Popular Post Claymation Posted January 4 Popular Post Share Posted January 4 That falls squarely on the shoulder of this CS, they have been the biggest liability this season. 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Claymation Posted January 4 Author Popular Post Share Posted January 4 Michael Nania @Michael_Nania The crux of Saleh's argument for the supposed offensive improvement is that he claims the film shows an increased number of opportunities being created, which you can't see by looking at the stats/production. "Through tape, [we've] seen a lot of improvement. Not going to get into stats." He's basically arguing that Hackett is doing a good job of scheming up opportunities but the talent is not executing them, leading to bad stats in spite of good opportunity creation by the scheme. In some situations, his argument could be feasible. This is something that can and does happen in the NFL. It's possible for a well-schemed offense to be let down by its talent. And to an extent, the Jets were obviously let down by talent this year. Their QBs, OL, and WRs were limiting factors that would make any coach look worse. But Saleh's comments insinuate that he thinks nobody watches the film. People do. And we can all see that, while the talent is definitely poor and will occasionally botch a well-schemed play, the coaching is still very poor overall. Both can be true at the same time. This is a league where we see so many teams overcome injuries and lackluster talent to be competitive thanks to good coaching. I'm not going to do the whole Browns rant again but that's a perfect example. What's the Jets' excuse? Hackett's offense is a highly penalized, disjointed mess. They fail to get the ball snapped in time at crucial points of the game. They constantly botch protections and leave people unblocked in the run game. There are often miscommunications between the QB and receiver. Coaching doesn't own any responsibility for these things? From a play calling perspective, Hackett very rarely schemes up an easy play for the pass game, is very unsuccessful at dialing up favorable numbers for the screen game, and is extremely predictable with his run/pass tendencies. Also, despite Saleh's claims of increased pre-snap motion, the Jets used a bottom-4 motion rate both in the first 8 games and the last 8 games. He also made poor decisions regarding personnel package distribution and often failed to construct game plans that were built around exploiting the opponent's weaknesses. When you watch most offenses around the NFL, a lot of their production comes on plays where the players' jobs were easy because the play was designed so perfectly. This almost never happened for the Jets this year. Anybody watching on a TV broadcast could see that. And while I will not claim to be an expert on schemes nor do I know the Jets' playbook, I can assure you from watching the tape every week that there are no secrets being withheld from fans on the All-22. Hackett gets circles coached around him for the majority of most games. It's not as if there are 10 open deep bombs being missed every week due to the QB/OL. It's stunning how far they go to defend one of the worst offenses in the history of the sport. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge4Tide Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Not good, but the fruit basket turnover on the offensive line and 4 different qbs starting games will lead to a lot of pre-snap penalties. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Warfish Posted January 4 Popular Post Share Posted January 4 Saleh is a poor coach who cannot get his team to play with any discipline whatsoever. It's shown with all the untimely, costly and constant penalties his teams have incurred throughout his tenure in New York. Sloppy and undisciplined. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sperm Edwards Posted January 4 Popular Post Share Posted January 4 1 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangerous Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 This is mainly on saleh. Blame the assistants? Sure but saleh hired them. The oline jumble is likely caused by Keith carter not understanding the plays that Hackett is trying to implement and then not giving the oline the right blocking formations. I’m not sure how the qb play calling plays into this. I see the QBs always pointing out the Mike lb but I’m not sure if he tells which guy each of them is supposed to block. And then there are the matador blocks by cook who has yet to successfully pick up a free runner. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Truth is with this much change on the OL seemingly every week, and then QB changes from one scrub to another later on, it’s not that surprising. They’re a hard offense to watch, even without the penalties. The crazy # of penalties on top of it all make it more or less a comedy, once you’re past the frustration phase as a fan. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyJohnson Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 35 of those on Becton 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hex Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 I've been a huge critic of the CS, but honestly I can't imagine it's easy to avoid these penalties when there are 4 QBs and 30 OLers going through the offense. I don't know whose fault that is, be it the CS for bad coaching and injury prevention or the front offense for getting injury prone or just bad players. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 A blow to the practice doesn’t matter crowd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomebodytoAnybody47 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Anyone know what they were ranked in 21 and 22? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomebodytoAnybody47 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 8 minutes ago, SomebodytoAnybody47 said: Anyone know what they were ranked in 21 and 22? 2022- 20th in pre snap off penalties. 2021 - 31st in pre snap off penalties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeNamathsFurCoat Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 This is not going to work. All the Rodgers injury did was buy Bobby Slogans a free pass on another losing season. The play was to sign Lamar and force the Ravens' hand. 2 1st round picks is nothing to pay for a 26 y.o. franchise QB in his prime. Even if the Ravens' had decided to match the offer, you adversely impact a dangerous AFC opponent by forcing them to commit and guarantee more $ against the cap than they wanted to. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeNamathsFurCoat Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 As far as Hackett being atrocious and bad at historic NFL levels, Sean Payton was clearly right. He just didn't need to say it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 "Bad team does things badly.... this and more, at 11" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doitny Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 1 hour ago, rangerous said: This is mainly on saleh. Blame the assistants? Sure but saleh hired them. The oline jumble is likely caused by Keith carter not understanding the plays that Hackett is trying to implement and then not giving the oline the right blocking formations. I’m not sure how the qb play calling plays into this. I see the QBs always pointing out the Mike lb but I’m not sure if he tells which guy each of them is supposed to block. And then there are the matador blocks by cook who has yet to successfully pick up a free runner. i know Hackett got here first but he was hired to help bring Rodgers here. Remember Salah did not want to fire MLF, Woody forced him. and say what you want about him but go back and look at the stats, the Offense ran much better when Zach wasnt at QB. interesting stat. in Zachs 11 games we avg 277 total yards and about 16 ppg. and im not even including the Miami game when he got hurt and we scored no points. in Siemans 2 starts we are averaging 370 total yards and 25 ppg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doitny Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 26 minutes ago, Hex said: I've been a huge critic of the CS, but honestly I can't imagine it's easy to avoid these penalties when there are 4 QBs and 30 OLers going through the offense. I don't know whose fault that is, be it the CS for bad coaching and injury prevention or the front offense for getting injury prone or just bad players. this is 100% right. this is only happening on the offense. the defense is ranked 9th in total penalties. this is what makes me laugh about all the undisciplined crap you hear here. Cleveland the best defense has the most defensive penalties, Eagles 3rd worst, Balt 5th worst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extmenace Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 I’d like to know what the break down is on that number. What % is from OL and or QB. We’ve had something like 12 different O line combinations. I know becton is responsible for roughly 10% of the teams entire penalty total… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesr Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Hey, we had ZERO pre-snap penalties with AR8 at QB! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 The lack of discipline is definitely the most clear-cut drawback of Saleh as a coach. It's been pretty clear since day one and while I think other deficiencies are less directly his fault these types of issues always fall directly at the feet of the HC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 1 hour ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said: This is not going to work. All the Rodgers injury did was buy Bobby Slogans a free pass on another losing season. The play was to sign Lamar and force the Ravens' hand. 2 1st round picks is nothing to pay for a 26 y.o. franchise QB in his prime. Even if the Ravens' had decided to match the offer, you adversely impact a dangerous AFC opponent by forcing them to commit and guarantee more $ against the cap than they wanted to. @JustInFudge 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymation Posted January 4 Author Share Posted January 4 1 hour ago, Paradis said: "Bad team does things badly.... this and more, at 11" While true, Aaron Rodgers playing next year isn't going to fix this. This Coaching Staff is going to have to figure it out. Playing on a short week isn't an excuse. Playing with backups isn't one either. Blaming the OL or the QB isn't what a leader of men do. The Buck Stops with Saleh. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomebodytoAnybody47 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 2 minutes ago, Claymation said: While true, Aaron Rodgers playing next year isn't going to fix this. This Coaching Staff is going to have to figure it out. Playing on a short week isn't an excuse. Playing with backups isn't one either. Blaming the OL or the QB isn't what a leader of men do. The Buck Stops with Saleh. They’ll figure it out by trying to stay healthy and not have 100 diff combinations with backups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymation Posted January 4 Author Share Posted January 4 36 minutes ago, SomebodytoAnybody47 said: They’ll figure it out by trying to stay healthy and not have 100 diff combinations with backups. The Browns played 4 QBs and had 13 different OL play this year. The Jets had 4 QBs and 14 different OL play this year. One team has 11 wins and the other 6. As George Washington once quipped, It is better to offer no excuse than a bad one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 2 hours ago, Claymation said: While true, Aaron Rodgers playing next year isn't going to fix this. This Coaching Staff is going to have to figure it out. Playing on a short week isn't an excuse. Playing with backups isn't one either. Blaming the OL or the QB isn't what a leader of men do. The Buck Stops with Saleh. Some of this is psychological/mental. Lose Aaron 4 seconds in the first game, Zach then looks like the next coming of Weekend at Bernie's and you get sloppy/the details. Good coaches can compensate for this -- but by virtue of not having the worst fcking luck and offense in the galaxy next season, you'll see a course correction regardless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZSOJ Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Comeon Gents, your missing it. We are 1st in something....🥵 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Well Cleveland is also pretty high on the penalty list. There are a bunch of different things I think that contribute. They are using a new system. A bunch of QBs and at least 4 centers. When Tippman took over they had a few. Those are the players that call the protections and that contributes for sure. They tried to roll in a bunch of younger WR and those guys have been called for a few incorrect formations. I was saying this was going to happen when people were crying to play more young blood. Play young, inexperienced players in a system they are not familiar and this is what you get. They also suck, which makes them prone to press. Becton has been having a hard time with the speed rush and has been having a ton of penalties, particularly false starts since he is getting beaten so badly off the ball. He had a couple each against Cleveland and Dallas. The papers were complaining in early December when he had 5, but I think he has 8 as of now. That is pretty significant and another reason to potentially move on. That being said, there are no excuses and if there are, I don't want to hear them. It does not surprise me, but it can't continue. I don't know if Saleh made some weird ass comments and I don't care. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Sorry but no excuse for all those penalties-Becton has been terrible this year as the one constant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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