Why didn't Petty go on IR?

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, bitonti said:

yeah and Tajh Boyd says welcome to McDonalds, may I take your order?  

the exception doesn't disprove the rule.

And what does he have to do with it?  Congratulations but we can all come up with 100's of QBs who didnt make it.  So?  About as relevant as bringing up Jamarcus Russell.  Evert 2nd round QB isnt a bust anymore than every 1st round QB makes it.

As for exceptions, how many Super Bowl wins do those exceptions have?  Even a Brunnel, Gannon, Hasselback are QBs who didnt go early and were successful.  

[Sperm Edwards]

26 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

Sorry, your mom tired me out

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

She said she couldn't feel your pinky dick. Maybe it was because you were after getting through all the sports rosters of her nearest state college (of course I can't say which). But FYI you should wash. Twice.

[SAR I]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

This isn't a playoff year, agreed.  So why waste $12mm on a QB that can't take you to the playoffs? 

I also think the Jets, Mac and Bowles think this is a team that can compete for a championship, so that while your being realistic your thought process isn't that of the leadership of the Jets organization.

Two different things.  I didn't care if we re-signed Fitzpatrick or not, part of me wanted to throw Petty into the fire and see what happened.  The main reason I like the Fitzpatrick signing is because I don't need to see Geno Smith ever again.

It's Bowles job to compete for a Championship each year.  It's Maccagnan's job to shape the roster for the long-haul.  Sometimes the two goals don't mesh, sometimes a compromise is reached.  Fitzpatrick makes sense for Bowles (job security, already a 10 game winner, makes the vets happy) and for Maccagnan (stalls D-Day on the young QB's for another year, Fitz is a no-brainer after last year, Fitz can be an mentor to the young guys without undermining them) so $12M is less about a QB to get to the playoffs and more about a QB that the fans find acceptable (we like him), Bowles finds acceptable (job security), and Maccagnan finds acceptable (low drama, mentor role).

SAR I

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Two different things.  I didn't care if we re-signed Fitzpatrick or not, part of me wanted to throw Petty into the fire and see what happened.  The main reason I like the Fitzpatrick signing is because I don't need to see Geno Smith ever again.

It's Bowles job to compete for a Championship each year.  It's Maccagnan's job to shape the roster for the long-haul.  Sometimes the two goals don't mesh, sometimes a compromise is reached.  Fitzpatrick makes sense for Bowles (job security, already a 10 game winner, makes the vets happy) and for Maccagnan (stalls D-Day on the young QB's for another year, Fitz is a no-brainer after last year, Fitz can be an mentor to the young guys without undermining them) so $12M is less about a QB to get to the playoffs and more about a QB that the fans find acceptable (we like him), Bowles finds acceptable (job security), and Maccagnan finds acceptable (low drama, mentor role).

SAR I

I agree with virtually everything you're saying, but disagree with the strategy ...

With that said, the highlighted above is exactly my point from the previous post - Too many Jet fans are content with losing gracefully.  

[SAR I]

27 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I agree with virtually everything you're saying, but disagree with the strategy ...

With that said, the highlighted above is exactly my point from the previous post - Too many Jet fans are content with losing gracefully.  

Work with me here.

No one wants to lose, ever.  But if a team tries to win every year by loading up on old discarded free agents and never takes the time to develop a quarterback we are going to lose, always.

What I'm saying is that I'd rather go 6-10 this year because we didn't spend crazy money on free agents than go 10-6, lose a wildcard game, and be another year removed from doing it the right way.  Groh, Edwards, Mangini, Ryan, we either held on to the old quarterback too long, rushed a young guy in too soon, or overspent on bad free agents because we were in constant 'win now' mode.  It's time to rebuild the right way.  Give up this potential above-average season so as to be an elite team in 2018.  We have to do this the right way.  The Mets did.  The Red Sox did.  The Yankees are trying.  It's our turn.

SAR I

[FidelioJet]

Just now, SAR I said:

Work with me here.

No one wants to lose, ever.  But if a team tries to win every year by loading up on old discarded free agents and never takes the time to develop a quarterback we are going to lose, always.

What I'm saying is that I'd rather go 6-10 this year because we didn't spend crazy money on free agents than go 10-6, lose a wildcard game, and be another year removed from doing it the right way.  Groh, Edwards, Mangini, Ryan, we either held on to the old quarterback too long, rushed a young guy in too soon, or overspent on bad free agents because we were in constant 'win now' mode.  It's time to rebuild the right way.  Give up this potential above-average season so as to be an elite team in 2018.  We have to do this the right way.  The Mets did.  The Red Sox did.  The Yankees are trying.  It's our turn.

SAR I

I agree 100% with you...except I wouldn't have given Fitz $12mm....would rather have saved that money to either keep our young guys or use in a couple of years when we are ready.

Otherwise we're entirely on the same page.

[Dcat]

8 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You don't keep Geno on the team as the #2 QB because you hope maybe there's a hope you can trade him in a narrow window during the season, and handicap your team to the tune of 1 more roster spot. That's no way to manage a roster once the season starts. 

Either Geno is the #2 or Petty is the #2. Not 2a and 2b, plus another #4 QB that's unusable but also must be kept. If Geno's the #2 and Petty's the #3 because that's what the HC and OC want, then Petty should have been early-IR'd. He's out for the first week or two as it is, and won't be back in rhythm for another week after that. Actually more, because he won't be working with the 1s at all and not with the 2s most of the time because the team needs to gameplan-practice not have summer tryouts anymore.

Sure there's the possibility that Fitz gets hurt and Geno goes in and gets hurt himself again. In that case it will look like a wise move. But odds are Petty will not see the field until well into the 2nd half of the season, if at all. We could have saved the roster spot.

Disagree entirely.  If the opportunity arises to get a decent draft pick for Geno, they will grab it and need Petty. Your opinion that this "is no way to manage a roster" is just that,  an opinion that others may not agree with. 

[isired]

Lol, no. Fitz is terrible and will be one of the primary reasons we start of terrible. His history against better teams is completely abysmal and I see no reason for that to change. He was one of the luckiest QBs I have ever seen play last year, and he will face much stiffer competition that will expose him as the complete fraud he is. Petty would do better in first 6 games than Fitz will. Why some Jets fans think this complete BUM that had never won more than 6 games before last year is a good QB all of a sudden and remotely capable of a 9-1 run is completely beyond me. Fuuck Fitz, he is going to wreck this season. 

I dunno, sounds like you're hoping, more than thinking. Just sayin'.

[Maxman]

On 9/6/2016 at 1:48 PM, Augustiniak said:

he's the 3rd string qb, bowles said he'll miss 1 or 2 games anyway, and he can return after week 6?  do they want to keep the IR return spot free, or were they going to name Petty the 2nd stringer but then he got hurt?  bowles' quote about geno being the backup wasn't 'he earned it', but something like 'safe to say geno is the backup'.  i understand they were always keeping hack.  is there something to read between the lines with an injured 3rd string petty not starting out on IR?

I think because it is a 1 or 2 week injury. No need to do I.R. even though they could bring him back. He wasn't playing week 1 or 2 anyway, so he will just be inactive.

[The Crusher]

6 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

She said she couldn't feel your pinky dick. Maybe it was because you were after getting through all the sports rosters of her nearest state college (of course I can't say which). But FYI you should wash. Twice.

I would have went with I don't have a mom, me and my Dad share yours.  I like that one. 

[JohnnyLV]

35 minutes ago, isired said:

I dunno, sounds like you're hoping, more than thinking. Just sayin'.

Never. I will root for Fitz on Sunday but I think he sucks and arguments saying "he is the best QB option" are completely uncompelling

 

[SAR I]

8 hours ago, bitonti said:

 I hate to be the one to break it to you guys but Petty and Hack aren't future franchise QBs in the incubator. They are non-first round QBs who probably amount to backups.

In this league, most of the starters are first round picks and most of the guys winning super Bowls are 1 overall.  Or blatant cheaters like Brady. 

We've seen enough of both players to know for a fact they are not Russell Wilson.  yes guys get better but 2nd rounders and 4th rounders don't turn into amazing prospects given enough time. If they were amazing prospects they go in rd 1. 

In your scenario, which is very true by the way, the Jets have 3 choices:

1.  Suck for years, get the #1 overall pick for years, be in that magical spot to draft the can't-miss guy when he materializes.

2.  Suck for years, save every cap dollar possible, wait for an elite QB to enter his free agent year, spend a fortune to steal him away.

3.  Be competitive, do your homework, draft a new QB in the 2nd or 3rd round each year, give them 2 years to develop, keep doing this until you unearth the franchise guy.

Considering the options, #3 doesn't sound like a bad idea with this team right now.  Option 1 is intolerable, Option 2 never happens because the original team locks him up.  Perhaps the difference between a Luck and a Petty isn't really ability, it's system and it's coaching and it's patience.

SAR I

[Sperm Edwards]

5 hours ago, Dcat said:

Disagree entirely.  If the opportunity arises to get a decent draft pick for Geno, they will grab it and need Petty. Your opinion that this "is no way to manage a roster" is just that,  an opinion that others may not agree with. 

Short the team of a roster spot through their toughest stretch on the off chance someone will suddenly trade what, a 5th round pick if we're incredibly lucky, for a failure QB whose contract expires at the end of the season? So he could go to their team and learn a new play book and develop rhythm & chemistry with a new offense instantaneously? Lol. 

What "decent draft pick" could you imagine getting for Geno after the season starts?

[Dcat]

7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Short the team of a roster spot through their toughest stretch on the off chance someone will suddenly trade what, a 5th round pick if we're incredibly lucky, for a failure QB whose contract expires at the end of the season? So he could go to their team and learn a new play book and develop rhythm & chemistry with a new offense instantaneously? Lol. 

What "decent draft pick" could you imagine getting for Geno after the season starts?

You'd be surprised.  I mean who would have ever believed that someone would give up a 1st plus a 4th for stinky Bradford, right?  Who's to say Geno couldn't get us a 4th from a desperate team?  Far fetched, but best to keep Petty active just in case. 

[CrazyCarl40]

14 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

I agree 100% with you...except I wouldn't have given Fitz $12mm....would rather have saved that money to either keep our young guys or use in a couple of years when we are ready.

Otherwise we're entirely on the same page.

What young guy is coming up at the end of a contract you'd rather give that 12 million to? There is no rainy day fund in the NFL. In a couple of years you know how much the Jets have committed to the Salary Cap? In 2018, they have 96 million committed and in 2019 they have less than 40. And will have some very cuttable contracts in both years. After next season the Jets will have plenty of space to chase a FA QB or commit solid money to a young guy they drafted. They just have to get through these bridge years first. 

[section314]

8 hours ago, SAR I said:

In your scenario, which is very true by the way, the Jets have 3 choices:

1.  Suck for years, get the #1 overall pick for years, be in that magical spot to draft the can't-miss guy when he materializes.

2.  Suck for years, save every cap dollar possible, wait for an elite QB to enter his free agent year, spend a fortune to steal him away.

3.  Be competitive, do your homework, draft a new QB in the 2nd or 3rd round each year, give them 2 years to develop, keep doing this until you unearth the franchise guy.

Considering the options, #3 doesn't sound like a bad idea with this team right now.  Option 1 is intolerable, Option 2 never happens because the original team locks him up.  Perhaps the difference between a Luck and a Petty isn't really ability, it's system and it's coaching and it's patience.

SAR I

Sar    good post. To add to your #1 choice, remember the Jets had the # 1 overall pick 2 years in a row(1996& 1997) and didn't come away with a franchise QB, probably the only team in history of the NFL that can say that. For every Luck, there are 10 George's, Leaf's, Sanchez's etc. Sucking for years is only good for your divisional opponents.

[Augustiniak]

9 hours ago, SAR I said:

3.  Be competitive, do your homework, draft a new QB in the 2nd or 3rd round each year, give them 2 years to develop, keep doing this until you unearth the franchise guy.

Perhaps the difference between a Luck and a Petty isn't really ability, it's system and it's coaching and it's patience.

SAR I

since parcells came, the jets have been relevant, going to 3 afc championship games.  but this franchise hasn't had a gm and coaching staff that has truly been dedicated to developing the qbs they've drafted.  all of the coaches have been former defensive guys - parcells, herm, mangini, rex.  the gms haven't been strong either.  this is the first time i can recall the gm is committed to developing 'a pipeline of qbs'.  mccags doesn't want just 1 qb.  he wants as many as possible.  look how they've done with petty, he'ss made nice strides in only a year, coming from a baylor offense many draft experts said it was virtually impossible to transition to the nfl game.  heck, petty has looked by far the best of all the jets qbs, just based on 'the eye test'.  on a broader scale, i like that mccags is drafting qbs who have the right measurables, the height and arm strength.  guys like sanchez, geno, mcelroy, even guys like clemens and bollinger, etc. - they're all undersized with arm limitations.  give me a guy like petty who can wing it.

on a side note, woody johnson's comments yesterday about geno smith are telling.  when asked about geno, woody said 'he's on the team....for now.'  we may well look back on that quote if they dump geno at some point this season and make petty the backup.  

[SouthernJet]

He will go on IR 1st chance it benefits Mac to do so....

[FidelioJet]

3 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

What young guy is coming up at the end of a contract you'd rather give that 12 million to? There is no rainy day fund in the NFL. In a couple of years you know how much the Jets have committed to the Salary Cap? In 2018, they have 96 million committed and in 2019 they have less than 40. And will have some very cuttable contracts in both years. After next season the Jets will have plenty of space to chase a FA QB or commit solid money to a young guy they drafted. They just have to get through these bridge years first. 

Sheldon Richardson for one...And potential impact free agents that come available.  CB, OLB, OL, Someone to replace Harris...

There's no shortage of places to spend $12mm....And the Jets have plenty of holes.

[CrazyCarl40]

12 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Sheldon Richardson for one...And potential impact free agents that come available.  CB, OLB, OL, Someone to replace Harris...

There's no shortage of places to spend $12mm....And the Jets have plenty of holes.

Sheldon is under contract another year and has a lot to prove if he's going to stick around. There's no rush there. 

What free agents did the Jets miss out on this offseason because of the Fitz money?

[FidelioJet]

Just now, CrazyCarl40 said:

Sheldon is under contract another year and has a lot to prove if he's going to stick around. There's no rush there. 

What free agents did the Jets miss out on this offseason because of the Fitz money?

Well, they lost Snacks...Also I'm not familiar with free agents for next year but that money certainly could have been carried over to next year to sign the things we need.

[jgb]

18 hours ago, SAR I said:

Two different things.  I didn't care if we re-signed Fitzpatrick or not, part of me wanted to throw Petty into the fire and see what happened.  The main reason I like the Fitzpatrick signing is because I don't need to see Geno Smith ever again.

It's Bowles job to compete for a Championship each year.  It's Maccagnan's job to shape the roster for the long-haul.  Sometimes the two goals don't mesh, sometimes a compromise is reached.  Fitzpatrick makes sense for Bowles (job security, already a 10 game winner, makes the vets happy) and for Maccagnan (stalls D-Day on the young QB's for another year, Fitz is a no-brainer after last year, Fitz can be an mentor to the young guys without undermining them) so $12M is less about a QB to get to the playoffs and more about a QB that the fans find acceptable (we like him), Bowles finds acceptable (job security), and Maccagnan finds acceptable (low drama, mentor role).

SAR I

Imagine that the professionals don't make decisions based on fantasy points

[CrazyCarl40]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

Well, they lost Snacks...Also I'm not familiar with free agents for next year but that money certainly could have been carried over to next year to sign the things we need.

They were never keeping Snacks at that price point. 

The money carried over, if that's a thing that can still happen (I'd have to research further), wouldn't have been as much as the 7 million he costs on the cap because they made that space but moving and cutting other players. They would have had to use it anyway this year. 

[bostonmajet]

I like the Fitz signing, not because I think we will win the SB, but because you don't want to build a culture of loosing. Even if Fitz wasn't here and Petty played with our defense and ST we are still likely not going to get the #1 pick (remember the Browns and other are out there). Or, with out O-line, we are likely to get Petty, Geno, Hack killed. Fitz is quick enough to hopefully avoid the rush (in decision making that is).

Also, you want the other players to grow and mature; our young WRs will not improve on a team without a QB. Get the system in place roll the dice and see how the season goes. If you move on from Fitz next year, still most of the offense will be 1 year better (and older for some) this give the next QB an advantage in coming in - he only needs to worry about himself as the rest of the offense knows the playbook and are better route runners - stepping into a quality offense (assuming the OL is in improved) is a great advantage especially for young QBs.

As far as loosing it all for years to get the next Luck, how did that work out for the Colts? A team bad enough to loose all of those games is hard to rebuild even around a Luck and a year of high picks. Look at all the teams picking #1/#2 these past years - which have a shot this year.

I do believe that the Jets think they can make some hay this year, or why else keep Geno around. Having a good backup isn't important if you don't think you have a shot to make it into the playoffs.

I would like to be optimistic about the Jets chances, but the OL scares me. If Clady goes down, they are done.

[DonCorleone]

21 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Hey, they're the ones that made him the QB2. There's no evidence Bowles was going to promote Petty over him despite the fans' reactions. They could have cut Geno before Petty got hurt and kept Petty out of game 4 as it is to protect him.

Agreed. There was also no immediate vote of confidence from the coaching staff until Petty got hurt. Enjoy the season and let's hope that number 2's become a thought for next season.

[C Mart]

On September 6, 2016 at 4:52 PM, Gas2No99 said:

I disagree, this year is a wash for Hack and Petty as the designated #3 would get those Reps on the Scout team as he's 1 year more familiar to RUN a Pro Scout team than Hack. 

Hmmm. 

Gailey says running scout team offense all season will be very beneficial for Hack because he'll work a ton on reading defenses. #NYJ