Ryan Fitzpatrick clear he wants to play for the Jets

[Warfish]

3 minutes ago, JiF said:

We dont know what we have in Geno Smith on this team, with these coaches and these weapons.

But out coaches do, and their actions to-date, the ongoing chase for Fitz, tells the tale frankly.  

Any faith in Geno as a #1 who could compete, and Fitz is cast aside and any effort to resign rescinded.

3 minutes ago, JiF said:

 You know what Geno was playing on the worst offensive teams in the league and terrible coaching.  HUGE difference.  See: Ryan Fitzpatrick

This "arent ready" talk I dont buy into.  You either are or you arent.  So lets see what we got and go.  Experience cant be substituted.  Not only on the field but in practice too.  Fitz takes snaps away from them all which holds back development. 

I hope our Coaches stay as far as humanly possible from this wasteful and proven ineffective belief.  I reject wholesale this foolish Cleveland-style burn-all-the-QB's idea.

Sit, learn, develop.  Both Petty and Hack came into this league miles away from being Pro-ready.  They require the time, the practice reps, the transition-period and time to learn under a pro coach and behind a legitimate pro QB.

Starting Hack in 2015, lol.  You reall ymust hate Hack to want that, it's the best way possible to end his career before it ever starts.

3 minutes ago, JiF said:

Manziel, Weeden, Quin and Couch - were all 1st round picks, who all started out of necessity or because of injury, except Couch who was the 1st overall pick.   Those are not similar examples, at all.  

Right, our draft pick QB's are nothing like their draft pick QB's.

You're missing the point.  Churning through QB's to 'see what we have" is a Cleveland style system of failure.  Consistency, competitiveness and developing young QB's on the bench a few years is the way to build a consistently competitive Franchise. 

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

Simple logic from a pure football standpoint.  Yet from the entertainment perspective that almost guarantees an unwatchable season.  I agree with you and 100% convinced Fitz will be back strictly to appease the masses.  Chance are Fitz returns from never ever again land and we see our young QBs get game action after we are mathematically eliminated.  Most likely close to the first week it's possible to be out.  This way we have plenty of time to talk about the QB we are taking next year.

Meh, you dont make Football decisions to please fans. 

1 hour ago, BowlesMovement said:

Its easy for fans to think like this, and I don't disagree one bit with your logic. But GM's, HC's and FO's do not and cannot think like this, especially in NY, or they get to drive by huge signs daily calling for their firing. If they think Fitzpatrick is worth 2-3 more wins this year than Geno, there is a price they will put on that. 

Well, I think them playing hardball with Fitz means they kind of are thinking like this...

[PatsFanTX]

And Fitz proved a year ago that he's the guy to get us to the playoffs

What did he prove last year?

It was his 11th straight year without a playoff game.

[Warfish]

Just now, PatsFanTX said:

What did he prove last year?

It was his 11th straight year without a playoff game.

I'm sorry, but I can't hear you with all those rings and trophies in your anus.

Can you speak up, please?

[BowlesMovement]

25 minutes ago, JiF said:

Well, I think them playing hardball with Fitz means they kind of are thinking like this...

Not sure I agree. If they were thinking like that, I would think the offer would be something like 3-4 mil for one year, knowing he won't take it. If they offer him 7 mil, they want him to be a bridge starting QB to give them as much of a chance as possible to have as good of a season as possible.

[cant wait]

30 minutes ago, JiF said:

Meh, you dont make Football decisions to please fans.

I agree, but this is NY and Mac hasn't built up a lot of clout here yet. If fitz doesn't come back, the rats like cimini and Myers will be calling for his job. At least this is what fitz is banking on

[Mike135]

20 minutes ago, cant wait said:

I agree, but this is NY and Mac hasn't built up a lot of clout here yet. If fitz doesn't come back, the rats like cimini and Myers will be calling for his job. At least this is what fitz is banking on

Same for Bowles keeping Fitz as the starter last season instead of going back to Geno once he was ready.

Macc n Bowles are trying to be way too "safe".  If they bring back Fitz for 7mil+ and Hack or Petty don't hit big time soon, we'll have a new GM and/or coach in 2018.

[Saul Goodman]

Geno Smith is not an option. The problem with him is that he gets you 3-6 wins, probable mutiny in the lockerroom, and that gets your HC and GM fired, or on the very hot seat.

We need to create a winning culture and give the current regime time to develop the young players, including Petty and Hackenberg. Start Fitz, hope for 8-11 wins, then start one of the young QB's in 2017.

That is the front office's plan, and it is the correct one. 

[ylekram]

2 minutes ago, Saul Goodman said:

Geno Smith is not an option. The problem with him is that he gets you 3-6 wins, probable mutiny in the lockerroom, and that gets your HC and GM fired, or on the very hot seat.

We need to create a winning culture and give the current regime time to develop the young players, including Petty and Hackenberg. Start Fitz, hope for 8-11 wins, then start one of the young QB's in 2017.

That is the front office's plan, and it is the correct one. 

how is that the correct plan? we don't know what we have in geno. he wasn't given a fair chance. a young qb must be gifted 4 starting gigs before you can determine his worth. not 3 but 4. just remember, peyton manning didn't play great his 1st 2 seasons,either. you would have to blind not to see the similarities between geno and peyton

[isired]

If we don't sign Fitz, we have the worst depth chart in the NFL at the leagues most important position. Including Cleveland and SF. No way Macc leaves us in that position. I've always thought Fitz will be back, maybe sometimes more sure than others, but I feel 99% sure he's coming back.

I think they do a 3 year deal to spread the cap hit, they'll want him year 2 even if he's the backup, year 3 meaningless.

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, BowlesMovement said:

Its easy for fans to think like this, and I don't disagree one bit with your logic. But GM's, HC's and FO's do not and cannot think like this, especially in NY, or they get to drive by huge signs daily calling for their firing. If they think Fitzpatrick is worth 2-3 more wins this year than Geno, there is a price they will put on that. 

Totally agree they don't have our luxury, but if there was even a belief in a 2-3 win discrepancy, if it's a difference between (as some think) 3-4 wins and 6 wins I don't think either helps their job security. Even less so if they fork over $11M and still only go 6-10 or 7-9. If they finish 6-10 to 8-8 with a combination of Geno/Petty or Geno/Hackenberg, and one of them finishes strong enough to give confidence in the following season, then I think that's preferable to an 8-8 (give or take) season with Fitz, where no young QB gets any snaps because our GM/HC are in full job preservation mode, and won't take a chance on anyone (lest they get second-guessed).

But again, yeah, it's totally easy/convenient for us to say who cares if we're 8-8 or 5-11; frankly the latter is preferable long-term on multiple levels (saves lots of cap room, we get much higher draft picks, and we get a live look at one of our recent draftees). Re-signing Fitz is only a good idea if we are true SB contenders IMO, since there is no way he's getting benched at $11M or more, even if someone else looks better this summer (just like Cro last summer, but double that as a popular, incumbent QB). That said, if he can be signed for millions less, I'm also ok with him as our bridge QB, so long as he could realistically lose his job if outplayed.

Basically I'm ok with the team chewing up and spitting out either him or Geno through/after the first 6 weeks, and to me using up $11M+ of next year's cap space is an absurd cost for such a task.

[jack48]

3 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Totally agree they don't have our luxury, but if there was even a belief in a 2-3 win discrepancy, if it's a difference between (as some think) 3-4 wins and 6 wins I don't think either helps their job security. Even less so if they fork over $11M and still only go 6-10 or 7-9. If they finish 6-10 to 8-8 with a combination of Geno/Petty or Geno/Hackenberg, and one of them finishes strong enough to give confidence in the following season, then I think that's preferable to an 8-8 (give or take) season with Fitz, where no young QB gets any snaps because our GM/HC are in full job preservation mode, and won't take a chance on anyone (lest they get second-guessed).

But again, yeah, it's totally easy/convenient for us to say who cares if we're 8-8 or 5-11; frankly the latter is preferable long-term on multiple levels (saves lots of cap room, we get much higher draft picks, and we get a live look at one of our recent draftees). Re-signing Fitz is only a good idea if we are true SB contenders IMO, since there is no way he's getting benched at $11M or more, even if someone else looks better this summer (just like Cro last summer, but double that as a popular, incumbent QB). That said, if he can be signed for millions less, I'm also ok with him as our bridge QB, so long as he could realistically lose his job if outplayed.

Basically I'm ok with the team chewing up and spitting out either him or Geno through/after the first 6 weeks, and to me using up $11M+ of next year's cap space is an absurd cost for such a task.

I do think that a healthy Fitz is an 8-8 guy with this schedule.  More fun to watch than 5-11, but not worth the cash.

[Colgateman]

27 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Same for Bowles keeping Fitz as the starter last season instead of going back to Geno once he was ready.

Macc n Bowles are trying to be way too "safe".  If they bring back Fitz for 7mil+ and Hack or Petty don't hit big time soon, we'll have a new GM and/or coach in 2018.

It's time to start studying deshaun closely.

Mac and Bowles should be gone by 2018, the fact that they caved and are offering Fitzpatrick 10 million plus says it all now. Time for them to o.

[Colgateman]

I'd rather go 2-14 with Geno or one of the other garbage bins, so we could take Watson next year, than restructure contracts and go 8-8 with Fitz.

[Jetfan13]

4 minutes ago, Colgateman said:

I'd rather go 2-14 with Geno or one of the other garbage bins, so we could take Watson next year, than restructure contracts and go 8-8 with Fitz.

Watson?  NFW

 

[56mehl56]

27 minutes ago, ylekram said:

how is that the correct plan? we don't know what we have in geno. he wasn't given a fair chance. a young qb must be gifted 4 starting gigs before you can determine his worth. not 3 but 4. just remember, peyton manning didn't play great his 1st 2 seasons,either. you would have to blind not to see the similarities between geno and peyton

But the argument for Fitz not making the playoffs in 11 years is that he played for bad teams - why is Geno not afforded the same excuse.

[JohnnyLV]

18 hours ago, Warfish said:

Low Contract (7 or so) with Incentives on top of incentives.  2 years.

Gives us a moderately competitive placeholder now, is cheap if he doesn't perform, and gives us a mentor for our two kid QB's.

If I was a betting man, thats what I'd bet the final outcome will be.....presuming Macc and Bowles don't actually love Geno.

And if they love Geno, why wouldn't the persuit of Fitz be done by now and Geno named starter?

It's the fact that that has not happened, more than anything, that tells me the Organization has no faith at all in Geno Smith as a #1 Qb.

I actually do not believe that at all. I think the Fitz thing is all Bowles. I am pretty positive Gailey prefers Geno. With our schedule Fitz the JAGOFF will crash and burn spectacularly thus seaon and Geno or Hack will be starting by midseaon, and the Jets will have done this by mortgaging the future and losing depth. It is clear he will be signed though from all the smoke lately.

[Colgateman]

4 minutes ago, Jetfan13 said:

Watson?  NFW

 

Deshaun Watson is his name. Did ou see the title game and the throws he was making? 

[Jetfan13]

2 minutes ago, Colgateman said:

Deshaun Watson is his name. Did ou see the title game and the throws he was making? 

As a Hurricane season ticket holder I have seen him in person more then once. NFW, his game will not transfer to the NFL. Pocket QB's win championships.

 

[Mike135]

23 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

But the argument for Fitz not making the playoffs in 11 years is that he played for bad teams - why is Geno not afforded the same excuse.

Exactly.

1. Fitz wants way more money.
2. Fitz hadn't won over 6 games until last year with better teams than Geno had.
3. Geno is younger.
4. And most importantly:  http://www.vice.com/read/beards-are-now-uncool

[Sperm Edwards]

7 minutes ago, jack48 said:

I do think that a healthy Fitz is an 8-8 guy with this schedule.  More fun to watch than 5-11, but not worth the cash.

If we would even be as low as 5-11, I agree. See, with this schedule there are enough favorable matchups to have a floor of 5 games. Just because there are enough killer matchups that I think 10 wins is unlikely and the chance at 11+ wins almost negligible, doesn't therefore mean there are 12-13 killer matchups that will land us a 3-4 win season either. This defense alone could carry 4-5 wins if we put an unready Bryce Petty out there (long-term wisdom of doing so aside).

Basically I think we're stuck in a 6-9 win area no matter who we trot out there. Our good D and schedule are enough to get us to that floor, but Fitz and the schedule aren't enough to raise it more than that. There are just too many good teams and he's too lousy against such opponents.

If the schedule was filled with 14 should-be wins again, then sure, go for it if the FO thinks he gets us over that hump. Of course that was the situation a year ago and it didn't happen then, so... 

The reason a Fitzpatrick-less season would be so intolerable isn't the final record; it'll be the Fitz-religious converts told-you-so'ing every turnover and every loss and, with neither proof nor merit, assigning each as a woulda-been TD or win if only we'd had the wisdom to re-sign Ryan Fitzpatrick. It's half the reason I want him back at $7M (preferably less). I can't listen to that all season long, as well as for the next upcoming years, which is surely what would happen. 

[faba]

yes lets tank the season and draft another project qb

[PatsFanTX]

Watson?  NFW

 

assmop says he is real good.

[Mike135]

14 minutes ago, Colgateman said:

I'd rather go 2-14 with Geno or one of the other garbage bins, so we could take Watson next year, than restructure contracts and go 8-8 with Fitz.

Yup, I'd prefer every possible Geno outcome (do horrible, OK, or great) over paying Fitz big for 8-8.  Granted going 2-14 isn't preferred, but still better than mortgaging the future for known mediocrity at best.

[Mike135]

7 minutes ago, faba said:

yes lets tank the season and draft another project qb

Project w/potential > known mediocrity w/o potential 

Edit: even if money wasn't a factor.

[Jetfan13]

7 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

assmop says he is real good.

I rest my case

[cant wait]

5 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

The reason a Fitzpatrick-less season would be so intolerable isn't the final record; it'll be the Fitz-religious converts told-you-so'ing every turnover and every loss and, with neither proof nor merit, assigning each as a woulda-been TD or win if only we'd had the wisdom to re-sign Ryan Fitzpatrick. It's half the reason I want him back at $7M (preferably less). I can't listen to that all season long, as well as for the next upcoming years, which is surely what would happen. 

Agreed, I'd rather lose with fitz for one season than hear about "the legend of ryan fitzpatrick" ad nauseum for the next few years from the fans and the media trolls alike. Just as long as we're not stuck with fitz for more than one season

[shuler82]

Imagine a bizarro world where Fitz and Geno switched personalities, but their on the field performances remained the same. What would we spend the offseason talking about? 

[ylekram]

28 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

But the argument for Fitz not making the playoffs in 11 years is that he played for bad teams - why is Geno not afforded the same excuse.

I don't know. ask the guy who made that statement

[Colgateman]

21 minutes ago, Jetfan13 said:

As a Hurricane season ticket holder I have seen him in person more then once. NFW, his game will not transfer to the NFL. Pocket QB's win championships.

 

Watson is a very good pocket passer. He just happens to run a lot too. 

[Warfish]

32 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I actually do not believe that at all. I think the Fitz thing is all Bowles. I am pretty positive Gailey prefers Geno.

I'm also pretty sure that hot gal from the cellphone commercials would totally date me.

32 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

With our schedule Fitz the JAGOFF will crash and burn spectacularly thus seaon and Geno or Hack will be starting by midseaon,

That is certainly a possibility.  

32 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

...and the Jets will have done this by mortgaging the future and losing depth. It is clear he will be signed though from all the smoke lately.

How do you define "mortgaging the future" exactly?  How many great long-term-future players will we be cutting to sign Fitz, would you say?  

[Mike135]

4 minutes ago, Warfish said:

How do you define "mortgaging the future" exactly?  How many great long-term-future players will we be cutting to sign Fitz, would you say?  

The money could be used on Wilk or Sheldon.  Hell, it doesn't even have to be used.  There's nothing wrong with banking the cap space for a year or two down the road when we're trying to sign a homegrown talent or FA.

Instead we want to not only max out 2016, but borrow from future seasons for Ryan Fitzpatrick?  Nuts.

[CrazyCarl40]

4 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

The money could be used on Wilk or Sheldon.  Hell, it doesn't even have to be used.  There's nothing wrong with banking the cap space for a year or two down the road when we're trying to sign a homegrown talent or FA.

Instead we want to not only max out 2016, but borrow from future seasons for Ryan Fitzpatrick?  Nuts.

Both are under contract this year and Sheldon is under contract next year. If they wanted to re-sign Wilk, they would have by now. He's gone next year and his 16 million dollar price tag will be off the cap. And, again, the Jets have 0 unrestricted Free agents in 2017 that they couldn't live without. 2018 might be a different story, but still not that many homegrown players they MUST bring back in 2018 either.

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

But out coaches do, and their actions to-date, the ongoing chase for Fitz, tells the tale frankly.  

Any faith in Geno as a #1 who could compete, and Fitz is cast aside and any effort to resign rescinded.

I hope our Coaches stay as far as humanly possible from this wasteful and proven ineffective belief.  I reject wholesale this foolish Cleveland-style burn-all-the-QB's idea.

Sit, learn, develop.  Both Petty and Hack came into this league miles away from being Pro-ready.  They require the time, the practice reps, the transition-period and time to learn under a pro coach and behind a legitimate pro QB.

Starting Hack in 2015, lol.  You reall ymust hate Hack to want that, it's the best way possible to end his career before it ever starts.

Right, our draft pick QB's are nothing like their draft pick QB's.

You're missing the point.  Churning through QB's to 'see what we have" is a Cleveland style system of failure.  Consistency, competitiveness and developing young QB's on the bench a few years is the way to build a consistently competitive Franchise. 

These are the same coaches that had him as their starter before he went and got his jaw broken.  This is the same GM playing hardball with Fitz who have drafted QB's in 2 consecutive years.  And this isnt about Geno, it's about moving on from someone that does nothing for the future of the team.  Signing a guy to maybe go 8-8 is pointless Jets stupidity, so I'm sure we'll do it. 

You're adhere to pampers and hand holding.  I dont.  Hack at one point with the #1 QB prospect in the land.  He was the household name before the pre-draft hype built up guys you've never heard of before.  Petty had a year.  How long does it take?  History has shown, the guys who start D1 are the ones who develop.  Rodgers and the Brady's of the world are anomalies these days. Nothing replaces lives bullets.  Nothing. 

You're missing the point.  We're not seeing what we have by starting Fitz.  Bottom line. 

1 hour ago, BowlesMovement said:

Not sure I agree. If they were thinking like that, I would think the offer would be something like 3-4 mil for one year, knowing he won't take it. If they offer him 7 mil, they want him to be a bridge starting QB to give them as much of a chance as possible to have as good of a season as possible.

I think some of the offer speculation is dictated by available funds.  But I see your point.  I think they know they have an aging offense and think Fitz is the best option.  And that's fine, if you're looking at a season by season.  

My problem with that is, what good does that do?  What do you have to show for last year?  You really think something is going to change?  Do you think Fitz gets the Jets to the playoffs?   I sure as hell dont.  So what's the point?   

 

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, cant wait said:

I agree, but this is NY and Mac hasn't built up a lot of clout here yet. If fitz doesn't come back, the rats like cimini and Myers will be calling for his job. At least this is what fitz is banking on

So what happens if they resign Fitz and miss the playoffs again?  Isnt that more of an indictment on Bowles?  He's had the best QB production in the history of the Jets franchise but cant make the playoffs?  Doesnt that get him to the chopping block sooner rather than buying a little time developing a QB?