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Breer On Jet Moves


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11 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Texans....Titans.  What's the difference :)

 

For the life of me I woke up thinking both deals were Texans.  LOL.  Nice narrative though.  SO I edited it to the correct GMs and it's no longer an irony, certainly not worth the post. :bag:

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55 minutes ago, Dcat said:

The irony is all the bonding JD did with the Texans' GM Robinson before Texans pick 18 paid off handsomely when JJ was still there at 26, so it worked out beautifully for both teams, but then in round 2, JD traded up with the NYG to get one spot ahead of those Texans who were 100% taking Hall there.   

Robinson & JD in round 1: "I love you, I love you, kiss, kiss, hug, hug, smootch"
Robinson & JD in round 2: "F- You! You sneaky bastard That's how you return a favor?  We were going to take Breece there.. he's ours.  Ours, you hear? I hate you."

Titans. Robinson is Titans GM

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5 minutes ago, section314 said:

The most telling and positive nugget from this has to be that JD and Saleh are so in sync with each other and are truly on the same page of how they want to continue to build this thing. Contrast this to the toxic culture Macc had with pretty much everyone in the building, culminating in his last draft where Gase basically left the war room. Good stuff.

Well Gase wasn’t too involved in the ‘20 draft either. Definitely not to the extent Saleh & his coaches are. 

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3 minutes ago, section314 said:

The most telling and positive nugget from this has to be that JD and Saleh are so in sync with each other and are truly on the same page of how they want to continue to build this thing. Contrast this to the toxic culture Macc had with pretty much everyone in the building, culminating in his last draft where Gase basically left the war room. Good stuff.

I always felt like Tannenbaum & Rex were on the same page during their combined tenure.  I do, however, think that Rex had some agreement in place with Woody, that he had say over round 1 picks.  I just can't see Tanny, and even Idzik later, completely ignoring offense in the 1st round, beginning the year after trading up to draft Sanchez.  Poor defensive round 1 picks like Coples, Kyle Wilson, Pryor,  had "Rex" written all over them.  

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38 minutes ago, OilfieldJet said:

It would be fun to be a GM, all the calls, relationships, trade ups, trade backs…..what a blast.

Totally agree. #2 on my sports bucket list would be to be ir the Jets War Room fot the 3 days of the draft. #1 on the list? Everyone gets 3 guesses and the first two don't count.😁

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8 minutes ago, C Mart said:

Well Gase wasn’t too involved in the ‘20 draft either. Definitely not to the extent Saleh & his coaches are. 

Yeah. Weren't there stories out there that when Macc had the last pre draft meeting with the scouts to set up their final board, that he wouldn't let Gase attend?

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31 minutes ago, Zachtomims47 said:

Wonder what happened in the pre draft meetings that turned teams off. 

Considering the Jets were with him during Senior Bowl along with other things, makes me feel pretty confident it'll turn out okay.

Yeah that caught my eye. Not sure what that was all about

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  • The analytics nerds panned the trade for AVT last year, but the reality was that the Jets had no LG, they could not sign one in FA (and they were very expensive) and without one ZW would have been more killed than he already was.   When you looked at the 2021 third round, it was hard to find players that we really missed out on.  So we all agree that the trade up was a good one, at the time.  We are now overpaying for a RG, but hopefully there is a plan.
  • In this draft, I like the players we got, but given the team needs I do feel we were a 3 and/or 4th round pick short.  Would have been nice to pick up another S, LB and/or DT, and there were guys on the board we could have used.  I hope we were not watching Channing Tindal kill us for the next 5+ years.
  • There was no way the Jets were not taking Jeremy Ruckert.  JR was not just another football player from LI-he was like the best HS player on LI for 3 years.   I do like the player, person and pick, but there is no way that there were not other considerations (PR, corporate, etc) in making that pick.  
  • But as we can see, and they have actually said it, the Jets are building a player pipeline. Many of these draft picks were made looking 1-3 years ahead.   Eventually the QB, EDGE and WRs will need to get paid, like other teams do.  So the Jets will have to find more affordable alternatives at other positions.   Ruckert and Mitchell will be the starters in 2023.  
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1 hour ago, slats said:

Just like to point out that the Jets got a late third rounder back in that trade, the one that netted Jeremy Ruckert. This makes it sound like they gave up a lot more to get him. In reality, the cost according to the draft pick trade chart was a mid-fifth rounder. 

Exactly. We swapped 3rd round positions, just like we swapped our 2nd for their 1st. The only thing we gave up was the 5th

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51 minutes ago, section314 said:

The most telling and positive nugget from this has to be that JD and Saleh are so in sync with each other and are truly on the same page of how they want to continue to build this thing. Contrast this to the toxic culture Macc had with pretty much everyone in the building, culminating in his last draft where Gase basically left the war room. Good stuff.

Yup. Maccagnans approach of separating the coaching staff from the acquisition of players was bizarre. 

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we are all praising JD for this draft but i have been wondering and this article makes me wonder more.... if Gardner is gone do we pick Stingley or go for a OL. cause an OL would have upend this whole draft.

Wilson should still be the pick at 10. or do they take JJ at 10. i doubt we still go Hall and Ruckert. no way do we just add an Edge and ignore the defense till rd 5

and then all the OL drama with Becton. he wouldnt be happy and he loves Twitter. and i dont think he gets traded cause of value and optics. or maybe Woody got invovled and told them they cant draft an OL 3 years in a row.

i guess we will never know until ESPN does a "30 for 30" in 20 years to talk about our 2025-26 Super Bowl championships and we look back at this draft as the main piece of it.

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14 minutes ago, varjet said:
  • The analytics nerds panned the trade for AVT last year, but the reality was that the Jets had no LG, they could not sign one in FA (and they were very expensive) and without one ZW would have been more killed than he already was.   When you looked at the 2021 third round, it was hard to find players that we really missed out on.  So we all agree that the trade up was a good one, at the time.  We are now overpaying for a RG, but hopefully there is a plan.
  • In this draft, I like the players we got, but given the team needs I do feel we were a 3 and/or 4th round pick short.  Would have been nice to pick up another S, LB and/or DT, and there were guys on the board we could have used.  I hope we were not watching Channing Tindal kill us for the next 5+ years. Sure, but you always want the guy that got away- and more! I like to think that A. the Jets CS is more confident in the players they have at LB, S and DT than Jet fans. Nas, Sherwood, Quincy, Marshall, Shep, Rankins and the slew of safeties we have should be plenty to fill in those positions for 2022. There is only so much room on the roster. B. It's nice to have QUALITY over quantity. Sure, we lost out on both 5th rounders. However, being able to get JJ and Hall seems worth it. Odds are you WOULD NOT have gotten the same quality of prospect without moving up.   
  • There was no way the Jets were not taking Jeremy Ruckert.  JR was not just another football player from LI-he was like the best HS player on LI for 3 years.   I do like the player, person and pick, but there is no way that there were not other considerations (PR, corporate, etc) in making that pick. Maybe. There's gotta be some truth to that. But the Jets also looked really close at him before the draft. Seems like they simply liked him purely as a TE prospect (regardless of where he's from) who has some athleticism, can block, catch and has a great demeanor on and off the field.    
  • But as we can see, and they have actually said it, the Jets are building a player pipeline. Many of these draft picks were made looking 1-3 years ahead.   Eventually the QB, EDGE and WRs will need to get paid, like other teams do.  So the Jets will have to find more affordable alternatives at other positions.  Ruckert and Mitchell will be the starters in 2023. Well, no guarantee. The HOPE, IMO is that Becton pans out and the Jets are able to keep Fant on a reasonable extension. Mitchell will need to really show out or have some outside influences go his way to start in 2023. Ruckert is buried on the depth chart right now as the #3 TE. Sure, he will get snaps this year b/c of his blocking ability and hopefully his role will expand next year. But again, he will really have to show out to 'start'.  CJ and Conklin were both signed to a 3yr deals with an out AFTER 2023. So unless they bust as FAs and Ruckert explodes onto the scene, I don't see how he will suddenly be the 'starting TE' in 2023.  

 

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33 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

Exactly. We swapped 3rd round positions, just like we swapped our 2nd for their 1st. The only thing we gave up was the 5th

We did drop down in the 3rd round like 30 spots, but probably picked the guy we would have anyway.  

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2 hours ago, slats said:

Just like to point out that the Jets got a late third rounder back in that trade, the one that netted Jeremy Ruckert. This makes it sound like they gave up a lot more to get him. In reality, the cost according to the draft pick trade chart was a mid-fifth rounder. 

I believe the difference between the third round picks alone was worth a third rounder - mid third on the Jimmy Johnson chart, very late third on the Rich Hill chart.

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7 minutes ago, PepPep said:

 

Good point on the other TE contracts.  I think that is right-Ruckert is TE1/2 in 2024, hopefully. 

As I had said before, although JD did structure his FA contracts with “outs” after 1-2 years, he has not exercised any of those outs yet.  McGovern, Fant and Rankins are still here.  I would think that Davis and Lawson are still here next year.  

There is no rational explanation at this point for trading up and not getting more defensive help than the Jets liking their defensive players better than those on this Board do.   We are a pretty smart group-we knew RG and T would be a problem, and it really, really was.   I hope we can add at least one quality hold-the-fort veteran.  

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8 minutes ago, doitny said:

we are all praising JD for this draft but i have been wondering and this article makes me wonder more.... if Gardner is gone do we pick Stingley or go for a OL. cause an OL would have upend this whole draft. I think Gardner was mainly a BAP pick. So if he was gone they would have take Ekwonu- just my guess. 

Wilson should still be the pick at 10. or do they take JJ at 10. i doubt we still go Hall and Ruckert. no way do we just add an Edge and ignore the defense till rd 5. I think Wilson (if available) is still the pick at 10. And yes, JJ, Hall and Ruckert are still the picks...why not? Does 1 CB selection (or lack there of) really make that much of a difference? Its not a huge need for the Jets with DJ Reed, Hall, Echols, Carter II, Guidry. Then, instead of Mitchell, you would assume they take a CB or S or defensive player.  

and then all the OL drama with Becton. he wouldnt be happy and he loves Twitter. and i dont think he gets traded cause of value and optics. or maybe Woody got invovled and told them they cant draft an OL 3 years in a row. Not sure about Woody, or what Becton would say, but the Jets would Fant in a contract year, Becton coming off injury and Ekwonu an unproven rookie. Going into 2022 and beyond, despite having 3 OTs, this is far from what you would call 'stability' at the position. I'm sure the Jets would be happy with the pick and the best two players will win out the job. Any drama would be generated by the media and fan base.  

i guess we will never know until ESPN does a "30 for 30" in 20 years to talk about our 2025-26 Super Bowl championships and we look back at this draft as the main piece of it. 🤞

 

 

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1 minute ago, derp said:

I believe the difference between the third round picks alone was worth a third rounder - mid third on the Jimmy Johnson chart, very late third on the Rich Hill chart.

I usually use this one: https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp

That Jimmy Johnson chart went out the window with the latest CBA. 

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4 minutes ago, slats said:

I usually use this one: https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp

That Jimmy Johnson chart went out the window with the latest CBA. 

That link is the Jimmy Johnson chart haha.

But even on the Hill chart on that page, pick 69 is worth 71 and pick 101 worth 36. Difference of 35 equals pick 102 or 103. So that difference is a late third rounder, not a fifth.

Then the fifth rounder gets it to the early 90’s.

Unless there’s a third chart I’m missing.

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2 minutes ago, derp said:

That link is the Jimmy Johnson chart haha.

But even on the Hill chart on that page, pick 69 is worth 71 and pick 101 worth 36. Difference of 35 equals pick 102 or 103. So that difference is a late third rounder, not a fifth.

Then the fifth rounder gets it to the early 90’s.

Unless there’s a third chart I’m missing.

Lol, then I don’t know what I’m doing… 

But using that chart I linked: 

Titans get: #36 = 540, #68 = 250, #163 = 24.6. Total: 814.6

Jets get: #26 = 700, #101 = 96. Total: 796 

Difference: 18.6, or a late fifth round pick. 

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40 minutes ago, doitny said:

we are all praising JD for this draft but i have been wondering and this article makes me wonder more.... if Gardner is gone do we pick Stingley or go for a OL. cause an OL would have upend this whole draft.

Wilson should still be the pick at 10. or do they take JJ at 10. i doubt we still go Hall and Ruckert. no way do we just add an Edge and ignore the defense till rd 5

and then all the OL drama with Becton. he wouldnt be happy and he loves Twitter. and i dont think he gets traded cause of value and optics. or maybe Woody got invovled and told them they cant draft an OL 3 years in a row.

i guess we will never know until ESPN does a "30 for 30" in 20 years to talk about our 2025-26 Super Bowl championships and we look back at this draft as the main piece of it.

Love it. Huge tailgate and party at Jetlife stadium for the premier.😁

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41 minutes ago, doitny said:

we are all praising JD for this draft but i have been wondering and this article makes me wonder more.... if Gardner is gone do we pick Stingley or go for a OL. cause an OL would have upend this whole draft.

Wilson should still be the pick at 10. or do they take JJ at 10. i doubt we still go Hall and Ruckert. no way do we just add an Edge and ignore the defense till rd 5

and then all the OL drama with Becton. he wouldnt be happy and he loves Twitter. and i dont think he gets traded cause of value and optics. or maybe Woody got invovled and told them they cant draft an OL 3 years in a row.

i guess we will never know until ESPN does a "30 for 30" in 20 years to talk about our 2025-26 Super Bowl championships and we look back at this draft as the main piece of it.

You’re sssuming the OT would replace becton. Fant is on his last year, it could be simply a backfill pick

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1 hour ago, CTJetsFan said:

Exactly. We swapped 3rd round positions, just like we swapped our 2nd for their 1st. The only thing we gave up was the 5th

It was an excellent trade from Douglas. Got his guy at 26, and didn't pay a lot. Getting that 3rd round pick swap included allowed him to take Ruckert, a really talented guy who should be a real asset to the team. Bargain.

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44 minutes ago, slats said:

Lol, then I don’t know what I’m doing… 

But using that chart I linked: 

Titans get: #36 = 540, #68 = 250, #163 = 24.6. Total: 814.6

Jets get: #26 = 700, #101 = 96. Total: 796 

Difference: 18.6, or a late fifth round pick. 

Haha my goodness I’m clearly sleep deprived. That is the Jimmy Johnson chart though!

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53 minutes ago, slats said:

Lol, then I don’t know what I’m doing… 

But using that chart I linked: 

Titans get: #36 = 540, #68 = 250, #163 = 24.6. Total: 814.6

Jets get: #26 = 700, #101 = 96. Total: 796 

Difference: 18.6, or a late fifth round pick. 

I think what you're saying is that in total, we overpaid by about a late fifth round pick.  Because you're including *all* of the picks.

What many people do is try to figure out what the value of the 3's and the 5th are - which I guess is like a late 3.   So then, you can say it cost us a late 3 to move up from 35 to 26.

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