Why don’t we want one of the big 3?

[SR24]

22 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

Who plays CB? There is no depth at the position. You really think in the passing league this has become that now neglecting that position is wise? No. You can still get an EDGE later in the first and then use the acquired picks to address other positions with them.

Who are we trading with? You’re confident in giving Mac More picks? What happens if we trade down and Mac whiffs on the picks like he’s done repeatedly outside the top 6 picks? Take the surer thing and move on. We can’t fix the whole team in this draft but adding a player who will help pressure opposing qbs and adding late OL help is a good start. I’m open to trading back if the value is right but im not taking less value just so we can justify taking people that play offense and a CB. 

[section314]

5 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Sweat’s draft stock is sinking like titanic due to his heart issue

 

Burns is a 4-3 DE in a 3-4 Olb body 

Heard on Sirius yesterday that many teams cleared him.

[CanadaSteve]

5 hours ago, Philc1 said:

I think Bosa is a 49er.  If he’s there at 3 absolutely snatch him up

IF Kyler Murray does not go #1, then someone might offer 49ers a boatload to move up.  Lynch proved in year one he will move down if he has the chance and gets a great deal.

[Philc1]

3 minutes ago, section314 said:

Just posted think he has been cleared by many teams.

He’s cleared for now but what about a couple years from now?

[SR24]

32 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Not only that our defense was really bad last year despite having the 5th easiest strength of schedule

 

When Matt Barkley coming off the street can score on the jets defense At will they might need a player 

Yep I’m snagging Bosa/Quinnen at 3 unless we get a haul

[Philc1]

8 minutes ago, SR24 said:

Who are we trading with? You’re confident in giving Mac More picks? What happens if we trade down and Mac whiffs on the picks like he’s done repeatedly outside the top 6 picks? Take the surer thing and move on. We can’t fix the whole team in this draft but adding a player who will help pressure opposing qbs and adding late OL help is a good start. I’m open to trading back if the value is right but im not taking less value just so we can justify taking people that play offense and a CB. 

What you don’t think Macagnan has shown himself to be a great talent evaluator?

[SR24]

9 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

What you don’t think Macagnan has shown himself to be a great talent evaluator?

Not enough to take less value for the pick! 

[choon328]

47 minutes ago, RobR said:

Dude just stop, you're making yourself look foolish. How many players in college make first team all american every single year they played? That's some rarefied air right there. 

He's also the most decorated player in this draft when it comes to awards. I mean the guy also won the Outland trophy as a true sophomore and you're saying he wasn't dominant. LOL

Lol, awards in College mean nothing when a player is being evaluated for pro potential. For instance, in an evaluation, being a Captain means much more than winning the Outland trophy. You can tell me how many awards he's won all day and it will have no bearing on a scouting report. Tell me what type of man he is, how hard he works, do his teammates look at him as a leader etc. Those are the things that matter beyond the film. And there are some severe red flags about those questions beyond the film with the way he handled last season.

Now, had he played every game last year he would've averaged 18-20 tfl per year and  4.5 sacks per year over his career. His best year was his freshman year which is not a good thing. How do you transfer those stats if he played at Clemson instead of Houston? You're probably talking 10-12 tfl and 2-3 sacks. Add in some of the personal question marks regarding last year and does that still warrant top 5 draft status? Top 10? Top 20? 

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

1 minute ago, choon328 said:

Lol, awards in College mean nothing when a player is being evaluated for pro potential. For instance, in an evaluation, being a Captain means much more than winning the Outland trophy. You can tell me how many awards he's won all day and it will have no bearing on a scouting report. Tell me what type of man he is, how hard he works, do his teammates look at him as a leader etc. Those are the things that matter beyond the film. 

Now, had he played every game last year he would've averaged 18-20 tfl per year and  4.5 sacks per year over his career. His best year was his freshman year which is not a good thing. How do you transfer those stats if he played at Clemson instead of Houston? You're probably talking 10-12 tfl and 2-3 sacks. Does that still warrant top 5 draft status? Top 10? I don't know.

Then stop posting.

[GreenFish]

45 minutes ago, section314 said:

Who said anything about trading down? I am talking about staying at #3 and taking an edge guy that is going to have a higher ceiling than Clark. You stated that the Jets hope that Bosa/Allen could become Clark. I would aim higher, somebody who can wreck a game, like Von Miller or Mack. In my humble opinion, that would be either Sweat or Burns.

I’m right there with you when it comes to Burns. My top edge in this draft. Based on what it seems most Jets fans want, our fanbase will implode if we go Burns at #3. I’d be pumped.

[choon328]

4 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

Then stop posting.

Shouldn't you be googling scouting reports and passing them off as your own thoughts?

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

Just now, choon328 said:

Shouldn't you be googling scouting reports and passing them off as your own thoughts?

Probably not. I mean it doesn't seem to be working all that well for you.

[choon328]

Just now, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

Probably not. I mean it doesn't seem to be working all that well for you.

I use my own thoughts and opinions. I don't steal other people's thoughts and make pretend their my opinions like you do. 

[RobR]

16 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Lol, awards in College mean nothing when a player is being evaluated for pro potential. For instance, in an evaluation, being a Captain means much more than winning the Outland trophy. You can tell me how many awards he's won all day and it will have no bearing on a scouting report. Tell me what type of man he is, how hard he works, do his teammates look at him as a leader etc. Those are the things that matter beyond the film. And there are some severe red flags about those questions beyond the film with the way he handled last season.

Now, had he played every game last year he would've averaged 18-20 tfl per year and  4.5 sacks per year over his career. His best year was his freshman year which is not a good thing. How do you transfer those stats if he played at Clemson instead of Houston? You're probably talking 10-12 tfl and 2-3 sacks. Add in some of the personal question marks regarding last year and does that still warrant top 5 draft status? Top 10? Top 20? 

You said he wasn't dominant in college. You were wrong.

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

1 minute ago, choon328 said:

I use my own thoughts and opinions. I don't steal other people's thoughts and make pretend their my opinions like you do. 

If we're doing the I'm rubber you're glue thing I'd toss in a mention of my execrable grammar. It's not my fault that people are saying stuff now that I've been saying for three months. That Frog guy is gonna be thrilled that he's got an audience for his little time machine rap tho. You guys should party 

[choon328]

4 minutes ago, RobR said:

You said he wasn't dominant in college. You were wrong.

Nathan Shepherd was dominant in College. It's all about the quality of the competition. He might as well have played for Stony Brook.

[RobR]

5 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Nathan Shepherd was dominant in College. It's all about the quality of the competition. He might as well have played for Stony Brook.

Last time I checked Nathan Shepherd wasn't a three time first team all american and I think his trophy case might be missing an Outland Trophy.

You're the fool that said Oliver wasn't dominant in college. You're still wrong. No need to change the whole argument saying that many All Americans don't do well in the NFL.....everyone knows that.  

[Doggin94it]

6 hours ago, Philc1 said:

We passed on Dan Marino and Payton Manning for Kenny O’Brien and James Farrior

 

Now Mac is trying to trade down to draft a Guard

 

What a joke

Remember when you were convince that Baker Mayfield was going to be a terrible NFL quarterback? Maybe you should give it a few years before taking strong stands on NFL Draft decisions again?

[RobR]

1 hour ago, choon328 said:

What's concerning is his non dominance at a smallish college program. That's the real concern.

Here you go Choon, your words not mine.

[choon328]

11 minutes ago, RobR said:

Here you go Choon, your words not mine.

Do you think 5 sacks at a small school against sub par competition is dominant? I don't.  You're not taking a guy top 5 for his ability to get tfl's. The Jets already have a guy like that in Leo.

He's a 270-275 lb DT. He's plays like a power forward in a small forward body. That's ok for College, especially a small D1 program, but he'll get eaten up inside against NFL lineman.

 

[sec101row23]

14 minutes ago, RobR said:

Last time I checked Nathan Shepherd wasn't a three time first team all american and I think his trophy case might be missing an Outland Trophy.

You're the fool that said Oliver wasn't dominant in college. You're still wrong. No need to change the whole argument saying that many All Americans don't do well in the NFL.....everyone knows that.  

I must have missed the game Nathan Shepherd beat Oklahoma.   

[choon328]

5 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

I must have missed the game Nathan Shepherd beat Oklahoma.   

Go check what Oliver did against big College teams the last 2 years and get back to me. This dude is living off of 1 game against Oklahoma 3 years ago.

I checked for you. 2 games against Arizona and Texas Tech each. 4 total tfl and no sacks. Dominant!

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

4 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

I must have missed the game Nathan Shepherd beat Oklahoma.   

Houston is exactly the same as 7-on-7 against Canadian middle school kids. No one denies this.

[sec101row23]

6 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Go check what Oliver did against big College teams the last 2 years and get back to me. This dude is living off of 1 game against Oklahoma 3 years ago.

I checked for you. 2 games against Arizona and Texas Tech each. 4 total tfl and no sacks. Dominant!

Stats, stats, more stats.  I see you’ve done your homework.  Watch a game, not a stat sheet.  

Also, it’s telling that you think Arizona is a “big” college team....Lol

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

1 minute ago, sec101row23 said:

Stats, stats, more stats.  I see you’ve done your homework.  

Homework is for queers and sailors. Only adjectives and butt feelings count as original thoughts.

[sec101row23]

Just now, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

Homework is for queers and sailors. Only adjectives and butt feelings count as original thoughts.

All he does is spout stat lines.  

[JetFaninMI]

1 hour ago, SR24 said:

Who are we trading with? You’re confident in giving Mac More picks? What happens if we trade down and Mac whiffs on the picks like he’s done repeatedly outside the top 6 picks? Take the surer thing and move on. We can’t fix the whole team in this draft but adding a player who will help pressure opposing qbs and adding late OL help is a good start. I’m open to trading back if the value is right but im not taking less value just so we can justify taking people that play offense and a CB. 

No I'm not confident that Macc will be able to trade the pick. There is no guarantee that ANY player drafted at ANY pick will have an impact. Even the highly rated ones.

Who is saying to take less value for the pick anyway? If the deal isn't right you don't make it.

 No one thinks they will be able to "fix" all the holes on this team in this years draft but it only makes sense to pick up as many picks if you can if you are able. If the Jets can trade the pick and stay in the top 10 plus add a 2nd and maybe a 1st rounder next year you won't sign on for that? I don't see the downside of that.

[JetFaninMI]

1 hour ago, Philc1 said:

He was running for his life because our wide receivers were horrible, injured and never got open so Sam had to hold onto the ball and try to run around and improvise 

 

Wr was a bigger weakness than OL

We disagree.

I am not happy with the WR's we have but to say that the OL played no part in the Jets offensive woe's last season is just plain wrong.

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

3 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

All he does is spout stat lines.  

Not true. He's also getting nine kinds of indignant about the coat.

[JetFaninMI]

1 hour ago, Philc1 said:

Pass rush can nullify even mobile qbs

 

And it’s the only way to actually beat Tom Brady

Old school thinking there.

You really want to gear your team around beating a a guy who is probably on the way out? What about Mahomes? Jackson? Brady can't take a hit true but you have to look at the big picture.

[SR24]

Just now, JetFaninMI said:

No I'm not confident that Macc will be able to trade the pick. There is no guarantee that ANY player drafted at ANY pick will have an impact. Even the highly rated ones.

Who is saying to take less value for the pick anyway? If the deal isn't right you don't make it.

 No one thinks they will be able to "fix" all the holes on this team in this years draft but it only makes sense to pick up as many picks if you can if you are able. If the Jets can trade the pick and stay in the top 10 plus add a 2nd and maybe a 1st rounder next year you won't sign on for that? I don't see the downside of that.

Who in the top ten is going to trade us an extra 1st and 2nd to move up?? People on here don't want Oliver/Quinnen for the simple fact that they play a position we've spent a lot of draft capital on but are still weak in. IMO the only 2 teams that we have a chance at trading with are CIN and WAS both are out of the T10 and this isn't a very deep draft as far as T1 talent goes. I read today that half the people drafted in RND1 will likely have 2nd round grades. This isn't the draft to trade down in unless you get a massive haul. WAS would have to come up with 2 1st rounders 2 2nds and more picks. Unless that happens I'm staying at 3 and picking from Bosa/Allen/Oliver/Quinnen

[RobR]

18 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Do you think 5 sacks at a small school against sub par competition is dominant? I don't.  You're not taking a guy top 5 for his ability to get tfl's. The Jets already have a guy like that in Leo.

He's a 270-275 lb DT. He's plays like a power forward in a small forward body. That's ok for College, especially a small D1 program, but he'll get eaten up inside against NFL lineman.

 

How hard is it for you to just admit you were wrong or misspoke?

I'll go on record here and say that every single player that won an Outland Trophy was dominant in college. Every player that garners a first team All American was dominant in college, never mind someone that won three. He also won defensive conference player of the year, and the Bill Willis trophy which is given to the best interior lineman in all of college football.

He's also not 270-275lbs like you said. 287 at the combine and 281 at his proday, not that this has anything to do with what you stated. It's either you trolling or spinning.

You can keep going round and round with this.......you're still wrong. 

[choon328]

21 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Stats, stats, more stats.  I see you’ve done your homework.  Watch a game, not a stat sheet.  

Also, it’s telling that you think Arizona is a “big” college team....Lol

Its more telling that it's the 2nd biggest team he played against in the last 2 years. And Arizona is in a power conference so it's considered a major college program. That doesn't mean they're good though. 

I have watched all of his games, he jumps out against weaker competition. Takes plays off. Struggles to beat the double team  thus the lack of sack production. Struggled against major division 1 opponents Arizona and Texas Tech. The majority of the time he's the best player on the field against weaker caliber players. 

If people can discount Josh Allen's sack production in the SEC bc he has 1 move then I can certainly question Oliver's lack of sack production against sub par lineman. That's fair.

Production matters in every level of football. Discounting stats is dumb and just a way to rationalize lack of production. If Oliver only ran an average 40 time this wouldn't even be a discussion.

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

2 minutes ago, choon328 said:

I have watched all of his games

You're obviously lying, but it would honestly be a whole lot worse if you really had watched three years of games and come away without a single thing to say.

[choon328]

5 minutes ago, RobR said:

How hard is it for you to just admit you were wrong or misspoke?

I'll go on record here and say that every single player that won an Outland Trophy was dominant in college. Every player that garners a first team All American was dominant in college, never mind someone that won three. He also won defensive conference player of the year, and the Bill Willis trophy which is given to the best interior lineman in all of college football.

He's also not 270-275lbs like you said. 287 at the combine and 281 at his proday, not that this has anything to do with what you stated. It's either you trolling or spinning.

You can keep going round and round with this.......you're still wrong. 

Many teams and scouts believed his weight in college was 270-275. He gained weight for the combine bc of those question marks. Then lost 6 lbs in less then a month between the combine and his pro day. That's bc being 287 lbs is not natural for him. His playing weight will be closer to 270 then 281.