760,000
  • AFC South

    • Houston Texans
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Brock Osweiler 3 $18,000,000
      Brandon Brooks 4 $8,000,000 Jeff Allen 4 $6,875,000
      Jared Crick 7 $1,750,000 Lamar Miller 5 $6,500,000
      Ben Jones 6 $4,375,000 Tony Bergstrom 7 $2,875,000
    • Indianapolis Colts
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Coby Fleener 4 $7,120,000  
      Jerrell Freeman 6 $4,000,000 Patrick Robinson 6 $4,666,667
      Dwight Lowery 7 $2,400,000 Scott Tolzien 7 $1,750,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Greg Toler 7 $840,000 Robert Turbin 7 $760,000
      Colt Anderson 7 $840,000 Jordan Todman 7 $760,000
    • Jacksonville Jaguars
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Malik Jackson 3 $14,250,000
        Tashaun Gipson 4 $7,106,250
        Chris Ivory 5 $6,400,000
      Stefen Wisniewski 7 $1,510,000 Kelvin Beachum 5 $5,375,000
      Bryan Anger 7 $1,750,000 Prince Amukamara 6 $5,343,750
      Andre Branch 7 $2,703,125 Brad Nortman 7 $2,200,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Sam Young 7 $910,000  
    • Tennessee Titans
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Ben Jones 6 $4,375,000
        Rishard Matthews 6 $5,000,000
      Joe Looney 7 $1,660,000 Sean Spence 7 $2,468,750
      Zach Brown 7 $1,250,000 Rashad Johnson 7 $2,000,000
        Matt Cassel 7 $2,000,000
        Antwon Blake 7 $1,500,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Steven Johnson 7 $840,000  
  • AFC West

    • Denver Broncos
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 7 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Brock Osweiler 3 $18,000,000  
      Malik Jackson 3 $14,250,000  
      Danny Trevathan 5 $6,025,000  
      Evan Mathis 6 $4,000,000 Russell Okung 6 $4,000,000
      David Bruton 7 $2,962,500 Donald Stephenson 6 $4,666,667
      Vernon Davis 7 $2,281,250 Jared Crick 7 $1,750,000
      Ryan Harris 7 $1,950,000  
    • Kansas City Chiefs
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 5 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Sean Smith 3 $9,250,000  
      Jeff Allen 4 $6,875,000 Mitchell Schwartz 4 $6,512,000
      Chase Daniel 5 $7,000,000  
      Donald Stephenson 6 $4,666,667  
      Tyvon Branch 6 $4,000,000  
    • San Diego Chargers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Eric Weddle 4 $6,500,000 Travis Benjamin 5 $6,000,000
      Patrick Robinson 6 $4,666,667 Casey Hayward 6 $5,100,000
      Ladarius Green 6 $5,000,000 Brandon Mebane 6 $4,500,000
        Dwight Lowery 7 $2,400,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Ricardo Mathews 7 $760,000  
    • Oakland Raiders
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Kelechi Osemele 3 $11,200,000
      Lorenzo Alexander 7 $885,000 Sean Smith 3 $9,250,000
      Tony Bergstrom 7 $2,875,000 Bruce Irvin 4 $9,000,000
      J’Marcus Webb 7 $2,870,000 Reggie Nelson 6 $4,000,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Rod Streater 7 $810,000  
  • NFC East

    • New York Giants
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 5
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Olivier Vernon 3 $16,750,000
        Janoris Jenkins 3 $12,400,000
        Damon Harrison 4 $9,000,000
      Robert Ayers 5 $6,500,000 Keenan Robinson 7 $2,434,375
      Prince Amukamara 6 $5,343,750 Will Johnson 7 $1,150,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Kelvin Sheppard 7 $840,000
        Bobby Rainey 7 $840,000
        Byron Stingily 7 $780,000
    • Dallas Cowboys
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Cedric Thornton 6 $4,250,000
      Matt Cassel 7 $2,000,000 Alfred Morris 7 $1,750,000
        Joe Looney 7 $1,660,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Robert Turbin 7 $760,000  
    • Philadelphia Eagles
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Brandon Brooks 4 $8,000,000
        Rodney McLeod 4 $7,000,000
        Chase Daniel 5 $7,000,000
      Cedric Thornton 6 $4,250,000 Nigel Bradham 6 $3,500,000
        Ron Brooks 7 $1,833,333
        Stefen Wisniewski 7 $1,510,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Thaddeus Lewis 7 $760,000  
    • Washington Redskins
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Josh Norman 3 $15,000,000
      Keenan Robinson 7 $2,434,375 David Bruton 7 $2,962,500
      Alfred Morris 7 $1,750,000 Vernon Davis 7 $2,281,250
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Greg Toler 7 $840,000
  • NFC North

    • Chicago Bears
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 5
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Bobby Massie 5 $5,868,750
        Danny Trevathan 5 $6,025,000
      Matt Forte 6 $4,000,000 Akiem Hicks 6 $5,000,000
      Jarvis Jenkins 7 $2,250,000 Jerrell Freeman 6 $4,000,000
      Shea McClellin 7 $2,816,666 Ted Larsen 7 $1,562,500
    • Detroit Lions
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 5
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Marvin Jones 4 $8,000,000
      Isa Abdul-Quddus 6 $4,250,000 Johnson Bademosi 7 $2,250,000
        Rafael Bush 7 $1,265,625
        Wallace Gilberry 7 $1,225,000
        Tavon Wilson 7 $1,100,000
    • Green Bay Packers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Casey Hayward 6 $5,100,000  
      Scott Tolzien 7 $1,750,000  
    • Minnesota Vikings
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Alex Boone 5 $6,600,000
        Andre Smith 6 $3,218,750
      Josh Robinson 7 $2,000,000 Emmanuel Lamur 7 $2,700,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Robert Blanton 7 $840,000  
  • NFC South

    • Atlanta Falcons
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Alex Mack 3 $9,000,000
        Mohamed Sanu 5 $6,500,000
        Derrick Shelby 6 $4,450,000
      Gino Gradkowski 7 $1,050,000 Matt Schaub 7 $1,750,000
        Sean Weatherspoon 7 $1,468,750
        Courtney Upshaw 7 $1,250,000
    • Carolina Panthers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Josh Norman 3 $15,000,000  
      Brad Nortman 7 $2,200,000 Gino Gradkowski 7 $1,050,000
    • New Orleans Saints
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Coby Fleener 4 $7,120,000
      Ben Watson 7 $3,500,000 Nick Fairley 7 $3,000,000
      Rafael Bush 7 $1,265,625 Craig Robertson 7 $1,333,333
    • Tampa Bay Buccaneers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 0 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Robert Ayers 5 $6,500,000
        J.R. Sweezy 5 $6,500,000
        Josh Robinson 7 $2,000,000
        Bryan Anger 7 $1,750,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Bobby Rainey 7 $840,000  
  • NFC West

    • Arizona Cardinals
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 5 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Bobby Massie 5 $5,868,750  
      Rashad Johnson 7 $2,000,000 Evan Mathis 6 $4,000,000
      Sean Weatherspoon 7 $1,468,750 Tyvon Branch 6 $4,000,000
      Ted Larsen 7 $1,562,500  
      Bradley Sowell 7 $1,000,000  
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Corey White 7 $840,000  
    • Los Angeles Rams
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Janoris Jenkins 3 $12,400,000  
      Rodney McLeod 4 $7,000,000  
      Nick Fairley 7 $3,000,000  
    • San Francisco 49ers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Alex Boone 5 $6,600,000  
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Rod Streater 7 $810,000
        Thaddeus Lewis 7 $760,000
    • Seattle Seahawks
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 4 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Bruce Irvin 4 $9,000,000  
      J.R. Sweezy 5 $6,500,000  
      Russell Okung 6 $4,000,000 Bradley Sowell 7 $1,000,000
      Brandon Mebane 6 $4,500,000 J’Marcus Webb 7 $2,870,000

 

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1 hour ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Why wouldn't it be wise? He's got no position here and he's a redundant asset. There's no need for him on this team and he's also a strike away from a real long suspension. Get what you can for him and move on. 

Thanks Mangini

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10 hours ago, maury77 said:

I don't agree with the bolded, wasn't Erin Henderson signed before the draft to be the starter?

You're right, they did resign him but I dont think Erin Henderson prevents you from getting better at the position, especially when David Harris is a wet log.

I think Lee was 100% a move that they thought filled the only void on the defensive side of the ball.  We already know Bowles bitched about drafting Paxton Lynch, you dont think this has his hands all over it after that Buffalo game?

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Dcat said:

All you needed was Jason's Comp Pick explanation and cancellation chart.  No need to write a treatise.

 this:  http://overthecap.com/compensatory-draft-picks-cancellation-chart/

  • AFC East

    • Buffalo Bills
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Nigel Bradham 6 $3,500,000 Zach Brown 7 $1,250,000
      Ron Brooks 7 $1,833,333 Lorenzo Alexander 7 $885,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Corey White 7 $840,000
        Robert Blanton 7 $840,000
        Colt Anderson 7 $840,000
    • New England Patriots
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Akiem Hicks 6 $5,000,000  
      Tavon Wilson 7 $1,100,000 Shea McClellin 7 $2,816,666
    • Miami Dolphins
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 4 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Olivier Vernon 3 $16,750,000  
      Lamar Miller 5 $6,500,000  
      Rishard Matthews 6 $5,000,000 Isa Abdul-Quddus 6 $4,250,000
      Derrick Shelby 6 $4,450,000 Andre Branch 7 $2,703,125
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Kelvin Sheppard 7 $840,000 Sam Young 7 $910,000
    • New York Jets
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Damon Harrison 4 $9,000,000 Matt Forte 6 $4,000,000
      Chris Ivory 5 $6,400,000 Steve McLendon 6 $3,500,000
      Demario Davis 6 $3,900,000 Jarvis Jenkins 7 $2,250,000
  • AFC North

    • Baltimore Ravens
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Kelechi Osemele 3 $11,200,000  
      Matt Schaub 7 $1,750,000 Eric Weddle 4 $6,500,000
      Courtney Upshaw 7 $1,250,000 Ben Watson 7 $3,500,000
    • Cleveland Browns
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 6 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Alex Mack 3 $9,000,000  
      Tashaun Gipson 4 $7,106,250  
      Mitchell Schwartz 4 $6,512,000  
      Travis Benjamin 5 $6,000,000  
      Johnson Bademosi 7 $2,250,000 Demario Davis 6 $3,900,000
      Craig Robertson 7 $1,333,333  
    • Cincinnati Bengals
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 6 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Marvin Jones 4 $8,000,000  
      Mohamed Sanu 5 $6,500,000  
      Reggie Nelson 6 $4,000,000  
      Andre Smith 6 $3,218,750  
      Emmanuel Lamur 7 $2,700,000  
      Wallace Gilberry 7 $1,225,000  
    • Pittsburgh Steelers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 5 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Kelvin Beachum 5 $5,375,000  
      Steve McLendon 6 $3,500,000 Ladarius Green 6 $5,000,000
      Sean Spence 7 $2,468,750 Ryan Harris 7 $1,950,000
      Antwon Blake 7 $1,500,000  
      Will Johnson 7 $1,150,000  
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Byron Stingily 7 $780,000 Steven Johnson 7 $840,000
      Jordan Todman 7 $760,000 Ricardo Mathews 7 $760,000
  • AFC South

    • Houston Texans
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Brock Osweiler 3 $18,000,000
      Brandon Brooks 4 $8,000,000 Jeff Allen 4 $6,875,000
      Jared Crick 7 $1,750,000 Lamar Miller 5 $6,500,000
      Ben Jones 6 $4,375,000 Tony Bergstrom 7 $2,875,000
    • Indianapolis Colts
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Coby Fleener 4 $7,120,000  
      Jerrell Freeman 6 $4,000,000 Patrick Robinson 6 $4,666,667
      Dwight Lowery 7 $2,400,000 Scott Tolzien 7 $1,750,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Greg Toler 7 $840,000 Robert Turbin 7 $760,000
      Colt Anderson 7 $840,000 Jordan Todman 7 $760,000
    • Jacksonville Jaguars
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Malik Jackson 3 $14,250,000
        Tashaun Gipson 4 $7,106,250
        Chris Ivory 5 $6,400,000
      Stefen Wisniewski 7 $1,510,000 Kelvin Beachum 5 $5,375,000
      Bryan Anger 7 $1,750,000 Prince Amukamara 6 $5,343,750
      Andre Branch 7 $2,703,125 Brad Nortman 7 $2,200,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Sam Young 7 $910,000  
    • Tennessee Titans
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Ben Jones 6 $4,375,000
        Rishard Matthews 6 $5,000,000
      Joe Looney 7 $1,660,000 Sean Spence 7 $2,468,750
      Zach Brown 7 $1,250,000 Rashad Johnson 7 $2,000,000
        Matt Cassel 7 $2,000,000
        Antwon Blake 7 $1,500,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Steven Johnson 7 $840,000  
  • AFC West

    • Denver Broncos
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 7 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Brock Osweiler 3 $18,000,000  
      Malik Jackson 3 $14,250,000  
      Danny Trevathan 5 $6,025,000  
      Evan Mathis 6 $4,000,000 Russell Okung 6 $4,000,000
      David Bruton 7 $2,962,500 Donald Stephenson 6 $4,666,667
      Vernon Davis 7 $2,281,250 Jared Crick 7 $1,750,000
      Ryan Harris 7 $1,950,000  
    • Kansas City Chiefs
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 5 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Sean Smith 3 $9,250,000  
      Jeff Allen 4 $6,875,000 Mitchell Schwartz 4 $6,512,000
      Chase Daniel 5 $7,000,000  
      Donald Stephenson 6 $4,666,667  
      Tyvon Branch 6 $4,000,000  
    • San Diego Chargers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Eric Weddle 4 $6,500,000 Travis Benjamin 5 $6,000,000
      Patrick Robinson 6 $4,666,667 Casey Hayward 6 $5,100,000
      Ladarius Green 6 $5,000,000 Brandon Mebane 6 $4,500,000
        Dwight Lowery 7 $2,400,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Ricardo Mathews 7 $760,000  
    • Oakland Raiders
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Kelechi Osemele 3 $11,200,000
      Lorenzo Alexander 7 $885,000 Sean Smith 3 $9,250,000
      Tony Bergstrom 7 $2,875,000 Bruce Irvin 4 $9,000,000
      J’Marcus Webb 7 $2,870,000 Reggie Nelson 6 $4,000,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Rod Streater 7 $810,000  
  • NFC East

    • New York Giants
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 5
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Olivier Vernon 3 $16,750,000
        Janoris Jenkins 3 $12,400,000
        Damon Harrison 4 $9,000,000
      Robert Ayers 5 $6,500,000 Keenan Robinson 7 $2,434,375
      Prince Amukamara 6 $5,343,750 Will Johnson 7 $1,150,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Kelvin Sheppard 7 $840,000
        Bobby Rainey 7 $840,000
        Byron Stingily 7 $780,000
    • Dallas Cowboys
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Cedric Thornton 6 $4,250,000
      Matt Cassel 7 $2,000,000 Alfred Morris 7 $1,750,000
        Joe Looney 7 $1,660,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Robert Turbin 7 $760,000  
    • Philadelphia Eagles
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Brandon Brooks 4 $8,000,000
        Rodney McLeod 4 $7,000,000
        Chase Daniel 5 $7,000,000
      Cedric Thornton 6 $4,250,000 Nigel Bradham 6 $3,500,000
        Ron Brooks 7 $1,833,333
        Stefen Wisniewski 7 $1,510,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Thaddeus Lewis 7 $760,000  
    • Washington Redskins
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Josh Norman 3 $15,000,000
      Keenan Robinson 7 $2,434,375 David Bruton 7 $2,962,500
      Alfred Morris 7 $1,750,000 Vernon Davis 7 $2,281,250
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Greg Toler 7 $840,000
  • NFC North

    • Chicago Bears
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 5
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Bobby Massie 5 $5,868,750
        Danny Trevathan 5 $6,025,000
      Matt Forte 6 $4,000,000 Akiem Hicks 6 $5,000,000
      Jarvis Jenkins 7 $2,250,000 Jerrell Freeman 6 $4,000,000
      Shea McClellin 7 $2,816,666 Ted Larsen 7 $1,562,500
    • Detroit Lions
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 5
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Marvin Jones 4 $8,000,000
      Isa Abdul-Quddus 6 $4,250,000 Johnson Bademosi 7 $2,250,000
        Rafael Bush 7 $1,265,625
        Wallace Gilberry 7 $1,225,000
        Tavon Wilson 7 $1,100,000
    • Green Bay Packers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Casey Hayward 6 $5,100,000  
      Scott Tolzien 7 $1,750,000  
    • Minnesota Vikings
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Alex Boone 5 $6,600,000
        Andre Smith 6 $3,218,750
      Josh Robinson 7 $2,000,000 Emmanuel Lamur 7 $2,700,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Robert Blanton 7 $840,000  
  • NFC South

    • Atlanta Falcons
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 6
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Alex Mack 3 $9,000,000
        Mohamed Sanu 5 $6,500,000
        Derrick Shelby 6 $4,450,000
      Gino Gradkowski 7 $1,050,000 Matt Schaub 7 $1,750,000
        Sean Weatherspoon 7 $1,468,750
        Courtney Upshaw 7 $1,250,000
    • Carolina Panthers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 1
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Josh Norman 3 $15,000,000  
      Brad Nortman 7 $2,200,000 Gino Gradkowski 7 $1,050,000
    • New Orleans Saints
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 2 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 3
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Coby Fleener 4 $7,120,000
      Ben Watson 7 $3,500,000 Nick Fairley 7 $3,000,000
      Rafael Bush 7 $1,265,625 Craig Robertson 7 $1,333,333
    • Tampa Bay Buccaneers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 0 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 4
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
        Robert Ayers 5 $6,500,000
        J.R. Sweezy 5 $6,500,000
        Josh Robinson 7 $2,000,000
        Bryan Anger 7 $1,750,000
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Bobby Rainey 7 $840,000  
  • NFC West

    • Arizona Cardinals
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 5 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Bobby Massie 5 $5,868,750  
      Rashad Johnson 7 $2,000,000 Evan Mathis 6 $4,000,000
      Sean Weatherspoon 7 $1,468,750 Tyvon Branch 6 $4,000,000
      Ted Larsen 7 $1,562,500  
      Bradley Sowell 7 $1,000,000  
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
      Corey White 7 $840,000  
    • Los Angeles Rams
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 3 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Janoris Jenkins 3 $12,400,000  
      Rodney McLeod 4 $7,000,000  
      Nick Fairley 7 $3,000,000  
    • San Francisco 49ers
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 1 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 0
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Alex Boone 5 $6,600,000  
      Non-Qualifying UFAs Lost Non-Qualifying UFAs Gained
        Rod Streater 7 $810,000
        Thaddeus Lewis 7 $760,000
    • Seattle Seahawks
      Qualifying UFAs Lost: 4 Qualifying UFAs Gained: 2
      Name Rd. APY Name Rd. APY
      Bruce Irvin 4 $9,000,000  
      J.R. Sweezy 5 $6,500,000  
      Russell Okung 6 $4,000,000 Bradley Sowell 7 $1,000,000
      Brandon Mebane 6 $4,500,000 J’Marcus Webb 7 $2,870,000

 

ae519cd15bc0053fce1342098a9b1143.jpg 

 

Don't correct ME.

 

Just nod and look at Miss Stein's rack.

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6 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Short answer or long answer? Short answer is yes, but more "yes and no" depending upon how you look at it. Also since I have something of an allergy to giving short answers:

We lost 3 UFAs (remember players cut don't count, nor do players signed elsewhere for the league minimum, like Douzable, Allen, Walls, etc.)

  1. Snacks (likely 4th round comp pick)
  2. Ivory (likely 5th round)
  3. D.Davis (likely 6th round)

We signed 3 UFAs from other teams:

  1. Forte
  2. McLendon
  3. Jenkins

We also re-signed 3 of our own UFAs in Powell, Fitzpatrick, and in the strictest sense, Mo. Had we not signed any of them, we'd have been due a comp pick for any/all of them as well (up to a maximum of 4 cumulatively for the year). The formula doesn't really care if you're adding one that is so much less valuable than you lost, if the totals are equal. Like you brought up, Jenkins vs. Snacks. However if that number is not equal (i.e. we lost one more than we gained) the formula will try to match up lost and gained ones.

So:

Lost Ivory $7M: signed Forte $4M. Lost Davis $4M, signed McLendon $3M. That leaves us with lost Snacks $9M...signed Jenkins $3M. Even though Snacks got $9M per on a long deal and Jenkins $3M per on a short deal, yes they'd cancel each other out because there's no one else less valuable for Jenkins to cancel.

The reason I say "yes and no" is merely because it wasn't Jenkins specifically that cancelled out Snacks. More like we lost 3 and picked up 3. Up to you how you want to claim who was cancelled out by whom. But the reason I say short answer is yes is because Forte and McLendon are starters so it could be better argued they were "worth" losing the pick. Adding Jenkins ended up being just idiotic, so my short answer is yes Jenkins cancelled out Snacks. Therefore, indirectly, we gave up a 4th round pick next year to sign Jenkins on a 1 yr $3M deal plus a 1 yr $3M team option. If/when we don't re-sign Jenkins, we'd recoup a comp pick as long as someone forks over more than the league minimum, but it won't be worth nearly a 4th rounder in 2017. Best realistic hope is a 7th rounder in 2018 or 2019, but even that would require Maccagnan to let it happen, and he's as bad as Tannenbaum at throwing away comp picks on backup scrubs, so forget it. Also a 7th rd comp pick rarely has any tangible value anyway.

If one wanted to be fair to MM, which I personally don't want to be right now, he was desperately trying to trade Mo (and failed). The idea was (presumably) after he'd traded Mo then we'd need depth behind Sheldon and Williams. I'm guessing Jenkins was brought in to be that depth. Then on top of that, it wasn't yet known how many games Sheldon would be suspended back in the early spring when we signed Jenkins. That's the best case to be made for signing Jenkins. Frankly it's still a sucky answer. One doesn't trade a 4th rounder to rent a meh player to maybe start for somewhere between 1-8 games at $3M (if he doesn't get injured himself). We could have just brought back Douzable and it wouldn't have cost us a pick at all. Just mindless.

Little things like this are why I don't think much of Maccagnan as a GM. Give up a pick here, give up a pick there, and before you know it we've surrendered a handful of picks in 2 offseasons, from a guy who's supposed to know what to do with them when we're on the clock. Honestly it's one of the things Idzik did very well (unfortunately he then botched the picks themselves, making it moot in the end). Re-signing Douzable for $800K and no pick, instead of Jenkins at over 3x that amount plus a 4th rounder, was a no-brainer move. It only makes it worse that we're now short another 4th rounder next year because we traded it for a 5th rounder this year to draft Shell. 

Any other short questions for me? lol

How's the weather?

And good post. I agree with pretty much everything you said there. I have the slightest of hopes that NFL looks at this rather non-mathematically at times, in which case McClendon for Snacks wouldn't be a wash. I say that because NFL has NEVER published the comp pick calculations. The theory, which you described, is about 99% correct. So there's a 1% chance we get a comp for Snacks. 

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22 minutes ago, JiF said:

You're right, they did resign him but I dont think Erin Henderson prevents you from getting better at the position, especially when David Harris is a wet log.

I think Lee was 100% a move that they thought filled the only void on the defensive side of the ball.  We already know Bowles bitched about drafting Paxton Lynch, you dont think this has his hands all over it after that Buffalo game?

 

 

You're using Adam Schein as a reference?

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6 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Short answer or long answer? Short answer is yes, but more "yes and no" depending upon how you look at it. Also since I have something of an allergy to giving short answers:

We lost 3 UFAs (remember players cut don't count, nor do players signed elsewhere for the league minimum, like Douzable, Allen, Walls, etc.)

  1. Snacks (likely 4th round comp pick)
  2. Ivory (likely 5th round)
  3. D.Davis (likely 6th round)

We signed 3 UFAs from other teams:

  1. Forte
  2. McLendon
  3. Jenkins

We also re-signed 3 of our own UFAs in Powell, Fitzpatrick, and in the strictest sense, Mo. Had we not signed any of them, we'd have been due a comp pick for any/all of them as well (up to a maximum of 4 cumulatively for the year). The formula doesn't really care if you're adding one that is so much less valuable than you lost, if the totals are equal. Like you brought up, Jenkins vs. Snacks. However if that number is not equal (i.e. we lost one more than we gained) the formula will try to match up lost and gained ones.

So:

Lost Ivory $7M: signed Forte $4M. Lost Davis $4M, signed McLendon $3M. That leaves us with lost Snacks $9M...signed Jenkins $3M. Even though Snacks got $9M per on a long deal and Jenkins $3M per on a short deal, yes they'd cancel each other out because there's no one else less valuable for Jenkins to cancel.

The reason I say "yes and no" is merely because it wasn't Jenkins specifically that cancelled out Snacks. More like we lost 3 and picked up 3. Up to you how you want to claim who was cancelled out by whom. But the reason I say short answer is yes is because Forte and McLendon are starters so it could be better argued they were "worth" losing the pick. Adding Jenkins ended up being just idiotic, so my short answer is yes Jenkins cancelled out Snacks. Therefore, indirectly, we gave up a 4th round pick next year to sign Jenkins on a 1 yr $3M deal plus a 1 yr $3M team option. If/when we don't re-sign Jenkins, we'd recoup a comp pick as long as someone forks over more than the league minimum, but it won't be worth nearly a 4th rounder in 2017. Best realistic hope is a 7th rounder in 2018 or 2019, but even that would require Maccagnan to let it happen, and he's as bad as Tannenbaum at throwing away comp picks on backup scrubs, so forget it. Also a 7th rd comp pick rarely has any tangible value anyway.

If one wanted to be fair to MM, which I personally don't want to be right now, he was desperately trying to trade Mo (and failed). The idea was (presumably) after he'd traded Mo then we'd need depth behind Sheldon and Williams. I'm guessing Jenkins was brought in to be that depth. Then on top of that, it wasn't yet known how many games Sheldon would be suspended back in the early spring when we signed Jenkins. That's the best case to be made for signing Jenkins. Frankly it's still a sucky answer. One doesn't trade a 4th rounder to rent a meh player to maybe start for somewhere between 1-8 games at $3M (if he doesn't get injured himself). We could have just brought back Douzable and it wouldn't have cost us a pick at all. Just mindless.

Little things like this are why I don't think much of Maccagnan as a GM. Give up a pick here, give up a pick there, and before you know it we've surrendered a handful of picks in 2 offseasons, from a guy who's supposed to know what to do with them when we're on the clock. Honestly it's one of the things Idzik did very well (unfortunately he then botched the picks themselves, making it moot in the end). Re-signing Douzable for $800K and no pick, instead of Jenkins at over 3x that amount plus a 4th rounder, was a no-brainer move. It only makes it worse that we're now short another 4th rounder next year because we traded it for a 5th rounder this year to draft Shell. 

Any other short questions for me? lol

Here's one: Maccagnan has drafted precisely one (1) impact player in two years, handed out exorbitant contracts to guys who can't play, and seemingly has no awareness of what to do in situations like the one discussed here. What does he do well?

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1 hour ago, JiF said:

You're right, they did resign him but I dont think Erin Henderson prevents you from getting better at the position, especially when David Harris is a wet log.

I think Lee was 100% a move that they thought filled the only void on the defensive side of the ball.  We already know Bowles bitched about drafting Paxton Lynch, you dont think this has his hands all over it after that Buffalo game?

 

 

Oh, I completely agree that Bowles has his prints all over the Lee selection and, while Lee has flashed a lot of potential thus far, an undersized LB is not the best allocation of resources with a first round pick.

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1 hour ago, dbatesman said:

Here's one: Maccagnan has drafted precisely one (1) impact player in two years, handed out exorbitant contracts to guys who can't play, and seemingly has no awareness of what to do in situations like the one discussed here. What does he do well?

We got no food. We got no money. OUR PETS' HEADS ARE FALLING OFF.

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23 hours ago, tkiss24 said:

I completely agree with this article. Maccagnan deserves time but Bowles' coaching has been just dreadful


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Time my azz. He had zillions to work with and his drafts have been Idziotlike. He has made some decent moves but in Mac I do  not trust. Just the fact that Geno Smith is on this roster reeks of ineptitude by him. The major issues with this team are numerous: secondary, QB, LB's. Mac spent and drafted very very unwisely in his 2 years.  A shrimp LB, cmon man. Wasting another #1 on Big Cat. Yes he's very good but we had a surplus of DL with much greater needs. Terrible contracts to the vaunted Swiss cheese secondary. Wasting a #2 on Hack when it was clear his value had slipped big time. We are a mediocre football team. We were lucky to win 10 games last year. As it was 5 of those games could have easily gone the other way and the schedule was softer. If not for Fitz playing at the highest level of his career, we go 5-11 and pat Mac on the shoulder with 'no worries it's just your first year and we gave it the ole college try'. Well welcome to reality and the crummy moves made by this Starbucks coffee sipping GM who is over his head and will soon be drowning in coffee.

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2 hours ago, j4jets said:

How's the weather?

And good post. I agree with pretty much everything you said there. I have the slightest of hopes that NFL looks at this rather non-mathematically at times, in which case McClendon for Snacks wouldn't be a wash. I say that because NFL has NEVER published the comp pick calculations. The theory, which you described, is about 99% correct. So there's a 1% chance we get a comp for Snacks. 

Point is it wouldn't matter. It's 3 UFAs out, 3 UFAs in, and we kept all 3 of them. That's that. It's never worked otherwise to my knowledge.

It's true they haven't released the formula, but the part they really haven't released is the exact value placed, and probably because there's something of an arbitrary ("judgment call") nature to it: for example, seeing how the player performed after signing the new contract may bump up or down one whose contract value was borderline between two rounds.

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3 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Here's one: Maccagnan has drafted precisely one (1) impact player in two years, handed out exorbitant contracts to guys who can't play, and seemingly has no awareness of what to do in situations like the one discussed here. What does he do well?

Best I've got is a couple of late round / UDFA WRs show some promise. Also our punter looks really good lol.

And I agree on the total of 1 impact player so far but it was so obvious to draft him, and he looked so good so early, that it should have affected (lowered) what he was willing to accept for Mo. Mo's cap number dropped this year with the new contract, meaning it will necessarily balloon after this year. So we used the cheap year for what? To give it to Fitzpatrick and our overpriced secondary?

I liked the Marshall pickup (I know you didn't and don't), but meanwhile I also classify that as an obvious move. This notion that he cold-called Chicago and sweet talked them into getting swindled is preposterous. They wanted him gone because they couldn't have him and Cutler together, and their best chance at replacing him with another stud WR in the draft was to get WR off our "huge need" list. They ended up with Kevin White, which was their goal all along (unless Cooper also fell as well).

The best of the rest is Carpenter, who is better than advertised. But meanwhile Maccagnan's ruined the cheap contract he got with him by artificially keeping his cap # in the $2M range for the first two years, boosting the latter two by the same amount. Otherwise the FAs are Skrine, Gilchrist (who looked a good amount better last year, not unlike Fitz...hmmm), Revis, Cromartie, Harris. Ugh.

Who else? I thought bringing in (or bringing back) a veteran RB with qualities of being an excellent receiver and blocker was a solid idea. But two of them? No. Sign one and draft another, and pocket the draft pick we wouldn't/shouldn't have forfeited. 

It's not just the players he brought in; it's the players he brought in with no regard to their FA status in a year when we'd have otherwise been due a few useful ones. The year before when we lost nobody? Yeah, have at it.

Next year we have no LT unless we fork over huge money for Clady ($13M in salary alone next year or a new, long contract). We have no obvious RT starter unless we bring back Suckomini, and Winters is a FA as well. Since Clady is unlikely to return at $13M, we will have holes at LT, RG, RT and our C isn't exactly young & in his prime (not to mention he'l be a FA himself a year later).

What a waste of a magnificent opportunity.

Yay #learningonthejob. Assuming he's even learning.

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11 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Point is it wouldn't matter. It's 3 UFAs out, 3 UFAs in, and we kept all 3 of them. That's that. It's never worked otherwise to my knowledge.

It's true they haven't released the formula, but the part they really haven't released is the exact value placed, and probably because there's something of an arbitrary ("judgment call") nature to it: for example, seeing how the player performed after signing the new contract may bump up or down one whose contract value was borderline between two rounds.

Jason at OTC has been doing these calcs for a few years now. IIRC, Jason said that the NFL has generally given out 1 or 2 extra comp picks almost every year compared to what his calcs showed. I obviously didn't spend any time investigating that for 32 teams. I know its been correct with the Jets at least in the recent 6-7 years. That extra pick or two could be the "judgement call" of "well, this team netted out, but they lost several high profile players and picked up several backup $ players, so lets give them a 4th or 5th rounder". There's a reason why the formula hasn't been posted. Glass half full on this one. 

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Just now, j4jets said:

Jason at OTC has been doing these calcs for a few years now. IIRC, Jason said that the NFL has generally given out 1 or 2 extra comp picks almost every year compared to what his calcs showed. I obviously didn't spend any time investigating that for 32 teams. I know its been correct with the Jets at least in the recent 6-7 years. That extra pick or two could be the "judgement call" of "well, this team netted out, but they lost several high profile players and picked up several backup $ players, so lets give them a 4th or 5th rounder". There's a reason why the formula hasn't been posted. Glass half full on this one. 

Know what? It doesn't matter. He should know that if he does get a pick out of charity from the league, that it's nothing more than blind, stupid luck. 

On paper we are not entitled to a single compensatory draft pic. He ought to know that, instead of stockpiling UFAs on 2-3 year contracts in a year he lost some high priced ones.

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2 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Here's one: Maccagnan has drafted precisely one (1) impact player in two years, handed out exorbitant contracts to guys who can't play, and seemingly has no awareness of what to do in situations like the one discussed here. What does he do well?

So guys like Rob Nincovich were factors right away were they? James Harrison?

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3 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Know what? It doesn't matter. He should know that if he does get a pick out of charity from the league, that it's nothing more than blind, stupid luck. 

On paper we are not entitled to a single compensatory draft pic. He ought to know that, instead of stockpiling UFAs on 2-3 year contracts in a year he lost some high priced ones.

The game isn't played on paper. I don't know why the NFL doesn't do what MLB does. Comp picks should only be taken away if a FA loss is equitable. 

Steve McClendon is not equitable to Snacks Harrison.

I read the open letter and I have a bone with it concerning 6 picks a draft. That's a fairly solid total since you are given 7 to start with

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Just now, UnitedWhofans said:

The game isn't played on paper. I don't know why the NFL doesn't do what MLB does. Comp picks should only be taken away if a FA loss is equitable. 

Steve McClendon is not equitable to Snacks Harrison.

I read the open letter and I have a bone with it concerning 6 picks a draft. That's a fairly solid total since you are given 7 to start with

Irrelevant. The system is the system. Everybody knows it. He doesn't get to use the ignorance excuse.

The open letter was stupid. 

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7 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Know what? It doesn't matter. He should know that if he does get a pick out of charity from the league, that it's nothing more than blind, stupid luck. 

On paper we are not entitled to a single compensatory draft pic. He ought to know that, instead of stockpiling UFAs on 2-3 year contracts in a year he lost some high priced ones.

Oh I agree with you. I was pissed the moment he signed him. Atleast Izdik was better at that...he just didn't know what to do with the pick, which was a shame anyways. 

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