Albert Breer on Travon Walker and More

[Scoop24]

• Where Georgia’s Travon Walker lands will be interesting. Yes, he’s a freak athlete—in that department, I’ve heard him compared to Myles Garrett (both were 6'5", 272 pounds at the combine, with Walker having run a 4.51 40 to Garrett’s 4.64, and Garrett having jumped 41" to Walker’s 35.5"). Yes, he’s tough, and plays with a strong motor, and has the sort of intangibles all teams look for in draft prospects. Yes, he was part of a generational defense.

So what’s the problem? The tape doesn’t come close to matching the athleticism. He looks lost at times, and what NFL teams will likely want him to do, work as an edge rusher, you don’t really see in his game at Georgia. In that regard, I’ve heard him compared to Vikings star Danielle Hunter, who similarly didn’t fully tap into his potential at LSU.

But here’s the thing—Hunter was a third-round pick, not the first overall pick. And where with Hunter you might be able to point to his struggles in college as a product of the coaching he got, it’d be tough to do that with Walker, given how strong the staff at Georgia, led by Kirby Smart, is, and how many other prospects they’ve pumped out on defense.

In the end, Walker’s a tough one, but also indicative of the class as a whole. Tough to get a read on.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/04/11/maqb-veteran-quarterbacks-helped-by-weak-nfl-draft-class

jets tidbit

https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/04/15/game-plan-mock-first-12-picks-league-rumors

[Greenseed4]

“There’s still a feeling…”

Feelings. 
 

 

 

[jetstream23]

 

[jetstream23]

Thibs and Walker have THE best athletic profiles of the Edge rushers the Jets might consider at #4. But Hutch and Jermaine Johnson seem to be the better/safer overall players.

[Beerfish]

I'll be elated for the young man Walker if he gets picked top 3.

[hmhertz]

Walker makes plays all over the field. He hasn't been

used as a pure edge rusher but his potential is top.

comparisons have been made to Garrett & Hunter.

By body type and speed a better comp the NFL's

REAL seasonal sack record holder, Mark Gastineau

 

[nj meadowlands]

This guy has Jets written all over him.  In a bad way.

[Warfish]

2 minutes ago, nj meadowlands said:

This guy has Jets written all over him.  In a bad way.

Distinct Gholston vibes. 

Workout wonder athletic freak....who isn't that as great an actual football player playing actual football.

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

21 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

 

That would be fantastic. If Texans can then take Hamilton...I will let out the biggest sigh of relief that Walker and Hamilton are off the board. (Which probably means they will both be future HOF's)

[#27TheDominator]

10 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Distinct Gholston vibes. 

Workout wonder athletic freak....who isn't that as great an actual football player playing actual football.

I admit that I liked Gholston coming out, but his "workout wonder" status is way overblown.  First of all, he had production in the Big Ten and second, his workout numbers were not so great.  Everybody knew he was big and fast.  He did nothing surprisingly good at the combine.  Walker is in another world from Gholston as an athlete.  His 3 cone is like two and a half tenths faster.  I get being leery on the prospect, but they do have have similar profiles. 

[Matt39]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I admit that I liked Gholston coming out, but his "workout wonder" status is way overblown.  First of all, he had production in the Big Ten and second, his workout numbers were not so great.  Everybody knew he was big and fast.  He did nothing surprisingly good at the combine.  Walker is in another world from Gholston as an athlete.  His 3 cone is like two and a half tenths faster.  I get being leery on the prospect, but they do have have similar profiles. 

Gholston stunk because he didnt care about football like at all. His combine was fine.

[Warfish]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I admit that I liked Gholston coming out, but his "workout wonder" status is way overblown.  First of all, he had production in the Big Ten and second, his workout numbers were not so great.  Everybody knew he was big and fast.  He did nothing surprisingly good at the combine. 

My memory of the conversations at the time differs from yours.  /shrug.

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Walker is in another world from Gholston as an athlete.  His 3 cone is like two and a half tenths faster.  I get being leery on the prospect, but they do have have similar profiles. 

"The tape doesn’t come close to matching the athleticism. He looks lost at times, and what NFL teams will likely want him to do, work as an edge rusher, you don’t really see in his game at Georgia."

We're not a team in the luxury position to take that kind of risk.  JMO.

[#27TheDominator]

23 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Gholston stunk because he didnt care about football like at all. His combine was fine.

I don't disagree, but Walker's was a bit better than fine.  If I tell my wife her dress looks fine I have to wait 45 minutes for her to change.

23 minutes ago, Warfish said:

My memory of the conversations at the time differs from yours.  /shrug.

"The tape doesn’t come close to matching the athleticism. He looks lost at times, and what NFL teams will likely want him to do, work as an edge rusher, you don’t really see in his game at Georgia."

We're not a team in the luxury position to take that kind of risk.  JMO.

/shrug is about right.  

I don't disagree about Walker.  The thing with a player like Walker is that it will come down to the interviews and coaching staff envisioning how they will use him and being sure they can get that out of him.  I totally get that he is the kind of pick that makes us nervous and that is the stuff we can't really see as much from our end.  It is much easier to gamble with an "athlete" in the 3rd, like Troy Andersen, than to consider playing that game at #4 overall.   

[Bruce Harper]

I wouldn't take Walker in the top ten.  Where's the production?

[Bruce Harper]

22 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

Thibs and Walker have THE best athletic profiles of the Edge rushers the Jets might consider at #4. But Hutch and Jermaine Johnson seem to be the better/safer overall players.

No way I would take Walker over Johnson.  The Combine should be used to confirm opinions of what you've seen on tape.  Not to create myths about guys who didn't produce in college.

[hmhertz]

It was said of Gohlston he played like a balking light switch,

you pull the switch and it takes forever for the light to come on.

vernon lifted weights because he had a body builders heart not a football player's

He was stiff and slow to react. his 4.67 , was really 4.7 build up speed. Walker is a guided

missle whose play speed looks 4.5 or better. He makes plays all over the field his

3 cone time suggest good bend. He  wasn't used as a rusher because Georgia plan

was to use other and use his speed in pursuit. With his speed, bend, strength and 35 1/2'' arms, demonstrated effort. He will make plays unlike Gohlston the statue and that

lazy slug, Quinnen Williams

 

[jetstream23]

I still prefer Jermaine Johnson over Walker.

Depending on what the Jets do at #4, if they're looking Edge at #10 I'm coming around to being okay with either Johnson or Karlaftis.

Karlaftis seems like the odd guy out this past month.  Maybe he's getting pushed down the board because he has slightly short arms, maybe it's because he didn't do some of the speed drills at the Combine.  But he's still a young guy and I'm getting more convinced that the only reason he's "apparently" sliding down the board is because of guys like Travon Walker ascending due to some great testing scores.

Draft "experts" who had Karlaftis as a Top 8 guy in January now suddenly have him in the 15-20 area.  I wouldn't take him at #4 but I'm increasingly going back to the original assessments and starting to think he'd be a good pick at #10 if 4 or 5 Edge rushers are already gone and the Jets didn't taken one at #4.

[T0mShane]

17 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Gholston stunk because he didnt care about football like at all. His combine was fine.

sh*tty three cone. Walker has the three cone of a 189 lb CB. 

[BurnleyJet]

2 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I still prefer Jermaine Johnson over Walker.

Depending on what the Jets do at #4, if they're looking Edge at #10 I'm coming around to being okay with either Johnson or Karlaftis.

Karlaftis seems like the odd guy out this past month.  Maybe he's getting pushed down the board because he has slightly short arms, maybe it's because he didn't do some of the speed drills at the Combine.  But he's still a young guy and I'm getting more convinced that the only reason he's "apparently" sliding down the board is because of guys like Travon Walker ascending due to some great testing scores.

Draft "experts" who had Karlaftis as a Top 8 guy in January now suddenly have him in the 15-20 area.  I wouldn't take him at #4 but I'm increasingly going back to the original assessments and starting to think he'd be a good pick at #10 if 4 or 5 Edge rushers are already gone and the Jets didn't taken one at #4.

I’m dream is we get Sauce at 4 and Johnson at 10.

[jetstream23]

9 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

I’m dream is we get Sauce at 4 and Johnson at 10.

That would be Saleh's wet dream for sure! lol

Hey, if we're trying to slow down opposing offenses then there's nothing like getting our DLine in Tua's face as Sauce tries to stay close to Tyreek Hill down the field.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

On 4/17/2022 at 11:46 AM, jetstream23 said:

Thibs and Walker have THE best athletic profiles of the Edge rushers the Jets might consider at #4. But Hutch and Jermaine Johnson seem to be the better/safer overall players.

Hutch outperformed Thibs on the athletic drills that matter (3 cone, shuttle, vert) , not sure where that assertion is coming from in comparing those guys in terms of athleticism. If anything, Thibs's biggest question mark is the bad agility scores and skipping the vert, which is basically questioning his athletic ability as an edge player.

Jermaine Johnson also basically dipped on his agility drills, so I'd hardly call him a safe player personally.

[derp]

12 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I still prefer Jermaine Johnson over Walker.

Depending on what the Jets do at #4, if they're looking Edge at #10 I'm coming around to being okay with either Johnson or Karlaftis.

Karlaftis seems like the odd guy out this past month.  Maybe he's getting pushed down the board because he has slightly short arms, maybe it's because he didn't do some of the speed drills at the Combine.  But he's still a young guy and I'm getting more convinced that the only reason he's "apparently" sliding down the board is because of guys like Travon Walker ascending due to some great testing scores.

Draft "experts" who had Karlaftis as a Top 8 guy in January now suddenly have him in the 15-20 area.  I wouldn't take him at #4 but I'm increasingly going back to the original assessments and starting to think he'd be a good pick at #10 if 4 or 5 Edge rushers are already gone and the Jets didn't taken one at #4.

I don't think anybody off of JN had Karlaftis in the top 8 in January. He's been in the teens for months.

[jetstream23]

7 minutes ago, derp said:

I don't think anybody off of JN had Karlaftis in the top 8 in January. He's been in the teens for months.

 

False.  He was Top 10 almost everywhere.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2022-nfl-mock-draft-houston-texans-notre-dame-safety-kyle-hamilton-desmond-ridder-pick-9-denver-broncos

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/jets/news/new-york-jets-pick-george-karlaftis-treylon-burks-first-round-mock-draft

 

[derp]

3 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

 

False.  He was Top 10 almost everywhere.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2022-nfl-mock-draft-houston-texans-notre-dame-safety-kyle-hamilton-desmond-ridder-pick-9-denver-broncos

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/jets/news/new-york-jets-pick-george-karlaftis-treylon-burks-first-round-mock-draft

 

Those are mocks, not rankings, SI is goofy, and PFF is always wonky as well. I suppose I was too broad with my comment but the more traditional consensus - Jeremiah, Brugler, Kiper, McShay had all moved him outside the top ten somewhere around January if not earlier.

[jetstream23]

15 minutes ago, derp said:

Those are mocks, not rankings, SI is goofy, and PFF is always wonky as well. I suppose I was too broad with my comment but the more traditional consensus - Jeremiah, Brugler, Kiper, McShay had all moved him outside the top ten somewhere around January if not earlier.

Fair point regarding mocks vs. rankings.  It's all subjective anyway.  But it's still crazy how some guys can launch up a Draft board by 10 places in Round 1 while another drops 10 spots simply after some "Underwear Olympics" at the Combine or Pro Days.  I might expect that to happen to Day 3 type guys who might move around a lot (ex. TE Jelani Woods) but it is still a bit strange to see a guy who for two years has been thought of at one tier suddenly drop a whole tier after some workouts.  Maybe it's just me.

[jetstream23]

Sporting News ranked Karlaftis at #8 back in January.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-draft-prospects-2022-player-rankings-big-board/15xmexshw7ywc1u9ijg32sjwhr

 

Bleacher Report had him at #6 in February.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2953210-2022-nfl-draft-big-board-br-nfl-scouting-depts-post-senior-bowl-rankings

[slimjasi]

25 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

 

False.  He was Top 10 almost everywhere.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2022-nfl-mock-draft-houston-texans-notre-dame-safety-kyle-hamilton-desmond-ridder-pick-9-denver-broncos

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/jets/news/new-york-jets-pick-george-karlaftis-treylon-burks-first-round-mock-draft

 

I still like and would probably take him over Walker, tbh

[derp]

3 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Fair point regarding mocks vs. rankings.  It's all subjective anyway.  But it's still crazy how some guys can launch up a Draft board by 10 places in Round 1 while another drops 10 spots simply after some "Underwear Olympics" at the Combine or Pro Days.  I might expect that to happen to Day 3 type guys who might move around a lot (ex. TE Jelani Woods) but it is still a bit strange to see a guy who for two years has been thought of at one tier suddenly drop a whole tier after some workouts.  Maybe it's just me.

Sporting News is bad too. I tried to tag you in another thread but Kiper, McShay, Brugler, and Matt Miller all had Karlaftis outside the top ten in early January and Daniel Jeremiah's first rankings February 1 had him at 14 as well. He's been outside the top ten for some time.

I think there's this perception that the combine impacts these guys when really there's just a lag when someone has a bad season, like Karlaftis did. Especially when it comes to hitting the rankings in the mock draft machines everyone uses. Karlaftis definitely fell pre combine because he had a disappointing junior year relative to expectations. He got a pass for a weird COVID sophomore year and ranked highly based on his productive freshman year and didn't live up to it. And it's extra pronounced this year because again, for a lot of these juniors they were getting ranked off of their freshman year and given a pass for a weird college season when they were sophomores.

The other thing is that a lot of these guys don't rise because of the combine but because people who do rankings are able to communicate with more people at these big events - Senior Bowl, combine - and find out that their rankings don't mesh with consensus, so they correct them.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

2 minutes ago, derp said:

Sporting News is bad too. I tried to tag you in another thread but Kiper, McShay, Brugler, and Matt Miller all had Karlaftis outside the top ten in early January and Daniel Jeremiah's first rankings February 1 had him at 14 as well. He's been outside the top ten for some time.

I think there's this perception that the combine impacts these guys when really there's just a lag when someone has a bad season, like Karlaftis did. Especially when it comes to hitting the rankings in the mock draft machines everyone uses. Karlaftis definitely fell pre combine because he had a disappointing junior year relative to expectations. He got a pass for a weird COVID sophomore year and ranked highly based on his productive freshman year and didn't live up to it. And it's extra pronounced this year because again, for a lot of these juniors they were getting ranked off of their freshman year and given a pass for a weird college season when they were sophomores.

The other thing is that a lot of these guys don't rise because of the combine but because people who do rankings are able to communicate with more people at these big events - Senior Bowl, combine - and find out that their rankings don't mesh with consensus, so they correct them.

I'd argue in the case of edge and TE you need to know athletic ceilings on guys and a bounce after testing is natural. People (including myself at one point) thought Jalen Wydermyer was a potential #1 TE prospect and now he's going to be lucky to be drafted based on how badly he performed. I thought Ojabo and Thibs were freakier athletes than they tested. Overall, the edge class posted mediocre agility and explosion numbers versus say last year like Parsons and Oweh.