Robert Saleh and Jeff Ulbrich are holding our defense back...

[RedBeardedSavage]

10 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I just watched a Jets like defense in Sf lose to a KC defense that uses its best players to attack.

To get to where we want to be our D has to lead the way and be the best it can be.

The 49ers defense played great, they just got beat by Mahomes.

As did the Ravens defense.

 

[jamesr]

14 hours ago, Green Ghost said:

This^^^^
you guys saying Saleh would’ve stopped Mahomes and SF would’ve won the Super Bowl are living in fantasy land.

You’re as bad as the idiots who claim Zach could become a FQB because of “that game he almost beat KC!l!”

When we played KC, we did a good job of stopping them for a lot of the game, then got beat by Mahomes being Mahomes with the game on the line.

Pretty much how it went for SF in the Superbowl. When it came to crunch time, Mahomes took the game over and his rushing ability killed the defense.

[Dunnie]

16 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I'm lukewarm on Ulbrich.  He's a "meets expectations" DC, imo (which makes him far better than Saleh and Hackett, btw). 

He's not bad but we could absolutely do better.  

He's fire and brimstone simplistic  -  not a whole lot of innovation coming out of Florham Park these days.

[DonCorleone]

15 hours ago, JetsFanatic said:

This defense was garbage prior to Saleh. Saleh is certainly open to criticism as a HC, however to accuse him of holding back the defense is insane. However I’m not surprised it was posted on this board because it’s been nothing but a whine fest, not to be taken too seriously, since this season turned disappointing. 

So Saleh is a good DC but a terrible HC. Did he not marked himself as "The CEO type" of coach. He has absolutely not been that. 

[Mogglez]

19 minutes ago, jamesr said:

When we played KC, we did a good job of stopping them for a lot of the game, then got beat by Mahomes being Mahomes with the game on the line.

Pretty much how it went for SF in the Superbowl. When it came to crunch time, Mahomes took the game over and his rushing ability killed the defense.

If by “…got beat by Mahomes being Mahomes with the game on the line” you mean having a game changing INT called back by a phantom penalty and Jermaine Johnson getting held like he needed a really long hug to cure his depression, allowing Mahomes to run all over the place then yeah, it was pretty much the same.

[Jet Nut]

23 minutes ago, Biggs said:

You can only not bitch about it because the Offensive roster is so bad it's an excuse for the D being gassed and giving up yards and points.  Yet we keep drafting guys on D for rotation to keep them fresh.

But unfortunately the offense is bare at WR with, once again, too many injuries to the OL and inadequate back ups and of course a mess at QB.

None of which is the responsibility of the DC.  Or should lead to blaming all on the defensive system.  

[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

If by “…got beat by Mahomes being Mahomes” you mean having a game changing INT called back by a phantom penalty and Jermaine Johnson getting held like he needed a really long hug to cure his depression, allowing Mahomes to run all over the place then yeah, it was pretty much the same.

Sometimes it’s hard to really see how effective the defense can be with zach wilson playing and all the punts.  I just hope they have a good plan B at qb as well as a plan c.  Maybe this playoffs will remind the owner (who seems to want offense, go figure) and gm that qbs make teams.  Allen, Tua, stroud, mahomes, hurts, dak, love, Goff, baker and Stafford.  Not to mention the bengals should have made it if burrow were healthy.  

[Biggs]

12 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

If by “…got beat by Mahomes being Mahomes with the game on the line” you mean having a game changing INT called back by a phantom penalty and Jermaine Johnson getting held like he needed a really long hug to cure his depression, allowing Mahomes to run all over the place then yeah, it was pretty much the same.

JD stealing Hardman from them almost worked.

[Beerfish]

43 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

The 49ers defense played great, they just got beat by Mahomes.

As did the Ravens defense.

 

KC defense as better than the Niners defense.

When it REALLY counted they brought big heat contained the QB and made it so purdy could not score a td.

KC won this year due o their defense and it was not a saleh/sf style defense.

[RedBeardedSavage]

2 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

KC defense as better than the Niners defense.

When it REALLY counted they brought big heat contained the QB and made it so purdy could not score a td.

KC won this year due o their defense and it was not a saleh/sf style defense.

Disagree.

The KC defense was playing against Purdy and the 49er defense was playing against Mahomes.

Both defenses played well, but only one of them had to be perfect to win (the 49ers).

[Beerfish]

5 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

Disagree.

The KC defense was playing against Purdy and the 49er defense was playing against Mahomes.

Both defenses played well, but only one of them had to be perfect to win (the 49ers).

The KC D was one of the best this whole season and when KC was no longer the kill it with offense team the D carried them.  One of the youngest D teams in the leauge.

Why do you have to be prefect as a D?  Like the Jets it is becasue you chose not to force the issue.

[jamesr]

If by “…got beat by Mahomes being Mahomes with the game on the line” you mean having a game changing INT called back by a phantom penalty and Jermaine Johnson getting held like he needed a really long hug to cure his depression, allowing Mahomes to run all over the place then yeah, it was pretty much the same.

I was mainly thinking that when KC needed to sustain a drive to run out the clock, Mahomes did exactly what he did vs. SF - beat us with his legs.



Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Hex]

12 hours ago, Rhg1084 said:

We had the #1 ranked defense. I think that’s the least of our problems, no? 

Well the issue is the Jets passing defense is much better than their rushing defense. Which is fine when the offense is good, because a lead forces the other team to pass to save time.

But because the Jets were always behind, teams just ran it up the Jets' throat over and over again. In fact, they were the most rushed against team in the league this season (I think). 

In this case, the best defense is a good offense, because it plays to the team's strengths.

As long as the offense is stagnant they will not play to their full potential.

[rangerous]

17 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Wiks system = saleh, no difference at all.

KC won becasue they had a balls out smart D guy in spags who blitzes and moves his best players into spots they can have the best effect on the game.

I agree that Spags launched some pretty timely blitzes but maybe the niners win if the kicker makes that extra point.  I can see where the jets defense can blitz more and move players for better match ups but I think the thing that helps the defense more is to have an offense that plays from ahead and can hold the lead.

[OtherwiseHappyinLife]

18 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Oh here we go another inane Beerfish post about the Jets defense.  Time to give him a thumbs down or sympathy emoji!

Bring it my pretties!

The NY Jets have a good defense, probably very good but for sure not 'elite' and yet we have some 'elite' players.

When system, whether offense or defense trumps player talent there is an issue.  

We do not make the best use of our talent on defense imo.

We play a simple basic defense, rush 4, hardly ever blitz (2nd lowest in the league) defense.

We do not move players around to take advantage of their strengths.

As a defense why are you hesitant to blitz?   Well you do not want to expose your secondary, especially your CBs.

But the Jets have very very good CBs .

We do not move our all pro CB around to take away the other teams best player.  Now DJ Reed is pretty good and Carter is a good slot CB but they are not Sauce.

We stick Quinnen Williams in the middle and let him essentially be Snacks Harrison or Mike Devito, eat up double teams and make some plays.

Quinnen is fully capable of having a Chris Jones impact but whereas KC is creative and moves him around and makes him a focus the Jets just stick Quinnen in one spot and hope he beats the double team.  Quinnen should be moved all over the Dline, yes even to end and let him seek out the other teams weak spots and make it much tougher to double him.

The Jets are obsessed with 4 man rush and rotation but guys like Huff play like 30% of snaps.   Oh but Huff is not great vs the run!  Well the jets essentially play with two base LBs and then either nickel or dime and a tiny lb.   We don't seem to care about run defense in other areas.  This is no longer the old NFL teams pass on 1st down ALOT.

The lack of blitzing makes a team predicable, the other team doesn't have to worry about the blitz, their backs and TEs don't have worry about picking up blitzes.

TL;DR

The Jets have a good defense because they have good players but could be far better and are built to play a riskier game which could vault them to that 'elite' status.

All gas and no brakes?  The Jets defense system has the drive in low gear and riding the brake all game long.

Release the Krakens you cowards!

 

 

Agreed.  
 

They are a chef with 5 star ingredients who make a 4 star meal.  Still a very good meal but could be so much better with innovation, surprise weekend specials and some more consistency.  

[Matt39]

The blueprint is out there on what the Jets do. Dallas and Miami toyed with the Jets defense by putting their best player in the slot and picking it apart. I think ultimately they’ll need a better mind coaching that side of the field if they ever want to be serious contenders. They’re playing a basic defense/the old Tampa two, which needs everything to break right.  Ulbrich was not impressive at all on HK either.

[#27TheDominator]

Jetnation:  The rules favor the offense to a crazy extent.  It is impossible to have a great D now!

Also, Jetnation:  The Jets D needs better coaching because while they are top 10 or 5 they are not historically great.  

5 start ingredients and 4 star meal?  They have 3 high level players on D.  One of them a holdover that people want to cut.  They have made an UDFA that is not capable of playing every down someone that people on this board think is worth the franchise tag.  Still more think is worth a 2nd round pick on the franchise tag.

 

[Matt39]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Jetnation:  The rules favor the offense to a crazy extent.  It is impossible to have a great D now!

Also, Jetnation:  The Jets D needs better coaching because while they are top 10 or 5 they are not historically great.  

5 start ingredients and 4 star meal?  They have 3 high level players on D.  One of them a holdover that people want to cut.  They have made an UDFA that is not capable of playing every down someone that people on this board think is worth the franchise tag.  Still more think is worth a 2nd round pick on the franchise tag.

 

There should be a level of concern about Tua having his way with this defense. And Allen at home against the Jets defense has gone to Allen, easily. They’re going to have to figure that out.

[RedBeardedSavage]

2 hours ago, Beerfish said:

The KC D was one of the best this whole season and when KC was no longer the kill it with offense team the D carried them.  One of the youngest D teams in the leauge.

Why do you have to be prefect as a D?  Like the Jets it is becasue you chose not to force the issue.

I just don't see it as a problem with scheme/coaching on the 49er side. It was a tight game where both defenses played well and the best quarterback in the league showed why he's earned that title @ the end of the game. 

I don't think it's more complicated than that. And to bring it back to the Jets - our D is good, if not great, but our offense last year was mythically bad.

It's like being fat but thinking your problem is that you haven't found the right suit to wear.

[Larz]

21 hours ago, bitonti said:

Bosa said after the game they weren't ready for 4th down 

Wilks is not the same  as saleh, in fact Wilks is probably going to get fired 

imagine that a franchise demanding accountability from their coaches 

Nostra-freaking-damus

wilks out as DC

[Mogglez]

6 hours ago, jamesr said:

I was mainly thinking that when KC needed to sustain a drive to run out the clock, Mahomes did exactly what he did vs. SF - beat us with his legs.



Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

Right, and I am simply pointing out that this wasn’t hard for Mahomes to do against us since the Chiefs tackles were wrapping their arms around Jermaine Johnson like he needed to be put in 4 point restraints for cannibalizing a small village of orphans who were afflicted by dwarfism.

Oh, and the small fact that the NFL referees decided to overturn a game-changing interception 2-3 actual seconds after it occurred, a lifetime in the NFL, on that same drive because of a penalty that, supposedly, occurred at the very beginning of the play, despite the fact that no flag was thrown at that point.

So yeah; other than that, it was exactly the same I guess.

[Beerfish]

Steve Wilks aka Robert Saleh just got fired.

[Beerfish]

7 hours ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

The 49ers defense played great, they just got beat by Mahomes.

As did the Ravens defense.

 

Hero Wilks just got sh*t canned

[Beerfish]

Oh and Spags just got extended.

[faba]

Meanwhile we reward incompetent coaches

[RedBeardedSavage]

2 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Hero Wilks just got sh*t canned

If they change their system, then I will come back and say "Beerfish, I apologize for using a Hunt for Red October meme to sh*t on your argument about the reason the 49ers lost the Super Bowl."

[JetsRay]

On 2/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Beerfish said:

Oh here we go another inane Beerfish post about the Jets defense.  Time to give him a thumbs down or sympathy emoji!

Bring it my pretties!

The NY Jets have a good defense, probably very good but for sure not 'elite' and yet we have some 'elite' players.

When system, whether offense or defense trumps player talent there is an issue.  

We do not make the best use of our talent on defense imo.

We play a simple basic defense, rush 4, hardly ever blitz (2nd lowest in the league) defense.

We do not move players around to take advantage of their strengths.

As a defense why are you hesitant to blitz?   Well you do not want to expose your secondary, especially your CBs.

But the Jets have very very good CBs .

We do not move our all pro CB around to take away the other teams best player.  Now DJ Reed is pretty good and Carter is a good slot CB but they are not Sauce.

We stick Quinnen Williams in the middle and let him essentially be Snacks Harrison or Mike Devito, eat up double teams and make some plays.

Quinnen is fully capable of having a Chris Jones impact but whereas KC is creative and moves him around and makes him a focus the Jets just stick Quinnen in one spot and hope he beats the double team.  Quinnen should be moved all over the Dline, yes even to end and let him seek out the other teams weak spots and make it much tougher to double him.

The Jets are obsessed with 4 man rush and rotation but guys like Huff play like 30% of snaps.   Oh but Huff is not great vs the run!  Well the jets essentially play with two base LBs and then either nickel or dime and a tiny lb.   We don't seem to care about run defense in other areas.  This is no longer the old NFL teams pass on 1st down ALOT.

The lack of blitzing makes a team predicable, the other team doesn't have to worry about the blitz, their backs and TEs don't have worry about picking up blitzes.

TL;DR

The Jets have a good defense because they have good players but could be far better and are built to play a riskier game which could vault them to that 'elite' status.

All gas and no brakes?  The Jets defense system has the drive in low gear and riding the brake all game long.

Release the Krakens you cowards!

 

 

[TBJ]

Shanahan says hiring another energetic D Coordinator isn't something he necessarily wants. Nor was it a reason Wilks was fired. 

"Watch Saleh now, he's not that energetic."