Debunking the Kirk Cousins/Neil O’ Donnell comparison.

[Patriot Killa]

5 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Stop starting Kirk F****** Cousins threads with people comparing him to Sanchez and people won't inadvertently derail them.  But back to the subject matter:

1.  The Redskins can franchise him if they want him.  If he's really any good, he's not leaving Washington.

2.  If he hits the market there is nothing, nothing to entice him to join the Jets.  No OL, no RB, weak OC, weak WR's, no TE, skechy HC, questionable GM, displaced owner, tough division.  There is zero chance, zero, that even a slightly-more-than-mediocre veteran QB like Kirk F****** Cousins comes to Florham Park.

So quit getting moist already.

SAR I

I started a thread comparing the situation and abilities of Neil O’Donell to Kirk Cousins. YOUU ARE THE ONE who made this a Sanchez thread. GFYS. You don’t have anything valueble to add here, obviously. Just the same crap. The only Kirk Cousins created threads were relevant news, I wasn’t even on board with it until a few days ago so how many threads have I REALLY made? Again, GFYS

[whodeawhodat]

7 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Stop starting Kirk F****** Cousins threads with people comparing him to Sanchez and people won't inadvertently derail them.  But back to the subject matter:

1.  The Redskins can franchise him if they want him.  If he's really any good, he's not leaving Washington.

2.  If he hits the market there is nothing, nothing to entice him to join the Jets.  No OL, no RB, weak OC, weak WR's, no TE, skechy HC, questionable GM, displaced owner, tough division.  There is zero chance, zero, that even a slightly-more-than-mediocre veteran QB like Kirk F****** Cousins comes to Florham Park.

So quit getting moist already.

SAR I

money, a whole lot of money and fame too.

[Jet Nut]

7 minutes ago, SAR I said:

I am not derailing this thread.  I read the Namath book by Mark Kriegel 20 years ago and that was my recollection.

My opinions on Kirk Cousins are documented (above) and I'll be happy to discuss that.

SAR I

Your opinion on Cousins is meaningless.  You actually think Sanchez was a top young QB prospect. You give him no blame for sucking over 6 seasons.  You blame others.  Here or wherever he's played. He was never, ever close to being as good as Cousins.  But not seeing that says you should stay out of any QB thread.  Your posts sound as childish as saying if the skins want Cousins all they have to do is franchise him.  

And yes, you've derailed this thread, like you always do when you troll your teams board.  Go troll the Giants.

[Patriot Killa]

1 minute ago, whodeawhodat said:

money, a whole lot of money and fame too.

Obviously @SAR I didn’t read the post a few days ago from one of @Mogglez insiders saying Kirk and his wife Julie LOVE NJ/NY and how it offers many endorsement opportunities. But hey, wtf do I know???‍♂️

[whodeawhodat]

Just now, Patriot Killa said:

Obviously @SAR I didn’t read the post a few days ago from one of @Mogglez insiders saying Kirk and his wife Julie LOVE NJ/NY and how it offers many endorsement opportunities. But hey, wtf do I know???‍♂️

i was just tossing him a cookie for not having the name sanchize in one of his posts. 

[SAR I]

6 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

money, a whole lot of money and fame too.

Kirk Cousins has made $46,633,295 between 2012 and 2017 and drives a dented GMC Savana passenger van with more than 100,000 miles on it.

Doesn't sound like the type of guy interested in a cash-grab.  Sounds like the type of guy who would want to find a great team ready to win now as a 30 year old entering the 2018 season.  Jacksonville feels like a very attractive landing spot for any free agent QB.  Arizona perhaps too.  Miami?  Why not?  The Jets can't attract Grade A free agents, not now, not with this head coach, not with this OL.  Soon, but not now.

SAR I

 

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, Patriot Killa said:

I’m kind of mad SAR just turned my thread into yet another f*cking 2010 Mark Sanchez thread. Get lost and join a Giants board.. I didn’t spend 2 hours doing this thread for you to suck off Mark Sanchez.

Interesting since the reason I am in this thread is due to you.  Your post from yesterday:

22 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

Awh, someone got hurt when I compared Neil O’ Donell to Mark Sanchez.

You know, there are no financial rewards for starting a popular thread on JN.  And there are a dozen Kirk Cousins threads for the membership to choose from.  We didn't need this one.

SAR I

[SAR I]

19 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I started a thread comparing the situation and abilities of Neil O’Donell to Kirk Cousins. YOUU ARE THE ONE who made this a Sanchez thread. GFYS. You don’t have anything valueble to add here, obviously. Just the same crap. The only Kirk Cousins created threads were relevant news, I wasn’t even on board with it until a few days ago so how many threads have I REALLY made? Again, GFYS

Oh, so now it's okay to go off topic? 

SAR I

[Patriot Killa]

5 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Interesting since the reason I am in this thread is due to you.  Your post from yesterday:

You know, there are no financial rewards for starting a popular thread on JN.  And there are a dozen Kirk Cousins threads for the membership to choose from.  We didn't need this one.

SAR I

I mentioned ONCE that he played a similar role with the Steelers that Sanchez played with the Jets. That doesn’t mean go off on a whole journey through time naming off reasons and excuses of why Mark Sanchez was good. That’s not what that means. Keep it movin.

 

edit: this thread wasn’t purely Kirk Cousins based. This thread stems from JW12 and Phil comparing Neil O’Donnell situation to Cousins situation. Someone asked me if I wanted to type up a thread of how they differ. I gladly accepted. Shut up already

[Patriot Killa]

55 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Oh, so now it's okay to go off topic? 

SAR I

Am I not suppose to reply just because you tried to ‘tell me off’ and then quickly added at the end of it .. “back on topic” to give off the illusion that if I replied to the basis of your post I would then be taking it off topic myself..? lol you aren’t slick. 

 

anywayzz back on topik guyz

Kirk has plenty of reasons to sign here and I fully expect him to be attracted to NY, period.

[SAR I]

3 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I mentioned ONCE that he played a similar role with the Steelers that Sanchez played with the Jets. That doesn’t mean go off on a whole journey through time naming off reasons and excuses of why Mark Sanchez was good. That’s not what that means. Keep it movin.

edit: this thread wasn’t purely Kirk Cousins based. This thread stems from JW12 and Phil comparing Neil O’Donnell situation to Cousins situation. Someone asked me if I wanted to type up a thread of how they differ. I gladly accepted. Shut up already

This isn't your thread anymore.  It's mine.  This is the Off Topic Kirk Cousins Thread ™ , makes it different than the dozen or so Legitimate Kirk Cousins Threads which stay completely on topic. 

SAR I

[SAR I]

2 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

Am I not suppose to reply just because you tried to ‘tell me off’ and then quickly added at the end of it .. “back on topic” to give off the illusion that if I replied to the basis of your post I would then be taking it off topic myself..lol you aren’t slick.

This post is properly off-topic and is allowed.

You may carry on.

SAR I

[Patriot Killa]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

This isn't your thread anymore.  It's mine.  This is the Off Topic Kirk Cousins Thread ™ , makes it different than the dozen or so Legitimate Kirk Cousins Threads which stay completely on topic. 

SAR I

Shouldn’t you be chopping it up about Rosen with the rest of the poor bastards from NY?

[Matt39]

Remember when Odonnell got hurt in warmups? Good times.

http://www.nytimes.com/1996/12/02/sports/o-donnell-strains-a-muscle-and-the-team-s-misery-grows.html

 

[Patriot Killa]

17 hours ago, TnT said:

@Gas2No99

ORRRRR, We can totally exclude 2012 being we all know it was the year nobody had an answer for RG3 and say Cousins managed to get a meh team in the 2015 playoffs that hadn’t been there in 7 yrs.

Thats kind of Franchiseish.

First ever year as a full time starter 68.7% completion percentage.

[Patriot Killa]

2 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Remember when Odonnell got hurt in warmups? Good times.

http://www.nytimes.com/1996/12/02/sports/o-donnell-strains-a-muscle-and-the-team-s-misery-grows.html

 

He missed a lot of games in his time here. 98’ was a little different but he proved he couldn’t be trusted as a passer. When the spotlight was on him instead of Barry Foster or the Defense..he choked. From what I have read and watched that Super Bowl against the Cowboys was such a bad performance people wondered if he threw the game on purpose 

[Matt39]

Just now, Patriot Killa said:

He missed a lot of games in his time here. 98’ was a little different but he proved he couldn’t be trusted as a passer. When the spotlight was on him instead of Barry Foster or the Defense..he choked. From what I have read and watched that Super Bowl against the Cowboys was such a bad performance people wondered if he threw the game on purpose 

Parcells had more confidence in Ray Lucas.

[Patriot Killa]

2 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Parcells had more confidence in Ray Lucas.

Which is saying an awful lot. He threw 14 touchdowns to 6 picks though. Did about as well as ODonnells best year.

[bla bla bla]

42 minutes ago, SAR I said:

1.  The Redskins can franchise him if they want him.  If he's really any good, he's not leaving Washington.

He said he wants to test FA so even if they hand him $34M for this year he'll still likely test FA anyway. It's not like the Redskins haven't tried to sign him to a LTD, it just looks like he doesn't want to be there or he wants the most money.

42 minutes ago, SAR I said:

2.  If he hits the market there is nothing, nothing to entice him to join the Jets.  No OL, no RB, weak OC, weak WR's, no TE, skechy HC, questionable GM, displaced owner, tough division.  There is zero chance, zero, that even a slightly-more-than-mediocre veteran QB like Kirk F****** Cousins comes to Florham Park.

If the Redskins place the Transition Tag on him and he doesn't want to play for the Redskins then there are only 2 teams than can beat the tag so the Redskins can't match it. If we also assume that Kirk will want to test the waters of FA then he'll likely need time to go from team to team before making a decision on where he is going to go. I don't believe he'll be the first FA signed so you'd think we'd use $60M or so to build the roster without Cousins prior to him making a decision. 

- I could see Macc making the case that Jensen + healthy Winters is a significant upgrade over an injured Winters and the 35th ranked C

- I could also see Macc saying RB is a priority in the top 3 rounds so we wouldn't neglect that position

- Weak OC? or can Macc say that we got career years out of 2 journey man QBs, just imagine what we can do with a legit QB

- Weak WRs/TE? please tell me a team that will have better options than us that can afford Cousins let alone beat a Transition Tag. Jags are losing Hurns, Lee, and Robinson to sign Cousins. Denver will likely cut Sanders and Thomas in order to fit him under the cap. I'm not sure the Bills or Browns are drastically better roster wise that Cousins would want to leave money on the table. It should be noted that Eli makes $8M per year in endorsements while the best QB in the league Aaron Roders makes $7.5M so NY has the edge money wise.

- Sketchy HC or questionable GM? you mean the guys that the owners just extended. Vance Joseph was almost fired, Hue Jackson doesn't exactly look like a world beater. McDermott and Marrone are better but again look at the above details and see if that doesn't play a factor.

- Displaced owner - Why does that even matter haha

- tough division?? Patriots are losing both coordinators and Belichick could be out as well and they have no heir apparent at QB behind a 41 year old Brady. The Bills and Dolphins are not scaring anyone. Going up against Luck, Mariota, and Watson or Rivers, Carr, and Smith/Mahomes or Big Ben and Flacco looks far worse than a division that could very well have 3 new QBs after next year.

 

If he is Transition Tagged and it comes down to Redskins vs Browns vs Jets I'd bet my signature that we land Cousins.

[joewilly12]

37 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

edit: this thread wasn’t purely Kirk Cousins based. This thread stems from JW12 and Phil comparing Neil O’Donnell situation to Cousins situation. Someone asked me if I wanted to type up a thread of how they differ. I gladly accepted. Shut up already

Oh no you don't!!!!!!!

This could have been posted in any Kirk Cousins thread on this board. 

Hey Kirk Cousins just took a sh*t should we start a thread?  Hey Kirk Cousins got laid should we start a thread?  

I never compared Kirk Cousins to Neal O'Donnell the player......I compared the overall scenario older free agents and the Jets signing them. 

You are grand standing. 

END OF STORY.

[Patriot Killa]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Oh no you don't!!!!!!!

You sound like my mom when her dog sh*ts on the rug too many times and she’s visibly fed up.

[TnT]

41 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

First ever year as a full time starter 68.7% completion percentage.

Debunking overload.

[joewilly12]

@Patriot Killa

[Patriot Killa]

9 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

@Patriot Killa

He’s staring your future happiness in the eyes right now, while he’s biting his lip. He was born to relive our agony, man.

[JetFaninMI]

7 hours ago, Pcola said:

I meant 93-95, sorry about that.  And I think where we are not on the same page is that O’Donnell was literally one of Pitt’s worst players where as Cousins is hands down the best player the Redskins have had in a very long time.  

I agree that Cousins wouldn’t be the optimum choice for us at QB because of his age, contract demands, and lack of playoff success...

but what choice do the Jets have?  Are there any guarantees with this draft?  Not talking about QBs being successful, I’m talking about the Jets being able to get a QB that has a chance.

Its not like we are picking in the top 2.  And unfortunately, the draft is after free agency opens. So unless we can get Cle or NYG to trade picks with us prior to early March, the team has no choice but to at least kick the tires on Cousins.  

An organization cannot go this long with one year rental after one year rental with out cleaning house and starting over.  If McCown is brought back (because that’s what we do) and we don’t come out of the draft with either Darnold or Rosen, we are going to be in the market for another GM/HC next January.

This is their fourth offseason.  There are no more excuses.

 

 

 

There are no guarantees PERIOD. Cousins could easily flame out in NY like so many other before him. So could the QB they draft. The question is do you really want to pay 25-30 mil per over a considerable amount of time to find that out? Or would you rather the drafted QB on a smaller contract that allows them to sign other FA's and remain attractive to perspective players in the future? I get the frustration believe me. The last good QB I saw play for this team won them a Super Bowl. Since then? Bunch of one year wonders and guys who had no business being under Center. Yeah there were flashes but it has been so long since this franchise had stellar consistent play at the QB position that we have forgotten what that looks like.

I figure the only way that happens is you grow and shape that QB from the beginning. Maybe he's out there in this draft maybe not. You have to keep trying though and if the Jets can't get their guy this year you keep drafting one until you find him. Its the only way to build a steady consistent winner. Time to nut up or shut up Macc and give us a friggin QB.

[Mogglez]

On 1/14/2018 at 9:11 PM, SAR I said:

Yeah, because Chaz Schillens, Clyde Gates, and Stephen Hill were Jets immortals. 

SAR I

 

On 1/14/2018 at 9:50 PM, SAR I said:

Mark didn't play defense and they couldn't hold a lead late in a game if their lives depended on it. In fact, Mark carried the defense in the 2010 season on 5 separate occasions, not the other way around. His fourth quarter heroics in leading the Jets to 5 epic comeback's against the Texans, Lions, Broncos, Browns, and Steelers turned a forgettable 6-10 season into a memorable 11-5 campaign. 

As for the offense, Vinny Testaverde and Chad Pennington had the benefit of Hall of Fame players like Curtis Martin and Kevin Mawae as well as Ring Of Honor caliber wide receivers like Wayne Chrebet and Keyshawn Johnson.  Mark Sanchez was given a pile of retreads like Plaxico Burress, Thomas Jones, LaDainian Tomlinson, and a disgruntled Santonio Holmes along with draft busts at WR and TE.

Like a typical Jet fan still under the spell of the Jedi mind tricks of Rex Ryan, you glorify the defense, you overrate the ground game, and you scapegoat the quarterback. You think you would've learned by now. 

SAR I

 

11 hours ago, SAR I said:

Four things:

Injured throwing shoulder:  Never the same after surgery.

Time away from the game:  Missed an entire year, then made a backup getting very limited reps.

Mind-fu**** by coaching staff:  These days, more important than physical gifts is the mental part of the game and I defy anyone who has gone from Office Rock Star status to Hated By The Boss status to tell me how that fall from grace doesn't affect someone very deeply.

OC merry go round:  Schottenheimer (2 seasons), Sporano (1 season), Philadelphia (1), Dallas (1), Chicago (1).  That's 5 offenses to learn in 8 years, it's 4 different offenses to learn in the 4 years since leaving the Jets.

If someone wanted to write a book on how to find and screw up a top NFL quarterback prospect, the Jets would be the case study.  You had the wrong head coach at the very moment you finally found a decent young QB in the draft.  If you had an offensive minded head coach you might have made something out of Mark Sanchez.  He showed enough in his first two seasons to be owed more than he got.  To me, it's the most tragic moment in your team's history since Joe Namath decided to go water skiing and blowing both his achilles tendons the year after he missed an entire season due to a knee injury.

SAR I

[BigO]

On 1/14/2018 at 11:38 PM, SenorGato said:

The only 90’s O’Donnell I acknowledge:

Don’t worry your secret is safe here. ?

[BigO]

11 hours ago, SAR I said:

Kirk Cousins has made $46,633,295 between 2012 and 2017 and drives a dented GMC Savana passenger van with more than 100,000 miles on it.

Doesn't sound like the type of guy interested in a cash-grab.  Sounds like the type of guy who would want to find a great team ready to win now as a 30 year old entering the 2018 season.  Jacksonville feels like a very attractive landing spot for any free agent QB.  Arizona perhaps too.  Miami?  Why not?  The Jets can't attract Grade A free agents, not now, not with this head coach, not with this OL.  Soon, but not now.

SAR I

 

Cousins would be a fool to come here. He doesn’t strike me as a fool. He’s a cool, collected, smart kid whose extremely confident and savy. He’s in prime position to pick his spot. The Browns followed by the Jets would be his least desirable destinations. Anybody who thinks he’d sign with the Jets is whistling Dixie.....and wasting mental energy. Get over it Jetsies,  he's signing with the Broncos. 

[jetspenguin]

On 1/15/2018 at 9:11 AM, Patriot Killa said:

You aren’t bright if that’s what you got out of this. Do you fail to recognize the team’s pieces moving around him, losing lineman, wide outs and having them replaced with players who can’t produce at all yet he is still completing close to a 65/68% clip EVERY year? Don’t be ignorant you are better than what you just replied with.

Wait, you just called me not too bright and ignorant? Wow that is funny youngin......

This is a nice write up but the fact is that it did go down every year he was a starter. I was half kidding but that doesnt change the facts. He isnt trending upwards, like many other have said he has given no indication that he can take a team to the playoff and lots of QB's can fall back on the excuse of not having a good enough team around him to "help him".

Don't get beside yourself because I chose not to repeat in detail what have been and still are valid criticism's of Cousin's performance/history. I pointed out the first obvious sign of a concern, don't delude yourself into thinking that is ALL I saw. I just didnt want to sit and go poke holes in your whole post because it has some good point. 

Dont be so sensitive. 

[Philc1]

On 1/15/2018 at 6:28 PM, Patriot Killa said:

Which is saying an awful lot. He threw 14 touchdowns to 6 picks though. Did about as well as ODonnells best year.

Congratulations you know how to google the players name and yahoo stats!

[Patriot Killa]

7 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Congratulations you know how to google the players name and yahoo stats!

You are so antagonizing and ignorant. I’ve watched pretty much every Jet QB play to an extensive point one way or another, whether that be game film on YouTube or other outlets. Can you leave me alone? Your belittlement and retarded ass posts are really redundant and pointless. Do you have a small d*ck or something? Do you feel a need to make up for some sort of insecurity by insulting my intelligence and question my validity on every post? You need something better to do on here besides hitting the quote button on my name and coming at me sideways in the snarky ass smug manner that you do. Block me if you don’t like what I post. You are the only one on here that just doesn’t get it. You have a thick skull.

[Patriot Killa]

5 hours ago, jetspenguin said:

Wait, you just called me not too bright and ignorant? Wow that is funny youngin......

This is a nice write up but the fact is that it did go down every year he was a starter. I was half kidding but that doesnt change the facts. He isnt trending upwards, like many other have said he has given no indication that he can take a team to the playoff and lots of QB's can fall back on the excuse of not having a good enough team around him to "help him".

Don't get beside yourself because I chose not to repeat in detail what have been and still are valid criticism's of Cousin's performance/history. I pointed out the first obvious sign of a concern, don't delude yourself into thinking that is ALL I saw. I just didnt want to sit and go poke holes in your whole post because it has some good point. 

Dont be so sensitive. 

I felt like you were only bringing that up because that was the only thing you got out of it. You should of just said this to begin with.? 

sorry, @jetspenguin hope we are good bro.

[bla bla bla]

23 hours ago, JetFaninMI said:

There are no guarantees PERIOD. Cousins could easily flame out in NY like so many other before him. So could the QB they draft. The question is do you really want to pay 25-30 mil per over a considerable amount of time to find that out? Or would you rather the drafted QB on a smaller contract that allows them to sign other FA's and remain attractive to perspective players in the future? I get the frustration believe me. The last good QB I saw play for this team won them a Super Bowl. Since then? Bunch of one year wonders and guys who had no business being under Center. Yeah there were flashes but it has been so long since this franchise had stellar consistent play at the QB position that we have forgotten what that looks like.

I figure the only way that happens is you grow and shape that QB from the beginning. Maybe he's out there in this draft maybe not. You have to keep trying though and if the Jets can't get their guy this year you keep drafting one until you find him. Its the only way to build a steady consistent winner. Time to nut up or shut up Macc and give us a friggin QB.

Would you be okay if Cousins was making 20M? (12% of our cap or 16th highest paid QB). If year 1 left us with $71M in cap space (4th overall in the NFL) to sign FAs this offseason and then say we had $45M in 2019 for FAs, do you think that is enough money to add FAs? Especially taking into account we won't need to resign any major FAs from our current roster until 2020.

Would you be willing to concede that paying him like the 16th highest paid QB is fair? And do you think $71M and $45M is enough to add talent over the next 2 years. Keep in mind we'd have 2 drafts in there as well.

[JetFaninMI]

1 minute ago, bla bla bla said:

Would you be okay if Cousins was making 20M? (12% of our cap or 16th highest paid QB). If year 1 left us with $71M in cap space (4th overall in the NFL) to sign FAs this offseason and then say we had $45M in 2019 for FAs, do you think that is enough money to add FAs? Especially taking into account we won't need to resign any major FAs from our current roster until 2020.

Would you be willing to concede that paying him like the 16th highest paid QB is fair? And do you think $71M and $45M is enough to add talent over the next 2 years. Keep in mind we'd have 2 drafts in there as well.

NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. You really think Cousins will take a 4mil pay cut?

[bla bla bla]

31 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. You really think Cousins will take a 4mil pay cut?

Just a hypothetical, is that something you'd sign up for?