Matt39 Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 Are you sure you know what literally means? Worst starting running back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 Worst starting running back. So you think Greene is the worst starting running back the worst starting running back in the league? Hmmm....seems off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 Worst starting running back. Dude, I'm not a huge Greene fan, but I don't think the dude forgot how to run the ball and I don't think the OL forgot how to block. The book is out on Sanchez, which makes life harder on everybody. Why would you even consider playing a safety 15 yards off the ball against this passing game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Dude, I'm not a huge Greene fan, but I don't think the dude forgot how to run the ball and I don't think the OL forgot how to block. The book is out on Sanchez, which makes life harder on everybody. Why would you even consider playing a safety 15 yards off the ball against this passing game? Could Greene ever really run though? Hell even when Chad was here, folks still hated Martin....Greene doesn't catch any heat for being terrible. He has no vision, zero burst, average power and can't catch the football at all. It's just crazy to me that every single problem with the Jets is Mark Sanchez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Shonn Greene not being a steady RB IS annoying. The offense was much less aggressive with both he and Tomlinson out, and that's saying something. The guy is a nagging injury machine.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Shonn Greene not being a steady RB IS annoying. The offense was much less aggressive with both he and Tomlinson out, and that's saying something. The guy is a nagging injury machine.... Our drafts have been bad. We get a dud in Greene in the 3rd round while Dallas gets a star in Murray. The Jets entire offense is a mess other than Mangold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Our drafts have been bad. We get a dud in Greene in the 3rd round while Dallas gets a star in Murray. The Jets entire offense is a mess other than Mangold. It's not that serious. A new right side of the OL, a younger version of Plaxico, a blocking TE who can catch a pass once in a while, and maybe a RB. Most of that could be covered by the QB stepping it up a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 actually think sanchez could be the guy with an OC who knew what he was doing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Could Greene ever really run though? Hell even when Chad was here, folks still hated Martin....Greene doesn't catch any heat for being terrible. He has no vision, zero burst, average power and can't catch the football at all. It's just crazy to me that every single problem with the Jets is Mark Sanchez. I was flamed for saying he sucked before the season, I hate him... His legend was born when he came in with fresh legs at the end of the season w/one of the top Olines... It was phoney from the get go.. THink Murray may be the same, in Dallas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsjetsjetss Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 OC needs to go but it does not fix sanchez having horrible vision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I was flamed for saying he sucked before the season, I hate him... His legend was born when he came in with fresh legs at the end of the season w/one of the top Olines... It was phoney from the get go.. THink Murray may be the same, in Dallas Without the Eric Weddle run, Greene is Cedric Houston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet27 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 News flash: Sanchez is not smart. 4TD passes, he sure looked smart yesterday, and the OL played well. Can't say that for the defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 He's playing better than he did last year and the year before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMaynard Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I believe in dude. Schotty is so bad that I feel that in order for me to really request a new QB I need to see sanchez fail with a competent O.C. Period. I dont expect ANYONE to thrive under Schotty, and his track record seems to agree with me. I completely agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMaynard Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I believe in dude. Schotty is so bad that I feel that in order for me to really request a new QB I need to see sanchez fail with a competent O.C. Period. I dont expect ANYONE to thrive under Schotty, and his track record seems to agree with me. I completely agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I think that we as fans are setting the bar a little high right now. He has improved since last season. He's improved pretty much on a consistent overall basis over his career. He's not up to his potential yet, and he has a long way to go, but so long as he keeps showing signs of improving you have to stick with him. He's extremely young still. Also, while he obviously has made some boneheaded throws, his OC calls a horrible game and the whole offensive concept is disjointed at best. If you ask me, I think Mark is at the point where he mentally understands what is going on before and during the play. He is reading he D, but it's still going too fast for him at times and he hesitates to pull the trigger and gets tentative. I think that's why alot of his passes are behind the receiver. You can also see in his demeanor that he's frustrated. He was always excitable on the field until this season. I think it was mostly "ignorant bliss", where he didn't really know what he was missing and was just having a blast. Now I think he knows the plays he is missing, and he's frustrated that he's not seeing it in time. The game still needs to slow down for him a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I think Mark is at the point where he mentally understands what is going on before and during the play. He is reading he D I think if anything, he's demonstrated that this is absolutely not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I think if anything, he's demonstrated that this is absolutely not the case. Read my whole post. I'm saying he knows what plays he's missing, but he's not pulling the trigger in time because the game is still moving too fast for him. I think if you asked him immediately after each play he'll have told you exactly what the D was doing and what he should have done. The problem is he's not seeing it in real time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Read my whole post. I'm saying he knows what plays he's missing, but he's not pulling the trigger in time because the game is still moving too fast for him. I think if you asked him immediately after each play he'll have told you exactly what the D was doing and what he should have done. The problem is he's not seeing it in real time. And I'm sure he could've had a 4.0 GPA at USC if you let him take tests after the answer key was distributed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jets Voice of Reason Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Read my whole post. I'm saying he knows what plays he's missing, but he's not pulling the trigger in time because the game is still moving too fast for him. I think if you asked him immediately after each play he'll have told you exactly what the D was doing and what he should have done. The problem is he's not seeing it in real time. That'd be true if he's making the right decisions, but is just missing receivers (which happens pretty frequently with him). But he's just flat out making stupid decisions with the ball too. Throwing into double and triple coverage. Making risky throws in the red zone or in their own end zone. Turning the ball over at a high rate with fumbles and picks. It also just seems like he's not going through his progressions very well, but obviously i'm not in his head to make that determination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 so....I have been the voice of support for teh sanchize with my couple of Jets fan friends here in Florida for the past season +. they have hated on him and I have said that 1. he is young 2. he is playing within the system. 3. he wins. these last few weeks I have been less and less optimistic of his ability to lead our offense. When we went down by 2 TDs against the Pasts, the announcer said "It is now up to Sanchez to lead this team back". That was my "ahha" moment....I couldnt see it and sure enough, it didnt happen. This is against the fawkin pasts attrocious defense....Against a team that we needed to beat to take a pole position in the AFC BEAST!!!! I dont see what a few of the sanchize's supporters say that he has improved over last year. You may have a couple of stats that say he is marginally better but he seems to play scared now. I thought he could be more consistent than last year and instead he has gotten worse.... Anyway, I am hoping that it is only a slump and that he will hit on all cylinders come time for the playoffs and we can chalk this abysmal stretch to OTJ learning. **I was about to post a picture of what "pole position in the AFC BEAST" looked like but I couldnt do that to the nice people of JN*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 And I'm sure he could've had a 4.0 GPA at USC if you let him take tests after the answer key was distributed... Apparently what I'm saying is going right over your heads. Before the play I think he can see the D, understands what he sees, and knows what the offensive play is designed to do to get a receiver open (ie clear out a safety with an underneath receiver, etc...). I think that once the ball is snapped he is hesitating because he doesn't trust that the play is actually going to work out the way it should and I think he's waiting too long to get rid of the ball. The kid is smart and he is obviously studious of his responsibilities as he demonstrated throughout the offseason, I just think the game is still moving too fast for him and I think he's getting frustrated with himself because he knows what he should do but is still not reacting to it in real time. I will say I miss the days here when it was cooler to actually have sensible discussion instead of who can come up with a more witty one-line response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Read my whole post. I'm saying he knows what plays he's missing, but he's not pulling the trigger in time because the game is still moving too fast for him. I think if you asked him immediately after each play he'll have told you exactly what the D was doing and what he should have done. The problem is he's not seeing it in real time. Ummm... Isn't that what makes some guys players and others not? There's a lot of things a lot of people could do with hindsight. Even if we were to accept your premise, that doesn't account for the stupid mistakes he makes. Simply not seeing defenders and throwing the ball right to them is not just about knowing the defense, it's about not having any vision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Apparently what I'm saying is going right over your heads. Yes, either what you're saying is going over the heads of some of the most intelligent people on this board, or, it doesn't make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Apparently what I'm saying is going right over your heads. Before the play I think he can see the D, understands what he sees, and knows what the offensive play is designed to do to get a receiver open (ie clear out a safety with an underneath receiver, etc...). I think that once the ball is snapped he is hesitating because he doesn't trust that the play is actually going to work out the way it should and I think he's waiting too long to get rid of the ball. The kid is smart and he is obviously studious of his responsibilities as he demonstrated throughout the offseason, I just think the game is still moving too fast for him and I think he's getting frustrated with himself because he knows what he should do but is still not reacting to it in real time. I will say I miss the days here when it was cooler to actually have sensible discussion instead of who can come up with a more witty one-line response. Further, what you think might be happening in Sanchez's mind, apparently has no bearing on what's happening on the field, so, it's based solely on your own projections, considering all we have as usable data is what we see on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Further, what you think might be happening in Sanchez's mind, apparently has no bearing on what's happening on the field, so, it's based solely on your own projections, considering all we have as usable data is what we see on the field. You're right. Teh Sanchez just sucks cock'n'ballz. He's friggin awful for following up 2 AFC championship seasons by keeping us in the playoff hunt. I say we just cut his sh*tty a$$ right now along with half the team and start all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Yes, either what you're saying is going over the heads of some of the most intelligent people on this board, or, it doesn't make sense. My apologies, I didn't realize I was trying to have a football discussion with the geniuses of football here who obviously know everything. I look forward to your long illustrious years of coaching in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 4TD passes, he sure looked smart yesterday, and the OL played well. Can't say that for the defense He looked stupid yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Before the play I think he can see the D, understands what he sees, and knows what the offensive play is designed to do to get a receiver open (ie clear out a safety with an underneath receiver, etc...). I think that once the ball is snapped he is hesitating because he doesn't trust that the play is actually going to work out the way it should and I think he's waiting too long to get rid of the ball. The kid is smart and he is obviously studious of his responsibilities as he demonstrated throughout the offseason, I just think the game is still moving too fast for him and I think he's getting frustrated with himself because he knows what he should do but is still not reacting to it in real time. Is there any evidence of this, or is this all just baseless speculation on your part? The bolded is the only thing I will agree with, as everything else you stated could be countered by claiming that his mistakes, after 40+ career starts, are the result of a lack of both the physical skills and mental acumen required to be a successful NFL QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 You're right. Teh Sanchez just sucks cock'n'ballz. He's friggin awful for following up 2 AFC championship seasons by keeping us in the playoff hunt. I say we just cut his sh*tty a$$ right now along with half the team and start all over again. I thought you liked intelligent football discussions. It seems, rather, you like to propose your ideas unchallenged, and then if someone dares challenge them, you jump to "Teh Sanchez just sucks cock'n'ballz." Impressive work there. Also, Schotty took us to 2 AFC Championship games too. So did Eric Smith. Wayne Hunter took us to one. Shonn Green was a participant as well. So, as long as that's the end all be all measurement, we definitely don't want to question them either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 My apologies, I didn't realize I was trying to have a football discussion with the geniuses of football here who obviously know everything. I look forward to your long illustrious years of coaching in the NFL. Interestingly, I'm not the genius trying to understand Sanchez's psychological make-up based on no evidence whatsoever and then use that understanding which I've fabricated to explain his performance. I'm just the guy watching him perform at a very low level compared to his peers. But, again, take your ball and go home now that someone dares disagree with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 I thought you liked intelligent football discussions. It seems, rather, you like to propose your ideas unchallenged, and then if someone dares challenge them, you jump to "Teh Sanchez just sucks cock'n'ballz." Impressive work there. Also, Schotty took us to 2 AFC Championship games too. So did Eric Smith. Wayne Hunter took us to one. Shonn Green was a participant as well. So, as long as that's the end all be all measurement, we definitely don't want to question them either. I agreed with you. You stated your obvious factual opinion and those of your football genius cronies that I was wrong. Not sure what the discussion is at this point, we should cut him. He obviously sucks as you and the football geniuses have stated. I didn't realize I was discussing this with guys that are so studious of the game that they can clearly just state he is terrible and no further conclusion need be brought up. I will cower back to my peasantry while I go get my pitchfork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 Is there any evidence of this, or is this all just baseless speculation on your part? The bolded is the only thing I will agree with, as everything else you stated could be countered by claiming that his mistakes, after 40+ career starts, are the result of a lack of both the physical skills and mental acumen required to be a successful NFL QB. The coaching staff obviously feels that he is smart enough to read a defense by giving him the audible ability at the line. he seems to have free reign with it. His problem (just my perspective) is that he fails to see the vertical depth of the field. He appears to do his progressions (his head is moving, so he is looking at something). I am not sure how you can fix that, or even if it is fixable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 The coaching staff obviously feels that he is smart enough to read a defense by giving him the audible ability at the line. he seems to have free reign with it. His problem (just my perspective) is that he fails to see the vertical depth of the field. He appears to do his progressions (his head is moving, so he is looking at something). I am not sure how you can fix that, or even if it is fixable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 28, 2011 Share Posted November 28, 2011 The coaching staff obviously feels that he is smart enough to read a defense by giving him the audible ability at the line. he seems to have free reign with it. His problem (just my perspective) is that he fails to see the vertical depth of the field. He appears to do his progressions (his head is moving, so he is looking at something). I am not sure how you can fix that, or even if it is fixable. The coaching staff obviously feels that he is smart enough to read a defense by giving him the audible ability at the line. he seems to have free reign with it. His problem (just my perspective) is that he fails to see the vertical depth of the field. He appears to do his progressions (his head is moving, so he is looking at something). I am not sure how you can fix that, or even if it is fixable. Careful Scott, you are treading into the area of disagreeing with the football genius hierarchy here. Stop trying to hypothesize why he's struggling and just go with "he sucks balls" and needs to be cut immediately or else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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