2024 a QB-rich draft

[derp]

1 hour ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

You Zach lovers will never stop trying to ninja him back into the starting job

I was vocally against them even drafting Zach Wilson, certainly am not a lover of his, and absolutely don’t want him to be starting. Other than that, though.

[maury77]

On 11/20/2023 at 11:59 AM, Rich Thornburgh said:

You Zach lovers will never stop trying to ninja him back into the starting job

Not to speak for @derp but I can't remember him ever posting anything Pro Zach. 

[derp]

27 minutes ago, maury77 said:

Not to speak for @derp but I can't remember him ever posting anything Pro Zach. 

I followed the same timeline as @JiF effectively. When nobody was talking about him mid college season I was like huh this guy is kind of interesting as a semi early developmental guy. Then I dug in more and it was a hard pass from there, but somehow he became a top three pick which made him even more of a hard pass.

[JustInFudge]

On 10/4/2023 at 1:52 PM, JiF said:

The guy I'm watching to see how he finishes the year is Jordan Travis.  His growth has been incredible over the years and he seems to get better and better every time I see him play.  His play making ability is undeniable and while down to down, he's not going to drop and pick you apart from the pocket, I do think he's of that Jalen Hurts mold where he's explosive in both the run and pass, cool calm and collected, a leader, etc.

I assume a 2nd/3rd round pick because he doesnt have the eye popping arm talent but the total package, is very intriguing and really want to see how he performs in the playoffs. 

 

Really a shame to see Jordan Travis injured before the playoffs but maybe this pushes him down the draft a little bit and you can grab him in the 3rd or 4th now like Herndon Hooker and let him heal, develop, etc. etc. etc.

I hate this top QB class so I havent even been interested in this thread or any of the prospects but I'm starting to come around on a few mid round guys and Travis is the top of the list.  I was actually really starting to like what I saw from Graham Mertz as well, no homer, I'll kill a Florida QB w/ the quickness, so it's shame he got hurt as well but he's another dude I'd look at in the late rounds.  And some may laugh at this but I really like the way Spencer Rattler is finishing his college career.  Another mid round dude I like. 

 

[Augustiniak]

7 minutes ago, JiF said:

Really a shame to see Jordan Travis injured before the playoffs but maybe this pushes him down the draft a little bit and you can grab him in the 3rd or 4th now like Herndon Hooker and let him heal, develop, etc. etc. etc.

I hate this top QB class so I havent even been interested in this thread or any of the prospects but I'm starting to come around on a few mid round guys and Travis is the top of the list.  I was actually really starting to like what I saw from Graham Mertz as well, no homer, I'll kill a Florida QB w/ the quickness, so it's shame he got hurt as well but he's another dude I'd look at in the late rounds.  And some may laugh at this but I really like the way Spencer Rattler is finishing his college career.  Another mid round dude I like. 

 

I suspect douglas is going to be scouting the heck out of those mid round prospects now.  Another name, Michael pratt, solid qb who can run an offense.  The opposite of wilson - mature, natural leader, decent arm, good instincts.  

[Adoni Beast]

1 hour ago, Augustiniak said:

I suspect douglas is going to be scouting the heck out of those mid round prospects now.  Another name, Michael pratt, solid qb who can run an offense.  The opposite of wilson - mature, natural leader, decent arm, good instincts.  

I agree that these are the types of QBs we should be / will probably be looking at this draft. Sign a vet this offseason (Tannehiill, Minshew, Famous Jameis) and draft someone to be a long-term backup.

[Augustiniak]

1 hour ago, Adoni Beast said:

I agree that these are the types of QBs we should be / will probably be looking at this draft. Sign a vet this offseason (Tannehiill, Minshew, Famous Jameis) and draft someone to be a long-term backup.

There are guys who could become starters they could draft on day 2.  

[JustInFudge]

5 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

I suspect douglas is going to be scouting the heck out of those mid round prospects now.  Another name, Michael pratt, solid qb who can run an offense.  The opposite of wilson - mature, natural leader, decent arm, good instincts.  

Yep, another solid name to throw out there.  I like Pratt.  Took notice of him last year in the AAC Champ game vs. UCF.  Dude balled out of control that day.  Havent really paid attention to him this year but looks like Tulane is having another solid year.

[T0mShane]

Just dipping my toe into the QB draft combo and can someone explain Drake Maye to me? He’s had one really good statistical game this season and that came against a school called “Campbell.” I know Brugler and Tice have been in love with him for two years, but I just don’t really see it when I watch him 

[Augustiniak]

16 hours ago, JiF said:

Yep, another solid name to throw out there.  I like Pratt.  Took notice of him last year in the AAC Champ game vs. UCF.  Dude balled out of control that day.  Havent really paid attention to him this year but looks like Tulane is having another solid year.

That’s the type of qb the jets should be drafting now.  No home run swings in the top 5.  Take an experienced qb who can lead and handle the pressure.  If they drafted rome in round 1 and pratt in 3 you give the offense the present and future it needs.  

[Augustiniak]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

Just dipping my toe into the QB draft combo and can someone explain Drake Maye to me? He’s had one really good statistical game this season and that came against a school called “Campbell.” I know Brugler and Tice have been in love with him for two years, but I just don’t really see it when I watch him 

Measureables. That ugly word that leads to picks like zachy

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, Augustiniak said:

That’s the type of qb the jets should be drafting now.  No home run swings in the top 5.  Take an experienced qb who can lead and handle the pressure.  If they drafted rome in round 1 and pratt in 3 you give the offense the present and future it needs.  

Yeah, for sure, I wouldnt mind that approach.  I might be in the minority but Rodgers at least on the surface looks rejuvenated here in terms of his desire to play and I do think he's the type of guy who could play for 2-3 more years at in the very least, top 15-10 range and that would such a welcome change and probably enough to make the Jets a playoff team, so why not?  The team needs to get stabilized and it gives them an opportunity to truly develop the roster and a young QB, instead of what they typically do.

[derp]

10 minutes ago, JiF said:

Yeah, for sure, I wouldnt mind that approach.  I might be in the minority but Rodgers at least on the surface looks rejuvenated here in terms of his desire to play and I do think he's the type of guy who could play for 2-3 more years at in the very least, top 15-10 range and that would such a welcome change and probably enough to make the Jets a playoff team, so why not?  The team needs to get stabilized and it gives them an opportunity to truly develop the roster and a young QB, instead of what they typically do.

If he hangs for a few years then they should just take a guy in round 2-4 annually unless they think they might have found the guy who will stick and start after Rodgers hangs em up once he’s in the building.

[Augustiniak]

16 minutes ago, JiF said:

Yeah, for sure, I wouldnt mind that approach.  I might be in the minority but Rodgers at least on the surface looks rejuvenated here in terms of his desire to play and I do think he's the type of guy who could play for 2-3 more years at in the very least, top 15-10 range and that would such a welcome change and probably enough to make the Jets a playoff team, so why not?  The team needs to get stabilized and it gives them an opportunity to truly develop the roster and a young QB, instead of what they typically do.

Even if rodgers plays 2 more seasons, he’s going to miss games.  Any vet qb they bring in is going to be marginal anyway.  It helps rodgers to draft a legit prospect who can come in and win games to keep playoff chances alive.  

[BCJet]

On 11/22/2023 at 4:20 PM, JiF said:

Yep, another solid name to throw out there.  I like Pratt.  Took notice of him last year in the AAC Champ game vs. UCF.  Dude balled out of control that day.  Havent really paid attention to him this year but looks like Tulane is having another solid year.

I really like Pratt as well and we need to keep taking shots on QBs whether its the mid rounds or higher.  I know OL is a huge need but we havent had a QB here in years.

You cant discount how helpful sitting behind rogers will be for one of these guys.  We can actually try to develop a QB for once rather then just throwing them into the fire.  

[Larz]

That kid from Alabama , Bryce Young is can’t miss, obviously the first pick 

[Grandy]

On 11/23/2023 at 7:11 AM, T0mShane said:

Just dipping my toe into the QB draft combo and can someone explain Drake Maye to me? He’s had one really good statistical game this season and that came against a school called “Campbell.” I know Brugler and Tice have been in love with him for two years, but I just don’t really see it when I watch him 

Big build, and big armed QB with good anticipation, accuracy and a really exciting ability to throw guys open. Really good at threading the needle downfield. Has good mobility and ability to improvise outside of the pocket. Led nation in big time throws last year, and so far is number 1 this season. Plays at a school without a lot of weapons and still manages to put up big numbers. Has already faced pressure, was sacked 40 times last season and put up 38 TDs to 7 picks through the air. Good pocket presence.

Easily my favorite prospect since Lawrence in '21. When I watch him I see a complete QB on the screen. Been a big fan of his since his 2nd game last year. Reminds me of a combo of Herbert and Darnold. Which is a good thing, I loved Darnold as a prospect. Guy can play and has all the upside you'd want from someone who would be able to sit behind Rodgers and learn.

[Rich Thornburgh]

On 11/23/2023 at 1:11 PM, T0mShane said:

Just dipping my toe into the QB draft combo and can someone explain Drake Maye to me? He’s had one really good statistical game this season and that came against a school called “Campbell.” I know Brugler and Tice have been in love with him for two years, but I just don’t really see it when I watch him 

Maye put up stats against trash competition?  Sounds like a JD guy to me

[Rich Thornburgh]

On 11/23/2023 at 5:28 PM, Augustiniak said:

Even if rodgers plays 2 more seasons, he’s going to miss games.  Any vet qb they bring in is going to be marginal anyway.  It helps rodgers to draft a legit prospect who can come in and win games to keep playoff chances alive.  

We coulda had Levis in round 2 last offseason as a developmental 3rd string qb.  Instead we signed a guy who sucked at UCONN because you know we still don’t know about Zachenberg

[bonkertons]

8 hours ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

We coulda had Levis in round 2 last offseason as a developmental 3rd string qb.  Instead we signed a guy who sucked at UCONN because you know we still don’t know about Zachenberg

Could we?  Levis went 33.  We didn't pick until 43.  Unless you're saying we should have taken him in the 1st?  I'm sure that would have went over real well days after trading for Rodgers.

[Jet_Engine1]

On 10/4/2023 at 7:54 PM, win4ever said:

I haven't gotten to him yet, waiting to see how the Jets season ends to figure out what we do with QB right now. 

I did get a glimpse of Cam Ward, reminds me a little bit of Watson (obviously hope he's not a rapist) with his ability to set up escapes.  He has that basketball hop (Russel Wilson/Mahomes have it as well) where he escapes a guy in front of him by slowing down and reading the direction the defender is leaning towards.  However, I only watched the Oregon State game, and he got really bailed out on a couple of amazing catches.  The thing that worried me is that he goes to the back shoulder pass a lot, and that one is always open in college.  I thought Darnold had this issue was well, if the guy was well covered, throw it short, and have the guy adjust at the last minute.  I didn't like how much he went to it at times, but I love the tools so far.  

Yeah, I haven't gotten to Travis yet, but I've been kinda looking at Johnny Wilson a bit, wondering if he drops.  

I was on some page that was discussing Falcons trading Pitts because he's just not putting up stats.  Jonnu Smith has better stats that him on the same team (albeit he has familiarity with the offense from the Titans).  What do you think is wrong?  I've been trying to look at his film, but Drake London isn't doing that great either.  Ridder is an issue, but I can't figure out why Pitts can't separate when they have an all world RB now.  

So... if Travis is sitting there in the 4th/5th Round... do you grab him? 

[Adoni Beast]

On 11/25/2023 at 8:28 PM, Jet_Engine1 said:

So... if Travis is sitting there in the 4th/5th Round... do you grab him? 

[maury77]

I'm hesitant to post this because I've been wrong about QB prospects more often than not, but I'm intrigued by drafting McCarthy and having him sit behind Rodgers for a year.

[Rich Thornburgh]

18 hours ago, maury77 said:

I'm hesitant to post this because I've been wrong about QB prospects more often than not, but I'm intrigued by drafting McCarthy and having him sit behind Rodgers for a year.

Seems like another Baker type of qb.  More flash and bravado than talent but anyone other than Zach as the backup next year PLEASE

[maury77]

3 hours ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

Seems like another Baker type of qb.  More flash and bravado than talent but anyone other than Zach as the backup next year PLEASE

I don't think talent is an issue at all with McCarthy. He's 6'3", really good arm, athletic, plays in bad weather, etc. He needs some seasoning and work on his deep accuracy so I think if a team plays him as a rookie, he will likely fail. That being said, there are tools to work with and he's played in front of a lot of big crowds in big games. 

[Rich Thornburgh]

2 minutes ago, maury77 said:

I don't think talent is an issue at all with McCarthy. He's 6'3", really good arm, athletic, plays in bad weather, etc. He needs some seasoning and work on his deep accuracy so I think if a team plays him as a rookie, he will likely fail. That being said, there are tools to work with and he's played in front of a lot of big crowds in big games. 

No you’re definitely right. I’m a little concerned he’s a product of Harbaugh coaching him up.  Harbaugh was able to resurrect Alex Smith’s career and he had Kaepernick looking good for a couple years

[derp]

6 hours ago, maury77 said:

I don't think talent is an issue at all with McCarthy. He's 6'3", really good arm, athletic, plays in bad weather, etc. He needs some seasoning and work on his deep accuracy so I think if a team plays him as a rookie, he will likely fail. That being said, there are tools to work with and he's played in front of a lot of big crowds in big games. 

My issue with McCarthy is he really hasn’t been asked to do all that much - Michigan is still a run first team. Nothing wrong with that, they’re undefeated, but it doesn’t give a great window into whether he can carry an offense.

He’s going to go in the first because of the talent and winning games in college, and because of that the expectation will be that he can be a do everything franchise guy. But then you’re finding out if he can take on a bigger role a level up.

Think he’s best off going into a very solid situation and sitting a little. It’d be interesting if a team goes and gets him for that - but even so his college career a little different than the guys I’m thinking of who’ve had success in that way (Mahomes, Allen, Jackson). Think he’s more Dak/Russell Wilson tier in terms of needing things around him.

[Rich Thornburgh]

4 minutes ago, derp said:

My issue with McCarthy is he really hasn’t been asked to do all that much - Michigan is still a run first team. Nothing wrong with that, they’re undefeated, but it doesn’t give a great window into whether he can carry an offense.

He’s going to go in the because of the talent and winning games in college, and because of that the expectation will be that he can be a do everything franchise guy. But then you’re finding out if he can take on a bigger role a level up.

Think he’s best off going into a very solid situation and sitting a little. It’d be interesting if a team goes and gets him for that - but even so his college career a little different than the guys I’m thinking of who’ve had success in that way (Mahomes, Allen, Jackson). Think he’s more Dak/Russell Wilson tier in terms of needing things around him.

If he was coming here as a package deal with Harbaugh definitely. Harbaugh could probably have him playing well in the NFL. 
 

 

but Aaron

[bonkertons]

The more we move up the more I'm leaning QB.  Not sure if/when we'll get another opportunity like this to go get a legitimate franchise QB, especially where the teams picking 1st and 2nd will most likely be leaning away from taking a QB.  Arizona appears committed to Kyler and Chicago could very well prefer to hang onto Fields and draft Marvin Harrison Jr, while building up their OL with their own 1st rounder.  

 

If Chicago takes MHJ at 1(I don't see them moving down for the haul they'd get from a QB-needy team - I think they'd prefer MHJ), what will Arizona do?  They could just take Fashanu or Alt, or they could move down to 5-7, get probably another 1st in 2025, and still get one of Alt/Fashanu OR take their pick of whatever defensive player they want.  

 

If you can trade your '25 1st to move up and draft Caleb or Maye, I think you have to at least consider it.  Stick him behind Rodgers for a year.  Hell even bring in a veteran backup too; carry 3 QBs and ensure yourself that the kid will never see the field year 1 if that's what you want.   

[Asymmetrical]

41 minutes ago, bonkertons said:

The more we move up the more I'm leaning QB.  Not sure if/when we'll get another opportunity like this to go get a legitimate franchise QB, especially where the teams picking 1st and 2nd will most likely be leaning away from taking a QB.  Arizona appears committed to Kyler and Chicago could very well prefer to hang onto Fields and draft Marvin Harrison Jr, while building up their OL with their own 1st rounder.  

 

If Chicago takes MHJ at 1(I don't see them moving down for the haul they'd get from a QB-needy team - I think they'd prefer MHJ), what will Arizona do?  They could just take Fashanu or Alt, or they could move down to 5-7, get probably another 1st in 2025, and still get one of Alt/Fashanu OR take their pick of whatever defensive player they want.  

 

If you can trade your '25 1st to move up and draft Caleb or Maye, I think you have to at least consider it.  Stick him behind Rodgers for a year.  Hell even bring in a veteran backup too; carry 3 QBs and ensure yourself that the kid will never see the field year 1 if that's what you want.   

 

I'd be shocked if Chicago doesn't take a qb. Fields hasn't shown enough to pass up resetting the qb clock for the GM, plus he's flashed enough that someone will give them something for him.  If one does fall to 6 or wherever the Jets end up picking, I think a trade down is more likely than outright taking a guy there. 

[Adoni Beast]

Wishful thinking here and I wish it were true but I doubt it. Chicago is going to have a new coach and probably gm and will want a shiny new QB to go with that.

They would be smart to keep Fields and let the rookie sit for a year though.

9 hours ago, bonkertons said:

Chicago could very well prefer to hang onto Fields and draft Marvin Harrison Jr, while building up their OL with their own 1st rounder.  

[Adoni Beast]

As much as I want to draft QB in this draft as there’s talent at the top and in the mid-rounds….this coaching staff has no business anywhere near a young QB.

They won’t develop the, the right way, let’s be honest. Build around Rodgers, sign a good vet backup, and give it a shot for 2 years then tear it all down win or lose at that time.

[Grandy]

11 hours ago, bonkertons said:

The more we move up the more I'm leaning QB.  Not sure if/when we'll get another opportunity like this to go get a legitimate franchise QB, especially where the teams picking 1st and 2nd will most likely be leaning away from taking a QB.  Arizona appears committed to Kyler and Chicago could very well prefer to hang onto Fields and draft Marvin Harrison Jr, while building up their OL with their own 1st rounder.  

 

If Chicago takes MHJ at 1(I don't see them moving down for the haul they'd get from a QB-needy team - I think they'd prefer MHJ), what will Arizona do?  They could just take Fashanu or Alt, or they could move down to 5-7, get probably another 1st in 2025, and still get one of Alt/Fashanu OR take their pick of whatever defensive player they want.  

 

If you can trade your '25 1st to move up and draft Caleb or Maye, I think you have to at least consider it.  Stick him behind Rodgers for a year.  Hell even bring in a veteran backup too; carry 3 QBs and ensure yourself that the kid will never see the field year 1 if that's what you want.   

I would love to trade up for one of those QB's. With a Rodgers mentorship, they'd be stars in the NFL. It's all we've ever wanted and it's achievable if we just pull the trigger. 

[derp]

Long way to go but I’d be fairly shocked if a trade in the top three happens. Teams that land those picks are almost certainly going to take Maye, Williams, and Harrison with Harrison going third. I can’t see any team that lands with a top two pick in this class being committed to their current QB.

[bonkertons]

12 hours ago, Adoni Beast said:

As much as I want to draft QB in this draft as there’s talent at the top and in the mid-rounds….this coaching staff has no business anywhere near a young QB.

They won’t develop the, the right way, let’s be honest. Build around Rodgers, sign a good vet backup, and give it a shot for 2 years then tear it all down win or lose at that time.

Yeah I don't really buy the whole "developing QBs" thing.  CJ Stroud is proof to me that some prospects are just meant to be good NFL QBs, while many aren't.  If you want to say that they are incapable of choosing the right guy, then sure.  No regime has chosen the right guy outside of whoever was running things back when Namath became a Jet.  Perhaps you can add Pennington to that list.  Like do we think that if Lawrence and Zach switched teams back in '21, nothing would have changed for each team?  I highly doubt it.  That said, taking a guy like Caleb or Maye seems a lot less risky than letting JD choose between JJ McCarthy, Bo Nix, Michael Penix, etc.  Chances are whoever we choose from that second tier will follow the Jet tradition of falling on their face.  But drafting Caleb and sticking him behind Rodgers for a year?  I'll buy that we can't develop QBs if he fails in that scenario.  

 

Also not big on tearing it down win or lose in 2 years.  Most of this team's best players were drafted within the last 2 or 3 years.  Overall this team's core is still extremely young.  Better plan would be to draft your QB of the future in '24(ideally) or '25 and have him ready to take over for Rodgers as early as 2025.  Try to compete while your QB is on his rookie deal, which should allow you to pay/keep your top players.

 

10 hours ago, derp said:

Long way to go but I’d be fairly shocked if a trade in the top three happens. Teams that land those picks are almost certainly going to take Maye, Williams, and Harrison with Harrison going third. I can’t see any team that lands with a top two pick in this class being committed to their current QB.

From what I'm hearing Arizona is pretty committed to Kyler, and he's looked pretty good post-injury.  I think if the Bears go Caleb 1, yeah there's no shot of moving up.  Arizona won't trade out, they'll just take Marvin Harrison, and then New England takes Maye.  Both QBs gone by pick 3.  If Chicago still believe in Fields though, I think they take Harrison and then Arizona trades out.  If that happens I think we still need to be around pick 5 or 6 to even be a contender there.  Even then a team like the Giants could offer up a 2nd this year which we obviously can't match.  If they're sitting around pick 9 or 10 though, and we're at pick 5, that might still give us an advantage even if we're only offering our 2025 1st.  Add in that they'd be sending Caleb out of the conference.  

 

Either way it wouldn't be make or break for me if it's not possible, just something we should absolutely be looking into.  Worst case you stay put and take a kid like Alt or even move down, pick up a 2nd and take one of those RTs like Latham/Fuaga and then maybe a WR round 2.  Or get swirly and just take Daniels who seems to be flying up draft boards.  Either way, this pick will be interesting.  No matter what, this offseason we need to walk away with a high-end OT, a #2 WR, and our QB of the future.  IMO, at least.