What are the reasons to not draft Watson?

[nicg4360]

One reason why I take the jets taking a qb as a smokescreen is due to how they seem to be making sure everyone knows they are interested in several QB's. With Hack last year if I remember it was very under the table how they had their private visit and with Mac everything is usually very hush hush. I'm taking all this qb talk as a non issue...Won't happen till the 2 or 3 Rd at the earliest.

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[JoJoTownsell1]

49 minutes ago, Pointdexter said:

QB's who are "consensus losers" among the experts are generally not projected in the top half of the first round. I don't know who these experts are you speak of, but obviously not the guys who have Watson going rd 1.

Most experts have him graded as a second round talent. But many have him projected in the first because they know teams tend to reach for QBs in the first round. See guys like EJ Manuel, manziel, tebow, ponder, locker. Most experts thought those guys were questionable prospects but also thought one team would likely take them in the first because teams are desperate for QBs. 

[dbatesman]

2 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Jets fans are fighting amongst themselves over the prospect of drafting a quarterback whose weakness is throwing the football. 

At least three guys coming out next yr whose strentgh is throwing the ball, Jets will have their pick of the litter folks,

[RutgersJetFan]

4 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

At least three guys coming out next yr whose strentgh is throwing the ball, Jets will have their pick of the litter folks,

look I realize jokes and sarcasm are your thing but we have a chance to draft the next ed Reed and our second safety in the first round in four years, you dont pass up an opportunity like that just so you can draft a guy who's tape doesnt pass the eye test

[dbatesman]

3 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

look I realize jokes and sarcasm are your thing but we have a chance to draft the next ed Reed and our second safety in the first round in four years, you dont pass up an opportunity like that just so you can draft a guy who's tape doesnt pass the eye test

FORNETT is the one guy in the draft who will immediaetly transform an offense, get a QB next yr and we are set for a decade...:

[Gas2No99]

9 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

FORNETT is the one guy in the draft who will immediaetly transform an offense, get a QB next yr and we are set for a decade...:

Oh lil' youngin'  dBatesman . . . . . . Dalvin Cook and Joe Mixon beg to differ. . . . and they CAN CATCH as well unlike Fournette who isn't AS savvy in running routes and catching the rock as smooooooooooothly as Cook & Mixon. 

[HessStation]

11 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

FORNETT is the one guy in the draft who will immediaetly transform an offense, get a QB next yr and we are set for a decade...:

...that weird moment when you sorta agree with somebody elses joke. 

[JetFaninMI]

6 minutes ago, Gas2No99 said:

Oh lil' youngin'  dBatesman . . . . . . Dalvin Cook and Joe Mixon beg to differ. . . . and they CAN CATCH as well unlike Fournette who isn't AS savvy in running routes and catching the rock as smooooooooooothly as Cook & Mixon. 

Mixon is the guy I want. If the Jets don't draft a QB at six and take Howard or one of the WR's and Mixon is the 2nd pick I would be one happy Jet Fan.

[Paradis]

what's this thread about?

[JoJoTownsell1]

13 minutes ago, Gas2No99 said:

Oh lil' youngin'  dBatesman . . . . . . Dalvin Cook and Joe Mixon beg to differ. . . . and they CAN CATCH as well unlike Fournette who isn't AS savvy in running routes and catching the rock as smooooooooooothly as Cook & Mixon. 

Fournette is a freak. He will dominate. Are cook and mixon better all around? Sure, they are both better all around than the likes of bo Jackson and Herschel walker. 

I love cook and mixon. I they're both pro bowl talents. But let's not get crazy here and suggest they're better players than Fournette. 

[Paradis]

1 minute ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Fournette is a freak. He will dominate. Are cook and mixon better all around? Sure, they are both better all around than the likes of bo Jackson and Herschel walker. 

I love cook and mixon. I they're both pro bowl talents. But let's not get crazy here and suggest they're better players than Fournette. 

I hear what you're saying, but you could easily make an argument that Cook won more games.

[Dunnie]

I need it laid out for me because I can not think of one.

 

interception machine

 

We need Pat Maholmes ... trade down

 

 

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[Gas2No99]

1 hour ago, dbatesman said:

FORNETT is the one guy in the draft who will immediaetly transform an offense, get a QB next yr and we are set for a decade...:

 

1 hour ago, Gas2No99 said:

Oh lil' youngin'  dBatesman . . . . . . Dalvin Cook and Joe Mixon beg to differ. . . . and they CAN CATCH as well unlike Fournette who isn't AS savvy in running routes and catching the rock as smooooooooooothly as Cook & Mixon. 

 

33 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Fournette is a freak. He will dominate. Are cook and mixon better all around? Sure, they are both better all around than the likes of bo Jackson and Herschel walker. 

I love cook and mixon. I they're both pro bowl talents. But let's not get crazy here and suggest they're better players than Fournette. 

 

Please RE-READ FROM THE TOP!

and you can correct yourself and see where you CLEARLY interjected and interpreted a statement and a claim that WAS NEVER MADE by me. I believe that Cook AND Mixon can ALSO immediately transform/improve an offense by their MERE presence; teams will have to keep a spy LB to limit/contain either RB's offensive production

 

Look BEFORE you leap . . . . . (or JUMP) to (INCORRECT) conclusions 

 

 

 

and for argument's sake, YOU ADMIT Cook and Mixon are "both better all around" - citing Walker and Bo makes no sense since NEITHER led their respective teams to anything noteworthy (Herschel? hello Minnesota trade?) . . . . SO YES, the RB prospects who have a more complete game MAY result as BETTER Pro's than a physical freak who is a runaway freight train; ESPECIALLY if we were to run some variation of a WCO. 

 

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

On Monday, April 17, 2017 at 9:47 PM, SenorGato said:

I need it laid out for me because I can not think of one.

I'll give you three. Geno Smith, JaMarcus Russell, and Billy Cole.

 

 

[Jet Life]

3 hours ago, SenorGato said:

Also 116 TD's and a 67.4% completion rate

That's good , but he still turns it over a ton and has a weak arm. You asked for reasons not to draft him and I listed some 

[Gas2No99]

17 minutes ago, Jet Life said:

That's good , but he still turns it over a ton and has a weak arm. You asked for reasons not to draft him and I listed some 

I actually re-watched the Fiesta Bowl last night to assess -GRANTED, one game sample-  Lattimore (meh), FS Hooker (good Center Fielder), ILB McMillain (active), CB Conley (solid), C Elfein (underwhelming), SwissArmy & BROOKLYN NATIVE Curtis Samuel (Jalin Marshal clone l?).

 

Watson LITERALLY telegraphs it to Conley for an INT not even 2 minutes into the game ending Clemson's drive. Hooker's INT was a thing of beauty - how'd he GET THERE so QUICKLY and catch it in that TIGHT area?!?!?!?

 

If Watson were to say he could part the Hudson River and walk across, . . . . . . . yeah, I'd check it out. GREAT leader, CLASS ACT. But not at #6. IF he's STILL there at #39? I'd stomach the player at THAT spot, but now wonder about the administration - ANOTHER 4 QB scenario?. 

 

OSU defense is STACKED! It was like seeing all the toys as a kid at KayBee and wanting to write a Xmas Wish List that I should send to Mac at Florham Park. 

 

[JoJoTownsell1]

5 hours ago, SenorGato said:

Also 116 TD's and a 67.4% completion rate

Geno Smith in College:

98 PASSING Tds and 67.4% completion rate with 21 Ints. 

 

Deshaun Watson in college:

90 PASSING Tds and 67.4% Completion rate with  32 Ints

 

[NoBowles]

7 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Geno Smith in College:

98 PASSING Tds and 67.4% completion rate with 21 Ints. 

 

Deshaun Watson in college:

90 PASSING Tds and 67.4% Completion rate with  32 Ints

 

Ahhhh, now I'm starting to see why so many Jets fans want to draft Watson at 6!

[thadude]

10 hours ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

I'll give you three. Geno Smith, JaMarcus Russell, and Billy Cole.

 

 

You mean billy cole from the The Last Boyscout?

[JustInFudge]

Matt Ryan threw 54 TD's and 34 int's from his sophomore to senior season, barely completed 60%, lost at least 3 games every year and just won the MVP of the NFL.

weird

[thadude]

10 minutes ago, JiF said:

Matt Ryan threw 54 TD's and 34 int's from his sophomore to senior season, barely completed 60%, lost at least 3 games every year and just won the MVP of the NFL.

weird

Jameis Winston statistically actually had a bad year before entering the draft

[JustInFudge]

1 minute ago, thadude said:

Jameis Winston statistically actually had a bad year before entering the draft

Yep.  He threw a ton of boneheaded INT's, some that are much worse than what we've seen from Watson.  But similar to Watson, the kid had ice in his veins, was a leader, a winner and would always put his team on his back and lead them to victory.

 

 

[thadude]

4 minutes ago, JiF said:

Yep.  He threw a ton of boneheaded INT's, some that are much worse than what we've seen from Watson.  But similar to Watson, the kid had ice in his veins, was a leader, a winner and would always put his team on his back and lead them to victory.

 

 

I think Winston's skill set translated much better to the pro game.

 

Watson to me is a glorified Alex Smith

 

[JustInFudge]

Just now, thadude said:

I think Winston's skill set translated much better to the pro game.

 

Watson to me is a glorified Alex Smith

 

Agreed and Winston came from one of the few pro-style offenses in the NCAA.

I think Watson is much more dynamic than Smith and has a lot more arm talent.  I see Marcus Mariota when I watch him play. 

[Gas2No99]

1 hour ago, thadude said:

You mean billy cole from the The Last Boyscout?

The ONE & ONLY!

[flgreen]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

Matt Ryan threw 54 TD's and 34 int's from his sophomore to senior season, barely completed 60%, lost at least 3 games every year and just won the MVP of the NFL.

weird

And that is exactly why picking a QB, particularly one who comes out of a spread O, is one of the most difficult jobs in the NFL.   That selection can either make you a HOF GM, or put you on the unemployment line in a heart beat. 

[Jet Life]

13 hours ago, Gas2No99 said:

I actually re-watched the Fiesta Bowl last night to assess -GRANTED, one game sample-  Lattimore (meh), FS Hooker (good Center Fielder), ILB McMillain (active), CB Conley (solid), C Elfein (underwhelming), SwissArmy & BROOKLYN NATIVE Curtis Samuel (Jalin Marshal clone l?).

 

Watson LITERALLY telegraphs it to Conley for an INT not even 2 minutes into the game ending Clemson's drive. Hooker's INT was a thing of beauty - how'd he GET THERE so QUICKLY and catch it in that TIGHT area?!?!?!?

 

If Watson were to say he could part the Hudson River and walk across, . . . . . . . yeah, I'd check it out. GREAT leader, CLASS ACT. But not at #6. IF he's STILL there at #39? I'd stomach the player at THAT spot, but now wonder about the administration - ANOTHER 4 QB scenario?. 

 

OSU defense is STACKED! It was like seeing all the toys as a kid at KayBee and wanting to write a Xmas Wish List that I should send to Mac at Florham Park. 

 

The Hooker INT in that game was very impressive! Covered a ton of ground

[Jet_Engine1]

21 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

Isn't this what they said about Russell Wilson........

No. It's not. The knock on Wilson was height. He had above average arm talent and was an undisputed leader of 2 NCAA Division 1 programs.

[Komba]

I've watched every game of Watson now multiple times. I wouldn't be shocked if he turns out to be a top 10 QB but I still lean towards that he's not going to be top 10.

My biggest issue with him is the accuracy.  Even when he completes some of the simple shorter passes, the ball isn't accurate enough and the receiver gives up too much of his position and it kills any chance of getting yards after the catch.  The other issue is his deep ball.  It's not accurate.  Oddly enough, he always seems to overthrow it and that's frustrating.  I could see him becoming Alex Smith in that Smith also can't throw deep, but that's not good enough to win a super bowl in this league. 

I would not hate a pick of Watson though.  He has a lot of qualities to like, I just think those qualities are going to hurt him.

The only QB where I see zero chance of making it work at any level is Davis Webb.  Much like Hack last year, he just shows a lack of feel for the game and accuracy (although Hack was worse). 

Trubisky is the guy to get out of this bunch.  He's the only guy I feel pretty confident of turning into a top 10 QB.  Most drafts don't even have a franchise QB possibility so I would do anything and everything to move up for Trubisky.

[JustInFudge]

17 hours ago, Gas2No99 said:

you realize that people who are "experts" in regards to the NFL draft are just as correct as any poster on this forum because it is ALL SUBJECTIVE opinion and speculation. 

If Watson were to stay ANOTHER year in college and be part of the 2018 QB draft class, he'd be regarded as a 4th rounder according to the experts. That's why he, and Trubisky, SEIZED the opportunity to CASH IN on a WEAK QB class in 2017 & entered what is a $hit crop of QB prospects. 

 

Those who are 100% SOLD on Watson going in the Top 10 haven't been watching American Football long enough and have only been exposed to the $HIT QB play PLAGUING 'Merica since the late 90's. FACT.

Huh?  Blaine Gabbert #10.  Blake Bortles went #5.  Jared Goff and Carson Wentz went #1 and #2.  RGIII went #2. Ryan Tannehill #8.  Christian Ponder #12.  Vince Young #3.  Matt Lienart #10  Byron Leftwich #7.  Joey Harrington #3. 

The list goes on brother.  The league is filled with stupidity.  Especially regarding the QB position.  And Watson is better than all those dudes.

[JustInFudge]

15 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Fournette is a freak. He will dominate. Are cook and mixon better all around? Sure, they are both better all around than the likes of bo Jackson and Herschel walker. 

I love cook and mixon. I they're both pro bowl talents. But let's not get crazy here and suggest they're better players than Fournette. 

What makes Fournette a "freak"?

[JustInFudge]

11 minutes ago, Komba said:

I've watched every game of Watson now multiple times. I wouldn't be shocked if he turns out to be a top 10 QB but I still lean towards that he's not going to be top 10.

My biggest issue with him is the accuracy.  Even when he completes some of the simple shorter passes, the ball isn't accurate enough and the receiver gives up too much of his position and it kills any chance of getting yards after the catch.  The other issue is his deep ball.  It's not accurate.  Oddly enough, he always seems to overthrow it and that's frustrating.  I could see him becoming Alex Smith in that Smith also can't throw deep, but that's not good enough to win a super bowl in this league. 

I would not hate a pick of Watson though.  He has a lot of qualities to like, I just think those qualities are going to hurt him.

The only QB where I see zero chance of making it work at any level is Davis Webb.  Much like Hack last year, he just shows a lack of feel for the game and accuracy (although Hack was worse). 

Trubisky is the guy to get out of this bunch.  He's the only guy I feel pretty confident of turning into a top 10 QB.  Most drafts don't even have a franchise QB possibility so I would do anything and everything to move up for Trubisky.

So the guy to draft is the one trying to overcome the greatest odds of them all? 

[JoJoTownsell1]

5 minutes ago, JiF said:

What makes Fournette a "freak"?

6ft 240 (Makes him bigger than Rueben Foster  a LB projected to go at the top of the draft)

4.51 in the 40 (Mike Williams the number 1 rated WR ran a 4.53 in the 40)

 

That's Bo Jackson type of freakish talent. He is as good of a RB as you will see come out of college. That doesn't mean that I don't love Cook/Mixon/Mccaffery. They should all be pro bowlers at some point, but if we pass on Fournette those other guys won't be around for us in the 2nd.  

 

He can run over you:

He can cut back you and then carry you:

 

He can turn the corner and fly past defenders:

He has a burst through the hole and outrun corners:

He can return kicks and make players on ND look like high school kids:

 

 

[JustInFudge]

23 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

6ft 240 (Makes him bigger than Rueben Foster  a LB projected to go at the top of the draft)

4.51 in the 40 (Mike Williams the number 1 rated WR ran a 4.53 in the 40)

 

That's Bo Jackson type of freakish talent. He is as good of a RB as you will see come out of college. That doesn't mean that I don't love Cook/Mixon/Mccaffery. They should all be pro bowlers at some point, but if we pass on Fournette those other guys won't be around for us in the 2nd.  

 

Bo Jackson ran a 4.12.  That's not even the same universe.  Foreman in this draft ran a similar 40 at a similar weight.  Calling Fournette a freak is a huge exaggeration IMO. Nothing about him is "freaky" other than being big and fast and he's not the first college RB who is big and fast.  

My concerns?  He's not a terribly dynamic player, he's not extremely passionate about Football, he's got a little bit of a star complex, we know he wont play through injury, he pushed a Florida coach pregame because they were razzing him for once again deciding not to play the game, he showed up over weigh to the biggest job interview of his life, doesnt know how to run outside, struggles with zone concepts, Bama shut him down with absolute ease every time they faced him and he's often injured because of his run style that will only increase in the NFL.

IMO he's Trent Richardson all over again.

[Komba]

Fournette isn't Richardson, but he's not going to be great in the NFL.  His biggest issue is that he doesn't get through the first level easily.  He's the type of guy who has to get started and in the NFL, it's difficult to get going all of the time.  That ability to make 3 yards out of nothing plays is very important and he doesn't do that particularly well.

I don't think Fournette will be a top 5 back and because of that I wouldn't take him.

 

To be honest, I think the 3 best RB's in this draft are Joe Williams from Utah, Jamaal WIlliams from BYU, and Dalvin Cook.  Cook will succeed because he's so, so good at just gliding through and running off of blocks. The two Williams' will go later than those other guys, but both are stars.  As long as they are healthy, guaranteed stars.