Tom Brady's suspension re-instated (MERGED)

[The Crusher]

2 hours ago, PatsFanTX said:

Really?

What do you call going 47 years without playing in a Super Bowl?

Now that is embarrassing.

Normal for a Jet fan .  Just like cheating is normal for a Pats fan. 

[AzogtheDefiler]

1 hour ago, greenwichjetfan said:

So it stands to reason why you and nyjunc (unc* fan) are constantly the only "jets" fans defending the pats* harder than most pats fans themselves.

It's all coming together. 

I defend justice. Who says I am a Jets OR a Pats fan. You know what team I follow if you really read all my posts. 

[AzogtheDefiler]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

The insecurity out of both of them is pretty insane.  @gEYno would have a field day analyzing them.

Are you attacking me personally I thought we were cool? Why so bitter? Long night? 

[Kleckineau]

2 hours ago, PatsFanTX said:

Really?

What do you call going 47 years without playing in a Super Bowl?

Now that is embarrassing.

The shameless one telling us what is embarassing.  Go figure.

[greenwichjetfan]

3 minutes ago, AzogtheDefiler said:

I defend justice. Who says I am a Jets OR a Pats fan. You know what team I follow if you really read all my posts. 

I guess I don't actually care. I just figured that since you're constantly on a Jets MB and don't have any tell tale signs of being a pats fans as most of the other guys do, I assumed you were a Jets fan. Relatively safe assumption given the forum you're posting in.

"Justice" lol.

[AzogtheDefiler]

5 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I guess I don't actually care. I just figured that since you're constantly on a Jets MB and don't have any tell tale signs of being a pats fans as most of the other guys do, I assumed you were a Jets fan. Relatively safe assumption given the forum you're posting in.

"Justice" lol.

I can't recall why I joined here actually but then I found the conversations riveting. Justice and I don't mean NE. Don't get all smarmy because you hate the school I attended.

[Jetsfan80]

15 minutes ago, AzogtheDefiler said:

Are you attacking me personally I thought we were cool? Why so bitter? Long night? 

We are cool, but I don't get the whole "I better rush in and mention Duke!" thing you've been doing lately.  People aren't disagreeing with the points you're trying to make because they hate Duke.  You're just making every conversation about it, even ones that aren't anything close to a college sports discussion.  Makes no sense.

[greenwichjetfan]

Just now, AzogtheDefiler said:

I can't recall why I joined here actually but then I found the conversations riveting. Justice and I don't mean NE. Don't get all smarmy because you hate the school I attended.

At least you attended the school you cheer for.

And trust me, I don't hate that school. They haven't given me any reason to. We haven't lost a tourney game to you since I was 5, which was a quarter-century ago, and single-handedly took two natn'l titles from you. If anything, I love how much we dominate you. 

[greenwichjetfan]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

We are cool, but I don't get the whole "I better rush in and mention Duke!" thing you've been doing lately.  People aren't disagreeing with the points you're trying to make because they hate Duke.  You're just making every conversation about it, even ones that aren't anything close to a college sports discussion.  Makes no sense.

Crap, he did it to me too. Didn't realize this was his new gameplan...can't defend the cheating ways of the pats: scream duke in every thread. 

Can't believe I fell for it. 

[Jet Fan RI]

12 hours ago, AFCEastFan said:

Thanks.  Our posts crossed. 

Right. I was just lucky my post appeared a hair before yours. If it had appeared after you had already responded, it would have appeared fairly patronizing.

[AzogtheDefiler]

6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

We are cool, but I don't get the whole "I better rush in and mention Duke!" thing you've been doing lately.  People aren't disagreeing with the points you're trying to make because they hate Duke.  You're just making every conversation about it, even ones that aren't anything close to a college sports discussion.  Makes no sense.

I get defensive when people mention that championships are not earned. Fatal Flaw of mine.

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, AzogtheDefiler said:

I get defensive when people mention that championships are not earned. Fatal Flaw of mine.

True.  But I mentioned UNCW in the college one and you said "SOUNDS LIKE DUKE ENVY".  I let that one go at first.  But then you did it here.  Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice.....

You've just got rabbit ears going on right now.  It's cool.  Anyways, you shouldn't be defending the Patriots and stuff.  They're actual cheaters, and arrogantly keep cheating even when caught several times.  Duke not so much. 

[AzogtheDefiler]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

True.  But I mentioned UNCW in the college one and you said "SOUNDS LIKE DUKE ENVY".  I let that one go at first.  But then you did it here.  Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice.....

You've just got rabbit ears going on right now.  It's cool.  Anyways, you shouldn't be defending the Patriots and stuff.  They're actual cheaters, and arrogantly keep cheating even when caught several times.  Duke not so much. 

Fair enough. But my team got hosed by Goodell and people said nothing. No one came to their defense. It sucked.

[Rangers9]

Brady has made no bones about hating the Jets. Plus he understands that his head coach despises our organization. The NEP owner has gone out of his way to take cheap shots at us. When he won his first couple of SBs he gloated about it and made negative references about the Jets. In other words he took the low road. So anything undignified that comes out about that org is no big surprise to me. And in fact I love it when these things come out. The only exception might be a disgraceful episode in their history and that was Aaron Hernandez. A guy who they knew was bad but they still signed to an extension, anyways. It tells you a lot about them but I wish this had never happened.

[greenwichjetfan]

16 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Anyways, you shouldn't be defending the Patriots and stuff.  They're actual cheaters, and arrogantly keep cheating even when caught several times.  Duke not so much. 

 

12 minutes ago, AzogtheDefiler said:

Fair enough. But my team got hosed by Goodell and people said nothing. No one came to their defense. It sucked.

So you're not even a pats* fan, yet you come to a jets forum daily and defend them like crazy across various threads, and then throw duke envy at people when it's clear that their (the pats*) cheating in indefensible? 

What the hell kinda orc does that, anyway?

[Dcat]

20 minutes ago, AzogtheDefiler said:

Fair enough. But my team got hosed by Goodell and people said nothing. No one came to their defense. It sucked.

no one came to their defense because the team never earned any respect from the others primarily because of its shady culture.  What goes around, comes around and the Patriots are a prime example.  Frankly, the Patriots, Belichick, and Brady earned every bit of this mess.  They created it and they have no one to blame, NO ONE, but themselves.

[Bruce Harper]

3 hours ago, PatsFanTX said:

Really?

What do you call going 47 years without playing in a Super Bowl?

Now that is embarrassing.

Deflect all you wish if it makes you feel better.  But the Jets' lack of recent success has nothing to do with the cringe-worthy unconditional defenses of Brady from his fans.  I am embarrassed for those who claim to be educated adults but will not acknowledge that their hero could ever do anything wrong.  It makes them look like utter simpletons.

[Jet Fan RI]

13 hours ago, AFCEastFan said:

Thanks.  Much appreciated.  I have reviewed the pages of the Wells report you cited and I agree that it is compelling and well-presented (and not as difficult to follow as I had thought). 

However, I do not want to discount Leonard's analysis solely because it may appear biased and/or poorly presented.  (Though if he is just plain wrong, then that is of course another story).  But I do think that he has tried to address the two major omissions you mention, by challenging the transient analyses on which the Exponent conclusions were based.  Of course, it was not done in the most organized manner (to say the least) -- as far as I can tell, it was done through a short (6 minute) video and his endorsement (on twitter, lol) of some random guy's data analysis.  

Below are those two items.  Again, if the analyses below are correct, then I don't want to discount them just because they may be poorly presented.  But if they are wrong, then I am done and would agree that the Exponent report is compelling and has not been validly challenged by anyone.   

https://wellsreportmistakes.com/

 

I think the "problems" with the Exponent report that Leonard is addressing in this video appeared to Leonard to be problems primarily because Leonard failed to account for the "Master Gauge" normalization of the data, which I mentioned in my first post on this topic. All that Leonard has done here is propose an alternate theory from that proposed by Exponent. Even if the Leonard theory is superior to the Exponent theory, which I do not believe, the theories are not what is definitive. It is the additional testing that Exponent did, which demonstrates convincingly that the Pat footballs deflated more than what can be explained by natural causes. In other words, I am saying forget about both theories, and focus only on the original measurements made by the refs, and the new measurements made by Exponent in their game-day simulations.

Please refer againt to Fig. 29 and Fig. 30 from the technical appendix to the Wells report. The curved blue and red bands in those figures are plots of the Exponent theory. Ignore both of these curved, colored bands.

They are irrelevant. It is only the parts of the plots based on measurements that are important. The horizontal blue and red straight lines represent the avergaes of the refs measurements at halftime. The blue and red bands above and below the horizontal straight lines represent the spreads in the ref measurements about the average values. So those horizontal bands are representations of measurements, no theory involved.

The last set of measurements depicted on the plots are the large blue and red dots. These are the measured results of the game-day simulations of the warming footballs in the refs' locker room. The simulations started with footballs that were properly inflated to within the rules. The Pat balls were inflated to the low end of the rule, the Colt balls to the high end of the rule. The balls were then subjected to simulations of game-day conditions. Again, these are measurements, no theory involved.

If the Pat balls had suffered only natural dflation, the large red dots should fall entirely within the horizontal red bands, and the Colt balls should fall completely withing the horizontal blue bands. In Fig 29, all 3 red dots lie well outside the horizontal band. All 3 blue dots fall within the blue band. In Fig. 30, the majority of two of the red dots lie outside the horizontal red band, while, less than 1 1/2 of the blue dots lie outside the horizontal blue band. Note however that the red dots are trending more and more out of the red band as time advances, whereas the blue dots are trending more and more into the blue band. Hence, it is at least "more likely than not" that if there had been more time for the refs to make measurements, matters would have continued to get worse for the Pats, but better for the Colts.

Looking at the totality of measured results in the two figures, I conclude it is much more likely than not that the deflation of the Pat balls cannot be explained by natural causes.

[Jet Fan RI]

3 hours ago, AzogtheDefiler said:

Thats fair but why can't the commissioner say just that?

I can't speak for the commissioner.

[AzogtheDefiler]

39 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

 

So you're not even a pats* fan, yet you come to a jets forum daily and defend them like crazy across various threads, and then throw duke envy at people when it's clear that their (the pats*) cheating in indefensible? 

What the hell kinda orc does that, anyway?

The PALE ORC! LOL

[AzogtheDefiler]

30 minutes ago, Dcat said:

no one came to their defense because the team never earned any respect from the others primarily because of its shady culture.  What goes around, comes around and the Patriots are a prime example.  Frankly, the Patriots, Belichick, and Brady earned every bit of this mess.  They created it and they have no one to blame, NO ONE, but themselves.

I am not talking about the Patriots.

[Maxman]

5 hours ago, PatsFanTX said:

Nah, I'll pass on that one.

Thought so.

[PFSIKH]

15 hours ago, EM31 said:

Signing in from Montego Bay Jamaica to register the fact that I approve of this thread.

What happened to all of the New England lawyers who were happy to give us their legal opinions before the appeals court ruled?  Or is it somehow that the appeals court is in the pocket of Goodell and other 31 teams?

Trying to catch up here.

Compared to the JN scientist who throw out the laws of physics?

[BaumerJet]

Per Adam Scheffler: NFL does not see any need to reopen any settlement talks with Tom Brady and the NFLPA, per league source. NFL believes neither NFLPA nor anyone from Brady's camp has provided any rationale for settlement discussions. The league believes the time for those talks has come and gone, after the two sides had discussed a settlement last summer.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk

[Larz]

hey

did you guys hear 2 judges found tom brady guilty in a court of law of cheating ?

[EM31]

1 hour ago, Larz said:

hey

did you guys hear 2 judges found tom brady guilty in a court of law of cheating ?

b-b-b-b-but what about the laws of fizziks and sh1t?

[Jet Fan RI]

5 minutes ago, EM31 said:

b-b-b-b-but what about the laws of fizziks and sh1t?

Even they indicate cheating, Pat fans' interpretations notwithstanding.

[AFCEastFan]

13 hours ago, Jet Fan RI said:

I think the "problems" with the Exponent report that Leonard is addressing in this video appeared to Leonard to be problems primarily because Leonard failed to account for the "Master Gauge" normalization of the data, which I mentioned in my first post on this topic. All that Leonard has done here is propose an alternate theory from that proposed by Exponent. Even if the Leonard theory is superior to the Exponent theory, which I do not believe, the theories are not what is definitive. It is the additional testing that Exponent did, which demonstrates convincingly that the Pat footballs deflated more than what can be explained by natural causes. In other words, I am saying forget about both theories, and focus only on the original measurements made by the refs, and the new measurements made by Exponent in their game-day simulations.

Please refer againt to Fig. 29 and Fig. 30 from the technical appendix to the Wells report. The curved blue and red bands in those figures are plots of the Exponent theory. Ignore both of these curved, colored bands.

They are irrelevant. It is only the parts of the plots based on measurements that are important. The horizontal blue and red straight lines represent the avergaes of the refs measurements at halftime. The blue and red bands above and below the horizontal straight lines represent the spreads in the ref measurements about the average values. So those horizontal bands are representations of measurements, no theory involved.

The last set of measurements depicted on the plots are the large blue and red dots. These are the measured results of the game-day simulations of the warming footballs in the refs' locker room. The simulations started with footballs that were properly inflated to within the rules. The Pat balls were inflated to the low end of the rule, the Colt balls to the high end of the rule. The balls were then subjected to simulations of game-day conditions. Again, these are measurements, no theory involved.

If the Pat balls had suffered only natural dflation, the large red dots should fall entirely within the horizontal red bands, and the Colt balls should fall completely withing the horizontal blue bands. In Fig 29, all 3 red dots lie well outside the horizontal band. All 3 blue dots fall within the blue band. In Fig. 30, the majority of two of the red dots lie outside the horizontal red band, while, less than 1 1/2 of the blue dots lie outside the horizontal blue band. Note however that the red dots are trending more and more out of the red band as time advances, whereas the blue dots are trending more and more into the blue band. Hence, it is at least "more likely than not" that if there had been more time for the refs to make measurements, matters would have continued to get worse for the Pats, but better for the Colts.

Looking at the totality of measured results in the two figures, I conclude it is much more likely than not that the deflation of the Pat balls cannot be explained by natural causes.

Got it -- thanks.  I had been confused by the transient data analyses but this is very clear.  Thank you for taking the time to walk me through that.  

[Maxman]

10 hours ago, BaumerJet said:

 

 

Per Adam Scheffler: NFL does not see any need to reopen any settlement talks with Tom Brady and the NFLPA, per league source. NFL believes neither NFLPA nor anyone from Brady's camp has provided any rationale for settlement discussions. The league believes the time for those talks has come and gone, after the two sides had discussed a settlement last summer.

 

 

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk

Boo-Ya.

[BaumerJet]

hey

did you guys hear 2 judges found tom brady guilty in a court of law of cheating ?

Actually that's not what the appeal was over.

The NFL's appeal was over jurisdiction issues as detailed by the new CBA.

What the NFL actually won what's the fact that the commissioner's decision would stand even if he was part of the NFL appeals jury because the new CBA gives him full power on all final decisions, including penalties.

In other words, the NFLPA's successful attempts to take the NFL to court in order to overturn penalties are over, for now...

Something else that all players can thank TOM BRADY for.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk

[Larz]

I know, that was a goof on tx

Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk

[Jet Fan RI]

10 hours ago, AFCEastFan said:

Got it -- thanks.  I had been confused by the transient data analyses but this is very clear.  Thank you for taking the time to walk me through that.  

You're very welcome.

So, is it fair to say you are convinced the Pat balls exhibited more deflation than can have occurred due to natural causes alone?

[greenwichjetfan]

3 hours ago, Larz said:

I know, that was a goof on tx

Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk

It's incredible. This entire year since the suspension was overturned, all pats fans except afceast ignorantly bloviated about how he's innocent as proven by the judge.....whereas everyone else was fully aware that the judge ruled on Goodell's powers, not on the merits of the suspension.

Now, they're all enlightened to what this new ruling actually pertained to.

God, I hate pats fans. 

[BaumerJet]

It's incredible. This entire year since the suspension was overturned, all pats fans except afceast ignorantly bloviated about how he's innocent as proven by the judge.....whereas everyone else was fully aware that the judge ruled on Goodell's powers, not on the merits of the suspension.

Now, they're all enlightened to what this new ruling actually pertained to.

God, I hate pats fans. 

Not the only one, what bothers me more than anything else is the fact that you have the media in the Massachusetts area that is basically throwing back again at DEFLATEGATE but not at what the actual ruling entails. They call themselves journalists but they act more like war mongers than anything else.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk

[BaumerJet]

We spoke too soon...

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/15428837/nflpa-adds-high-profile-attorney-help-tom-brady-deflategate-appeal

If at all a month too soon. It appears that Bob Kraft might be in cahoots with the NFLPA for getting this former GW Bush attorney.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk