Cimini: Locker room is grumbling about Wilson, team is close to imploding

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

If Zach once again puts up a 32nd-ranked type performance today, he simply must be benched again, this time for good.

I don't care if the f'ing ballboy has to play QB next week, this insanity of throwing Zach out week after week and him putting up league-worst play and production week after week simply cannot be permitted to continue.

Hell, it'd be a mercy benching.  I don't know Zach Wilson, he could be a scumbag for all I know, but even he doesn't deserve this historical embarrassment the Jets are creating here, where he will go down in history as a top 5 all-time NFL bust QB, one of the worst to ever play this game in the modern era.

I’d take it a step further. If Zach melts down this week, I bench him for Denver and I trade him at the deadline for, like, Brian Hoyer. They need to cleanse the house of an evil spirit.

[Warfish]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

I’d take it a step further. If Zach melts down this week, I bench him for Denver and I trade him at the deadline for, like, Brian Hoyer. They need to cleanse the house of an evil spirit.

You likely remember how I felt about Sam Darnold, at that point, I'd trade Wilson to San Fran for Darnold ffs.  

[T0mShane]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

You likely remember how I felt about Sam Darnold, at that point, I'd trade Wilson to San Fran for Darnold ffs.  

I think Darnold would stab himself in the leg before he’d agree to come back here. That dude is cashing checks, surfing every day and living large

[LIJetsFan]

19 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Imagine how painful it is to play with Zach Wilson and then find yourself getting blamed for Zach Wilson’s many failings. 

 

Yeah I watched this guys video already and wondered wtf he was talking about.  

[Lith]

15 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I don’t think they wanted to eat the money on Zach ($20 mil, iirc) and—I’m guessing—they didn’t want to agitate Rodgers by bringing in anyone viable behind him. Rodger loved having no-talent sycophants on the bench backing him up in Green Bay—Kurt Benkert, Danny Etling, etc. Zach fit that mold. 

It is already spent.  Would have been an accelerated cap hit, but no cash impact for Woody.  I also wonder if some of this was JD's arrogance.  "I am going to show everyone I was right about Zach.  We are going to win with Aaron and then Zach will be ready step in."

While I still think this was an avoidable mess, we also had some incredible bad luck.  Losing Rodgers 4 plays into week 1 is the worst possible outcome.  If we lost him in preseason, there would have been more options.  If we lost him after a few weeks or a month or two, we would be that much closer to the trade deadline when there may be some real options.  We lose him week 1, which means we have half a season of Zach, Tim Boyle and a bunch of cast-offs who could not make a roster (Siemian).

 

 

[Biggs]

9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I’d take it a step further. If Zach melts down this week, I bench him for Denver and I trade him at the deadline for, like, Brian Hoyer. They need to cleanse the house of an evil spirit.

This game is Zach's breakout game.  350 to 400 yards, 3 to 4 TD's.  He goes head to head with Mahomes.   Off platform throws.  20 plus yards runs.  He creates, he moves the team easily down the field and they close out drives with TD's.   

Nobody will be talking about Aaron Rodgers ever again in Jetsville.  Zach is about to have a statement game.  

Melt down?  He's about to reward Saleh and call in all the receipts tonight.  

[Lith]

4 minutes ago, Biggs said:

This game is Zach's breakout game.  350 to 400 yards, 3 to 4 TD's.  He goes head to head with Mahomes.   Off platform throws.  20 plus yards runs.  He creates, he moves the team easily down the field and they close out drives with TD's.   

Nobody will be talking about Aaron Rodgers ever again in Jetsville.  Zach is about to have a statement game.  

Melt down?  He's about to reward Saleh and call in all the receipts tonight.  

Someone has started drinking early on Sunday AM.

[Biggs]

Just now, Lith said:

Someone has started drinking early on Sunday AM.

Went to an EST seminar yesterday.  

[TuscanyTile2]

4 minutes ago, Biggs said:

This game is Zach's breakout game.  350 to 400 yards, 3 to 4 TD's.  He goes head to head with Mahomes.   Off platform throws.  20 plus yards runs.  He creates, he moves the team easily down the field and they close out drives with TD's.   

Nobody will be talking about Aaron Rodgers ever again in Jetsville.  Zach is about to have a statement game.  

Melt down?  He's about to reward Saleh and call in all the receipts tonight.  

Let's hope so.  Though the reality will likely be another conservative game plan from our crappy CS with no creativity (e.g. no reverses to Mecole Hardman).

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, Lith said:

It is already spent.  Would have been an accelerated cap hit, but no cash impact for Woody.  I also wonder if some of this was JD's arrogance.  "I am going to show everyone I was right about Zach.  We are going to win with Aaron and then Zach will be ready step in."

While I still think this was an avoidable mess, we also had some incredible bad luck.  Losing Rodgers 4 plays into week 1 is the worst possible outcome.  If we lost him in preseason, there would have been more options.  If we lost him after a few weeks or a month or two, we would be that much closer to the trade deadline when there may be some real options.  We lose him week 1, which means we have half a season of Zach, Tim Boyle and a bunch of cast-offs who could not make a roster (Siemian).

 

 

Spent money cap-wise, but zero ROI on checks that still cross Woody’s desk every two weeks. Woody still has power of the purse if nothing else. Even as a QB2 with the cockamamie idea that Zach might be ok in the distant future, it’s still a story you could sell to him. 

[Biggs]

2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Let's hope so.  Though the reality will likely be another conservative game plan from our crappy CS with no creativity (e.g. no reverses to Mecole Hardman).

Zach is going to put on a pair of noise canceling head phones under his helmet,  close his eyes and let it rip tonight.  

[dbatesman]

43 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

they didn’t want to agitate Rodgers by bringing in anyone viable behind him. Rodger loved having no-talent sycophants on the bench backing him up in Green Bay—Kurt Benkert, Danny Etling, etc. Zach fit that mold. 

Whoa whoa whoa, hold on just a second. I was told—aggressively, condescendingly, and  for months on end—that Rodgers is utterly selfless. That his only desire, without condition or qualification, was to play for the New York Jets. That any reports of his selfishness, peevishness, and demands for say in the Packers’ roster were slander of the basest and most scurrilous sort. That even if the Jets had, entirely of their own volition, approached Rodgers about his own vision for the roster, any resulting suggestions were all purely in the interests of the Jets, with no regard for his own desires or preferences, and that moreover these suggestions were bold and dynamic and had the clarity of vision we associate with great statesmanship, and that really when you think about it making Rodgers our de facto president of football operations was not an onerous hoop we had to jump through to assure his acquisition (because, again, Rodgers would never in his life dream of making such a churlish demand (although even if he did (which he did not), it would be solely because he felt his unique genius in spotting football talent might serve the Jets in good stead in their quest to win a Super Bowl, the fulfillment of which objective was always his ultimate and really only end in this entire situation)), but was in point of fact a positive good, as certainly the visionary roster-building talents of such a talented and experienced player could only be a boon to our woebegone franchise.

[Barton]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

The great unanswered question with this regime is who amongst them wants to keep pushing Zach out there?
 

—I do not think it’s Saleh, because Saleh was making Zach a healthy scratch at the end of last year. I believe Saleh is just falling on the sword because he’s a company man, even though he’s ruining his career. Reminds me very much of the way Bowles would cover up for Maccagnan with Darnold. Saleh would do will to flip a table at some point and cover his own ass, presuming Zach is being forced upon him. 
 

—Is it Douglas? Dan Hanzus of the NFLN is a huge Jets fan and he’s “heard” that Zach Wilson is Douglas’ white whale, and that Douglas is the one who can’t let go. But why? Zach is murdering the 52 other guys on the roster, and making every coach look like dumbasses. Why would the GM compromise everything else for one bad player? 
 

—It HAS TO BE Woody. I do not believe Woody is cheap, per se, but I do believe that Woody is much more comfortable talking to accountants than he is coaches. The Jets have invested a ton of money into QBs during his time as owner, and I do think Woody knows what that number is when it comes to Zach Wilson and Aaron Rodgers. I could absolutely see Woody throwing that number in Douglas’ face in the event Douglas comes, hat in hand, to ask for another $7(?) million in cash to buy Matt Ryan out of his TV contract. Add to it that I think Woody just like the idea of Zach Wilson working out here so he can parade him around town to meet and greets and to the RNC next year to show him off. End of the day, I could see Woody being *very* embittered by Zach flaming out here and he ends up firing Saleh and his staff for it, regardless of how Rodgers feels about it. 

Yup.

I'm thinking its JD. He has a STRONG track record of shoving his failed free agents and draft picks down our throats by starting them over others, repeatedly. 

If Zach hit the bench for anyone else but Rodgers, then the Wilson pick has its final nail in the coffin as a total bust and thus it makes JD look worse as a GM.

Short-sighted and idiotic move. 

[Lith]

26 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Spent money cap-wise, but zero ROI on checks that still cross Woody’s desk every two weeks. Woody still has power of the purse if nothing else. Even as a QB2 with the cockamamie idea that Zach might be ok in the distant future, it’s still a story you could sell to him. 

But how do you stop writing those checks.  Trade him and let someone else assume his remaining base salary.

[T0mShane]

16 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Whoa whoa whoa, hold on just a second. I was told—aggressively, condescendingly, and  for months on end—that Rodgers is utterly selfless. That his only desire, without condition or qualification, was to play for the New York Jets. That any reports of his selfishness, peevishness, and demands for say in the Packers’ roster were slander of the basest and most scurrilous sort. That even if the Jets had, entirely of their own volition, approached Rodgers about his own vision for the roster, any resulting suggestions were all purely in the interests of the Jets, with no regard for his own desires or preferences, and that moreover these suggestions were bold and dynamic and had the clarity of vision we associate with great statesmanship, and that really when you think about it making Rodgers our de facto president of football operations was not an onerous hoop we had to jump through to assure his acquisition (because, again, Rodgers would never in his life dream of making such a churlish demand (although even if he did (which he did not), it would be solely because he felt his unique genius in spotting football talent might serve the Jets in good stead in their quest to win a Super Bowl, the fulfillment of which objective was always his ultimate and really only end in this entire situation)), but was in point of fact a positive good, as certainly the visionary roster-building talents of such a talented and experienced player could only be a boon to our woebegone franchise.

Counterpoint: EVERY GOOD QB IS AN a$$hole AND A SOCIOPATH

[dbatesman]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

Counterpoint: EVERY GOOD QB IS AN a$$hole AND A SOCIOPATH

Of course. That’s a great reason not to give them an office next to the GM’s.

[TuscanyTile2]

If/when ZW is benched, I think people are going to be very disappointed in how bad his replacement looks (assuming it's either Siemian or Boyle)

[doitny]

55 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I’d take it a step further. If Zach melts down this week, I bench him for Denver and I trade him at the deadline for, like, Brian Hoyer. They need to cleanse the house of an evil spirit.

he is untradeable. i would have cut him last week but they dont have the ball to do that. 

but next year we are paying him in the last year of his contract whether he is here or not. he better not be here

[doitny]

1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

If/when ZW is benched, I think people are going to be very disappointed in how bad his replacement looks (assuming it's either Siemian or Boyle)

we know there bad, but are they worst than Zach? maybe, maybe not.

[maury77]

20 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Imagine how painful it is to play with Zach Wilson and then find yourself getting blamed for Zach Wilson’s many failings. 

 

This play is what Wilson made a killing on his final year at BYU. BYU would send their WRs on deep routes and Wilson would chuck it and let the WR make a play. Now he won't even take those shots when they are open.

[hawk]

20 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Imagine how painful it is to play with Zach Wilson and then find yourself getting blamed for Zach Wilson’s many failings. 

 

I'm confused.  I thought the excuse was receivers aren't getting open?

[maury77]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

If Zach once again puts up a 32nd-ranked type performance today, he simply must be benched again, this time for good.

I don't care if the f'ing ballboy has to play QB next week, this insanity of throwing Zach out week after week and him putting up league-worst play and production week after week simply cannot be permitted to continue.

Hell, it'd be a mercy benching.  I don't know Zach Wilson, he could be a scumbag for all I know, but even he doesn't deserve this historical embarrassment the Jets are creating here, where he will go down in history as a top 5 all-time NFL bust QB, one of the worst to ever play this game in the modern era.

I'm going tonight and I'm feeling very uneasy about having a "but fumble"-esque calamity on hand. I can't remember the last time the Jets were on Sunday Night Football but it has been a long time (if ever). As bad of an opinion as I have of Zach Wilson under normal circumstances, I if the crowd starts booing him tonight he is going to emotionally collapse and it is going to snowball into a huge embarrassment for Woody. 

We can't do anything about Woody but if Douglas is really the one behind the decision to keep playing Wilson then Douglas needs to go the minute the season is over because he either cannot evaluate the QB position or he is allowing his ego to detrimentally effect the team. 

[T0mShane]

59 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Of course. That’s a great reason not to give them an office next to the GM’s.

Well yeah. ****

[Matt39]

14 minutes ago, maury77 said:

I'm going tonight and I'm feeling very uneasy about having a "but fumble"-esque calamity on hand. I can't remember the last time the Jets were on Sunday Night Football but it has been a long time (if ever). As bad of an opinion as I have of Zach Wilson under normal circumstances, I if the crowd starts booing him tonight he is going to emotionally collapse and it is going to snowball into a huge embarrassment for Woody. 

We can't do anything about Woody but if Douglas is really the one behind the decision to keep playing Wilson then Douglas needs to go the minute the season is over because he either cannot evaluate the QB position or he is allowing his ego to detrimentally effect the team. 

It would be nice to hear from Joe Douglas every so often.

[Sammybighead]

2 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Rodgers will be 40 to start next season he isn't going to be around for long. He's been around long enough to be a grown up and understand how the NFL works. I don't agree with the belief that us taking a first round QB is going to piss him off. Besides, the last time he was pissed off by his team taking a 1st round QB he just went out and won MVP.

If we don't take a QB next year and Rodgers is healthy when are we taking a QB? We're probably a playoff team w/him starting the whole season ...

We're not taking one in 2024. It'll have to be 2025. Trade down, build the team. For better or worse, we're hitched to Rodgers in 2024.

[Sammybighead]

2 hours ago, Matt39 said:

He feels none of this pressure. 

If that was true, there wouldn't be rumblings about people potentially losing their jobs.

[Matt39]

1 minute ago, Sammybighead said:

If that was true, there wouldn't be rumblings about people potentially losing their jobs.

I don’t think those things are mutually exclusive 

[hawk]

1 minute ago, Sammybighead said:

We're not taking one in 2024. It'll have to be 2025. Trade down, build the team. For better or worse, we're hitched to Rodgers in 2024.

They are hitched, and that is why draft his replacement in 2024.

Personally, if we end up with a top 5 pick, trade back and pick a guy later in round 1.

Also, if we are out of playoff contention by trade deadline, fire sale for draft picks.

[Augustiniak]

Just now, hawk said:

They are hitched, and that is why draft his replacement in 2024.

Personally, if we end up with a top 5 pick, trade back and pick a guy later in round 1.

Also, if we are out of playoff contention by trade deadline, fire sale for draft picks.

If the jets are really picking top 5 again, that could be enough of a swell of support to take a qb and tell rodgers you have one year to prove you can still be good.  There’s no easier path to improving the team than picking the right qb.  If they’re picking 12 and a few qbs come off the board before then, I’d prefer a trade down. 

[TuscanyTile2]

2 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

If the jets are really picking top 5 again, that could be enough of a swell of support to take a qb and tell rodgers you have one year to prove you can still be good.  There’s no easier path to improving the team than picking the right qb.  If they’re picking 12 and a few qbs come off the board before then, I’d prefer a trade down. 

If we pick top 5, offer any players we have to try to trade up to #1 OA.  And I mean any players (Sauce, GW, QW, etc).  

[Augustiniak]

Just now, hawk said:

They are hitched, and that is why draft his replacement in 2024.

Personally, if we end up with a top 5 pick, trade back and pick a guy later in round 1.

Also, if we are out of playoff contention by trade deadline, fire sale for draft picks.

If the jets are really picking top 5 again, that could be enough of a swell of support to take a qb and tell rodgers you have one year to prove you can still be good.  There’s no easier path to improving the team than picking the right qb.  If they’re picking 12 and a few qbs come off the board before then, I’d prefer a trade down. 

[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

If we pick top 5, offer any players we have to try to trade up to #1 OA.  And I mean any players (Sauce, GW, QW, etc).  

I doubt that’s happening.  But i think the better the draft pick, the more likely they’re going to be enticed to take a qb.  

[hawk]

8 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

If the jets are really picking top 5 again, that could be enough of a swell of support to take a qb and tell rodgers you have one year to prove you can still be good.  There’s no easier path to improving the team than picking the right qb.  If they’re picking 12 and a few qbs come off the board before then, I’d prefer a trade down. 

And the front office forces sh*t down out throats because a qb was drafted high.  

Trade back and develop a guy while Rodgers is the guy.  Better yet, trade for Davis Mills now and culture him foe the rest of the season and let him develop behind Rodgers.

Let's face it, the only reason Wilson is on the roster is because he was a number 2 pick and I DO NOT believe that either Douglas nor Saleh want him on the roster.

Woody Johnson is the only reason he is, and that should be painfully obvious to anyone with half a brain.

[Barry McCockinner]

 

[Icer]

The whole world knows Zach Wilson is cheeks and Saleh is gonna keep rolling him out there as QB1. What could go wrong