If Brock Bowers falls, do we take him?

[Dunnie]

2 minutes ago, GKnight83 said:

The only way JD survives taking Bowers is if it was the resulting pick after a trade down where the Jets pick up a 2nd or 3rd.

Bowers would need to become Gronk/Sharpe in the same body.

[bicketybam]

If he's there at 10, there might be a team that would want to trade with us in order to grab him. What do you do then?

[Warfish]

I'd prefer to go O-Line or WR at #10, given who should/is likely to be available at that spot.

[Alka]

8 hours ago, Jdeet said:

Obviously we have it set in stone that we are picking an OT at 10. Nearly every mock draft seemed to be leading us in that direction. But, I am seeing Brock Bowers fall to us lately, including Mel Kiper’s latest mock.

i personally feel like we can get enough offensive line help in free agency and later in the draft, to allow us to get a unique playmaker like Bowers. He compares to George Kittle with a championship college career and is a superb talent. It would obviously make Aaron Rodgers happy and give a dynamic to our offense that we have really never had. (And to follow that up, wouldn’t be shocked to see us draft WR Ladd McConkey from Georgia, as well, later on day 2)

Is Brock Bowers an acceptable pick, Jets fans, or will this cause a revolt? This might have been brought up previously, but I haven’t been around much. 

Having Bowers on the board at 10 might encourage other teams to make a trade with the Jets.  Maybe a team around #15 loves the guy, trades up to 10 to get him, and we pick up a 2nd round pick in the meantime.  

That is a trade that I would jump all over, since we still get a highly touted 1st round OT at around #15, and get either a 2nd OT or highly touted guard in the second round, or a wide receiver that we desperately need opposite Garrett Wilson.

The Jets are not one player away from being good offensively, and we must fix that offensive line, and we need more than one player to do that.

 

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

Idk why but I do feel like the team would prefer to take a play maker in the first over an OL. 

[slats]

The TE position might have the longest learning curve from college to the pros. TEs usually need to work with both the receivers’ coaches and the OL coaches, being a significant component of both the rushing and passing offenses. TE is also a lower paid position -only slightly higher than RB- making it a questionable choice for a top ten pick. 
 
All things being equal, probably not the direction I’d want to see them go in. I’d also like to see what Freak Kuntz can do. 

[Wit]

If the jets pick someone that didn’t bust and is great I’m not going to complain. If it was future star QB vs short term star saftey; I would be more concerned.


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[bonkertons]

Surprising how many clowns list Becht and Brady as reasons why we shouldn't take Bowers.  Guys who were drafted before a decent chunk of this fanbase were even born.  Keller is the most recent at SIXTEEN years ago, and to act like he was any way comparable to Bowers as a prospect is just comical.  Honestly, to act like any TE prospect ever is comparable to Bowers is comical.  But yeah it's the same stupid argument that some make when saying we should never draft a QB again because Zach, Darnold, and Sanchez sucked.  It's just dumb, and obviously not realistic.  

 

Yes, IF we solve the tackle spots in free agency, Bowers should absolutely be on the table.  If we don't, we're kind of stuck having to use our pick on an OT at 10.  Curious to see what JD does once free agency starts.

[Jdeet]

Need to remember that Bowers is basically a WR. If you have watched him play. He had 5 rushing TDs for Gods sake. He will never be Gronk. He isn’t built that way. But he could be Kelce or Kittle but faster. 

I have a feeling some here have never even seen the man play, if they are comparing to Becht and Brady. The comments here are hilarious.

And the learning curve wasn’t much of an issue for Laporta or Kincaid. Just saying. 

A sure thing OT at 10 is not guaranteed. Bowers might be the closest to it. 

[section314]

If JD wants to pull  MaCagnan and get canned righy after the draft, then by all means take Bowers.

[JetPotato]

Lunacy to even consider it. I can't believe we're even talking about it. Do people even watch this sport?

[Greenseed4]

5 minutes ago, Jdeet said:

Need to remember that Bowers is basically a WR. If you have watched him play. He had 5 rushing TDs for Gods sake. He will never be Gronk. He isn’t built that way. But he could be Kelce or Kittle but faster. 

I have a feeling some here have never even seen the man play, if they are comparing to Becht and Brady. The comments here are hilarious.

And the learning curve wasn’t much of an issue for Laporta or Kincaid. Just saying. 
 

^This
Kincaid (6’4, 240) 73 rec, 2 TDs    
LaPorta (6’3, 245) 86 rec, 10 TDs

Bowers (6’4, 240) would be joining a team that had the following receiving stats leaders:

G Wilson, 95 rec, 3 TDs     
B Hall, 76 rec, 4 TDs
T Conklin, 61 rec, 0 TDs
A Lazard, 23 rec, 1 TD

 

 

 

[section314]

7 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said:

^This
Kincaid (6’4, 240) 73 rec, 2 TDs    
LaPorta (6’3, 245) 86 rec, 10 TDs

Bowers (6’4, 240) would be joining a team that had the following receiving stats leaders:

G Wilson, 95 rec, 3 TDs     
B Hall, 76 rec, 4 TDs
T Conklin, 61 rec, 0 TDs
A Lazard, 23 rec, 1 TD

 

 

 

Kincaid was pick 25, LaPorta was 2nd rd. Not #10.

[THE BARON]

Yes.   

[THE BARON]

8 hours ago, Arsis said:

Dustin Keller

keller not a blocker,  he was an h back,  bowers can block

[GreenFish]

All depends on free agency. We need a LT, RT and LG before we have the luxury to not use the 10th pick on OL. And I’m a weapons > oline person. But our oline is so bad, it needs all hands on deck.

And even in the scenario where we hit homeruns along the OL in FA, I’d still go WR over TE. 

[HawkeyeJet]

Here is the conundrum with Bowers in my opinion:

We are in win now mode, clearly.  Right or wrong, that’s the situation.  I think Bowers can help ANY team on offense as he is a complete TE.  He’s every bit the receiving threat”generational” Kyle Pitts is, but is also an ass kicker in the run game, which we currently don’t have at TE.  TEs that can block make a much bigger difference in the run game than people give credit for.

That said, his value at 10 has to be as a high end receiver PLUS ass kicker, plus top red zone threat.  He is capable of that but is that how Hackett and Rodgers would use him? 

Rodgers doesn’t have a ton of great producing TE correlation, but the best TE statistical performance was probably Jermichael Finley in the early 2010s.  He was often injured and his career was cut short, but in 3 seasons with Rodgers where he played over 12 games he averaged about 60 catches for 700 yards and 5 TDs a year. That doesn’t seem like a ton, but that’s very close to Tee Higgins average production over his 4 year career, except Higgins accounts for about 200 more yards a season.

I think you can certainly make a case for or against Bowers at 10
 

 

[Paradis]

10 hours ago, Jdeet said:

Obviously we have it set in stone that we are picking an OT at 10. Nearly every mock draft seemed to be leading us in that direction. But, I am seeing Brock Bowers fall to us lately, including Mel Kiper’s latest mock.

i personally feel like we can get enough offensive line help in free agency and later in the draft, to allow us to get a unique playmaker like Bowers. He compares to George Kittle with a championship college career and is a superb talent. It would obviously make Aaron Rodgers happy and give a dynamic to our offense that we have really never had. (And to follow that up, wouldn’t be shocked to see us draft WR Ladd McConkey from Georgia, as well, later on day 2)

Is Brock Bowers an acceptable pick, Jets fans, or will this cause a revolt? This might have been brought up previously, but I haven’t been around much. 

Just so you know, there definitely isn't 3 topics on this spanning 42 pages in the draft forum...

 

This is the first time this subject has materialized

[Rangers9]

At 10 it would be a great selection.

[Jet Nut]

People do realize FA comes first and if the OL is addressed in FA the need to pass on Bowers and go OL changes a bit.

A lot actually.

[varjet]

Looking at the recent history of the NFL draft-

Great TEs are found rounds 2 and below.  Kyle Pitts has not made a difference on the Falcons

Teams have been missing on OTs as the desperate reach for them early in the first round   
 

WRs go in the Teens and have a big impact.

So it’s either a WR for me, unless we think Bowers is basically a big blocking great WR   Bowers has Jet written all over him   

 

 

 

 

 

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, section314 said:

If JD wants to pull  MaCagnan and get canned righy after the draft, then by all means take Bowers.

This is a banner-post for bad take. Bowers is 100000% worth his weight and should be a priority pick... 

Baring JD casting spells in FA however, we'll be assuredly selecting an OT, as we should. But otherwise, yes. You take Bowers. Absolutely.

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

21 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

Here is the conundrum with Bowers in my opinion:

We are in win now mode, clearly.  Right or wrong, that’s the situation.  I think Bowers can help ANY team on offense as he is a complete TE.  He’s every bit the receiving threat”generational” Kyle Pitts is, but is also an ass kicker in the run game, which we currently don’t have at TE.  TEs that can block make a much bigger difference in the run game than people give credit for.

That said, his value at 10 has to be as a high end receiver PLUS ass kicker, plus top red zone threat.  He is capable of that but is that how Hackett and Rodgers would use him? 

Rodgers doesn’t have a ton of great producing TE correlation, but the best TE statistical performance was probably Jermichael Finley in the early 2010s.  He was often injured and his career was cut short, but in 3 seasons with Rodgers where he played over 12 games he averaged about 60 catches for 700 yards and 5 TDs a year. That doesn’t seem like a ton, but that’s very close to Tee Higgins average production over his 4 year career, except Higgins accounts for about 200 more yards a season.

I think you can certainly make a case for or against Bowers at 10
 

 

I'm more so worried they'd STILL give Conklin more reps and he'd be a part time player. 

But I wouldn't be worried about Rodgers and his past experience with TE production. IMO he's just going to go to whoever is getting open and not f'n up the most. That's what he cares about the most. Be where you're supposed to be when I tell you do something. If he can handle that, then he'll get the targets.

I'd be shocked if Bowers wasn't lighting it up in camp against Mosley in coverage lol.

[section314]

3 minutes ago, Paradis said:

This is a banner-post for bad take. Bowers is 100000% worth his weight and should be a priority pick... 

Baring JD casting spells in FA however, we'll be assuredly selecting an OT, as we should. But otherwise, yes. You take Bowers. Absolutely.

I always trust and defer to your knowledge and judgement, but on this I wholeheartedly disagree.

[Paradis]

11 minutes ago, section314 said:

I always trust and defer to your knowledge and judgement, but on this I wholeheartedly disagree.

but why? I think ppl are getting hung on the draft selection spot, not the talent. There's this illusion that you can just find a brock Bowers on day 2... first of all, there's only 4-5 real TEs in the NFL right now who can take over a game (most have come from Iowa lol) the rest, come and go... the other part is - yea, so and so went in round 3. So did 67 other tights in the last 10 years who did little to nothing. 

It just isn't as simple as some are making out. 

[HawkeyeJet]

A follow up thought, in my little dream world I live in, I actually have wanted to see a modern NFL or College(namely Iowa) offense prioritize 3 TE sets as a/thee main part of their offense for several years now.  The Hawkeyes would be the absolute perfect use case if they had a coach who could develop passing schemes for the TEs out of these sets, but they don’t have that mind on their staff.

You could argue the Jets could also be an ideal candidate for this if they were to select Bowers.  They would have 3 TEs, each with a specific skill set.  Conklin more a receiver, Ruckert more a blocker and Bowers the high end blend of both.  All capable as receivers.  Breece as your back, Wilson as your single WR.  I don’t think modern NFL defenses are built to deal with that.  In theory, would have to load up with LBs to stop the run, but Jets gain advantage in passing game with LBs trying to cover Breece, Bowers and Conklin.  Do safeties help there or on Wilson?  I truly would love to see it play out in real life.
 

 

[Dax89]

1 minute ago, Paradis said:

but why? I think ppl are getting hung on the draft selection spot, not the talent. There's this illusion that you can just find a brock Bowers on day 2... first of all, there's only 4-5 real TEs in the NFL right now who can take over a game (most have come from Iowa lol) the rest, come and go... the other part is - yea, so and so went in round 3. So did 67 other tights in the last 10 years who did little to nothing. 

It just is as simple as some are making it out. 

We have two good TE's, and TE's are relatively cheap to pick up in free agency.  

We have ZERO starting tackles, have no 2nd round pick, tackles are expensive in FA....and oh yea we have a 40 year old QB.  And this is looking like a pretty good tackle class, we're all but guaranteed to get a day 1 starter even if we trade down a few spots.  

[Jdeet]

1 hour ago, section314 said:

Kincaid was pick 25, LaPorta was 2nd rd. Not #10.

The reason those names were brought up, was because many are saying that TEs learning curve to the NFL, takes a while, and I brought two names of guys that produced in their rookie seasons. And Bowers could be even better. 

[THE BARON]

49 minutes ago, GreenFish said:

All depends on free agency. We need a LT, RT and LG before we have the luxury to not use the 10th pick on OL. And I’m a weapons > oline person. But our oline is so bad, it needs all hands on deck.

And even in the scenario where we hit homeruns along the OL in FA, I’d still go WR over TE. 

I have been looking over OT's that will go in later rounds.  I see two that may very well pan out with good coaching.

Matt Goncalves, Pitt

Roger Rosengarten: Washington,

I would like to see JD snatch one of them in round 4 or 5

 

[Untouchable]

9 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

A follow up thought, in my little dream world I live in, I actually have wanted to see a modern NFL or College(namely Iowa) offense prioritize 3 TE sets as a/thee main part of their offense for several years now.  The Hawkeyes would be the absolute perfect use case if they had a coach who could develop passing schemes for the TEs out of these sets, but they don’t have that mind on their staff.

You could argue the Jets could also be an ideal candidate for this if they were to select Bowers.  They would have 3 TEs, each with a specific skill set.  Conklin more a receiver, Ruckert more a blocker and Bowers the high end blend of both.  All capable as receivers.  Breece as your back, Wilson as your single WR.  I don’t think modern NFL defenses are built to deal with that.  In theory, would have to load up with LBs to stop the run, but Jets gain advantage in passing game with LBs trying to cover Breece, Bowers and Conklin.  Do safeties help there or on Wilson?  I truly would love to see it play out in real life.
 

 

I’ve said for the last two months that if Bowers is there, I take him and run more 12 and 13 personnel than any team in the league, by far and away.

Question is if Hackett would possess the common sense to do the same.

[Paradis]

5 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

A follow up thought, in my little dream world I live in, I actually have wanted to see a modern NFL or College(namely Iowa) offense prioritize 3 TE sets as a/thee main part of their offense for several years now.  The Hawkeyes would be the absolute perfect use case if they had a coach who could develop passing schemes for the TEs out of these sets, but they don’t have that mind on their staff.

I've been lusting for the perfect "13 personnel" package for a over decade... if you have G Wilson, B Hall and then 3 TEs lined up as 1-Y (in line), 1-U/F (move/flex), and 1-H-back (think Hernandez). it puts Defenses through a mental blender.

you create near unlimited flexibility in and around LOS, which for a 40 year old Aaron Rodgers is a perfect scenario. Ball comes out quick, he's seasoned veteran who can read the D quickly, know where/who is open - lots of YAC which is how NE won all their sh*t

[Paradis]

9 minutes ago, Dax89 said:

We have two good TE's, and TE's are relatively cheap to pick up in free agency.  

We have ZERO starting tackles, have no 2nd round pick, tackles are expensive in FA....and oh yea we have a 40 year old QB.  And this is looking like a pretty good tackle class, we're all but guaranteed to get a day 1 starter even if we trade down a few spots.  

welcome to my first post where i said, its moot because we're taking an OT, as we should.

[greenwichjetfan]

12 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

A follow up thought, in my little dream world I live in, I actually have wanted to see a modern NFL or College(namely Iowa) offense prioritize 3 TE sets as a/thee main part of their offense for several years now.  The Hawkeyes would be the absolute perfect use case if they had a coach who could develop passing schemes for the TEs out of these sets, but they don’t have that mind on their staff.

You could argue the Jets could also be an ideal candidate for this if they were to select Bowers.  They would have 3 TEs, each with a specific skill set.  Conklin more a receiver, Ruckert more a blocker and Bowers the high end blend of both.  All capable as receivers.  Breece as your back, Wilson as your single WR.  I don’t think modern NFL defenses are built to deal with that.  In theory, would have to load up with LBs to stop the run, but Jets gain advantage in passing game with LBs trying to cover Breece, Bowers and Conklin.  Do safeties help there or on Wilson?  I truly would love to see it play out in real life.
 

 

I don't hate it. Safeties would come down on Breece (but he's still good enough to win) and Bowers and Conklin would win as well. Would be great running out of that set too. The problem is that it's a 'positive game script' set. If the Jets were to find themselves down early, they wouldn't be able to run that set nearly as effectively. 

[HawkeyeJet]

1 minute ago, Paradis said:

I've been lusting for the perfect "13 personnel" package for a over decade... if you have G Wilson, B Hall and then 3 TEs lined up as 1-Y (in line), 1-U/F (move/flex), and 1-H-back (think Hernandez). it puts Defenses through a mental blender.

you create near unlimited flexibility in and around LOS, which for a 40 year old Aaron Rodgers is a perfect scenario. Ball comes out quick, he's seasoned veteran who can read the D quickly, know where/who is open - lots of YAC which is how NE won all their sh*t

Yep, absolutely.  Bill O’Brien did this a lot at Penn State too.