NOT BUYING THE HYPE

[Matt39]

Mangini won four games with a roster that's much better than the one Rex is currently working with. Rex won four playoff games with Mark Sanchez at QB, while Mangini won zero with Pennington and Favre. It's not even close. Mangini may've acted more the way you like a head coach to act, but he was incompetent.

It's not even close.

His drafts were better though IMO.

[sourceworx]

See, here's where you and I diverge on this.  He's either earned a multi-year extension or he has not.  If he only gets a 1-year extension then - in the players' eyes - he's no less of a lame duck HC than without it.  He's still just as replaceable in 2015 whether he has 1 or 0 years left on his contract.  So the question is whether he has earned a 2-3 year extension (on top of the 1 year he already has remaining), or whether he has not.  I don't think he has.  Still unsure as to whether or not he should even return for that final year, but only because it depends on who he's getting replaced with, but I don't think he's earned an extension of any length.

 

The team was playing at least average for a while, but came back down to earth (to the talent level they actually have) and it's a what have you done for me lately league.  It's absurd to say how much better we'd be, with this roster, if only someone else was the HC.  There are over a dozen teams with an even worse record than we've got and all of them don't have worse rosters and no giftie wins.  And among those with better records, I guarantee they all haven't "earned" every win and didn't get any huge ref gifts that ultimately decided the game.  But we've looked atrocious on too many occasions this year alone to warrant any type of extension.

 

If he doesn't get fired, he should just play out his current contract and earn an extension.  If he's doing well, it can be offered to him mid-season or in January.  Unlike players, who must max out every dollar when their 1 opportunity arises, a HC is different.  If the team's done well enough at the close of the 2014 season to warrant a 3-year (give or take) extension, he'll take it with the Jets.  He's an emotional guy and it'll be his team and he's not going to run away to another city.  The only question, theoretically, is how it affects his relationship with his players during that final contract year.  I don't think a weak, 1-year extension does a blessed thing to change that.

 

Only way I change my mind on that is if we win out and make the playoffs.  That would be an accomplishment with this roster.

 

 

The Jets can't do this, especially this year, when they're likely going to spend some money in free agency.  What big time talent will want to sign a multi-year contract, knowing the coach is on the hot seat?

 

They either extend Rex for a few years, or go in a new direction.

[sourceworx]

His drafts were better though IMO.

 

They were.  But he also picked earlier in most of his drafts.  

[Matt39]

They were. But he also picked earlier in most of his drafts.

Bradway was behind the Revis pick and the trade up fwiw.

With Mangini however I don't think he was pounding the table for defense like Rex does.

As far as who gets blamed for what everyone who's in the war room has their own guys.

[Lupz27]

His drafts were better though IMO.

Those were Tannenbaum's drafts not Mangini's, and/or Rex's!

First Tannenbaum built an offensive line, a linebacker core, and a secondary, this happens under Mangini's watch, then with Rex he tried to get a franchise QB, and build a defensive line while trading away most of his picks to gain veteran talent to win now, fell short, and miscalculated the window, and for that he lost his job, but mostly lost it because from 2006 till 2012 he was unable to get the Jets a franchise QB, and most GM's will be graded in that manner these days.

[T0mShane]

Mangini won four games with a roster that's much better than the one Rex is currently working with. Rex won four playoff games with Mark Sanchez at QB, while Mangini won zero with Pennington and Favre. It's not even close. Mangini may've acted more the way you like a head coach to act, but he was incompetent.

It's not even close.

Who cares? He did a better job developing the players he was given by the same GM you're claiming gave Rex nothing to work with.

[Klecko73isGod]

Even if we subscribe to the theory that Rex never picked a single player, the fact is he's done an awful job with the players he was given.

 

I disagree. On the offensive side of the ball the only draftee/FA he was "given" with any developable talent was Kerley and he's worked out just fine IMO. On the defensive side, there's Wilkerson, Harrison, Demario Davis is pretty good, Richardson. Rex also gets credit for developing Mike DeVito. 

 

The reality is Tannenbaum traded away so many picks, the Jets had to rely on UDFAs for talent development so they were starting at a huge disadvantage. When you are only picking 2-4 players per draft the draft picks need to work out or you're screwed long term. The reality is the Jets haven't had many 3rd to 7th rounders to develop on Rex's watch - also not his fault as he was not the guy trading away draft picks to impress Woody by dominating the back pages. 

[Matt39]

Reality is both Tannenbaum and Rex thought the team(and Sanchez) we're better than they were and didn't care how many picks they traded away. I think with IdIk you'll see a more conservative approach...but he still has to hit in his draft picks.

[T0mShane]

I disagree. On the offensive side of the ball the only draftee/FA he was "given" with any developable talent was Kerley and he's worked out just fine IMO. On the defensive side, there's Wilkerson, Harrison, Demario Davis is pretty good, Richardson. Rex also gets credit for developing Mike DeVito.

The reality is Tannenbaum traded away so many picks, the Jets had to rely on UDFAs for talent development so they were starting at a huge disadvantage. When you are only picking 2-4 players per draft the draft picks need to work out or you're screwed long term. The reality is the Jets haven't had many 3rd to 7th rounders to develop on Rex's watch - also not his fault as he was not the guy trading away draft picks to impress Woody by dominating the back pages.

He's had 15 players come through the door drafted in rounds 1-4.

[Pac]

I don't think there are any coaches who would survive a three year stretch like Rex has had. Zero.

 

You conveniently forget to include years 1 and 2...  

 

But even if you discount that what you're saying is no other coach has survived 8-8, 6-10, and 1 game under .500 with a good chance of 8 wins?  There are a number of teams who would extend a coach with that record. 

 

Your hyperbole has reached comical levels.

[Sperm Edwards]

I don't think there are any coaches who would survive a three year stretch like Rex has had. Zero.

 

Think Tomlin survives this year?  With a 12-win team (that had the NFL's #1 defense) he lost to Tim Tebow in the playoffs on his own turf.  Given the way people speak of our 2009 and 2010 seasons, that is far bigger failure.  The next year he's 8-8.  Now he's 5-8.  Through it all, he's had a HOF QB and some damn good WRs and a supposed genius as his DC.  5 of their losses this year are by a TD or less.  Everyone knows that sometimes losses are just bad breaks but when there are so many like that it's coaching.  When you're getting blown out of the water often, typically, your team just stinks.

 

Is Mike McCarthy a good HC? Without Aaron Rodgers (but with "only" Nelson & Jones at WR), the Packers definitely suck worse than the Geno Smith Jets.  And their division is far more up for grabs than ours.

 

Is John Fox a good HC? His last year in Carolina they went 2-14.  Before Manning came to town they were 8-8 with more impossible/miraculous/divine intervention wins than we've had this season.  Orton isn't good, but he can throw and they had solid receivers & pass rushers and they were still pretty terrible.  Going to Tebow was Elway's way of tanking for a better draft pick (little did he know he'd get it by trading Tebow to Tannenbaum).

 

What was the great Andy Reid's record last year? When he got McCoy injured it was twice as irresponsible as when Sanchez went down in pre-season.  As was your complaint about the recent Jets (until this year when it was foiled twice), what team with a winning record have the Chiefs beaten? The Titans (who themselves hadn't beaten a winning team)?

 

Is Darrell Bevell even a good offensive coordinator if you want an attacking, passing offense? The only top-10 passing team he's ever overseen, in 8 seasons, was with Favre back in 2009.  I find it hard to believe he wasn't at least instrumental in the team trading for, and signing to big bucks, the great Matt Flynn.  Wilson being Wilson is stupid Tom Brady-like luck.  If it wasn't, we'd see a couple just like him come out every season.

 

Does Mike Munchak survive the offseason?

 

I can't believe someone is actually yearning for the 2006-2008 Eric Mangini.  This current coach, who is supposedly worse, took that team (with a rookie Mark Sanchez instead of Brett Favre) and came as close to the SB as this team has come since the 1960s.  Twice.  You want to bring in Mangini to help with the draft? Fine, even if we have to suffer through his Anthony Schlegels here & there.  But he's a horrid gameday head coach who was basically good for nothing except getting people to hate him.  The guy went with a strict 3-4 line with Dewayne Robertson at nose instead of either benching him or trying to find some way he could be a positive (insert bit to tell me about the few games he played well in during his half-decade here).  Someone who would do that is just a bad and stupid HC.  Maybe if he could coach some technique he would have put Pouha in there instead of the guy being a useless sack of garbage pre-Rex.

[T0mShane]

You conveniently forget to include years 1 and 2...

But even if you discount that what you're saying is no other coach has survived 8-8, 6-10, and 1 game under .500 with a good chance of 8 wins? There are a number of teams who would extend a coach with that record.

Your hyperbole has reached comical levels.

Go find that team with that coach.

[Jetsfan80]

You conveniently forget to include years 1 and 2...  

 

But even if you discount that what you're saying is no other coach has survived 8-8, 6-10, and 1 game under .500 with a good chance of 8 wins?  There are a number of teams who would extend a coach with that record. 

 

Your hyperbole has reached comical levels.

 

The Bears fired Lovie Smith after 11-5, 8-8 (Cutler got injured after a 7-3 start), and then 10-6 seasons. 

[Sperm Edwards]

The Jets can't do this, especially this year, when they're likely going to spend some money in free agency.  What big time talent will want to sign a multi-year contract, knowing the coach is on the hot seat?

 

They either extend Rex for a few years, or go in a new direction.

 

I don't believe that.  With some few exceptions (like staying where they are because they're comfortable or whatever reasons), FAs generally follow the money.  I don't know how often a low bidder gets a player because of a good situation.  Maybe a WR if he thinks he'll earn more in the future if he's paired with a better QB but that isn't the case with or without Rex.

 

And if that is the case, then Rex should go.

[T0mShane]

Think Tomlin survives this year? With a 12-win team (that had the NFL's #1 defense) he lost to Tim Tebow in the playoffs on his own turf. Given the way people speak of our 2009 and 2010 seasons, that is far bigger failure. The next year he's 8-8. Now he's 5-8. Through it all, he's had a HOF QB and some damn good WRs and a supposed genius as his DC. 5 of their losses this year are by a TD or less. Everyone knows that sometimes losses are just bad breaks but when there are so many like that it's coaching. When you're getting blown out of the water often, typically, your team just stinks.

Is Mike McCarthy a good HC? Without Aaron Rodgers (but with "only" Nelson & Jones at WR), the Packers definitely suck worse than the Geno Smith Jets. And their division is far more up for grabs than ours.

Is John Fox a good HC? His last year in Carolina they went 2-14. Before Manning came to town they were 8-8 with more impossible/miraculous/divine intervention wins than we've had this season. Orton isn't good, but he can throw and they had solid receivers & pass rushers and they were still pretty terrible. Going to Tebow was Elway's way of tanking for a better draft pick (little did he know he'd get it by trading Tebow to Tannenbaum).

What was the great Andy Reid's record last year? When he got McCoy injured it was twice as irresponsible as when Sanchez went down in pre-season. As was your complaint about the recent Jets (until this year when it was foiled twice), what team with a winning record have the Chiefs beaten? The Titans (who themselves hadn't beaten a winning team)?

Is Darrell Bevell even a good offensive coordinator if you want an attacking, passing offense? The only top-10 passing team he's ever overseen, in 8 seasons, was with Favre back in 2009. I find it hard to believe he wasn't at least instrumental in the team trading for, and signing to big bucks, the great Matt Flynn. Wilson being Wilson is stupid Tom Brady-like luck. If it wasn't, we'd see a couple just like him come out every season.

Does Mike Munchak survive the offseason?

I can't believe someone is actually yearning for the 2006-2008 Eric Mangini. This current coach, who is supposedly worse, took that team (with a rookie Mark Sanchez instead of Brett Favre) and came as close to the SB as this team has come since the 1960s. Twice. You want to bring in Mangini to help with the draft? Fine, even if we have to suffer through his Anthony Schlegels here & there. But he's a horrid gameday head coach who was basically good for nothing except getting people to hate him. The guy went with a strict 3-4 line with Dewayne Robertson at nose instead of either benching him or trying to find some way he could be a positive (insert bit to tell me about the few games he played well in during his half-decade here). Someone who would do that is just a bad and stupid HC. Maybe if he could coach some technique he would have put Pouha in there instead of the guy being a useless sack of garbage pre-Rex.

So, the coach that put together three seasons like Rex has put together and kept his job. Go on.

[slats]

Who cares? He did a better job developing the players he was given by the same GM you're claiming gave Rex nothing to work with.

Did better how? Losing with pro bowl players is better than winning with non pro bowlers? Is that really the case you're now making?

[Pac]

The Bears fired Lovie Smith after 11-5, 8-8 (Cutler got injured after a 7-3 start), and then 10-6 seasons. 

 

Correct.  And it was universally considered a pretty stupid move by a GM eager to stake his claim to the franchise.  Look at them now..  I suspect they'll lose tonight and have work to do to finish .500.

[T0mShane]

Did better how? Losing with pro bowl players is better than winning with non pro bowlers? Is that really the case you're now making?

REX ISN'T WINNING.

[Pac]

Go find that team with that coach.

 

In about a month it will be your NY Jets.

 

p.s.  You're getting throttled today...  you shouldn't have stoked the fire this morning.  You got Slats and SE using you for a punching bag.

[Sperm Edwards]

So, the coach that put together three seasons like Rex has put together and kept his job. Go on.

 

This is a QB league.  The Jets have not had a QB.  You can blame Rex for that all day and all night if it makes you feel better.  Meanwhile the Packers sans Rodgers - but still with "weapons" on offense - are worse than the Jets and are pissing their season away.

 

Seems to me their whole team (and coaching staff) amounts to little more than Aaron Rodgers.  We should totally get him.

[slats]

REX ISN'T WINNING.

Rex has won a lot more, with a lot less, than your beloved Mangini ever did.

[sourceworx]

REX ISN'T WINNING.

 

^All caps. He must be mad.

[ECURB]

I agree. However that's what it's going to take to save his job. Idzik, like any other GM, wants to bring his own guy in to coach the team. He was willing to stick with Rex for a year to satisfy Woody. But that's just about done now, so the only way for Rex to save himself is to make the playoffs.

It would be really hard for Idzik to justify firing a coach who took this putrid roster to the postseason.

But this is all moot, because our chances of getting in are very, very slim.

Are you friends with Idzik or something? Sounds more like you feel your theories are fact while everyone else's are false.

[Pac]

If we only had Mike Shannahan coaching this bunch of malcontents.  Then we'd see what real discipline and accountability can do for a program.

[Bugg]

The Jets can't do this, especially this year, when they're likely going to spend some money in free agency.  What big time talent will want to sign a multi-year contract, knowing the coach is on the hot seat?

 

They either extend Rex for a few years, or go in a new direction.

Further what big time WR or TE is signing up to watch this abortion of a caveman offense. Such players earn money with big time stats. NOBODY on  a Wrecks offense is racking up YPC, TDs  and catches. Nobody else bothers to run the Wildcat. Nobody wants to play with a crappy QB. Jimmy graham is not signing to get thrown 2 balls a week, and one of'em way off target.

[sourceworx]

Are you friends with Idzik or something? Sounds more like you feel your theories are fact while everyone else's are false.

 

 

LOL

 

No, I just think Rex needs a small miracle to save his job.  For all we know, Idzik could be negotiating an extension for Rex as we speak.  I doubt it, but you never know.  Crazier things have happened with this team.

[Sperm Edwards]

Are you friends with Idzik or something? Sounds more like you feel your theories are fact while everyone else's are false.

 

I'd say you're in the minority if you disagree.  It is unlikely just a rumor that keeping Rex for this season was a condition for Idzik.  It is not far-fetched that most GMs want to bring in their own guy if the team isn't already doing well.  But then, most teams doing well don't fire their GM in the first place, so it's unusual.

 

What is your take on the situation, as contradicts what he wrote? Not trying to be a dick; I'm curious.

[T0mShane]

In about a month it will be your NY Jets.

p.s. You're getting throttled today... you shouldn't have stoked the fire this morning. You got Slats and SE using you for a punching bag.

I'm just glad they're back posting. They've been suspiciously absent for three weeks.

[Sperm Edwards]

I'm just glad they're back posting. They've been suspiciously absent for three weeks.

 

I've had family stuff going on (and still do).

[T0mShane]

I've had family stuff going on (and still do).

Hope it's not too serious. Just poking.

[Sperm Edwards]

Hope it's not too serious. Just poking.

 

I thought it would liven your day, seeing as how you like being unhappy.

 

Honestly, I've been on the site here & there but it's been on a phone or ipad and I can't write my dissertation-length posts on them.  Didn't even realize, until I just looked, that I didn't post for about 10 days.

[Pac]

I'm just glad they're back posting. They've been suspiciously absent for three weeks.

 

agreed.  I commend you for making ludicrous comments to draw out the intellectuals.

[Jacked4JetsFB]

This is a QB league.  The Jets have not had a QB.  You can blame Rex for that all day and all night if it makes you feel better.  Meanwhile the Packers sans Rodgers - but still with "weapons" on offense - are worse than the Jets and are pissing their season away.

 

Seems to me their whole team (and coaching staff) amounts to little more than Aaron Rodgers.  We should totally get him.

 

I think Rex can do a better job coaching a team without a big time QB than most other coaches in the league.

 

But IMO that is not the issue.

 

The real issue is can Rex develop a QB??

 

I know you are in the camp of a QB is either good or bad, period, but I vehemently disagree with that for 90% of the QB's who are "NFL caliber".

 

About 2%, maybe less, are just awesome and will thrive no matter what.

 

About 8% will suck no matter what.

 

The rest can end up being anywhere from complete crap to HOF'ers based on development.

 

 

Most of us agree that the league is all about the QB, and unless you have a franchise QB your not going to win big.

 

So the real question that I hope the organization asks itself, can Rex develop a QB?? Or at the very least can he hire someone who can?

 

I have not seen any reason at all to believe he can, in fact I have seen all the reason to believe he cannot.

 

Hopefully Idzik will base his decision on that more than anything, and can get to the bottom of the answer.

[Integrity28]

agreed.  I commend you for making ludicrous comments to draw out the intellectuals.

 

 

LOL "intellectuals".

 

You just gave Slats a stroke-my-ego boner.

[Pac]

LOL "intellectuals".

 

You just gave Slats a stroke-my-ego boner.

 

shush..  I want to see where this goes.  I got time to burn.