Francessa: Jets called Bucs about Glennon: MERGED

[Villain The Foe]

28 minutes ago, bealeb319 said:

or if Glennon ended up not playing up to your expectations we might be flying planes over the Jets practice and buying billboards demanding that Macc gets fired. Pretty steep consequences if he gets it wrong. If he were able to get Glennon for a third or lower people obviously wouldn't mind as much but a first rounder even at 20 is to much of a risk to take for Glennon (I think)

It hard for the team holding the rights to trade a guy cheaply that they know will most likely be the starter. I highly doubt the Bucs pull a first but I wouldnt be surprised if they get a 2nd. Anyone who's done their evaluation can clearly see that Glennon's 19 games has showed better play at this stage of his development than atleast 10 starting QB's from last season. 

[Villain The Foe]

8 minutes ago, ylekram said:

you are right about this, but i would be willing to bet it wouldnt be 7m

I was right about both. I also didnt say that Fitz would be getting 18 million. 

But you may be right on that bet...but if you werent dont be surprised. Macc may not pay that money, but there's 31 other teams and atleast 1 has shown to give 72 million dollars to a guy who I believe started less than 20 games since leaving high school (Osweiler). 

Glennon has 19 professional games under his belt. 

[ylekram]

4 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

I was right about both. I also didnt say that Fitz would be getting 18 million. 

But you may be right on that bet...but if you werent dont be surprised. Macc may not pay that money, but there's 31 other teams and atleast 1 has shown to give 72 million dollars to a guy who I believe started less than 20 games since leaving high school (Osweiler). 

yea, i see glennon as next years osweiler. kid is going to get paid regardless if he gets traded this year or hits free agency next year. i dont see any team fiendly extention from glennon. not after this year free agency

[Villain The Foe]

36 minutes ago, ylekram said:

yea, i see glennon as next years osweiler. kid is going to get paid regardless if he gets traded this year or hits free agency next year. i dont see any team fiendly extention from glennon. not after this year free agency

 

36 minutes ago, ylekram said:

yea, i see glennon as next years osweiler. kid is going to get paid regardless if he gets traded this year or hits free agency next year. i dont see any team fiendly extention from glennon. not after this year free agency

Wait, so you think 7 million was to "little"? If he hits free agency next year that may inflate the price but if someone trades for his rights and is the only person on the market I highly doubt that if offered 7 million per year Glennon and his agent will decline that and prefer to sit behind Winston for yet another year in order to test FA with 2 years of riding the pine, missing out on his first year at 7 million and a starting job from a team that actually traded for him in order to start him and paid him 7 million to do it. 

Osweiler started 7 mediocre games for a team that ultimately won the SB. His 5-2 record for that SB team stacked with talent is what got him 72 million. Mike Glennon playing very well but only winning 5 of those games will play a part when it comes to the money. I personally dont associate w/l percentage to talent, but when you have a guy who has played well for 19 games then benched for a year (no matter the stupidity behind it) you dont go demanding mega money from a team that could help you during your next contract. 

Glennon at 7 million with this line up will probably get him 20 million per year in 4-5 years. Glennon rejecting 7 million today and deciding to wait for FA only to get picked up by the Rams/Browns of the league will probably have him at 10-12 million but probably also ending his career because he'd be in the same situation as he was in Tampa. Nice ability, no coaching staff to really develop him and no talent to support him. 

I would think that his agent would see the upside here. Getting his client a 7 million per year contract which is more than 2x the amount of his entire rookie contact combined, getting him the #1 WR duo in the league to throw to, Matt Forte as his RB and #3 receiver, a good (but not awesome) offensive line, a top 5 defense that can hold leads and create turnovers, an AFC division where Rex is picking up the pace on ruining Buffalo, Tanny has already ruined Miami and Brady is almost 40, an actual coach in Chan Gailey who isnt just stated to be a "QB guru" but has virtually gotten the most out of every QB he's ever had to take on... etc. etc.

I would call it insane to take a chance and force your man to sit another year behind Winston just to get into FA and PROBABLY pick up a few extra million from a team that may not have the talent on the squad to compliment you and is willing to ignore that you just sat for two years on the bench, with 1 year being willingly...and to add, we wont be talking about Mike Glennon and 72 million dollars like it was Osweiler based on what I previously mentioned. He'd be a fool not to accept a respectable contract with a team full of talent. A fool. 

[ylekram]

17 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

 

Wait, so you think 7 million was to "little"? If he hits free agency next year that may inflate the price but if someone trades for his rights and is the only person on the market I highly doubt that if offered 7 million per year Glennon and his agent will decline that and prefer to sit behind Winston for yet another year in order to test FA with 2 years of riding the pine, missing out on his first year at 7 million and a starting job from a team that actually traded for you in order to start you and paid you 7 million to do it. 

Osweiler started 7 mediocre games for a team that ultimately won the SB. His 5-2 record for that SB team stacked with talent is what got him 72 million. Mike Glennon playing very well but only winning 5 of those games will play a part when it comes to the money. I personally dont associate w/l percentage to talent, but when you have a guy who has played well for 19 games then benched for a year (no matter the stupidity behind it) you dont go demanding mega money from a team that could help you during your next contract. 

Glennon at 7 million with this line up will probably get him 20 million in 4-5 years. Glennon rejecting 7 million today and deciding to wait for FA only to get picked up by the Rams/Browns of the league will probably have him at 10-12 million but also the end of his career because he'd be in the same situation as he was in Tampa. Nice ability, no coaching staff to really develop and no talent to support him. 

I would think that his agent would see the upside here. Getting his client a 7 million per year contract which is more than 2x the amount of his entire rookie contact combined, getting him the #1 WR duo in the league do throw to, Matt Forte as his RB and #3 receiver, a good (but not awesome) offensive line, a top 5 defense that can hold leads and create turnovers, a division where Rex is picking up the pace on ruining Buffalo, Tanny has already ruined Miami and Brady is almost 40 etc. etc.

I would call it insane to take a chance and force your man to sit another year behind Winston just to get into FA and pick up a few extra million from a team that may not have the talent on the squad to compliment you...and to add, we wont be talking about Mike Glennon and 72 million dollars like it was Osweiler based on what I previously mentioned. He'd be a fool not to accept a respectable contract with a team full of talent. A fool. 

when i told you to swap the numbers around, i meant that glennon would be the one getting close to 18m and fitz getting the lesser amount(around 10m). i know you have pounding the table for glennon, but those who can spot potential, definetely see potential in mike glennon. i dont think glennons potential is a secret. i have said as much last year to you when i said tampa would be a fool to trade glennon for a 3rd or 4th. smart teams are inquiring about glennon as we speak and i have heard rumors about a 2nd rounder being rejected. thats tells me alot. throw in the fact that glennon played well, while only winning 5 games for a garbage franchise. i think there will be a line of teams ready to fix tampas mistake. imo, his salary will top osweilers. osweiler didnt get 72m for winning 5 games on the super bowl team. he got 72m because he is young, freakishly tall, strong arm, and played decent in the limited time he had. sounds alot like glennon,no? i think your way off on that 10m-12m number on glennon. i guess we will find out

[bealeb319]

50 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

It hard for the team holding the rights to trade a guy cheaply that they know will most likely be the starter. I highly doubt the Bucs pull a first but I wouldnt be surprised if they get a 2nd. Anyone who's done their evaluation can clearly see that Glennon's 19 games has showed better play at this stage of his development than atleast 10 starting QB's from last season. 

He might be worth a second but any trade talks will probably end in a stalemate as the Bucs know that there are at least 4 teams who would love to have him on their roster  and any team interested in trading for him know that the Bucs only own him for one more year and will likely take the highest of whatever lowball offer they receive.

[Villain The Foe]

7 minutes ago, ylekram said:

when i told you to swap the numbers around, i meant that glennon would be the one getting close to 18m and fitz getting the lesser amount(around 10m). i know you have pounding the table for glennon, but those who can spot potential, definetely see potential in mike glennon. i dont think glennons potential is a secret. i have said as much last year to you when i said tampa would be a fool to trade glennon for a 3rd or 4th. smart teams are inquiring about glennon as we speak and i have heard rumors about a 2nd rounder being rejected. thats tells me alot. throw in the fact that glennon played well, while only winning 5 games for a garbage franchise. i think there will be a line of teams ready to fix tampas mistake. imo, his salary will top osweilers. osweiler didnt get 72m for winning 5 games on the super bowl team. he got 72m because he is young, freakishly tall, strong arm, and played decent in the limited time he had. sounds alot like glennon,no? i think your way off on that 10m-12m number on glennon. i guess we will find out

You could be right, its hard to argue against something without having anything concrete to refer to. If 10 million mean's glennon is a Jet then so be it. Though I disagree in respect to how important those 7 games were for Osweiler in comparison to just age/measurements, I will say that both QB's final starting years are pretty comparable, however what isnt comparable is the talent around them. Glennon put up similar stats with an aging Jackson, a rookie Mike Evans a poor Oline and no running game...not the same as a D. Thomas,  E. Sanders a solid Oline and CJ Anderson. I expect Osweiler to do okay with DeAndre Hopkins given that you can just throw the ball up, however, Glennon with Marshall/Decker is a great combo along with everything else and even if the Jets are put in position to pony 10 million I personally would be surprised but no concerned because I think either way he'll earn the money. 

[ASH1962]

You guys are soooo desperate.

 

Mike Glennon the bobblehead?

 

Whatever....

[mrfield16]

Guys. A 4th max for Glennon. And I love the guy.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Villain The Foe]

14 minutes ago, mrfield16 said:

Guys. A 4th max for Glennon. And I love the guy.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

A 4th for a guy you "love"? If that's what he's worth then this shouldnt even be a discussion. We have a 2nd rounder in Glennon and a current 4th rounder in Bryce Petty. Glennon is only as valuable "Max" than our 3rd string QB who's never seen the field in a live game, let alone started 19 of them? C'mon. 

[elgoman]

I'm not against it. Glennon is a good QB in need of a chance, here or elsewhere. On the other hand I think we can get Glennon next year without trading draft picks so I'd rather just wait, play Geno and sign Glennon next year if Geno fails.

[Gas2No99]

2 hours ago, elgoman said:

I'm not against it. Glennon is a good QB in need of a chance, here or elsewhere. On the other hand I think we can get Glennon next year without trading draft picks so I'd rather just wait, play Geno and sign Glennon next year if Geno fails.

easy for you to say. You're not DOLING OUT $4K+ for 3+ PSL seats in Season Tix.

If the Jets are going to charge me that RIDICULOUS AMOUNT to watch THEM LIVE! Then, despite how MINIMAL the STH PRICE INCREASE IS, I am not WILLIG TO PAY in the THOUSANDS to watch the GENO DEBACLE again LIVE as I did in 2013 & 2014. The NYJ can go F*uck Themselves in THAT CASE!!!

 

YES! I am NOT EBRIATED AT this point in time and IN VINO VERITAS!!!!!

[elgoman]

7 minutes ago, Gas2No99 said:

easy for you to say. You're not DOLING OUT $4K+ for 3+ PSL seats in Season Tix.

If the Jets are going to charge me that RIDICULOUS AMOUNT to watch THEM LIVE! Then, despite how MINIMAL the STH PRICE INCREASE IS, I am not WILLIG TO PAY in the THOUSANDS to watch the GENO DEBACLE again LIVE as I did in 2013 & 2014. The NYJ can go F*uck Themselves in THAT CASE!!!

 

YES! I am NOT EBRIATED AT this point in time and IN VINO VERITAS!!!!!

I understand your concern but we should exhaust all possible options and make decisions based on what is best for the team, not what pleases fan and ticket sales. If we wanted to please fans and get more butts in seats, we could just start Manziel or Tebow. However if we want to do what is best for the team long term, we play Geno Smith this year and sign Glennon next year if Geno fails. If you want to stop supporting the Jets next year upon Geno starting then that is your prerogative but the front office shouldn't sacrifice the team's long term viability in order to please some angry fans. That's not how teams run a successful franchise. 

[Maxman]

2 hours ago, elgoman said:

I'm not against it. Glennon is a good QB in need of a chance, here or elsewhere. On the other hand I think we can get Glennon next year without trading draft picks so I'd rather just wait, play Geno and sign Glennon next year if Geno fails.

I wouldn't let a draft pick get in the way of acquiring someone that you think could be your starting QB.

[elgoman]

20 minutes ago, Maxman said:

I wouldn't let a draft pick get in the way of acquiring someone that you think could be your starting QB.

That's fair enough but I wouldn't sacrifice a draft pick for an unproven QB that is probably going to be a free agent next year anyway. High draft picks are important building blocks and shouldn't be taken lightly, especially when said unproven QB is going to be available free in the near future. 

[j4jets]

22 hours ago, Gas2No99 said:

I'd be willing to swap our 2nd & 7th rounder for their 3rd rounder & Glennon. 

They move up 23 spots (#74 to #51) in the selection process and would now have two 2nd rounders to help build a team around Winston and a 7th round pick to boot. We get an experienced STRONG ARMed young QB w/starts under his belt by moving back 23 spots but still have two 3rd round picks to play with that can be parlayed (as MacCags did last year) to possibly recoup the 7th we forked over.

 

Value Chart Nerds: does your mystical Ouija trade value chart see possibility in this proposed transaction? What do the Runes predict!?!???!?

 

 

 

 

A trade like this is very unlikely during the FA period. This is more of a draft day trade when a team really loves a guy that falls in the draft and they don't wanna wait to select him. Besides, if they want a 1st, why would they settle for draft pick swap?

[j4jets]

3 minutes ago, elgoman said:

That's fair enough but I wouldn't sacrifice a draft pick for an unproven QB that is probably going to be a free agent next year anyway. High draft picks are important building blocks and shouldn't be taken lightly, especially when said unproven QB is going to be available free in the near future.

Thats no guarantee he will be yours. Bucs can hold on to him and let him walk as a FA and recoup possibly a 4th rounder or try to trade him for a 1st. Keyword: Try. He can be had for a 2nd rounder easily but if Kaep is worth a 4th in Elway's book, Glennon can't be worth much more than that.

[Villain The Foe]

56 minutes ago, elgoman said:

That's fair enough but I wouldn't sacrifice a draft pick for an unproven QB that is probably going to be a free agent next year anyway. High draft picks are important building blocks and shouldn't be taken lightly, especially when said unproven QB is going to be available free in the near future. 

You're right, high draft picks are important building blocks and shouldnt be taken lightly. But I dont understand, you talk about Glennon being an unproven QB, though he has 2 seasons of game tape that anyone can view, yet you hold on to draft picks only to draft unproven rookies with zero professional experience whatsoever. You make it seem as if trading a 2nd rounder for Glennon isnt a building block. He's better than every QB we have now, based on his tape he's better than the the bottom 10 starting QB's of 2015, and in respects to "building blocks" he's 7 years younger than Fitzpatrick and in today's league not even in his prime as a QB. I couldnt tell you one "proven" rookie this season but I can show you footage of Mike Glennon shredding the Seahawks defense during their SB year and a come from behind victory with about 1 minute left in the game against the Steelers. 

So sure, you can trade for a player and it could ultimately end up being a bad trade, but you could also draft the great Ryan Leaf. 

51 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Thats no guarantee he will be yours. Bucs can hold on to him and let him walk as a FA and recoup possibly a 4th rounder or try to trade him for a 1st. Keyword: Try. He can be had for a 2nd rounder easily but if Kaep is worth a 4th in Elway's book, Glennon can't be worth much more than that.

For what its worth, Kaep isnt worth a 4th unless he's actually traded for a 4th. No matter what Elway's book suggest. If a team looks at Kaep as their potential starter then that would, in the eyes of the 9er's, make him a bit more valuable that just being equivalent to Bryce Petty in terms of draft stock. 

[Villain The Foe]

1 hour ago, Gas2No99 said:

easy for you to say. You're not DOLING OUT $4K+ for 3+ PSL seats in Season Tix.

If the Jets are going to charge me that RIDICULOUS AMOUNT to watch THEM LIVE! Then, despite how MINIMAL the STH PRICE INCREASE IS, I am not WILLIG TO PAY in the THOUSANDS to watch the GENO DEBACLE again LIVE as I did in 2013 & 2014. The NYJ can go F*uck Themselves in THAT CASE!!!

 

YES! I am NOT EBRIATED AT this point in time and IN VINO VERITAS!!!!!

To be fair, that wasnt all Geno's fault. Geno was a rookie in 2013 and in 2014 Idzik purposely stripped the team down given the bad contracts by Tanny and his regime which meant that outside of Decker the team was void of talent at the skillset position, and 2014 showed that Decker is an okay #1 at times but 2015 showed that he is a superb #2 WR. 

Not to mention the quality of coaching this team had. Rex Ryan and his zero role with the offense etc. Im not saying that Geno didnt have faults, but I also didnt expect him to develop into anything with a coaching staff headed by Rex Ryan and the Ryan loyalists along with Idzik stripping the team in order to create cap room. We've seen stretches at times where the best WR on the field is Jeremy Kerley and the best CB on the field was a developing Marcus Williams. THAT'S what the Jets also had you pay for in 2014....and that had nothing to do with Geno. 

[UnitedWhofans]

Wilkerson for Glennon and a 4th-5th (Suggestion not news)

[section314]

5 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Wilkerson for Glennon and a 4th-5th (Suggestion not news)

Funny you said that. I was thinking of posting a trade idea other day, but thought I'd get killed on here for it.Here goes.   Mo to Tampa for Glennon, we swap 1sts with Tampa(we get #9)  and we get either 3rd or 4th as well.

[Ex-Rex]

On 3/15/2016 at 3:43 PM, Augustiniak said:

the jets are not looking for a 2 year solution to the qb position.  they want qbs to develop.  they really don't have much interest in fitz.

I don't know if Mac has lack of 'interest' in Fitz it is just that he knows what he is getting and is not going to overpay for him. I totally agree. I enjoyed Fitzy's play last season until the Buffalo game, but I could definitely live without him.

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, section314 said:

Funny you said that. I was thinking of posting a trade idea other day, but thought I'd get killed on here for it.Here goes.   Mo to Tampa for Glennon, we swap 1sts with Tampa(we get #9)  and we get either 3rd or 4th as well.

I don't know if they would swap 1sts. That's a big gap. But the concept of trading Wilkerson for Glennon makes sense to me. Get rid of the salary cap and possibly find a long term solution at QB.

[section314]

1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

I don't know if they would swap 1sts. That's a big gap. But the concept of trading Wilkerson for Glennon makes sense to me. Get rid of the salary cap and possibly find a long term solution at QB.

Look at it this way. They turn a 3Rd round backup into a 1st rd pro bowler DE in his prime, and still keep a 1st round pick.

[Maxman]

7 hours ago, elgoman said:

That's fair enough but I wouldn't sacrifice a draft pick for an unproven QB that is probably going to be a free agent next year anyway. High draft picks are important building blocks and shouldn't be taken lightly, especially when said unproven QB is going to be available free in the near future. 

Depends on what it is. I wouldn't give a first. But the case can be made if we finally have real talent evaluators in place this scenario:

1. Trade a 2nd or 3rd for Glennon. Sign him to a two year contract extension that gives him some guaranteed money. Watch him win the starting job and because great.

Would be better than ...

2. Trying to sign him as a free agent and have to pay crazy money for a still unproven QB with other teams bidding and driving up the price.

Any way you slice it if we have true talent evaluators in place (and we might) they will figure it out. My thought is with the cap, I would rather lose a pick than have to pay a lot of money on the open market. That could hurt the team more.

But in your defense, if we have true talent guys in place, the 2nd round pick we give up could be a hall of famer haha.

[ylekram]

7 hours ago, elgoman said:

That's fair enough but I wouldn't sacrifice a draft pick for an unproven QB that is probably going to be a free agent next year anyway. High draft picks are important building blocks and shouldn't be taken lightly, especially when said unproven QB is going to be available free in the near future. 

if a team trades for him this year, glennon ceases to be "free" & "available" in the near future

[ylekram]

here is a list of the ny jets 2nd round draft picks over the past 10 years. you make the ccall

2006-kellen clemens

2007-david harris

2008-traded (david harris? revis? keller? cant remember)

2009-traded (sanchez)

2010-vladimir ducasse

2011-traded (cromartie)

2012-stephen hill

2013-geno smith

2014-jace amaro

2015-devin smith

[sourceworx]

1 hour ago, Maxman said:

Depends on what it is. I wouldn't give a first. But the case can be made if we finally have real talent evaluators in place this scenario:

1. Trade a 2nd or 3rd for Glennon. Sign him to a two year contract extension that gives him some guaranteed money. Watch him win the starting job and because great.

Would be better than ...

2. Trying to sign him as a free agent and have to pay crazy money for a still unproven QB with other teams bidding and driving up the price.

Any way you slice it if we have true talent evaluators in place (and we might) they will figure it out. My thought is with the cap, I would rather lose a pick than have to pay a lot of money on the open market. That could hurt the team more.

But in your defense, if we have true talent guys in place, the 2nd round pick we give up could be a hall of famer haha.

With our luck, that's exactly what would happen. LOL

And I completely agree with you on your second point.  If they believe Glennon can be a viable (and potentially good) starting QB in this league, then you give up a 2nd rounder now, and sign him to a modest deal. That's far better than doling out an Osweiler-type of contract next year while he's still unproven.

 

[Jet Nut]

11 hours ago, elgoman said:

I'm not against it. Glennon is a good QB in need of a chance, here or elsewhere. On the other hand I think we can get Glennon next year without trading draft picks so I'd rather just wait, play Geno and sign Glennon next year if Geno fails.

Winning this year is worth the pick

If we dont win, if Glennon isnt the answer, its worth the pick to find out now so that we can plan accordingly, instead of waiting another year and possibly missing the chance to find someone in the draft, etc

[pajet]

1 hour ago, Maxman said:

Depends on what it is. I wouldn't give a first. But the case can be made if we finally have real talent evaluators in place this scenario:

1. Trade a 2nd or 3rd for Glennon. Sign him to a two year contract extension that gives him some guaranteed money. Watch him win the starting job and because great.

Would be better than ...

2. Trying to sign him as a free agent and have to pay crazy money for a still unproven QB with other teams bidding and driving up the price.

Any way you slice it if we have true talent evaluators in place (and we might) they will figure it out. My thought is with the cap, I would rather lose a pick than have to pay a lot of money on the open market. That could hurt the team more.

But in your defense, if we have true talent guys in place, the 2nd round pick we give up could be a hall of famer haha.

I think it really depends on whether or not Mac really believes he could be "the guy".  If you really believe he is a franchise QB, sure you try to negotiate and get that price down to a third rounder, absolutely play the game.   But if you believe he is a franchise caliber QB and push comes to shove, I'd give up the 1.   Isn't that really what you are doing in the first round of the draft anyway.   OTOH, if he is viewed as an option who might be OK, you stick to your guns and if TB doesn't budge you move on to your next option.

 

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, ylekram said:

here is a list of the ny jets 2nd round draft picks over the past 10 years. you make the ccall

2006-kellen clemens

2007-david harris

2008-traded (david harris? revis? keller? cant remember)

2009-traded (sanchez)

2010-vladimir ducasse

2011-traded (cromartie)

2012-stephen hill

2013-geno smith

2014-jace amaro

2015-devin smith

So what are you saying?

[ylekram]

Just now, Sperm Edwards said:

So what are you saying?

nothing at all. just posted all the 2nd rounders over 10 years for everyones reading pleasure

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, ylekram said:

nothing at all. just posted all the 2nd rounders over 10 years for everyones reading pleasure

I think TX is likely the only one getting any pleasure out of it tbh.

[LWC611]

So Villain, do you give up the first round pick for Glennon or what?

[ylekram]

Just now, Sperm Edwards said:

I think TX is likely the only one getting any pleasure out of it tbh.

well, in his defense, there are not alot of players that belong in the hall of fame there