Saleh: Jarrad Davis likely out until Bye Week (Week 6)

[genot]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

To be fair, those aren't last year's numbers.   Nasrildeen weighed 215 at his pro day on March 22, 2021.  Sherwood weighed 216 at his pro day on March 18.  I don't think rookies usually pack on much weight.  They usually have trouble keeping their weight up with all the activity.  

I expect this team to run with undersized safety/LB hybrids most of the time and I expect them to struggle with the run.  I think we should be prepared for that.  Without Davis, they will probably do more situational mixing and matching and hopefully deal a little better with short yardage.  I don't think they do as much of that in preseason - I would expect to see more of Fatukasi to stuff the run and possibly more of a regular LB than our usual hybrids..  

my whole point un my original post was that they 'we're well below 230lbs, and that's ONE of the reasons why our run defense might struggle. But Jet Nut felt like arguing so he who only read into my post what he thought he could pick apart

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Moselys 250 then? 

Thats his number for last years.  Hes already said hes down in the low 230s, 231 I thin is what he said  

 

When did they weigh Mosley?  Pretty sure it was in 2019.  I am telling you the day those guys were weighed and what they weighed.  Ignore it if you want.  They can and will put on weight.  I doubt it will be significant for 2021 and they already look suspect against the run.  

[Larz]

1 hour ago, genot said:

Its an attacking style defense. The d-lineman need to penetrate and disrupt the QB.  Our second line of defense is way undersized. Quick slants, screens, and a good running scheme will be a problem for us. 

Agree. I love Sherwood, I’ve tried watch him every chance I get. He understandably is really struggling with guards. 
once the real games begin he’s going to get a steady diet of it. 

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, #27TheDominator said:

You complain about "last year's numbers" and pull out an article referencing high school weights?   By those references, Nasrildeen weighed 210 and Sherwood 190 (though their own text says 181 lbs).  That is small even by the standards of the article.  I get the trend, but we probably need somebody that will be able to hold up against the run, if only situationally.

OK, its not talking about the trend in the NFL?  

I reference the trend to lighter LBs.  

 

 

[jetsons]

5 hours ago, Lith said:

 

Don't let DWC see this... ?

[Defense Wins Championships]

1 minute ago, #27TheDominator said:

You complain about "last year's numbers" and pull out an article referencing high school weights?   By those references, Nasrildeen weighed 210 and Sherwood 190 (though their own text says 181 lbs).  That is small even by the standards of the article.  I get the trend, but we probably need somebody that will be able to hold up against the run, if only situationally.

Both Quinnen Williams and C.J. Mosley feast against the run. 

And Hamsah Nasirildeen is the same exact weight as Jamal Adams who lines up as a LINEBACKER and destroys the run game and Hamsah Nasirildeen is a much more physical tackling machine than Adams ever was coming out of LSU.

We've got run stuffing animals everywhere. 

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

OK, its not talking about the trend in the NFL?  

I reference the trend to lighter LBs.  

 

 

Yes.  We all agree about the trend.  Thing is, even by the standards of the "trend" these guys are undersized.

[sec101row23]

5 minutes ago, genot said:

my whole point un my original post was that they 'we're well below 230lbs, and that's ONE of the reasons why our run defense might struggle. But Jet Nut felt like arguing so he who only read into my post what he thought he could pick apart

I don’t think this run defense is designed for the LBers to take on guards however.  The guys up front are supposed to occupy those O linemen and the LBers are supposed to come up and clean up the RBs.  I don’t think Saleh wants any of his LBers taking on guards and trying to stack and shed them.  

[varjet]

The LBs in a 4-3 do not have to be 250 lbs.  They can be 230-235 pounds.  Nas and Sherwood will weigh more at this time next year.  But they don't now.  

For JD to sign a 6 year contract, starting in May, to be GM was at the time considered relatively unusual.   I think the reality is that is first stub year and second full year were basically mulligans.  With Saleh now JD is in year 1 of his rebuild.   If the team is not very competitive, like playoffs, in the 2023 season I can see JD and probably Saleh getting fired.  

But for 2021, I don't see them trading future assets to fill holes.    I would say half of the position groups have decent depth with young players to develop.   Another year of drafting and FA should have the Jets in a better position to compete seriously next year.

QB-need backup

RB-good depth

TE-need players.

OL-will need 2-3 more players (Moses only 1 year left, RG needs upgrade, McGovern hopefully can stay on contract).

WR-good depth

DL-good depth

LB-will need more depth but players to develop.  Jarrad is on one year deal.

CB-lots of players, hopefully some develop plus infusion.

S-could need whole new room.  

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Both Quinnen Williams and C.J. Mosley feast against the run. 

And Hamsah Nasirildeen is the same exact weight as Jamal Adams who lines up as a LINEBACKER and destroys the run game and Hamsah Nasirildeen is a much more physical tackling machine than Adams ever was coming out of LSU.

We've got run stuffing animals everywhere. 

So these guys are putting on weight will help, but Mosley dropping 20 lbs isn't going to hurt him as a "run stopping animal?"  More importantly they looked like sh*t on Saturday.

[Defense Wins Championships]

Just now, jetsons said:

Don't let DWC see this... ?

Why not let me see it? Hamsah Nasirildeen was already starting at OLB and now Sherwood gets to start too because of Davis injury. 

OLB: Hamsah Nasrildeen. 

MLB: C.J. Mosley.

OLB: Jamien Sherwood. 

And speaking of run Defense, Carl Lawson was never a good DE vs. the run because he always pins his ears back in order to pass rush and often times over purses and gets slashed against the run.

Just ask Cincinnati's run Defense who ranked 29th in rushing yards allowed and 31st in yards per carry against last year. 

I'm done with this Run D talk because with QW as a 4-3 DT and C.J. Mosley linebacking behind him our run D under Saleh will rank top 5 and I'll bump this thread after we hold Christian McCaffrey under 60-70 rushing yards week 1. 

[jetsons]

5 hours ago, Saul Goodman said:

Curtis Martin as well. High ankle sprain ended his career. It can be a really bad injury for a football player. 

It was the bone on bone knee issue that had him call it a career...

 Martin was incredibly devoted to physical fitness, and that devotion allowed him to keep playing, and playing very well, beyond the age of 30, when most running backs break down. In 2004, at age 31, Martin ran 371 times for 1,697 yards. That kind of production from a running back that old is extraordinary, but all those carries took their toll. In 2005 Martin's ailing knee caused him constant pain as he hobbled through the worst year of his career, and although he was on the Jets' roster, he never got on the field in 2006.

[Defense Wins Championships]

Just now, #27TheDominator said:

So these guys are putting on weight will help, but Mosley dropping 20 lbs isn't going to hurt him as a "run stopping animal?"  More importantly they looked like sh*t on Saturday.

Our most dominant football player and run stopper wasn't playing on Saturday in Quinnen Williams, now was he? 

 

[#27TheDominator]

56 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Off of when, did you recently weigh him?  

But wait, you complain that he sucked for the last two years and then complain that our LBs dont weigh as much as he does? 

LOL

FWIW, ourlads seems to have updated their weights.  They have Mosley at 234.  Nasrildeen at 213 and Sherwood at 220.  They list Davis at 238.  

[#27TheDominator]

3 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Our most dominant football player and run stopper wasn't playing on Saturday in Quinnen Williams, now was he? 

 

Quinnen Williams >  Aaron Rodgers?

[Defense Wins Championships]

Just now, #27TheDominator said:

Quinnen Williams >  Aaron Rodgers?

Robert Saleh > Aaron Rodgers ala 2-0 vs. Aaron Rodgers in 2019 and eliminated him during the NFC Championship Game too. 

[Jethead]

I think the Jets D is going to have its challenging moments this year. Losing Lawson and Davis will definitely hurt. But, I expect these kids to play with their hair on fire, leaving it all out there. We will definitely have teams that are matchup problems but I expect them to have their moments too and show promise for what they will become. I'm fine with that.

[Jet Nut]

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

FWIW, ourlads seems to have updated their weights.  They have Mosley at 234.  Nasrildeen at 213 and Sherwood at 220.  They list Davis at 238.  

Which was my original post, the weights are from last season and we dont know what they actually weigh.  It was apparent by Davis and Mosleys listed weights

[genot]

13 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

I don’t think this run defense is designed for the LBers to take on guards however.  The guys up front are supposed to occupy those O linemen and the LBers are supposed to come up and clean up the RBs.  I don’t think Saleh wants any of his LBers taking on guards and trying to stack and shed them.  

I thought Saleh wanted his d-lineman to attack and penetrate. Meaning not waiting for the play to come to them. Holding up and the releasing from an o-lineman. Something that Leo did very well. Fatasuki also plays well that way.

[sec101row23]

4 minutes ago, genot said:

I thought Saleh wanted his d-lineman to attack and penetrate. Meaning not waiting for the play to come to them. Holding up and the releasing from an o-lineman. Something that Leo did very well. Fatasuki also plays well that way.

But that penetration should draw the attention of the guards, plus the whole notion of having these smaller more athletic LBers is to shoot those gaps and get there before the guards can get out on them.  If the opposing offensive line is consistently getting to the second level and getting their hands on the LBers, it’s going to be a long day.  

[#27TheDominator]

8 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

Robert Saleh > Aaron Rodgers ala 2-0 vs. Aaron Rodgers in 2019 and eliminated him during the NFC Championship Game too. 

What a mook statement to keep repeating.  Rodgers is 2-2 against Saleh.  He put up 305 @80% 3/0 in 2020  Please spare me a repost of your "ravaged with injuries" saga.  

[genot]

3 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

But that penetration should draw the attention of the guards, plus the whole notion of having these smaller more athletic LBers is to shoot those gaps and get there before the guards can get out on them.  If the opposing offensive line is consistently getting to the second level and getting their hands on the LBers, it’s going to be a long day.  

An intelligent response. Not a surprise. Opposing OC's will figure out a way to get a guard or TE free in the run game. It's what they do. im not sure abour JFM, abd Rankins being quality run defenders. They're is a skill to it that a lot of lineman don't seem to have

[Defense Wins Championships]

12 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

What a mook statement to keep repeating.  Rodgers is 2-2 against Saleh.  He put up 305 @80% 3/0 in 2020  Please spare me a repost of your "ravaged with injuries" saga.  

I was clowning because your'e acting like our Defense is going to get worse against the run after adding Saleh, CJ Mosley and QW going to 4-3 DT (his natural Alabama position) along with a tackling machine in Hamsah Nasrildeen (after ranking 6th in average yards per rush against last year). 

AND YES. HE WAS RAVAGED BY 2020 INJURIES ALA JUST ASK 2019's HEALTHY SB D AND ASK 2019 AARON RODGERS TOO?

[Prepare 2 Takeoff]

It’s starting to feel like every time I go to check Jets news, another starter or decent player is hurt… so much for the new conditioning/training staff or just terrible luck 

[Jet Nut]

11 minutes ago, Prepare 2 Takeoff said:

It’s starting to feel like every time I go to check Jets news, another starter or decent player is hurt… so much for the new conditioning/training staff or just terrible luck 

What exactly does a condition coach have to do with ankle and achilles injuries?  

[Defense Wins Championships]

Just now, Jet Nut said:

What exactly does a condition coach have to do with ankle and achilles injuries?  

Some just don't realize Football is a violent sport with gruesome injuries due to explosion on every play and these players who get injured aren't playing table tennis, ping pong, chess or even soccer. 

I guess all NFL conditioning coaches stink too?

[kdels62]

1 hour ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

That's what happens with NFL training. You gain weight. 

When Derrick Brooks came to Florida State he weighed about 185 pounds and as a Rookie if you think he started his playing career @ where he finished 230+ you're kidding yourself he was close to 215-220 as an NFL Rookie and immediately impacted from day 1.

I believe coach Saleh knows what he's doing in regards to both Sherwood and especially Hamsah Nasirildeen (who's more of a tackling machine than Jamal Adams who's 214 lbs).

 

Cool. It’s still two undersized OLBs. There’s a reason to be concerned about the run defense. Derrick Brooks was also a first rounder rather than a 5th rounder. 

[Jetluv58]

7 hours ago, BroadwayRay said:

Definitely going to be a bumpy ride for the defense. A lot of young talent and a lot of inexperience means a lot of highs and lows.

Maybe we’ll get Chandler on the edge in a trade?

[rangerous]

7 hours ago, Jethead said:

Cashman played ok on Saturday. Maybe he can finally shake off the injury bug.

KJ Wagner is still out there but I'm fine if Saleh wants to ride with the kiddos. He's the perfect style of coach for this kind of young team.

Guys like Mosley, Fatukashi and Q can hold the kids accountable in a positive way. Listen to Foley's interview after Lawson went down. There's leaders for the kids to follow. The Wilkersons and Richardsons are gone and we don't need to add the wrong kind of player to the locker room for panic reasons.

did you see the bump saleh gave cashman after a play against the packers?  it looked like one of those you did great bumps.  i'll bet saleh is pretty high on cashman and he did play pretty well filling in for mosely.  if he stays healthy he'll be in there.

[Defense Wins Championships]

9 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Cool. It’s still two undersized OLBs. There’s a reason to be concerned about the run defense. Derrick Brooks was also a first rounder rather than a 5th rounder. 

If you knew anything about FSU Football you'd know that Hamsah Nasirildeen was A.) Guaranteed 1st round pick before injury and B.) Now 100% recovered from injury. 

And Cool.

Because Joe Montana and Russell Wilson were both 3rd round picks.

Richard Sherman was a 5th round pick.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick.

Shannon Sharpe was a 7th round pick.

 Bart Starr was a 17th round pick.

And all of John Randle, Kurt Warner,  Warren Moon, Tony Romo, Priest Holmes, Wes Welker, Rod Smith, Nate Newton, Adam Vinatieri, Donnie Shell, James Harrison, Dick Night Train Lane and Antonio Gates were all UNDRAFTED. 

So what are you trying to say in regards to Hamsah Nasirildeen? What type of point are you trying to prove? 

Because I can list you another 100+ players in order to teach you how draft stock is completely thrown out the window (once kids play their 1st practice) and means absolutely nothingness.

I can also show you hundreds of 1st round busts too. 

So what was your point for your post above?

[Larz]

Can we get a hot air or blow hard emoji? 

[kdels62]

17 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

If you knew anything about FSU Football you'd know that Hamsah Nasirildeen was A.) Guaranteed 1st round pick before injury and B.) Now 100% recovered from injury. 

And Cool.

Because Joe Montana and Russell Wilson were both 3rd round picks.

Richard Sherman was a 5th round pick.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick.

Shannon Sharpe was a 7th round pick.

 Bart Starr was a 17th round pick.

And all of John Randle, Kurt Warner,  Warren Moon, Tony Romo, Priest Holmes, Wes Welker, Rod Smith, Nate Newton, Adam Vinatieri, Donnie Shell, James Harrison, Dick Night Train Lane and Antonio Gates were all UNDRAFTED. 

So what are you trying to say in regards to Hamsah Nasirildeen? What type of point are you trying to prove? 

Because I can list you another 100+ players in order to teach you how draft stock is completely thrown out the window (once kids play their 1st practice) and means absolutely nothingness.

I can also show you hundreds of 1st round busts too. 

So what was your point for your post above?

That comparing 5th and 6th rounders who are changing positions to a first round talent at his natural position is at best foolish at worst disingenuous. 

Please make me a list of every linebacker bust in rounds 5-6. Then make me a list of every 5-6 round LB that started day 1 on a good defense. 

As for Hamsah, I know you like him, I don’t care. I thought he was great value in round 6. He dropped because he came back and was ok in two games and then he was mostly terrible in the senior bowl practices and then he put up a bad pro day before conveniently pulling up lame while running the 40. Plenty of players go into their last college season as “future number 1 picks” and drop. 

[genot]

2 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Yes.  We all agree about the trend.  Thing is, even by the standards of the "trend" these guys are undersized.

Thank You for stating the obvious. With some posters, that's necessary.

[Green Ghost]

Jet nut and DWC doing jet nut and DWC things.

Again.

It’s gotten to a point where most threads are unreadable, unless you want to read non stop arguing over minutia, and the usual DWC nonsense.

@genot you’re a better man than me for dealing with it.

[Defense Wins Championships]

27 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

That comparing 5th and 6th rounders who are changing positions to a first round talent at his natural position is at best foolish at worst disingenuous. 

Please make me a list of every linebacker bust in rounds 5-6. Then make me a list of every 5-6 round LB that started day 1 on a good defense. 

As for Hamsah, I know you like him, I don’t care. I thought he was great value in round 6. He dropped because he came back and was ok in two games and then he was mostly terrible in the senior bowl practices and then he put up a bad pro day before conveniently pulling up lame while running the 40. Plenty of players go into their last college season as “future number 1 picks” and drop. 

You don't even WATCH FSU games. Just ok during his last game?!?

He was a BEAST who recorded 9 tackles (1 for loss), a pass defended and a 20+ yard INT return during his final game of the season and during his int return I woke my daughter up from her nap screaming at my TV GO NAS GO HE'S BACCCKKKK

Just OK? He fkn FEASTED during his 2nd game back which lets me know you didn't really watch the game.

And if you actually watched any FSU FOOTBALL you'd also know he played a lot of LB in the box.  

Seasons of 91 tackles and 101 tackles? Not even Jamal Adams @ LSU flew to the ball and made tackles quite like Hamsah Nasirildeen did for FSU.

And as a Rookie he's going to record 100+ tackles because 5-6 tackles is nothingness to this beast. 

ACL is the only reason why he fell out of the 1st round. 

STICK TO WATCHING IOWA GAMES BECAUSE I'VE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE HAMSAH NASRILDEEN GAME.