I'm Still Not Sold On Zach Wilson

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

Zappe is ahead in terms of development... Zappe is far behind in terms of potential.
 

Oh this magical “potential” Zach has!

Yet not one defender can tell me anything that’s special about him beyond a strong arm (sorta like the one JaMarcus Russell had!)

[TheAustrian]

51 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Oh this magical “potential” Zach has!

Yet not one defender can tell me anything that’s special about him beyond a strong arm (sorta like the one JaMarcus Russell had!)

Come on, lets stop hating now...
We can go on with it in 2 years, when he finally loses games for us again (hopefully he will develop in a future hof franchise qb (0,0001 % chance)

[jgb]

3 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Oh this magical “potential” Zach has!

Yet not one defender can tell me anything that’s special about him beyond a strong arm (sorta like the one JaMarcus Russell had!)

And not even as strong. Jamarcus is still considered by many scouts to have been the most physically-gifted QB prospect of all time.

[jgb]

2 hours ago, TheAustrian said:

Come on, lets stop hating now...
We can go on with it in 2 years, when he finally loses games for us again (hopefully he will develop in a future hof franchise qb (0,0001 % chance)

[Biggs]

Looks like the Jets are still afraid to have any competition for Zach’s fragile ego.  

[Matt39]

3 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Looks like the Jets are still afraid to have any competition for Zach’s fragile ego.  

It’s an arrangement 

[varjet]

I am going to recap this thread:

• I don't think there is anyone sold on Zach Wilson-no one on this Board, the coaches, the other players, Zach Wilson himself.
• For purposes of building a team in 2023, the system they are running, continuity, etc., JD and Saleh have concluded that letting Zach be QB2 is their best option.   Zach has won games for the Jets.   There will be a strong running game.  If heaven forbid Rodgers got hurt, hopefully Wilson could step in for a game and 1/2 or so.  
• But generally, I also think the view is that if Rodgers if hurt long term, the season is done and play for the draft pick, which hopefully would include a 1 if Rodgers does not meet the playing time target.  
• I don't think there is a long-term Zach Wilson plan.  Next year is a new story.   If Zach is traded next year to someone, like Darnold was, the Jets break even on cap and save cash, also potentially yielding a draft pick.  It could happen, but on the other hand, the Jets will not make the same mistake GB did-they will use all of their draft resources to support Rodgers while he is playing.   I don't see them picking a successor QB high, at least next draft.

[JetsYanks13]

Zappe is ahead in terms of development... Zappe is far behind in terms of potential.

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So ahead in terms of potential he was cut by a team with a goat HC and a bottom tier Starting QB, Why?


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[Dunnie]

So ahead in terms of potential he was cut by a team with a goat HC and a bottom tier Starting QB, Why?


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Reread the paragraph my man.

I said Zappe is behind in terms of potential.

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[JetsYanks13]

Reread the paragraph my man.

I said Zappe is behind in terms of potential.

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Either which way, he’s without a job.


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[slats]

12 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Tim Boyle does, AND he out-performed Wilson in preseason games.  Any objections to promoting Boyle to the QB2 spot?

Same objection that has existed all along: like most NFL teams, the Jets aren’t interested in carrying three QBs on the 53 man roster. Over your oft-repeated objections, they’re opting to continue to develop Zach in the #2 role. I expect Boyle to be on the practice squad as QB #3, although I’d prefer it if they found a better option. 

[PFSIKH]

8 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Zappe is ahead in terms of development... Zappe is far behind in terms of potential.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

He might not be.  It is being speculated that he looked so bad this training camp due to his inability to pick-up a complex offense.  Apparently, as Western Kentucky it was a fairly simple air raidesque type of offense.  Last year he looked decent in Patricia's simplistic offense.  Now, with a real OC and a real offense, he has struggled processing the offense.

[Claymation]

11 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

My statement was that he out-performed Zach Wilson, which he did.  I didn’t say he played well.  It’s a low bar we’re talking about here.  

Zach was OK in the preseason. Didn't have any turnovers. Would have liked to see him get the team in the endzone but he didn't do that.

They both had almost identical stats. Except Boyle had more turnovers but he had more TDs. 

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, JetsYanks13 said:

So ahead in terms of potential he was cut by a team with a goat HC and a bottom tier Starting QB, Why?


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Because his name isn’t Zach Wilson. That’s it, along with nonsense imagined.  Davito and Boyle were also ahead of him and now are on their way to a practice squad near you.

The idea that he’s improved pisses them off and keeps sending them into a rant filled with denials and comparisons that prove nothing  

[Dunnie]

23 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Zach was OK in the preseason. Didn't have any turnovers. Would have liked to see him get the team in the endzone but he didn't do that.
They both had almost identical stats. Except Boyle had more turnovers but he had more TDs. 

Yeah ... I would have liked to have seen Zach in a full offense and completing a wider range of passes .. mid range and deep. But I was pleased with the progress on the short stuff.

Hope he continues and accelerates his progress. Time will tell.


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Edited August 30, 2023 by Dunnie

[The Crusher]

30 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

He might not be.  It is being speculated that he looked so bad this training camp due to his inability to pick-up a complex offense.  Apparently, as Western Kentucky it was a fairly simple air raidesque type of offense.  Last year he looked decent in Patricia's simplistic offense.  Now, with a real OC and a real offense, he has struggled processing the offense.

It would take him and Zach an entire season to get one side of the Rubic’s cube together me thinks. 

[Jetsfan80]

33 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Zach was OK in the preseason. Didn't have any turnovers. Would have liked to see him get the team in the endzone but he didn't do that.

They both had almost identical stats. Except Boyle had more turnovers but he had more TDs. 

So Boyle scored more points than Zach, yes.  

[Matt39]

35 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Zach was OK in the preseason. Didn't have any turnovers. Would have liked to see him get the team in the endzone but he didn't do that.

They both had almost identical stats. Except Boyle had more turnovers but he had more TDs. 

Why Boyle and Wilson got equal reps is the question. It’s fair to question what exactly the Jets intentions were here. Zach should have thrown more than 50 some odd passes this preseason.

[slimjasi]

16 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

 

The idea that he’s improved pisses them off and keeps sends them into a rant filled with denials and comparisons that prove haven’t proven out.  

[greenwichjetfan]

I fully expected to open this thread and see the opening post from end of 2021 season or beginning of 2022 season. That fact that it was just started Sunday tells me that some of you have been living in a Jets-free zone for the last two years.

tl;dr version: he's sucked for a long time, you johnny come latelys

[carlito1171]

Zach isn't QB1 anymore....

I hope to never see him take a snap this season 

[Matt39]

9 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I fully expected to open this thread and see the opening post from end of 2021 season or beginning of 2022 season. That fact that it was just started Sunday tells me that some of you have been living in a Jets-free zone for the last two years.

tl;dr version: he's sucked for a long time, you johnny come latelys

Zach’s Uncle and Woody are boys. He was a big wig in the Westchester/Greenwich/New Cannan scene. Founded JetBlue, the Jets major sponsor and they cochaired Romneys campaign together. Not hard to connect the dots. All of Neelemans kids grew up in NY. Zach’s on scholarship until his rookie deal runs out. It’s not a coincidence on why he’s been coddled to this extent.

[slats]

1 minute ago, Matt39 said:

Zach’s Uncle and Woody are boys. He was a big wig in the Westchester/Greenwich/New Cannan scene. Founded JetBlue, the Jets major sponsor and they cochaired Romneys campaign together. Not hard to connect the dots. All of Neelemans kids grew up in NY. Zach’s on scholarship until his rookie deal runs out. It’s not a coincidence on why he’s been coddled to this extent.

If dot connecting is your thing, it’s never hard. 

[Claymation]

4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

So Boyle scored more points than Zach, yes.  

He did, but turned the ball over more as well.

Many people on this site have already made up their mind on Zach, much like Mekhi. It would be foolish to think this FO won't give Zach every opportunity to improve/succeed. Similar to Mekhi. 

[Matt39]

Just now, slats said:

If dot connecting is your thing, it’s never hard. 

I mean I’m speaking from what I know and have been told. This is all out there.

[Claymation]

16 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Why Boyle and Wilson got equal reps is the question. It’s fair to question what exactly the Jets intentions were here. Zach should have thrown more than 50 some odd passes this preseason.

Well I'm sure he got the lion's share in practice between the two.

[jgb]

32 minutes ago, Claymation said:

He did, but turned the ball over more as well.

Many people on this site have already made up their mind on Zach, much like Mekhi. It would be foolish to think this FO won't give Zach every opportunity to improve/succeed. Similar to Mekhi. 

We have made up our minds in the sense we believe he is unlikely to become a franchise guy. Contained within that opinion is an acknowledgement that there is a non-zero chance that he does.

I’ve also made up my mind that a coin flip is a 50/50 proposition. That doesn’t mean I’m certain of the outcome.

[Biggs]

32 minutes ago, Claymation said:

He did, but turned the ball over more as well.

Many people on this site have already made up their mind on Zach, much like Mekhi. It would be foolish to think this FO won't give Zach every opportunity to improve/succeed. Similar to Mekhi. 

The comparison to Becton is a little nuts.  Becton when he played was actually a starting caliber NFL Left Tackle.  Zach when he played was actually not even remotely competent as an NFL game manager at QB.

Becton's issues are a result of a serious eating disorder and a lack of training.  Thanks to the fat shaming by Jets fans, many on this board, Becton got himself in great shape and has made changes to his eating habits.

Zach's issues are more complex.  He's brain isn't wired to operate at NFL speed.  I'm afraid no amount of shaming is going to help him.  Rodgers isn't going to help him. The kid needs the Wizard of Oz to give him a diploma.  

[Warfish]

45 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Many people on this site have already made up their mind on Zach, much like Mekhi.

An interesting comparison, as I've been a "wait and see" guy on Becton all along, albeit not overly optimistic he would return to his full potential.  And Becton's rookie year quality of play was materially higher than any play Zach has shown to-date.

I've "made up my mind" in terms of evaluating what I've seen from Wilson to-date, absolutely.  So far, he's a historic-level bust, one of the worst producing top-picked QB's in NFL history.  He has exposed several serious mechanical flaws in his game, and a level of immaturity at times that is concerning for future growth.  For him to overcome these things after 2 seasons would be near-on unprecedented.  As much as folks like to compare, this isn't a Steve Young or Peyton Manning type of situation.  This is far closer to a Russel Wilson or Akili Smith situation, and the odds of Wilson becoming a FQB is about the same as it was for Russel Wilson and Akili Smith.  Even Geno is a bad example as a Wilson analogue, because it took Geno several teams and multiple years to find his spot in Seattle.  

Nothing is impossible.  To be clear.  But some things are alot more likely than not likely.  For Zach Wilson to 1. overcome a historic bust beginning to his career, 2. to then have a massive turnaround to FQB quality, and 3. to do that for the same team that drafted him, not some other team, is simply a very, very unlikely outcome.  Possible, absolutely.  Likely, I'd argue no.

As noted, he is here in 2023 primarily because the ramifications of cutting/trading him weren't worth it.  That, and I've argued that JD (may, possibly) still believe in "his guy, his pick" Wilson, and wants to give him every opportunity to (frankly) validate JD's selection of him.

But ultimately, a decision point is coming, and that is the end of the 2024 season when Zach will become a Free Agent.  Until then, he's our backup QB, and I hope we never see him, because I hope Rodgers plays every snap at QB this year and does so at a Super Bowl/League MVP level, which he's done in the past.  If we do see him, I hope every one of his loudest advocates here at JN are right, and that he's materially improved.

Ultimately, Wilson's future will work itself out in time, and we'll see who was right and who was wrong, dead horses, kicking, etc.

45 minutes ago, Claymation said:

It would be foolish to think this FO won't give Zach every opportunity to improve/succeed. Similar to Mekhi. 

Depends on how you define "opportunity to succeed", as many Wilson advocates would say the FO give him no chance to succeed in his first two seasons here.

With that said, I agree with you.  He's being given a very rare opportunity here given his first two seasons, to still be here, to be the backup, and do so under a HOF'er who seems willing to help try and salvage his future.  

[Claymation]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

We have made up our minds in the sense we believe he is unlikely to become a franchise guy. Contained within that opinion is an acknowledgement that there is a non-zero chance that he does.

I’ve also made up my mind that a coin flip is a 50/50 proposition. That doesn’t mean I’m certain of the outcome.

There are people on this site that believe Zach is a bust, and that he should have been released. Much like Mekhi 2 weeks ago. The media turned on both of them. The fans did as well. Mekhi is starting and Zach is the primary backup.

And some people on this site are not happy. In spite of having a legitimate chance to win it all this season.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

So Boyle scored more points than Zach, yes.  

And Boyle never faced anything other than a 3rd string or worse D.  

Other  than in camp.  

Where the CS can evaluate him.  

And we can’t. 

[jgb]

Just now, Claymation said:

There are people on this site that believe Zach is a bust, and that he should have been released. Much like Mekhi 2 weeks ago. The media turned on both of them. The fans did as well. Mekhi is starting and Zach is the primary backup.

He is a bust. Most busts don’t turn it around. Hence, high chance he remains a bust.

Just now, Claymation said:

And some people on this site are not happy. In spite of having a legitimate chance to win it all this season.

Consider: those who are unhappy may just disagree that the Jets have a legitimate chance to win it all. The notion that there are Jets fans who care enough about the team to be active here who want the Jets to lose or Jets players to fail is absurd. 

[Jet Nut]

6 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I've "made up my mind" in terms of evaluating what I've seen from Wilson to-date, absolutely.  So far, he's a historic-level bust, one of the worst producing top-picked QB's in NFL history. 

You would also made up your mind about Lawrence through 22 games.  And the historic-level bust is funny, look at Elways numbers well past 22 games they’re worse.  His numbers are nowhere near historic 

[Warfish]

3 minutes ago, jgb said:

The notion that there are Jets fans who care enough about the team to be active here who want the Jets to lose or Jets players to fail is absurd. 

We all want the same thing, a Jets Super Bowl title.

We simply may not all agree on the best route to get there/obtain that outcome.

I, for one, would never, ever tell say, a Denzel Mims fan, that they "were rooting for the Jets to fail" because they really liked a really crappy player.  I trust they were being honest, and truly thought (at the time) that Mims was going to become good, and be a real help. 

I don't go directly to "they must be out to sabotage the Jets because they are a non-fan troll!!! No one with half a brain could like a crappy player like Mims!".

And yet, that is exactly what many Wilson (and this isn't limited to Wilson, we heard the same about Darnold, Geno, Sanchez, even from a rare few, Hackenberg!) advocates say to those who do not share their view that Wilson is X, Y or Z.

It's all a bit silly, really.   

[PFSIKH]

1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

It would take him and Zach an entire season to get one side of the Rubic’s cube together me thinks. 

It would also take Zappe one season to get you Caleb Williams.