Fitz Just Not Good Enough

[joewilly12]

So back on topic Fitz just not good enough.

[jgb]

So back on topic Fitz just not good enough.

Good enough for what and compared to whom?

[joewilly12]

Good enough for what and compared to whom?

johnysd started the thread and gave you the answers. 

[jgb]

johnysd started the thread and gave you the answers. 

Was asking your opinion but if it's "ditto" that's cool

[loluchka80]

First of all, let me say that Fitz played very well today. His competitiveness is infectious and he is leaving nothing out on the field he is using every little bit of talent he has. His teammates love him and respond to him. he is smart, well controlled and he deserves kudos for the effort he put in today. He did everything he could. Looking at his record against NE maybe one of his best efforts.

But his best is just not good enough to get this team where it needs to go.

He is just too limited. In a lot of ways it is very similar to the situation the 49ers had. Alex Smith was the ultimate game manager. He did not turn the ball over. He was smart, fairly accurate and a much better runner than Fitz. But he could not get the 49ers where they needed to go and went to Kapernick (who is now failing for completely different reasons)

Put frankly, Fitz is not dynamic enough for the opposition to really need to account for him. Not only can he not open up the game downfield. he is not really able to consistently press it in the mid range either. On drives, since all he can do is controlled offense, he has to essentially play perfect, converting lots of 3rd downs and having long multi play scores. Quick strikes are off the table with Fitz as is the play action for the most part. 

He is incapable of letting his offense dictate to the opposing defense. He is forced to take what they give him. As we say today. if they stack the box and double Marshall, he has very little and is not capable of making the plays needed to get the opposition out of that by stretching the field, or being effective with play action.

What this means is we have very limited ways to win a game. Essentially we have to have the defense play lights out. get turnovers and use field position to make scores. This is the only way Fitz will win.

you can say this about almost every QB in the NFL except for a handful.  

Fitz needs a good team around him to win.  As long as he doesn't make mistakes the jets will always have a shot to win.

[Jetsfan80]

For years we had to deal with weekly threads telling us why losses were not Sanchez or Geno's fault.

Now a QB actually plays well enough to win and is let down by his teammates, yet the QB gets blamed.

Unreal. 

[jgb]

For years we had to deal with weekly threads telling us why losses were not Sanchez or Geno's fault.

Now a QB actually plays well enough to win and is let down by his teammates, yet the QB gets blamed.

Unreal. 

We have a puncher's chance or better in every game with fitz. Conversely Geno doesn't even have a puncher's chance in his own locker room. I'll take it.

[GandWFan]

We have a puncher's chance or better in every game with fitz. Conversely Geno doesn't even have a puncher's chance in his own locker room. I'll take it.

Now that is funny.  I don't care what anyone says.  LOL

[JustInFudge]

You know who else isnt good enough to beat that Pats in Foxborough?  

Every single QB in the NFL.

 

[The Crusher]

You know who else isnt good enough to beat that Pats in Foxborough?  

Every single QB in the NFL.

 

Yes.  Marshall dropping the touchdown and the no call on the pass interference robbed Fitz of two more touchdown.  I think Fitz done enough to win.  That is just me.  People can bitch about him all they want and not saying its not warranted.  But he is not the reason we lost yesterday.  Two things I mentioned above and us giving up that stupid 3/17 nail in the coffin.

[Sperm Edwards]

And I'm saying that the results you believe to have perceived (unfairness or inequitable treatment), if indeed you did see them and are not just suffering from negativity bias (only remembering 'red lights'), is easily explained by random human variance and chance, not by some conspiracy or the refs being in the tank for the Pats.

I think if you looked at the game in objective fashion you would see plenty of poor calls or no-calls that benefited the Jets. But of course as Jets fans the bad calls are the ones that elicit the strongest and most memorable reactions.

Where are you getting this "conspiracy" stuff from? Save that soap box speech for someone who thinks airplanes are really UFOs.

- They repeatedly didn't call holding on the Patriots despite a sh*tload of holding occurring.

- They didn't call at least one blatant PI penalty on a would-be TD (and if they had called it then it would have been 1st & goal from the 1).

Noticing these things doesn't mean there is a conspiracy. It means they didn't call it despite these thing occurring.

However:

If you want to break down every Jets drop back and point to equal amounts of holding committed by the Jets, and PI in the end zone not called on the Jets, then be my guest and show it. Until then, your refutation holds no water other than your personal assumption that the same occurred both ways even though it was not seen by anyone. So go prove it if you contest that it is so, because your personal assumptions and faith are not proof. 

[JustInFudge]

For years we had to deal with weekly threads telling us why losses were not Sanchez or Geno's fault.

Now a QB actually plays well enough to win and is let down by his teammates, yet the QB gets blamed.

Unreal. 

HC and QB.  It's always their fault. They're the easiest scapegoats.

Personally, I felt they should have let him throw it more.  The run game was awful.  Zach Stacy running the ball is literally wasted down and we had guys open all over the field in the pass game.  Spread it out and throw ball, just dont throw to Owusu.  He is ******* awful.  Why Kerley doesnt get more run then him is ridiculous.  

The Pats abandoned the run because we had no answer for Brady and Gronk...it was there all game.  Why Gailey doesnt do the same is truly a question for the ages.   

[JustInFudge]

Yes.  Marshall dropping the touchdown and the no call on the pass interference robbed Fitz of two more touchdown.  I think Fitz done enough to win.  That is just me.  People can bitch about him all they want and not saying its not warranted.  But he is not the reason we lost yesterday.  Two things I mentioned above and us giving up that stupid 3/17 nail in the coffin.

100% he played great.  Like I said above, they should have let him throw it more. 

[The Crusher]

HC and QB.  It's always their fault. They're the easiest scapegoats.

Personally, I felt they should have let him throw it more.  The run game was awful.  Zach Stacy running the ball is literally wasted down and we had guys open all over the field in the pass game.  Spread it out and throw ball, just dont throw to Owusu.  He is ******* awful.  Why Kerley doesnt get more run then him is ridiculous.  

The Pats abandoned the run because we had no answer for Brady and Gronk...it was there all game.  Why Gailey doesnt do the same is truly a question for the ages.   

It felt to me that Gailey thinks we are good with 2nd and 8 or 2nd and 7.  Because he stuck with the first down run and Im pretty sure that was the result about every time.  The Pats midget DB's could not cover our wide outs with out fouling them.

[Jetsfan80]

HC and QB.  It's always their fault. They're the easiest scapegoats.

Personally, I felt they should have let him throw it more.  The run game was awful.  Zach Stacy running the ball is literally wasted down and we had guys open all over the field in the pass game.  Spread it out and throw ball, just dont throw to Owusu.  He is ******* awful.  Why Kerley doesnt get more run then him is ridiculous.  

The Pats abandoned the run because we had no answer for Brady and Gronk...it was there all game.  Why Gailey doesnt do the same is truly a question for the ages.   

With the way Ivory had been running all season, it's hard to question an initial gameplan that involves a lot of running the ball, especially when you're trying to beat Brady on the road.  We said before the game that that was going to be the key to victory.  However, Belichick is great at taking away what you do best, and Ivory coming out of the game for what seemed like the entire first half didn't help.

Yes, we should have probably adjusted in the 2nd half and gotten more aggressive, for the same reason already stated:  We were trying to beat Brady on the road and needed to be the aggressors.  But I don't question the fact that we needed to go in with a balanced attack as best as possible.  Running clock and keeping Brady off the field with a consistent running attack is smart....when it works.

 

[The Crusher]

100% he played great.  Like I said above, they should have let him throw it more. 

Hell if the stupid lineman didn;t move we would have had a chance to tie it up at the end.  We had the ball on there 30 I think?

[JustInFudge]

Hell if the stupid lineman didn;t move we would have had a chance to tie it up at the end.  We had the ball on there 30 I think?

That was actually Marshall.  He moved right when the ball was snapped because he wasnt on the LOS. 

[joewilly12]

It felt to me that Gailey thinks we are good with 2nd and 8 or 2nd and 7.  Because he stuck with the first down run and Im pretty sure that was the result about every time.  The Pats midget DB's could not cover our wide outs with out fouling them.

Decker was destroying New England secondary in the first half.

[JustInFudge]

With the way Ivory had been running all season, it's hard to question an initial gameplan that involves a lot of running the ball, especially when you're trying to beat Brady on the road.  We said before the game that that was going to be the key to victory.  However, Belichick is great at taking away what you do best, and Ivory coming out of the game for what seemed like the entire first half didn't help.

Yes, we should have probably adjusted in the 2nd half and gotten more aggressive, for the same reason already stated:  We were trying to beat Brady on the road and needed to be the aggressors.  But I don't question the fact that we needed to go in with a balanced attack as best as possible.  Running clock and keeping Brady off the field with a consistent running attack is smart....when it works.

 

He doesnt adjust well in game, at all.  He's a scripted game caller and has very little feel for the flow of the game.  They were crashing the LOS on runs and rolling coverage to Marshall all game.  That should have been a game that Decker and Kerley went mental but he refused to open it up.  He called a scared, not to lose game with the lead too. 

 

[BowlesMovement]

To quote the great Teddy Roosevelt:

"Complaining about a problem without a solution is called whining"

So, either have the balls to come out and say you think Geno would have won that game, and should start moving forward, or come up with a solution that is better than what Fitz is giving us right now. There are a ton of teams who don't have a top 5-10 QB, if there were easy solutions everyone would have one. These posts are getting old quick. 

[Jet_Engine1]

We have a puncher's chance or better in every game with fitz. Conversely Geno doesn't even have a puncher's chance in his own locker room. I'll take it.

That there is how its done, folks.

[The Crusher]

That was actually Marshall.  He moved right when the ball was snapped because he wasnt on the LOS. 

Marshal!!!  Come on man!!

[The Crusher]

Decker was destroying New England secondary in the first half.

It's what I saw.  He was physically too big for them. 

[joewilly12]

It's what I saw.  He was physically too big for them. 

Chan failed to recognize this and continue the onslaught as the game went on we played a preventive offense instead of an attacking taking advantage one. 

[sackdance]

Decker was destroying New England secondary in the first half.

Alone?

[GKnight83]

I am pretty sure the OP was the Border Collie and not a human being.

[The Crusher]

Chan failed to recognize this and continue the onslaught as the game went on we played a preventive offense instead of an attacking taking advantage one. 

No argument here.  He seems to enjoy 2nd and 7 or 8. 

[Snell41]

HC and QB.  It's always their fault. They're the easiest scapegoats.

Personally, I felt they should have let him throw it more.  The run game was awful.  Zach Stacy running the ball is literally wasted down and we had guys open all over the field in the pass game.  Spread it out and throw ball, just dont throw to Owusu.  He is ******* awful.  Why Kerley doesnt get more run then him is ridiculous.  

The Pats abandoned the run because we had no answer for Brady and Gronk...it was there all game.  Why Gailey doesnt do the same is truly a question for the ages.   

We have a Gronk!?!?  Hallelujah, holy sh*t!!!  I had no idea, you're absolutely right let's get him in there, stupid Chan!

 

[nyjunc]

yesterday was a total team loss.

Fitz missed some throws and had some awful decisions(why would you throw a 10 yd pass to decker w/ no Tos and 15 secs left? and the pass attempt to Smith down the field)

Ivory wasn't all there the 1st half

Marshall's drop

the Ol struggled

the D folded in the 2nd half

Weatherford was awful

[JustInFudge]

We have a Gronk!?!?  Hallelujah, holy sh*t!!!  I had no idea, you're absolutely right let's get him in there, stupid Chan!

 

WTF are you talking about? 

[Snell41]

WTF are you talking about? 

Reread your post:

"The Pats abandoned the run because we had no answer for Brady and Gronk...it was there all game.  Why Gailey doesnt do the same is truly a question for the ages."

For Gailey to do the same would require having a Gronk, and a Brady for that matter. 

 

[JustInFudge]

Reread your post:

"The Pats abandoned the run because we had no answer for Brady and Gronk...it was there all game.  Why Gailey doesnt do the same is truly a question for the ages."

For Gailey to do the same would require having a Gronk, and a Brady for that matter. 

 

That's not what I said.  The Pats abandoned the run and the Jets should have too.  The pass game was too easy yesterday but instead he thought running Zach Stacy would be a good idea. 

[Snell41]

That's not what I said.  The Pats abandoned the run and the Jets should have too.  The pass game was too easy yesterday but instead he thought running Zach Stacy would be a good idea. 

I gotcha brother, just busting your chops it's all good.  It's easy to pass every play when you have Brady.  Do you really want Fitz throwing every down? 

[Sperm Edwards]

No argument here.  He seems to enjoy 2nd and 7 or 8. 

It's a mentality that a lot of defensive coaches (or OCs coaching for defensive-minded HCs) have trouble breaking out of. In this regard, Ryan was no different, nor was Mangini before him, Herm before him, or Parcells before him. Running the ball keeps the clock moving. If you can keep moving them slowly you're where you want to be: your offense on the field instead of theirs.

In a way it can become a goal to have a means to scoring via a certain way, seemingly more than actually scoring no matter which way is most efficient in a given game or situation: as long as you move the chains, it keeps your offense and their defense on the field longer; likewise it means their offense your own defense on the field less. Running has a higher percentage of gaining yards than a pass since there's probably a 95% chance of gaining at least 1-2 yards at worst but even an unreal QB doesn't connect 75% of the time. A meh QB you're happy with anything north of 60%.

By the end of the game this would (theoretically) pay dividends. Also the idea that the other team will simply score fewer times if they have fewer possessions, and when they do have a possession your own defense will be less-winded because your offense provided them a longer rest since the last time they were out there.

The problem is while that works if your running game is getting chunks of 3-6 yards, with the occasional bigger run feathered in to boot. It doesn't when they're only gaining 1-3 yards a pop where the "big" gain is 7 yards and you have to wait until almost the 4th Q to see it. 

[JustInFudge]

I gotcha brother, just busting your chops it's all good.  It's easy to pass every play when you have Brady.  Do you really want Fitz throwing every down? 

Yesterday, with a hobbled Ivory and Zach ******* Stacy, yes.  It was there and he was playing well, so why not?  

Like I said in the other thread, you have to go for the jugular vs. that team, especially in Foxborough.  You know they score at will once its clicking and that's only a matter of time. I thought we should have spread it wide and force them to stop it.  Running the ball was just wasting downs...especially with Stacy.

29 carriers at 3.1 a clip? (Ivory 2.4 and Stacy 2.1)  It's the definition of insanity.  Trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.  Meanwhile, Fitz was completing the ball at 7 per toss. 

The Jets had 19 passing first downs.  19.  And 3 running first downs. They were 8-14 on 3rd down.  You have to be conscious of that if you're calling the game.