The Great Jeff Ulbrich

[slimjasi]

Clue #45 that Saleh is a bad head coach:

 

He constantly hides behind his “system” - he has explained several times in response to the suggestion that Sauce travel with the other team’s best WR that the corners must stay on their side of the field in his system. He says it “complicates” the system for everyone else to let the corner travel. 
 

Bad coaches tend to use their system as a crutch. I’ve noticed it with Gase and Hackett - who are always talking about their “system” 

[TuscanyTile2]

10 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Clue #45 that Saleh is bad head coach:

 

He constantly hides behind his “system” - he has explained several times in response to the suggestion that Sauce travel with the other team’s best WR that the corners must stay on their side of the field in his system. He says it “complicates” the system for everyone else to let the corner travel. 
 

Bad coaches tend of use their system as a crutch. I’ve noticed it with Gase and Hackett - who are always talking about their “system” 

I can't stand Saleh at this point.  Even the wording in his PC's are subtle (or not so subtle!) jabs at others.  In yesterday's PC, he said something like he believes they have a championship roster but they have to win with the players they have on the field.  In other words, "It's not my fault!  We had injuries!"  IIRC, Benigno said that Saleh told him something like "I just want a chance to coach with a real QB".  Pathetic that he would take a shot like that at a guy who is on his roster (and he knows Benigno has no filter so WTF is he doing talking to him about this stuff?!)  Meanwhile, the Browns are 9-5 and they have Joe Flacco at QB.   

It really annoys me that Saleh throws around Navy Seals' rhetoric, considering he's the king of "passing the buck".  I'd love it if he got fired after this season (though I know it won't happen).

[UntouchableCrew]

49 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Without their MVP candidate, Tyreek Hill, Tua went 21/24 for 224 yards.  

#TheGreatJeffUlbrich

The offense had 103 yards, 4 turnovers and 0 points.

Why are we talking about the defense?

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, UntouchableCrew said:

The offense had 103 yards, 4 turnovers and 0 points.

Why are we talking about the defense?

Why wouldn't we?  

[UntouchableCrew]

Just now, TuscanyTile2 said:

Why wouldn't we?  

Because they’re a top ten unit by pretty much any metric and our offense is exceptionally, historically terrible and the obvious problem with this team.

If the offense was even halfway passable we’re in the playoffs this year.

[slimjasi]

3 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

The offense had 103 yards, 4 turnovers and 0 points.

Why are we talking about the defense?

Fun fact about the Saleh/Wilson era:

The Jets have had 5 games in their history with 103 yards or fewer - Saleh/Wilson were the coach/QB for 3 of them. 

[Sperm Edwards]

On 12/18/2023 at 7:49 AM, BP said:

If you always have to look at film on Monday it means you have no answers on gameday and are incompetent. How shocking that our coaching staff never has an answer after the game, but always says “I don’t know I have to look at the film” it’s too late to look at the film you dumbass the games over

That's just coaches' easy-out ways of not answering questions, so they don't potentially eat their words later in the week, make changes on their timelines not the reporters' timelines, and further don't have to call out individual players as playing like crap that play (ors that whole game). It's been a hallmark of every HC for many years no matter how much better their coaching reputations: Reid, Belichick, everybody. HOF players say it, too.

You just don't hear it as much from more successful coaches because fewer negative questions get asked. We hear it more from Saleh because he's overwhelmingly been a loser gameday HC more than twice as often as he's been a winning one. His 16*-32 record includes giving him credit for the game Middleton won while Saleh was out with covid.

[TuscanyTile2]

6 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Because they’re a top ten unit by pretty much any metric and our offense is exceptionally, historically terrible and the obvious problem with this team.

If the offense was even halfway passable we’re in the playoffs this year.

The defense is loaded though.  They should be a top 10 unit.  The question is "Is Jeff Ulbrich the guy who deserves to be behind the wheel?"

I'm not saying he's bad but I've said all season long that there are probably plenty of other guys out there who could do just as good of a job, if not better.  I stand by that statement.

Quote

If the offense was even halfway passable we’re in the playoffs this year.

So what?  I don't want "good enough but he leaves a lot of stuff on the table".  It's not like Ulbrich should be above scrutiny.  He hasn't come anywhere close to earning that right.

[FidelioJet]

8 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Meanwhile, the Browns are 9-5 and they have Joe Flacco at QB.   

This is such a good point.  Flacco was a disaster here.  Even Wilson last year (and he's been better this year) gave the Jets a better chance to win than Flacco....

He looks MUCH better in Cleveland than he did on the Jets.   What does that tell us?

[Jetsplayer21]

30 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Well, we'll likely have a top 10 pick that we can us to help out the defense!  Saleh is going to embarrass some QBs next year!!!

The almighty Joe doughnuts just may go with the safe D pick once again like last yr lol. Imagine being so bad at your job, and still have the audacity to use your first round pick for even more extra DL depth while your ENTIRE offense is starving for talent. Why not double down and do it again 🙈

[UntouchableCrew]

Just now, TuscanyTile2 said:

The defense is loaded though.  They should be a top 10 unit.  The question is "Is Jeff Ulbrich the guy who deserves to be behind the wheel?"

I'm not saying he's bad but I've said all season long that there are probably plenty of other guys out there who could do just as good of a job, if not better.  I stand by that statement.

Maybe. I think Ulbrich has done a good job by and large.

The inherent issue with this team is so clear and well defined though that complaining about the defense just seems preposterous. The offense (which has virtually without exception sucked for decades) has reached rock bottom and is literally setting records for failure — I mean, all time records for inability to convert third downs.

[UntouchableCrew]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

This is such a good point.  Flacco was a disaster here.  Even Wilson last year (and he's been better this year) gave the Jets a better chance to win than Flacco....

He looks MUCH better in Cleveland than he did on the Jets.   What does that tell us?

Actually Joe Flacco was head and shoulders better than Zach Wilson last year.

[T0mShane]

9 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

This is such a good point.  Flacco was a disaster here.  Even Wilson last year (and he's been better this year) gave the Jets a better chance to win than Flacco....

He looks MUCH better in Cleveland than he did on the Jets.   What does that tell us?

Mike White put up 315 yards and three TDs against that Bears defense last year and you said it didn’t count. 

[TuscanyTile2]

7 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Maybe. I think Ulbrich has done a good job by and large.

The inherent issue with this team is so clear and well defined though that complaining about the defense just seems preposterous. The offense (which has virtually without exception sucked for decades) has reached rock bottom and is literally setting records for failure — I mean, all time records for inability to convert third downs.

I understand where you're coming from but I want this team to improve from every angle.  Let's not forget that Ulbrich's defense was a disaster a couple of years ago too (remember 54-13 against the Pats?)  Then the team greatly upgraded the talent and now he's got a top 10 unit. That's great but it's also something we should demand/expect, given the talent level.

The job of a coach is to get the most out of what he's been given.  I'm not sure Ulbrich is our best option here.  The season was on the line last week and our defense laid an egg against a team that was missing it's superstar WR.  But our DC didn't adjust because of his scheme.

Ulbrich hasn't proven anywhere near enough to be above scrutiny.

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Mike White out up 315 yards and three TDs against that Bears defense last year and you said it didn’t count. 

Not everything is about Mike White.  

Joe Flacco simply looks like a better QB than he did last year, by a lot.  It says something about this organization that he looked so lethargic, uninterested and completely disjointed.  Now he looks like an NFL QB again.

That's the point.  

Now, if you want to make it about Mike White...I suspect if he had to start in Miami he would look substantially better too.  Almost certainly be better than his 8:12 TD:INT ratio and he would probably even find a way to actually find a way to win a few games too - Thing change when playing in an organization that values offense.

[Jetsplayer21]

8 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I understand where you're coming from but I want this team to improve from every angle.  Let's not forget that Ulbrich's defense was a disaster a couple of years ago too (remember 54-13 against the Pats?)  Then the team greatly upgraded the talent and now he's got a top 10 unit. That's great but it's also something we should demand/expect, given the talent level.

The job of a coach is to get the most out of what he's been given.  I'm not sure Ulbrich is our best option here.  The season was on the line last week and our defense laid an egg against a team that was missing it's superstar WR.  But our DC didn't adjust because of his scheme.

Ulbrich hasn't proven anywhere near enough to be above scrutiny.

His D has really come through when it counts this year. You know the rare times we were protecting leads at end of games. Not like the guy who let Seahawks backup look like Tom Brady last night. KC game is the only loss of season where offense scored more than 13 points. Which was 20. So it’s not like we can say the D has been costing us games when the offense got the job done. Most teams would have a lot less wins if their offense wasn’t even scoring 2 touchdowns. But defending the slim leads at end of games is thankfully a very bright spot of the D. 

[Jetsplayer21]

21 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Not everything is about Mike White.  

Joe Flacco simply looks like a better QB than he did last year, by a lot.  It says something about this organization that he looked so lethargic, uninterested and completely disjointed.  Now he looks like an NFL QB again.

That's the point.  

Now, if you want to make it about Mike White...I suspect if he had to start in Miami he would look substantially better too.  Almost certainly be better than his 8:12 TD:INT ratio and he would probably even find a way to actually find a way to win a few games too - Thing change when playing in an organization that values offense.

It’s the desire and need to prove something that makes a lot of players , qbs maybe especially, find that extra gear/ motivation. You are right Flacco looked like he didn’t care much last yr. Maybe because he thought he would just cruise through the backup stage, not have to put much into it. Until nobody wanted to sign his asss this yr. Sitting at home waiting for call, he now has to fight and play hard again.
 

Can say same thing about Zach. He has looked like complete doggsh*t when he is comfortable in his position. The rare two good games he had this yr was KC and Houston. Before the KC game it was leaked zach and Saleh was losing lockeroom, and Zach was going to be benched if he didn’t show something in KC game. Can’t judge qbs by W/L, and other than the bonehead fumble end of game, he played a good game. You could see the hunger to prove the doubters wrong. Ofcouse he didn’t keep it up once he was confident and comfortable in his spot again. Then we saw that competitive pissed off play again vs Houston after benching.

[ylekram]

On 12/18/2023 at 12:11 AM, TuscanyTile2 said:

Still won't put Sauce on the opposing team's WR1.  Waddle burned us for 142 yards and a TD yet our #4 overall pick was guarding Braxton Berrios.

 

i wish our #2 wide receiver would put up 142 yards .oh wait, we don't have a #2 receiver, or a #3 receiver, or a QB, or an oline, or a running game, or

[greenwichjetfan]

On 12/17/2023 at 11:15 PM, Vader said:

this is one of the more mysterious ones

like seriously wtf is so hard about more flexible perimeter D

On 12/17/2023 at 11:11 PM, TuscanyTile2 said:

Still won't put Sauce on the opposing team's WR1.  Waddle burned us for 142 yards and a TD yet our #4 overall pick was guarding Braxton Berrios.

 

On 12/18/2023 at 5:23 AM, Maxman said:

I hated the thought of this scheme originally. But we have seen it work well.

The scheme is great, the lack of flexibility is what sucks.

Some weeks you need a new game plan.

On 12/18/2023 at 5:43 AM, neckdemon said:

but thats just it. the scheme is so rigid apparently that they can't or won't make in game adjustments. when the opposing offense is scheming way to create mismatches against you, and destroying you because of it, you need to be able to counter that. if you can't because your scheme won't allow it, well then the scheme has a catastrophic fault. the scheme looks good when it's working. i think its the quality of players that makes it look better than it is. it's my belief that with a proper scheme this group of guys is capable of being the best defense in the league. 

I think we're missing the picture here. I don't think the coaches are looking at this and saying we don't want to change our scheme. I think they're looking at it and saying that DJ has been even better than Sauce all year, so he should be the guy going up against their WR1 with Tyreek out.

Sometimes it's ok to blame the player. DJ is probably my favorite defender on the team, but he got played on Sunday. It happens.

This defense behind Ulbrich and Saleh is the best defense we've seen in 13 years. After Rodgers went down, it's been the only thing that's given most of us any sense of confidence going into any game. If we had any semblance of offense, this would be a top 3 defense in multiple major categories. Odd that this is the hill some folks are choosing to die on. 

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I think we're missing the picture here. I don't think the coaches are looking at this and saying we don't want to change our scheme. I think they're looking at it and saying that DJ has been even better than Sauce all year, so he should be the guy going up against their WR1 with Tyreek out.

Sometimes it's ok to blame the player. DJ is probably my favorite defender on the team, but he got played on Sunday. It happens.

This defense behind Ulbrich and Saleh is the best defense we've seen in 13 years. After Rodgers went down, it's been the only thing that's given most of us any sense of confidence going into any game. If we had any semblance of offense, this would be a top 3 defense in multiple major categories. Odd that this is the hill some folks are choosing to die on. 

Why is criticizing Ulbrich considered to be "dying on a hill"?  We're not allowed to criticize the guy because our offense has been historically bad?!  That makes no sense whatsoever to me.

And even if they think DJ has been better than Sauce, why not switch at some point during the game when it was apparent it wasn't DJ's day?

Again, our season was on the line and the Dolphins were missing their MVP candidate WR, yet Tua went 21 of 24 for 224 yards.

[Ken Schroy]

On 12/18/2023 at 6:23 AM, Maxman said:

I hated the thought of this scheme originally. But we have seen it work well.

The scheme is great, the lack of flexibility is what sucks.

Some weeks you need a new game plan.

There is an arrogance from this CS that is stunning. What have they done to be so stubborn?

[DJF71]

On 12/17/2023 at 11:11 PM, TuscanyTile2 said:

Still won't put Sauce on the opposing team's WR1.  Waddle burned us for 142 yards and a TD yet our #4 overall pick was guarding Braxton Berrios.

 

This is Saleh's defense. He is the head coach. He can make changes. This is not Ulbrich's fault. 

[Plen T]

its Bobby Boys call

Saleh is a HORRIBLE coach who has ALWAYS had STACKED TALENT!

[LIJetsFan]

2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

That's just coaches' easy-out ways of not answering questions, so they don't potentially eat their words later in the week, make changes on their timelines not the reporters' timelines, and further don't have to call out individual players as playing like crap that play (ors that whole game). It's been a hallmark of every HC for many years no matter how much better their coaching reputations: Reid, Belichick, everybody. HOF players say it, too.

You just don't hear it as much from more successful coaches because fewer negative questions get asked. We hear it more from Saleh because he's overwhelmingly been a loser gameday HC more than twice as often as he's been a winning one. His 16*-32 record includes giving him credit for the game Middleton won while Saleh was out with covid.

Serious question, what is so wrong with calling out players who screw up?  

[Beerfish]

On 12/17/2023 at 10:11 PM, TuscanyTile2 said:

Still won't put Sauce on the opposing team's WR1.  Waddle burned us for 142 yards and a TD yet our #4 overall pick was guarding Braxton Berrios.

 

Ulbrich and Saleh are oh so similar to Todd Bowles.  "Our system is more important than compromising it to neutralize the other teams top player'  And then let that top player beat you.   The total opposite o Bellichicks philosophy.  We are going to see out to stop you best players, try and have your 3rd option beat our team.

[Jet_Engine1]

On 12/18/2023 at 6:23 AM, Maxman said:

I hated the thought of this scheme originally. But we have seen it work well.

The scheme is great, the lack of flexibility is what sucks.

Some weeks you need a new game plan.

It works until it doesn't.  Then you have to adjust. They refuse.

[FTL Jet Fan]

On 12/18/2023 at 12:11 AM, TuscanyTile2 said:

Still won't put Sauce on the opposing team's WR1.  Waddle burned us for 142 yards and a TD yet our #4 overall pick was guarding Braxton Berrios.

 

[LIJetsFan]

LOL complaining about or D.  Jets message board fans  

[JohnnyLV]

Secret:

We would have a Top 5 defense in any scheme with any DC. In fact, we would likely be better in a different defensive scheme. In fact I am positive we would be

[TuscanyTile2]

15 minutes ago, LIJetsFan said:

LOL complaining about or D.  Jets message board fans  

Tyreek is an MVP candidate this year and he wasn't playing.  Yet we allowed Tua to go 21 of 24 for 224 yards.  This in a game where our season was on the line.  Our DC didn't put Sauce on Waddle.  Instead, he covered Braxton Berrios.

Obviously we've been a very good defense this year but, again, we should be based on talent.  In a must-win game, our DC sh-t the bed.  Were they the main problem?  Absolutely not.  But you don't just ignore problems because you also have other problems.  You forget that Ulbrich's defense gave up 54 to the Pats a couple of years ago?  Now they're a much better defense because the talent level has been greatly upgraded.  But expectations for our CS also need to be raised accordingly.  And on Sunday, we stunk.

[Sperm Edwards]

24 minutes ago, LIJetsFan said:

Serious question, what is so wrong with calling out players who screw up?  

They do sometimes, depending on which player & the situation & how obvious the screw-up was, but most of the time they just don't anymore & it's not just Saleh. Some of these players now just have more clout than the HC, tbh. 

When would they? Yeah if there was only one turnover and it was a muffed punt & that fumble became the turning point of the game or something, but even then most of them say the whole game isn't about that one play, it's a team loss, etc. (idea being if they were up by 10 points a TD after a fumble wouldn't have mattered). It's a way to spread out the blame, probably, so it's less likely the locker room divides into warring factions over a single game. Over time when the good/bad play is so lopsided on one side of the ball - like with this team - I'm sure to a degree it happens anyway.

Other than that explanation, I've got nothing. 

[T0mShane]

36 minutes ago, LIJetsFan said:

LOL complaining about or D.  Jets message board fans  

It’s like the pro-iceberg people trying to explain why the Titanic sank without ever mentioning the iceberg. 

[T0mShane]

24 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Yet we allowed Tua to go 21 of 24 for 224 yards

He hit the one 60 yarder by half an inch and gave up 20 completions for 164 yards otherwise. They held the league’s #2 rushing attack to 2.8 yards per carry. The Dolphins put together one sustained scoring drive over 42 yards, and that was helped by a roughing penalty on Tony Adams. 

[LIJetsFan]

45 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

They do sometimes, depending on which player & the situation & how obvious the screw-up was, but most of the time they just don't anymore & it's not just Saleh. Some of these players now just have more clout than the HC, tbh. 

When would they? Yeah if there was only one turnover and it was a muffed punt & that fumble became the turning point of the game or something, but even then most of them say the whole game isn't about that one play, it's a team loss, etc. (idea being if they were up by 10 points a TD after a fumble wouldn't have mattered). It's a way to spread out the blame, probably, so it's less likely the locker room divides into warring factions over a single game. Over time when the good/bad play is so lopsided on one side of the ball - like with this team - I'm sure to a degree it happens anyway.

Other than that explanation, I've got nothing. 

Old school HCing, if player screwed up on the field he would be benched for some or all of that game.  Another way of calling out a player.  I just wish our HC would do something, anything to hold some of these knuckleheads accountable.  

[TuscanyTile2]

29 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

He hit the one 60 yarder by half an inch and gave up 20 completions for 164 yards otherwise. They held the league’s #2 rushing attack to 2.8 yards per carry. The Dolphins put together one sustained scoring drive over 42 yards, and that was helped by a roughing penalty on Tony Adams. 

Waddle had 8 catches.  We didn't hold the Dolphins to anything.  Mike McDaniel took it easy on his buddy in the 2nd half.