Green DNA Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 23 minutes ago, JetsMetsDevilsPA said: I just heard on SNY (So take it for what it's worth) that an insider close to Reddick said he is fully prepared to sit the whole season out. If so, his current deal rolls over into next year and he is in the same position (less $14m) 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARodJetsFan Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 Just now, Green DNA said: If so, his current deal rolls over into next year and he is in the same position (less $14m) If the Jets stand strong and don't trade him, that's exactly what will happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 Player signs a free agent deal. Player outplays his deal or at least that is the argument Player decides to withhold his labor until a new deal is worked out even though he is still on the old one Front office yields to his demands and works out a new deal What is to stop Quincy Williams for example doing exactly the same thing tomorrow? After all, JD''s sphincter will already have been loosened up a bit after Reddick is done with him. Quincy has shed some actual blood for this team. Quincy is not a carpetbagger from elsewhere. All of this is madness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pac Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 51 minutes ago, ARodJetsFan said: I admire your optimism @Pac I woudln't be at all surprised if this drags into the regular season. Some guys are such extreme narcisists, that they don't have the ability to swallow their pride & Reddick to me, certainly comes off as that type of guy. I have nothing factual to base this on, it's just a gut feeling of mine, based primarily on his actions, up until now. JD at this point, really has no choice but to stand his ground, as he's setting a precedent for future contract negotiations - which means Reddick will have to cave & report for something to get done - and I just don't see him doing that. I don't think Reddick will come in because he's not a narcissist, I think he'll come in because he'll do the math on what he stands to lose. No one is going to give a 31 year old headache a mega contract after holding out for a year, the Jets will still have control, and he will have lost 14 million. It's career suicide to continue this charade. For a guy who is motivated by money he sure is losing a lot of it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimjasi Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, JetsMetsDevilsPA said: I just heard on SNY (So take it for what it's worth) that an insider close to Reddick said he is fully prepared to sit the whole season out. Nothing would shock me at this point (I figured he would have reported already), but talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face! This approach would make infinitely more sense if, after holding out, the Jets didn't control his rights next year, too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 54 minutes ago, EM31 said: Player signs a free agent deal. Player outplays his deal or at least that is the argument Player decides to withhold his labor until a new deal is worked out even though he is still on the old one Front office yields to his demands and works out a new deal What is to stop Quincy Williams for example doing exactly the same thing tomorrow? After all, JD''s sphincter will already have been loosened up a bit after Reddick is done with him. Quincy has shed some actual blood for this team. Quincy is not a carpetbagger from elsewhere. All of this is madness Qunicy Williams didn't just force his way off another team due to being unhappy with his contract - and the Jet didn't just trade for him fully knowledgable of that situation. This isn't Apples to Apples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, FidelioJet said: Not interested in whining. I'm interested in winning. If Joe is so good as manipulating the cap then why not pay the guy? As for if he comes in at week 7 or 8 and they end up missing the playoffs by a game or two - then yes - it's a big deal. Him missing games added to missing the playoffs. It's a 17 game season. Every one of them is a big deal. I just can't understand Jet fans such easy acceptance that this team is so good it doesn't really need an elite Edge rusher. I like this roster, genuinely. But I'm surely not cocky about it, which seems to the be the prevailing thought on this forum right now. Not sure what the prevailing thought is, but mine is that the Jets shouldn’t be bending over backwards for a guy who’s never played a down for them and won’t even give them the courtesy of showing up to negotiate. Your position seems to be to just bend over. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 23 minutes ago, FidelioJet said: Qunicy Williams didn't just force his way off another team due to being unhappy with his contract - and the Jet didn't just trade for him fully knowledgable of that situation. This isn't Apples to Apples. Quincy Williams has outplayed his contract by any measure. If dot dot dot.... he was a free agent today he would certainly get paid more. Again, If JD gives in to Reddick why should Williams stick to the deal he signed? Why would any player who outplays his contract? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARodJetsFan Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 49 minutes ago, Pac said: I don't think Reddick will come in because he's not a narcissist, I think he'll come in because he'll do the math on what he stands to lose. No one is going to give a 31 year old headache a mega contract after holding out for a year, the Jets will still have control, and he will have lost 14 million. It's career suicide to continue this charade. For a guy who is motivated by money he sure is losing a lot of it. Reddick is in denial. He truly believes that being stubborn & foolish, will pay off for him. You can't fix stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 Just now, ARodJetsFan said: The man (Reddick) is in denial. He truly believes that being foolish, will pay off for him. You can't fix stupid. Yes you can. You cannot fix it to the benefit of your own team but Reddick will learn his lesson at the point he eventually signs with his next one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARodJetsFan Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 1 minute ago, EM31 said: Yes you can. You cannot fix it to the benefit of your own team but Reddick will learn his lesson at the point he eventually signs with his next one. He sits out this season and he'll get nothing but one year "prove it" deals, for the rest of his NFL days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, ARodJetsFan said: If the Jets stand strong and don't trade him, that's exactly what will happen. I strongly disagree. This result is much more damaging to Reddick than the Jets. The one interesting thing to me would be how this would effect the comp pick formula. If it were strictly based on the contract he could sign, I think the Jets would pretty much get back their investment if they were able to forgive the last year on his contract the way the Vikings did when Bridgewater went out for the year. If that meant that they had to cut him or he needed to have played for them for him to count for the Jets things are much murkier. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 Apparently this guy is the Duke Manyweather of pass rushing coaches. So we’ve got that going for us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicketybam Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 1 minute ago, Larz said: Apparently this guy is the Duke Manyweather of pass rushing coaches. So we’ve got that going for us He's no Chubs! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 2 hours ago, ARodJetsFan said: He sits out this season and he'll get nothing but one year "prove it" deals, for the rest of his NFL days. Le'Veon Bell got 4/$52M with $27M guaranteed coming off his hold out and many considered it a bargain. For me the biggest issue for Reddick is that he is too small to be a prototypical edge and unable to cover like a true LB. That and his age will work against him, but he sack totals will get him some money I am sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 2 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: Le'Veon Bell got 4/$52M with $27M guaranteed coming off his hold out and many considered it a bargain. For me the biggest issue for Reddick is that he is too small to be a prototypical edge and unable to cover like a true LB. That and his age will work against him, but he sack totals will get him some money I am sure. Bell might be a cautionary tale for GMs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevisIsland610 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 5 hours ago, JetsMetsDevilsPA said: I just heard on SNY (So take it for what it's worth) that an insider close to Reddick said he is fully prepared to sit the whole season out. i would say that is probably a really bad decision on his part. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymation Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 2 minutes ago, RevisIsland610 said: i would say that is probably a really bad decision on his part. I don’t think he has the guts. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetPotato Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 LMAO. "Willing to sit out all season" is a last ditch bluff by the agent. Nothing like undermining your own attempt by simultaneously posting workout videos to social media. What a moron. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 10 hours ago, JetPotato said: LMAO. "Willing to sit out all season" is a last ditch bluff by the agent. Nothing like undermining your own attempt by simultaneously posting workout videos to social media. What a moron. Best I can come up with is he put it out there to get other teams to call the Jets with offers, despite the team’s official stance that they’re not seeking a trade. Maybe the hope is they’re viewing that as potentially coded language from Douglas: the Jets not seeking a trade doesn’t mean they refuse to trade him should the right offer come in; like the Jets’ official stance “intention” to keep Adams long-term doesn’t mean something might not come along - like the offer of a pair of 1st rounders and more - to change that intent). I’ve intended to do lots of things before circumstances changed. Other than that…what does this video do for him then? Cave in to me and you’ll get the player you thought you traded for back in April? That’s pretty weak, seeing how the team just might weigh his prior-seasons footage a bit more than a 5-second clip of him playing with inanimate objects, tapping his feet in boxes then tapping away tall weebles. He’s a gifted pass rusher, but his negotiating skills aren’t nearly as elite. Best thing he can hope for at this point is for the next guys up getting exposed week 1 or getting injured. Ultimately he’s rooting for Jets failure without him, as it’s the only thing that might alter the leverage to tilt towards him, which itself wouldn’t thrill any of us as fans. If Will McDonald gets to Purdy even once (never mind 1.5 sacks or more) it could be devastating for the Reddick camp, especially with 4 tomato cans upcoming on the schedule after San Fran. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 13 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: Best I can come up with is he put it out there to get other teams to call the Jets with offers, despite the team’s official stance that they’re not seeking a trade. Maybe the hope is they’re viewing that as potentially coded language from Douglas: the Jets not seeking a trade doesn’t mean they refuse to trade him should the right offer come in; like the Jets’ official stance “intention” to keep Adams long-term doesn’t mean something might not come along - like the offer of a pair of 1st rounders and more - to change that intent). I’ve intended to do lots of things before circumstances changed. Other than that…what does this video do for him then? Cave in to me and you’ll get the player you thought you traded for back in April? That’s pretty weak, seeing how the team just might weigh his prior-seasons footage a bit more than a 5-second clip of him playing with inanimate objects, tapping his feet in boxes then tapping away tall weebles. He’s a gifted pass rusher, but his negotiating skills aren’t nearly as elite. Best thing he can hope for at this point is for the next guys up getting exposed week 1 or getting injured. Ultimately he’s rooting for Jets failure without him, as it’s the only thing that might alter the leverage to tilt towards him, which itself wouldn’t thrill any of us as fans. If Will McDonald gets to Purdy even once (never mind 1.5 sacks or more) it could be devastating for the Reddick camp, especially with 4 tomato cans upcoming on the schedule after San Fran. I agree that it helps his case if the Jets suffer an anemic pass rush performance or worse DL injury. His attention will also probably perk up if there is a significant injury elsewhere in the NFL but that one is a real long shot because he would need it to happen to a team with the cap room to give him his new deal. I am not sure how many teams fit that bill. In any event I was always of the opinion that a partial Reddick in 2024, one who is playing his a$$ off for his next deal would still be worth the 3rd rounder in 2026 but here is the question. At what point could the Jets possibly use his 2024 $15m to help craft an extension for one of our home grown core players? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 On 8/28/2024 at 8:34 AM, FidelioJet said: I don't buy that kind stuff. Every negotiation is different. All of those contracts will work themselves out differently. But if I wanted to accept your premise as being, truly, an issue then I can play the other side of that coin and say Joe is showing he's unwilling to be reasonable and that's not a good thing either. Agents don't want to work with unreasonable GM's either. Point is, we really don't know what's going on behind the scene. We know JD traded for a player and now that player is currently not on the roster. I'm just tired of all the excuses for Joe. It's one after the other with him. Get the guy in house and let's F-ing go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymation Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 17 hours ago, EM31 said: Player signs a free agent deal. Player outplays his deal or at least that is the argument Player decides to withhold his labor until a new deal is worked out even though he is still on the old one Front office yields to his demands and works out a new deal What is to stop Quincy Williams for example doing exactly the same thing tomorrow? After all, JD''s sphincter will already have been loosened up a bit after Reddick is done with him. Quincy has shed some actual blood for this team. Quincy is not a carpetbagger from elsewhere. All of this is madness Seriously? Not there is anything wrong with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 16 hours ago, ARodJetsFan said: Reddick is in denial. He truly believes that being stubborn & foolish, will pay off for him. You can't fix stupid. He will show up when he has to. He will produce when he has to and he will be an FA at the end of the year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 1 hour ago, EM31 said: I agree that it helps his case if the Jets suffer an anemic pass rush performance or worse DL injury. His attention will also probably perk up if there is a significant injury elsewhere in the NFL but that one is a real long shot because he would need it to happen to a team with the cap room to give him his new deal. I am not sure how many teams fit that bill. In any event I was always of the opinion that a partial Reddick in 2024, one who is playing his a$$ off for his next deal would still be worth the 3rd rounder in 2026 but here is the question. At what point could the Jets possibly use his 2024 $15m to help craft an extension for one of our home grown core players? A 3rd rounder in 2026 had the trade value of a 5th in 2024 (if it was otherwise, then the Jets would have happily given up a 2025 3rd rounder instead of holding out for one a year later). I said back when they got Santonio Holmes, minus his 4-game(?) suspension, that I’d trade the team’s 5th rounder for a 12 games (plus the playoffs) of a probowl WR - playing for a new contract - every single year. I’ve changed my stance on many things since then, but I’d still probably agree with that. Every now & then we’d miss out on a very cheap young player for 4 seasons, but since the odds of that are less than 1 in 4 anyway, I’d take that sure thing even still. Plus with Reddick it’s even easier, since Saleh rotates his end/edge DL guys enough they could stand to be without him more than a typical team could be without it’s WR1b for 1/4 of the season. If Reddick holds out through week 6, and they get 10 official (regular season) games out of him (9 really, figuring he’ll be used less in his first game back), plus full playoffs, and it’s at basically half the cost of his original $14MM, plus he has to show on the field that he’s worth the contract he hopes to get after that? Pfft, yeah I’d make that trade every year. Still unknown what Reddick will do, though; he’s not been following a rational/logical path thus far, and while he is threatening to hold out the whole season it seems on paper an empty threat. He’s stuck here and the union won’t lift a finger to involve themselves on his behalf. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 7 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: A 3rd rounder in 2026 had the trade value of a 5th in 2024 (if it was otherwise, then the Jets would have happily given up a 2025 3rd rounder instead of holding out for one a year later). I said back when they got Santonio Holmes, minus his 4-game(?) suspension, that I’d trade the team’s 5th rounder for a 12 games (plus the playoffs) of a probowl WR - playing for a new contract - every single year. I’ve changed my stance on many things since then, but I’d still probably agree with that. Every now & then we’d miss out on a very cheap young player for 4 seasons, but since the odds of that are less than 1 in 4 anyway, I’d take that sure thing even still. Plus with Reddick it’s even easier, since Saleh rotates his end/edge DL guys enough they could stand to be without him more than a typical team could be without it’s WR1b for 1/4 of the season. If Reddick holds out through week 6, and they get 10 official (regular season) games out of him (9 really, figuring he’ll be used less in his first game back), plus full playoffs, and it’s at basically half the cost of his original $14MM, plus he has to show on the field that he’s worth the contract he hopes to get after that? Pfft, yeah I’d make that trade every year. Still unknown what Reddick will do, though; he’s not been following a rational/logical path thus far, and while he is threatening to hold out the whole season it seems on paper an empty threat. He’s stuck here and the union won’t lift a finger to involve themselves on his behalf. Are there any time constraints on Reddick holding out and the Jets being able to allocate some or all of his cap dollars elsewhere? Unused cap dollars is one of the only unforgivable sins for a GM IMO. We have some contracts for example which might be helpful in the out years if we got them done earlier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARodJetsFan Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 21 minutes ago, Biggs said: He will show up when he has to. He will produce when he has to and he will be an FA at the end of the year. @Biggs It would be nice if you're right & I'm hopeful that you are. But I'm not at all convinced. Reddick is an unorthodox individual & I believe he doesn't follow any type of conventional wisdom, in his decision making. It's not about money at this point - if it was, I believe he would have reported already, being nearly 2 million in the hole now. "Foolish pride" is what's driving his decisions now, which is why nobody can predict with any kind of certainty, what Reddick will, or will not do next. I don't expect anybody to agree with me, but this is the impression I get from the man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 11 minutes ago, EM31 said: Are there any time constraints on Reddick holding out and the Jets being able to allocate some or all of his cap dollars elsewhere? Unused cap dollars is one of the only unforgivable sins for a GM IMO. We have some contracts for example which might be helpful in the out years if we got them done earlier. If he ends up holding out the whole season then I think they’d get a cap credit of $14.25MM next season (a $14.25MM higher cap ceiling than they’d have otherwise had). If he holds out through week 6 then they didn’t pay him his game checks for those weeks. I think that relief hits this year (as each missed game comes to pass), but unless there’s someone major they acquire for big dollars, in effect that’d also push to next year. The fines are paid & come off the cap, though. I’m not 100% sure on all of that, but definitely the $50K/day of missed camp. The preseason games missed may be a fine and they may be game checks forfeited. To Reddick that’s the same thing, but for the Jets that’s the difference between it coming off the cap or not for those 3 games. Anyway those are my best guesses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 22 minutes ago, ARodJetsFan said: @Biggs It would be nice if you're right & I'm hopeful that you are. But I'm not at all convinced. Reddick is an unorthodox individual & I believe he doesn't follow any type of conventional wisdom, in his decision making. It's not about money at this point - if it was, I believe he would have reported already, being nearly 2 million in the hole now. "Foolish pride" is what's driving his decisions now, which is why nobody can predict with any kind of certainty, what Reddick will, or will not do next. I don't expect anybody to agree with me, but this is the impression I get from the man. Reddick is a superb athlete who has made over 50 million dollars playing NFL football. He has earned the right to be his own man. He owes JD and the NY jets absolutely nothing and the Jets owe him absolutely nothing. I'm not sure why all the personal invective regarding his state of mind which none of us has a clue about? I think he shows up when he has to if he wants to play NFL football. People do change their career path, some very successfully. 30 is a great age to move on from the NFL. The downside risk is much greater than the upside reward. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 32 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: If he ends up holding out the whole season then I think they’d get a cap credit of $14.25MM next season (a $14.25MM higher cap ceiling than they’d have otherwise had). If he holds out through week 6 then they didn’t pay him his game checks for those weeks. I think that relief hits this year (as each missed game comes to pass), but unless there’s someone major they acquire for big dollars, in effect that’d also push to next year. The fines are paid & come off the cap, though. I’m not 100% sure on all of that, but definitely the $50K/day of missed camp. The preseason games missed may be a fine and they may be game checks forfeited. To Reddick that’s the same thing, but for the Jets that’s the difference between it coming off the cap or not for those 3 games. Anyway those are my best guesses. I think that as long as Reddick fails to report his contract does not count against the cap, and the Jets are free to use that money however they want to. Should he decide to return, then the team would have to make adjustments to fit him in. In fact, I believe they’ve already spent some of it being that his $14.2M salary currently doesn’t count against the cap, but (according to OTC) the Jets only have $11M in room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 50 minutes ago, slats said: If he holds out through week 6 then they didn’t pay him his game checks for those weeks. I think that relief hits this year (as each missed game comes to pass), but unless there’s someone major they acquire for big dollars 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Fangold Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 Not mentioned much in this whole saga is that the Jets want to ensure he plays less than 67.5% of the snaps to avoid the 3rd becoming a second so if he misses a few games or has to be eased into the rotation it helps facilitate that part of the deal and makes it easy to use him more late in the season against the overall tougher part of our schedule. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARodJetsFan Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 1 hour ago, Biggs said: I think he shows up when he has to if he wants to play NFL football. You've said that twice now. When in your mind, does "he have to" show up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARodJetsFan Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 22 minutes ago, Nick Fangold said: Not mentioned much in this whole saga is that the Jets want to ensure he plays less than 67.5% of the snaps to avoid the 3rd becoming a second so if he misses a few games or has to be eased into the rotation it helps facilitate that part of the deal The way this is heading, he'll play 0% of the snaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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