All Zach Wilson throws vs Jax

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

 

That “nice player” (Marvin Jones) is having a down year, even as an old vet, and he still almost has the combined yardage of both of these guys (Cole and Berrios).  Cole is not good dude.  Him and Gardner connected a bunch of times in garbage time last year and they padded stats.  Call it the Breshad Perriman effect, if you will.  

Lawrence also had the privilege of going against the guys we picked up off the street this week to play for our already depleted and struggling defense.  Honestly, I still love Trevor, but the dude hasn’t thrown a TD since November 28th.  First people told me it was Urban Meyer (after they initially told me Urban was a “winner”).  Then Urban got fired.  If Zach Wilson went an entire month accounting for 0 points this forum would be up in flames.

Cole and Berrios had catch percentages of 64 and 67% playing with garbage last year. The only receiver playing well for the Jets this season is Berrios, because of the itty bitty routes he runs. Wilson is completing 56% of his passes. He’s dragging his receiving corps down, as rookies do. 

[Jetsfan80]

17 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I get it, you didn’t want the Jets to draft him instead of Fields - who also stinks himself, mind you - but you’re being more than a little ridiculous throughout this thread.

It was thrilling watching White and his 1 game + 1 drive career, but no one seriously believes those exact same results would’ve ensued if White attempted only half the passes, further handicapped by not having Moore & Carter starting, whose presence further opened up those 20 throws underneath to Carter & Johnson. 

The team’s #4 and #5 receivers were #1 and #2 today, and the team just runs different plays under those circumstances, as anyone would expect. It’s one thing to whine over not having elite wepponz; it’s another when the only two NFL-level downfield receivers are Berrios & Cole (neither exactly running 20+ yard routes as some matter of routine).

With the team’s top 3 WRs out, he had 193 yards and 2 TDs on 26 dropbacks, not counting a couple obvious drops that weren’t reflections on the one throwing it.

I take for granted a QB isn’t going to have as many passing yards when the team gains 270 yards on the ground plus they lose 1 possession to a KOR TD plus another possession that began on a short field. He had 4 pass attempts until almost halfway through the 2nd quarter ffs, and that second offensive drive ended on a perfect strike his receiver just flat-out dropped.

No serious person is anointing him anything based on today, and on balance his rookie season has sucked, but overall today - including his yards with his feet, which do count - he was fine. Factoring everything, to come away from today’s game with literally nothing but criticism of a rookie QB is saying more about you than the player.

What I’m most concerned about at this stage with a rookie QB - particularly one who’s had a pretty lousy start to his career - is not just standing back there taking stupid sacks (nor the opposite: feeling pressure that isn’t there), and of course his ball placement. He was good on the former concern today. On the latter, one of them on that first attempt to Mims, I’ll assume was the throw, though with Mims you never know where he was actually expected to be; and there was another early dumpoff it looked like he just flat-out missed (though it’s also possible he thought Kroft would keep running and was just trying to lead him). If you’re going to go out of your way to note & count interceptable passes, the same goes for dropped passes & their yards & extended drives which you purposely ignore. Anyway, on the rest of his attempts, the placement on actual pass attempts was good, weak opponent notwithstanding. Never mind 91 rushing yards on 4 broken pass plays.

This is an odd game to wage a multi-front war over it like a Pats fan joining up to troll the fan base. He played fine. 

This is a lot to say Wilson didn’t play good or bad, which is what I stated earlier.

The problem is he’s piling up an awful lot of games where the best you can say is he was “fine”.

Even Darnold had a better rookie season than this, and had a weaker supporting cast over the course of his rookie season than Wilson has.  Is it not relevant to point that out every week when fans try to justify Wilson’s latest pitiful/discouraging/OK game as being a good thing?

Every week lately we’re told “This isn’t the right week to bash Wilson.  He wasn’t the problem.”  Cool.  As if we should be super thrilled he went from throwing 4 picks to throwing for 102 yards while the ground game does all the work.  When is he going to start looking like a solution?

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

This is a lot to say Wilson didn’t play good or bad, which is what I stated earlier.

The problem is he’s piling up an awful lot of games where the best you can say is he was “fine”.

Even Darnold had a better rookie season than this, and had a weaker supporting cast over the course of his rookie season than Wilson has.  Is it not relevant to point that out every week when fans try to justify Wilson’s latest pitiful/discouraging/OK game as being a good thing?

Every week we’re told “This isn’t the right week to bash Wilson.  He wasn’t the problem.”  Cool.  When is he going to start looking like a solution?

Everyone is dying to give this entire team a redshirt year. It’s wild.

[Patriot Killa]

4 hours ago, Butterfield said:

I saw nothing inspiring today.  More eh.  

 

[Hal N of Provo]

4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

This is a lot to say Wilson didn’t play good or bad, which is what I stated earlier.

The problem is he’s piling up an awful lot of games where the best you can say is he was “fine”.

Even Darnold had a better rookie season than this, and had a weaker supporting cast over the course of his rookie season than Wilson has.  Is it not relevant to point that out every week when fans try to justify Wilson’s latest pitiful/discouraging/OK game as being a good thing?

Every week lately we’re told “This isn’t the right week to bash Wilson.  He wasn’t the problem.”  Cool.  As if we should be super thrilled he went from throwing 4 picks to throwing for 102 yards while the ground game does all the work.  When is he going to start looking like a solution?

Nobody drafts a QB for who will have the best rookie season.  You hope for development   

Wilson has only had 5 games with a rating 80 or higher.  But 3 out of the last 4 are in that group.  
 

 

 

[Jetsfan80]

Just now, Patriot Killa said:

 

Zach Wilson finishing with a higher QBR than Joe Burrow today is a fantastic reason to dismiss QBR as a useful metric forever.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Zach Wilson finishing with a higher QBR than Joe Burrow today is a fantastic reason to dismiss QBR as a useful metric forever.

You get extra points for completing TDs to backup tackles

[Patriot Killa]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Zach Wilson finishing with a higher QBR than Joe Burrow today is a fantastic reason to dismiss QBR as a useful metric forever.

But does it mean Wilson did bad? It doesn’t.

[Hal N of Provo]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Zach Wilson finishing with a higher QBR than Joe Burrow today is a fantastic reason to dismiss QBR as a useful metric forever.

 

 

[ryu79]

4 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

Nobody drafts a QB for who will have the best rookie season.  You hope for development   

Wilson has only had 5 games with a rating 80 or higher.  But 3 out of the last 4 are in that group.  
 

 

 

Amazing how Bellicheck tends to crush our young QBs with games that majorly distort their stats. 

I remember early on with Rex if you saw a rookie coming up in the schedule we were going to drive them nuts. More recently, doesn't matter who it is, for years we just make them all look great...

[ryu79]

In totally random observation not associated with today's game, the new season of Letterkenny just dropped and I realized Wilson is the spitting image of Stewart without his wig...

[Hal N of Provo]

1 minute ago, ryu79 said:

Amazing how Bellicheck tends to crush our young QBs with games that majorly distort their stats. 

I remember early on with Rex if you saw a rookie coming up in the schedule we were going to drive them nuts. More recently, doesn't matter who it is, for years we just make them all look great...

I watched that all throw video the other day.   Zach already looks like a new QB.
 

Hopefully it’s a different story next season.  

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

You get extra points for completing TDs to backup tackles

It’s kind of funny it wasn’t designed though lol.  

[Patriot Killa]

I like Twitter so much better than JetNation.
 

The positivity is much more lively than dealing with all the football masters here.

[Mogglez]

34 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Cole and Berrios had catch percentages of 64 and 67% playing with garbage last year. The only receiver playing well for the Jets this season is Berrios, because of the itty bitty routes he runs. Wilson is completing 56% of his passes. He’s dragging his receiving corps down, as rookies do. 

Never said that he wasn’t.  That being said, Zach Wilson isn’t causing Keelan Cole to drop balls, run the wrong routes, or fail to gain any bit of separation.  That’s a Keelan Cole issue.

Finally, for what it’s worth, Cole’s best game was the Tennessee game, a game that Zach started.  What do you think is more likely:  Cole is an inconsistent, but still decent decent 4th receiver, who can do some stuff when he’s not the main target and all eyes aren’t on him, or that he’s a potential stud being held back by the QB?  I know my answer, and it’s the same answer every single time this question is posed about a WR.  There are plenty of Keelan Cole’s in this league.  None of them should be starters.  Marvin Jones and Keelan Cole are worlds apart.

[Hal N of Provo]

Just now, Patriot Killa said:

I like Twitter so much better than JetNation.
 

The positivity is much more lively than dealing with all the football masters here.

Reddit game thread was all about the game and seemed fair and positive throughout as well.  

[Jetsfan80]

10 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

But does it mean Wilson did bad? It doesn’t.

It doesn’t mean anything.  QBR is useless.  

[Hal N of Provo]

3 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Never said that he wasn’t.  That being said, Zach Wilson isn’t causing Keelan Cole to drop balls, run the wrong routes, or fail to gain any bit of separation.  That’s a Keelan Cole issue.

Finally, for what it’s worth, Cole’s best game was the Tennessee game, a game that Zach started.  What do you think is more likely:  Cole is an inconsistent, but still decent decent 4th receiver, who can do some stuff when he’s not the main target and all eyes aren’t on him, or that he’s a potential stud being held back by the QB?  I know my answer, and it’s the same answer every single time.  There are plenty of Keelan Cole’s in this league.  None of them should be starters.

I hope Cole is gone next season.  

[Sperm Edwards]

3 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Cole and Berrios had catch percentages of 64 and 67% playing with garbage last year. The only receiver playing well for the Jets this season is Berrios, because of the itty bitty routes he runs. Wilson is completing 56% of his passes. He’s dragging his receiving corps down, as rookies do. 

Wilson’s only completing 56% to those two? Seems passes their way were 5/5 and 2/2 respectively. Plus adding another 1.5% to Cole’s percentage last year is weak. Berrios has caught 17 of the last 22 (77%) thrown his way by Wilson since those first 3 career games ended. Not a lot of attempts, but hard to find fault with results in excess of 3/4 completions. 

Today had one throwaway in the grasp; plus 0/2 to Mims, who’s just terrible; one brutal 1st down drop by Jeff Smith on 3rd & 9; one that bounced off Kroft’s hands; and I forget the others offhand.

This wasn’t a HOF QB performance or anything, but today wasn’t another OMG our QB is the worst thing ever game either. Unfortunately I can’t say that for all his other games, when people were mocking up Zachenberg jerseys with good reason. 

Impossible to know if his first x-number of games would’ve been just as bad if he was on the sideline for the first month or two, but what’s done is done. I’m not yet convinced he’ll be a consistently good passer, as much as I’d like it to happen. He has the tools to do so, but so do plenty of QBs who don’t have it upstairs and never amount to anything. 

I’m still in fingers-crossed mode with him. They’re not drafting anyone else next year, but I’m still hoping there’s a serious veteran option. Hopefully he takes a huge leap forward, since he could take a huge leap forward statistically and still not be a pro bowler.

[Mogglez]

1 minute ago, Hal N of Provo said:

I hope Cole is gone next season.  

I’d keep him for depth, but I want at least one big time WR brought in, whether it be by trade, FA, or the draft.

[Hal N of Provo]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

It doesn’t mean anything.  QBR is useless.  

Agree.   QBR is trash.  

QB rating was also good.  Tape was also good.  Runs were awesome.  

[Green Ghost]

12 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I like Twitter so much better than JetNation.
 

The positivity is much more lively than dealing with all the football masters here.

It’s pretty bad when a rookie QB playing with half a roster gets trashed after a win, but here we are.

Im as critical as anyone with the kid, but today’s not the day. He played pretty well, why can’t people admit it and take the win?

[Patriot Killa]

6 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

Reddit game thread was all about the game and seemed fair and positive throughout as well.  

I’ve been an every day poster here since 2013. 8 years ago.

lol a lot of topics have worn on me thru out the years. It’s the same game.

Just a different QB.

[Patriot Killa]

5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

It doesn’t mean anything.  QBR is useless.  

Okay bro u win

[Patriot Killa]

2 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

It’s pretty bad when a rookie QB playing with half a roster gets trashed after a win, but here we are.

Im as critical as anyone with the kid, but today’s not the day. 

We experienced the same Darnold rookie season on the same board. Darnold couldn’t of done what Wilson just did. Not the decisions he made, not the big runs, not 26 points and not a W.

[T0mShane]

7 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Never said that he wasn’t.  That being said, Zach Wilson isn’t causing Keelan Cole to drop balls, run the wrong routes, or fail to gain any bit of separation.  That’s a Keelan Cole issue.

Finally, for what it’s worth, Cole’s best game was the Tennessee game, a game that Zach started.  What do you think is more likely:  Cole is an inconsistent, but still decent decent 4th receiver, who can do some stuff when he’s not the main target, or that he’s a potential stud being held back by the QB?  I know my answer, and it’s the same answer every single time.  There are plenty of Keelan Cole’s in this league.  None of them should be starters.

What do you think is more likely: every Jets receiver has coincidentally had a down year all at once or the rookie quarterback who has struggled with accuracy for the far majority of his eleven starts has been a statistical drag on every player assigned to catch those predominantly off-target passes this year? 

[Sperm Edwards]

24 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

This is a lot to say Wilson didn’t play good or bad, which is what I stated earlier.

The problem is he’s piling up an awful lot of games where the best you can say is he was “fine”.

Even Darnold had a better rookie season than this, and had a weaker supporting cast over the course of his rookie season than Wilson has.  Is it not relevant to point that out every week when fans try to justify Wilson’s latest pitiful/discouraging/OK game as being a good thing?

Every week lately we’re told “This isn’t the right week to bash Wilson.  He wasn’t the problem.”  Cool.  As if we should be super thrilled he went from throwing 4 picks to throwing for 102 yards while the ground game does all the work.  When is he going to start looking like a solution?

He played fine; your comments give the impression he was garbage.

Today isn’t his whole rookie season. Today was today. He played with a bunch of backup receivers and a conservative gameplan that got that much more conservative with all the rushing (and defense and special teams) yards.

It’s silly to complain about passing yardage stats. There were ~200 Wilson yards not ~100 Wilson yards, as though those extra ground yards & TD were courtesy of someone else. So, you’re still doing it, like you want to count dropped interceptions but not dropped passes (even when drive-ending) as though he was the cause.

It’s been depressing watching him for most of the season, but today is a silly game to be displaying such venom & seeking out conflict to champion that causes. He was mostly efficient with only backup receivers, he got out of some bad trouble & turned them into big gainers, and they won despite still fielding a terrible defense and the HC+K deleting 7 points outright.

To read your posts after today’s game you’d think he was 9 of 30 with 0 TDs and 3+ turnovers and the Jets lost by 4 TDs.

[T0mShane]

16 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I like Twitter so much better than JetNation.
 

The positivity is much more lively than dealing with all the football masters here.

 

14 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

Reddit game thread was all about the game and seemed fair and positive throughout as well.  

Conversations tend to run smoother when you can pre-select the audience with whom you’re conversing and unfollow the ones you disagree with. 

[Jetsfan80]

17 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I like Twitter so much better than JetNation.
 

The positivity is much more lively than dealing with all the football masters here.

So you want to have piss running down your leg and have people tell you it’s raining?

Its not our fault the product on the field is miserable, even in games we win.  Just make fun of the Jets like the rest of us. It’s more fun that way. 

[Green Ghost]

4 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

We experienced the same Darnold rookie season on the same board. Darnold couldn’t of done what Wilson just did. Not the decisions he made, not the big runs, not 26 points and not a W.

You don’t have to tell me about Darnold…  Remember how frustrated you got with me for bashing him as early as I did?

I was the guy greenbean mentioned as the leader of the anti Sam contingent in his first JN video. ?

[Jetsfan80]

9 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

We experienced the same Darnold rookie season on the same board. Darnold couldn’t of done what Wilson just did. Not the decisions he made, not the big runs, not 26 points and not a W.

Lmao he could and he did, minus the big run.

[Green Ghost]

4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

He played fine; your comments give the impression he was garbage.

Today isn’t his whole rookie season. Today was today. He played with a bunch of backup receivers and a conservative gameplan that got that much more conservative with all the rushing (and defense and special teams) yards.

It’s silly to complain about passing yardage stats. There were ~200 Wilson yards not ~100 Wilson yards, as though those extra ground yards & TD were courtesy of someone else. So, you’re still doing it, like you want to count dropped interceptions but not dropped passes (even when drive-ending) as though he was the cause.

It’s been depressing watching him for most of the season, but today is a silly game to be displaying such venom & seeking out conflict to champion that causes. He was mostly efficient with only backup receivers, he got out of some bad trouble & turned them into big gainers, and they won despite still fielding a terrible defense and the HC+K deleting 7 points outright.

To read your posts after today’s game you’d think he was 9 of 30 with 0 TDs and 3+ turnovers and the Jets lost by 4 TDs.

This.

[Patriot Killa]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

So you want to have piss running down your leg and have people tell you it’s raining?

Its not our fault the product on the field is miserable, even in games we win.  Just make fun of the Jets like the rest of us. It’s more fun that way. 

It wasn’t piss today and he didn’t have a poor game. All I’m sayin. So when I’m feeling pretty good and I waltz on JN per usual and I see this lol… I kinda just let y’all have it because damn.. I don’t share that opinion so idk what to say

[Patriot Killa]

5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

 

Conversations tend to run smoother when you can pre-select the audience with whom you’re conversing and unfollow the ones you disagree with. 

I just don’t have them anymore on here, you guys are wild with it.

[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

He played fine; your comments give the impression he was garbage.

Today isn’t his whole rookie season. Today was today. He played with a bunch of backup receivers and a conservative gameplan that got that much more conservative with all the rushing (and defense and special teams) yards.

It’s silly to complain about passing yardage stats. There were ~200 Wilson yards not ~100 Wilson yards, as though those extra ground yards & TD were courtesy of someone else. So, you’re still doing it, like you want to count dropped interceptions but not dropped passes (even when drive-ending) as though he was the cause.

It’s been depressing watching him for most of the season, but today is a silly game to be displaying such venom & seeking out conflict to champion that causes. He was mostly efficient with only backup receivers, he got out of some bad trouble & turned them into big gainers, and they won despite still fielding a terrible defense and the HC+K deleting 7 points outright.

To read your posts after today’s game you’d think he was 9 of 30 with 0 TDs and 3+ turnovers and the Jets lost by 4 TDs.

If that’s how you’re reading my posts then that sounds like a you problem, sir.  I do think Wilson sucks and today didn’t move the needle in the positive direction.  So the negativity you must be picking up on is of the season-long/big picture variety.

[undertow]

10 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Lmao he could and he did. 

The last 4 games of Darnold's rookie season he was the best QB in the league....It's hard to have conversations with people when they aren't living in reality.  The only way you are seen as not negative around here is if you are blown away by a QB that faced the worst team in the league and threw for 100 yards.  He didn't suck that's the best I got. lol