" Potential cap cuts for New York Jets " ~ ~ ~

[kelly]

Potential cap cuts for New York Jets

The fun and games are over, and now we get down to the business portion of the NFL calendar.With a projected $47 million in salary-cap room, the New York Jets are under no pressure whatsoever to dump high-priced players, but they may make some cuts in the coming weeks as various financial deadlines approach.

A look at the potential cap casualties :

Percy Harvin, wide receiver ($10.5 million cap charge): Former general manager John Idzik executed a desperation trade last October that made sense on the risk-reward scale, but the landscape has changed. Not only is $10.5 million too much money for a player of Harvin's ilk, but there's also draft-pick compensation to consider. The Jets owe the Seattle Seahawks a conditional sixth-round pick that improves to a fourth-rounder if they keep him on the roster until March 19. The X factor is offensive coordinator Chan Gailey; his spread offense would be a nice fit for Harvin (if that's the system they choose to run). The March 19 deadline allows the Jets to explore free agency before making a decision on Harvin, who hasn't been an impact player since 2011.

Chris Johnson, running back ($5.25 million): The Jets have until Feb. 16 to decide whether to pay a $500,000 option bonus, part of the two-year, $8 million contract Johnson signed last April. The amount of the bonus isn't prohibitive, but the cap charge is steep for a player who would be no more than a part-time back again. Johnson was a worthwhile signing a year ago, but he'll be 30 in September and isn't close to being the player he once was. The Jets can save $3.5 million by parting ways with Johnson. That probably will be the outcome.

Calvin Pace, linebacker ($2.25 million): To keep him, the Jets have to pay a $250,000 option bonus before the start of the league year, March 10. It's not a crazy number, and neither is Pace's cap charge. The most important number to consider is 34 -- Pace's age. If new coach Todd Bowles puts an emphasis on getting younger and faster on defense, it probably means Pace isn't a fit. Bill Parcells used to have a label for players like Pace; he called them "progress stoppers." If they commit to Pace for another year, it will stunt the development of second-year linebackers Trevor Reilly and IK Enemkpali. The Jets can save $2.125 million by cutting Pace.

Jason Babin, linebacker ($1.625 million): Like Pace, Babin is due a $250,000 option bonus. He's a useful player because he's a pass-rushing specialist with the ability to play every down in a pinch. He's also a pass-rushing specialist who had only two sacks, so there's that. As with Pace, it's an age issue more than a financial issue; Babin will be 35 in May. How many mid-30s linebackers can a rebuilding team have? The Jets would save $1.325 million by dropping him.

 

> espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49064/potential-cap-cuts-for-new-york-jets

[Patriot Killa]

Cut Babin and Pace. We need to get younger and faster pass rusherS since 2011.

[faba]

Bye Johnson  and Calvin you did some nice things for us but time to get younger and more athletic.

[Patriot Killa]

Bye Johnson and Calvin you did some nice things for us but time to get younger and more athletic.

CJ too.. he did absolutely NOTHING.

[Jack Straw]

Cut everyone. We blew up the front office and coaching staff - why stop there? Cut all dead weight and let's roll young. We're two good drafts and a QB away from being really competitive - no need for a bunch of old geezers and a $10 million/year china doll of a receiver taking up space on this roster.

[Beerfish]

Harvin is the only one I would consider retaining.  We don't have to make a decision on him though until after FA starts so i would first look at better fa possibilities but would not be opposed to retaining him.  I would only restructure if it makes sense.  I'd rather over pay him on a year by year basis with no cap issues for cutting him than to restructure to a slightly better number but then have guaranteed money and cap implications.

[Jetster]

Harvin is the only one I would consider retaining.  We don't have to make a decision on him though until after FA starts so i would first look at better fa possibilities but would not be opposed to retaining him.  I would only restructure if it makes sense.  I'd rather over pay him on a year by year basis with no cap issues for cutting him than to restructure to a slightly better number but then have guaranteed money and cap implications.

Totally agree! He's year to year & isn't that the best way to evaluate him? Next year is a HUGE ? Anyway. For an 8-8 type of team a player of Harvins ilk might turn two tight games into wins & your 10-6 & in the playoffs.

WE HAVE THE MONEY!

The Jets aren't gonna be getting guys coming here for 1 year deals. The guys they target will get paid large upfront dollars that's why Percy on a year to year is perfect (absolutely no salary cap ramifications).

Last year Amaro was a rookie (he'll certainly better), if they bring in a Spiller, there's another guy with good hands out of the backfield.

Add in a vet QB & Harvin becomes a legitimate threat in a spread offense.

Once the Jets cut Harris (or restructure but it would have to be for a LOT LESS MONEY), cut Pace, CJ, Babin, Colon, the Jets are going to be close to 55 million in cap space as the cap it seems is going higher than they thought.

Plenty of Money to redo Wilk, grab a few studs & then bargain hunt when everyone else is snug against the cap.

I think the bargain hunting will be for some vet LBs that aren't close to collecting SS like Pace/Harris/Babin.

[kelly]

fyi  ;

 

~ ~ There will be a lot of speculation in the coming weeks about the future of wide receiver Percy Harvin, who arrived last October in a trade with the Seattle Seahawks.The New York Jets face a multilayered decision, one that will be based primarily on his contract ($10.5 million in 2015) and the draft-pick compensation they will owe the Seahawks to complete last October's trade.

The key date is March 19.

If Harvin remains on the Jets' roster after 4 p.m. on the 10th day of the league year (March 19), the Jets must give their fourth-round draft pick to the Seahawks. If the Jets release him before then, they owe the Seahawks a sixth-round choice.

The Jets were smart to make it March 19. Two reasons :

It gives them nine days to explore wide-receiver options in free agency. If they find a better player than Harvin, they can sign that player, cut Harvin and retain their fourth-round pick. The date also gives them leverage in any renegotiation talks with Harvin. If the Jets want to re-work his deal and he declines, the team can keep him until March 18, meaning he'd miss the first wave of free agency -- when the big money is doled out.If the Jets keep Harvin on the roster beyond the deadline, it doesn't guarantee his $10.5-million base salary and it wouldn't preclude them from cutting him at a later date. But looking at it from a practical standpoint, it wouldn't make sense to dump a player after committing a fourth-round pick.

What if the Jets try to circumvent the draft-pick upgrade by cutting him before March 19 and re-signing him at a later date? Sorry, that won't work. In other words, if they cut him March 18 and re-sign him at any point before the second day of the draft (May 1), they owe a fourth-rounder to the Seahawks.

In terms of the financials, Harvin's contract no longer contains any guaranteed money, meaning there would be no salary-cap ramifications if they decide to part ways. His salaries after 2015 are $9.9 million, $9.95 million and $11.15 million.Basically, it's a year-to-year contract, so what the Jets have to decide is this: Do they give up a sixth-round pick for the half-year he gave them in 2014 or do they surrender a fourth-rounder for a minimum of 1 1/2 years?

Interesting decision.

 

> http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49076/jets-face-march-19-deadline-on-percy-harvin-decision

[khesanh]

Very well done, I didn't think on how important the date was.  It works in our favor bigtime!!!!

[kelly]

I'm hopin' we cut all 4...

time to move-on

[joewilly12]

Cut all but Harvin proven NFL superstar get him healthy and in camp explosive playmaker much needed on this team 

[#27TheDominator]

I don't think I want Harvin AND Spiller.  I mean, sure I'd want them, but probably ends up being a lot of $$ and a bit duplicative.

[pointman]

Finding a threat like Harvin is hard. We have him, we gotta renegotiate. We need him.

[32EBoozer]

Take the Harvin $ and re-sign Wilkerson. Take the Babin, Pace and CJ $ and sign Maclin.

Take the other $30mil and sign Houston, Cro, Iupati and Fitzpatrick with $8 mil left over for draft picks and emergency signings in season.

[BroadwayJets]

Definitely cut Pace and CJ2k

Maybe Harvin

I keep Babin, he did pretty well this year. If we let go of PAce and Babin we'd be ****ed at OLB. Fill up one side of the OLB this offseason, and when Babin is gone, fill that other side up. 

[joewilly12]

Finding a threat like Harvin is hard. We have him, we gotta renegotiate. We need him.

This guy gets it 

[patman]

Take the Harvin $ and re-sign Wilkerson. Take the Babin, Pace and CJ $ and sign Maclin.

Take the other $30mil and sign Houston, Cro, Iupati and Fitzpatrick with $8 mil left over for draft picks and emergency signings in season.

Fitz sined a two year deal with Texas, You don't think Houston is tagged? Besides Dez i think he is the most likely to get tagged. They will cut Hali who is 31 rather than let Houston who is 26. But most likely it will be Bowe is cut under the June 1st rule. At the very least it is a tag and trade.

[Patriot Killa]

Keeping Harvin at 10 mill and cutting the rest gives us 46 mill to play with. It's worth it.. give him a year to contribute under Gailey.. it may pay off.

[LAD_Brooklyn]

No way would I keep Harvin at $10 mil. Bring his salary down to $8 mil and convert $2 mil of that into a roster bonus that he can cash in on in March. I think that's a fair middle ground rather then telling him straight up to take a pay cut. Teams are going to over $pend on any top WR that's going to hit the market.

 

If Harvin manages to get back to his old form we have him under contract for 3 years -$30 mil in March 2016 with no cap penalties if his play drops off or as his childhood friends on this board who know all about him say "if he becomes a locker room cancer".

[32EBoozer]

Fitz sined a two year deal with Texas, You don't think Houston is tagged? Besides Dez i think he is the most likely to get tagged. They will cut Hali who is 31 rather than let Houston who is 26. But most likely it will be Bowe is cut under the June 1st rule. At the very least it is a tag and trade.

KC is in a ton of hurt Cap wise. I don't see them ":tagging" Houston. Thanks for the update on Fitz... guess we go with Locker, Moore, McCoy.

 

From Jason @ OvertheCap.com

"Everyone saw the writing on the wall for where this was headed once the Chiefs were successful in 2013. The team spent a great deal of money that season to add to a group of underachievers which did push them over the hump, but was going to leave them clawing and scratching for cap space down the line. With major players to re-sign one could argue that they have the second worst cap position in the NFL. There is no team in the NFL that would benefit more from the salary cap rising well beyond the NFL projections of $138-142 million.

If they are forced to carry Houston on the tag and we use our $140M cap estimate that puts the Chiefs in the ballpark of $15 million over the salary cap. With that kind of position it will be near impossible to free up space to negotiate favorable terms with Houston and Hudson, instead needing to go the large bonus and low cap charge in year one route. That said the Chiefs usually use such contract mechanisms so it is not the kind of departure from the norm it would be with other teams."

[BRONX DUDE]

Harris really needs to go. WAY PAST HIS PRIME,.  jag now.

[patman]

KC is in a ton of hurt Cap wise. I don't see them ":tagging" Houston. Thanks for the update on Fitz... guess we go with Locker, Moore, McCoy.

 

From Jason @ OvertheCap.com

"Everyone saw the writing on the wall for where this was headed once the Chiefs were successful in 2013. The team spent a great deal of money that season to add to a group of underachievers which did push them over the hump, but was going to leave them clawing and scratching for cap space down the line. With major players to re-sign one could argue that they have the second worst cap position in the NFL. There is no team in the NFL that would benefit more from the salary cap rising well beyond the NFL projections of $138-142 million.

If they are forced to carry Houston on the tag and we use our $140M cap estimate that puts the Chiefs in the ballpark of $15 million over the salary cap. With that kind of position it will be near impossible to free up space to negotiate favorable terms with Houston and Hudson, instead needing to go the large bonus and low cap charge in year one route. That said the Chiefs usually use such contract mechanisms so it is not the kind of departure from the norm it would be with other teams."

Yeah, like I said they can save 9 mill by cutting Bowe as a June 1st cut and hali will save them almost 7, that is enough right there, once they tag him they could reach a long term deal. Eric Berry will most likely be a non football injury, so that is 6 mill, Cut devito for 4mill, Teams will not lose a guy with 22 sacks for nothing.

[sirlancemehlot]

Harris really needs to go. WAY PAST HIS PRIME,.  jag now.

Led the team with 124 tackles, led the defense in forced fumbles and had six sacks this year to boot.  Harris has never been a JAG and is still going strong.

[bitonti]

Cut everyone. We blew up the front office and coaching staff - why stop there? Cut all dead weight and let's roll young. We're two good drafts and a QB away from being really competitive - no need for a bunch of old geezers and a $10 million/year china doll of a receiver taking up space on this roster.

 

in the last two years they actually spent so little money they need to spend serious dough to get up to the floor. They have room for Harvin if they want him. More than enough room. Their problem is too much room.

[shuler82]

in the last two years they actually spent so little money they need to spend serious dough to get up to the floor. They have room for Harvin if they want him. More than enough room. Their problem is too much room.

I don't get why people don't understand this. Harvins contract is not an issue this year. Maybe in 2016.. But at that point we can still cut him without ramifications or give him an extension/rework

[Patriot Killa]

If Harris is willing to re sign at a reasonable price then why the hell not? He still has some left in him And he can mentor.

[32EBoozer]

Yeah, like I said they can save 9 mill by cutting Bowe as a June 1st cut and hali will save them almost 7, that is enough right there, once they tag him they could reach a long term deal. Eric Berry will most likely be a non football injury, so that is 6 mill, Cut devito for 4mill, Teams will not lose a guy with 22 sacks for nothing.

Then I guess the next man up would be Pernell McPhee(very good player), Brooks Reed, Jerry Hughes(my favorite after Houston), Bruce Carter, Worilds, Orakpo, Brandon Graham(another good possibility)

[Villain The Foe]

Percy Harvin, wide receiver ($10.5 million cap charge): Former general manager John Idzik executed a desperation trade last October that made sense on the risk-reward scale, but the landscape has changed. Not only is $10.5 million too much money for a player of Harvin's ilk, but there's also draft-pick compensation to consider. The Jets owe the Seattle Seahawks a conditional sixth-round pick that improves to a fourth-rounder if they keep him on the roster until March 19. The X factor is offensive coordinator Chan Gailey; his spread offense would be a nice fit for Harvin (if that's the system they choose to run). The March 19 deadline allows the Jets to explore free agency before making a decision on Harvin, who hasn't been an impact player since 2011.

 

 

The Jets need to cut everyone, but I will speak specifically on why I feel that we need to also cut Harvin. Some people believe that "Superstar" and "Harvin" are somehow synonymous. Harvin is a nice addition to a team, but I dont see superstar. He's had breakout games, he's had moments where he's taken over games, but what makes a superstar is the ability to be consistent with that ability and his numbers simply dont show consistency. Also, outside of his first 2 years in the league, Harvin has not put up crazy numbers on special teams. In his first two years in the league he's averaged 1050 kickoff return yards and 1.5 TD's per season. From 2011 to present he's averaging 480 kickoff return yards  and 0.5 TD's a year and he doesnt return punts. 

 

This means that we will have to get 8 to 10 million dollars out of Harvin primarily through his ability to be a WR and this is where I see a problem. Harvin for his career is averaging less than 12 yards per completion (11.5). He averages less than 4 TD's a season (3.5), has never had a season where he reached 1,000 yards receiving in an era when rookies straight out of college are reaching the plateau. And if anyone wants to bring up the fact that he didnt really have great QB's in Minnesota, then I will rebuttal that with him having a pretty decent one in Seattle and they were willing to ship him off to the Jets even though they gave up a 1st rounder to acquire him. This action by Seattle gives me the feeling that they recognized a mistake they made.

 

Percy Harvin is not worth 10.5 Million this year or 7 to 8 million a year over 3-4 years. Cut him along with the other guys mentioned and use that money to sign a WR such as a Torrey Smith and a RT like a  Bryan Bulaga, then use that 4th rounder that we saved and draft a RB that could catch out of the backfield and contribute on special teams. 

[Sperm Edwards]

Harris really needs to go. WAY PAST HIS PRIME,.  jag now.

 

He's a free agent so unless the Jets decide to offer him a new deal he's no more a Jet in 2015 than any other team.

 

Harvin is the only one I would consider retaining.  We don't have to make a decision on him though until after FA starts so i would first look at better fa possibilities but would not be opposed to retaining him.  I would only restructure if it makes sense.  I'd rather over pay him on a year by year basis with no cap issues for cutting him than to restructure to a slightly better number but then have guaranteed money and cap implications.

Agree. The only "risk" in hanging onto him through the end of August is downgrading from our high 4th to a high 6th. But the options it keeps open so far outweighs that. No pressure to grossly overdo it with a free agent WR or over-draft someone because of a massive hole there for this season.

Keep him. If we are able to land a sure-starter FA then dump Harvin at the end of the summer. Ditto if we draft a WR at #6. No reason to hand him the starting job in May; let him take it away from Harvin.

If the draft pick downgrade is REALLY that much of a factor for some, then trade down. Maybe Chicago wants to move up 1 slot to get Mariotta instead of Philly. Or move down 8-10 slots in round 2 (or twice that drop in round 3) to get the 4th rounder back. (Truth is we should have moved at least 1 pick from last year's draft to this year. 4 of our picks were unmovable because they were comp picks, but taking 12 picks ensures we're cutting 4 players by Sept 1st even if we did a GOOD job drafting. And since last year was considered such a marquis draft, I'm sure we'd have been able to find 1 team to trade with, even if it was only moving a 6th last year for a 5th this year.)

My concern is that, since Maccagnan is a college scout first and foremost, that he'll be more concerned with downgrading that 4th rounder than he should be (particularly in his first draft where he'd understandably want to show his stuff). And so the concern is he's going to cut Harvin early, before FA begins, just for that reason.

[#27TheDominator]

 

He's a free agent so unless the Jets decide to offer him a new deal he's no more a Jet in 2015 than any other team.

 

Agree. The only "risk" in hanging onto him through the end of August is downgrading from our high 4th to a high 6th. But the options it keeps open so far outweighs that. No pressure to grossly overdo it with a free agent WR or over-draft someone because of a massive hole there for this season.

Keep him. If we are able to land a sure-starter FA then dump Harvin at the end of the summer. Ditto if we draft a WR at #6. No reason to hand him the starting job in May; let him take it away from Harvin.

If the draft pick downgrade is REALLY that much of a factor for some, then trade down. Maybe Chicago wants to move up 1 slot to get Mariotta instead of Philly. Or move down 8-10 slots in round 2 (or twice that drop in round 3) to get the 4th rounder back. (Truth is we should have moved at least 1 pick from last year's draft to this year. 4 of our picks were unmovable because they were comp picks, but taking 12 picks ensures we're cutting 4 players by Sept 1st even if we did a GOOD job drafting. And since last year was considered such a marquis draft, I'm sure we'd have been able to find 1 team to trade with, even if it was only moving a 6th last year for a 5th this year.)

My concern is that, since Maccagnan is a college scout first and foremost, that he'll be more concerned with downgrading that 4th rounder than he should be (particularly in his first draft where he'd understandably want to show his stuff). And so the concern is he's going to cut Harvin early, before FA begins, just for that reason.

 

 

One interesting thing is the value chart.  According to the (not necessarily accurate) draft value chart, the value of moving from our fourth to our sixth is.... wait for it... A FOURTH!

 

Assuming we pick 6th every round, our 4th would be pick 102 which is valued at 92 points and our 6th would be pick 166 valued at 25 points.  The difference, 67 points falls smack in between picks 113 and 114 which are 17 and 18 in the 4th round.  I am sure that the comp picks will muck this up,  but there is a significant difference in the perceived value.

[Rexorcism]

Cut his ass and then re sign him

[kelly]

Cut his ass and then re sign him

 

re-sign him at the " right price ",.. cool ~ ~

 

 

 

[Sperm Edwards]

One interesting thing is the value chart.  According to the (not necessarily accurate) draft value chart, the value of moving from our fourth to our sixth is.... wait for it... A FOURTH!

 

Assuming we pick 6th every round, our 4th would be pick 102 which is valued at 92 points and our 6th would be pick 166 valued at 25 points.  The difference, 67 points falls smack in between picks 113 and 114 which are 17 and 18 in the 4th round.  I am sure that the comp picks will muck this up,  but there is a significant difference in the perceived value.

 

There were only two 4-12 teams this year (us and Washington, who picks 5th in round 1), so we flip flop every round with them (round 1 we pick 6th, round 2 we pick 5th, round 3 we pick 6th, etc.).

 

My point was only that it's easy enough to recoup if we value a 4th rounder so much. I wouldn't base the entire season's strategy, or pigeon-hole us into forcing our hand in FA or in round 1 of the draft, to preserve a single 4th round pick that we can re-acquire by trading down a little bit.

[#27TheDominator]

There were only two 4-12 teams this year (us and Washington, who picks 5th in round 1), so we flip flop every round with them (round 1 we pick 6th, round 2 we pick 5th, round 3 we pick 6th, etc.).

 

My point was only that it's easy enough to recoup if we value a 4th rounder so much. I wouldn't base the entire season's strategy, or pigeon-hole us into forcing our hand in FA or in round 1 of the draft, to preserve a single 4th round pick that we can re-acquire by trading down a little bit.

 

I didn't think it had anything to do with your point, I just thought it was interesting.  I actually looked into it expecting the two picks to be much closer in value. 

[Joe Jets fan]

Cut his ass and then re sign him

Of course you have read things and know the Jets can't do that. If they did Seattle still gets the 4th round pick. But I am sure you knew that and are just kidding.