Fitz Speaks

[jgb]

22 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Not really fair to focus just on the Bills game when he won that Pats game with late game heroics.  Perfect he ain't.  I'm hoping he turns out to be like Rich Gannon, who really didn't hit his stride until 33 or 34.  Cross your fingers and hope for the best.

Amazing how some people only need one half of football from that Bills game to say Fitz stinks but then complain we need more time after 3 years to properly evaluate Geno.

[Warfish]

12 minutes ago, slats said:

Woody Johnson is all about public relations. I tend to believe that with the hiring of Mac & Bolwes, he recognizes that sticking his nose into the business of his team is bad buisiness. However, if he was involved with the Fitz dealings at all, I'd think he was involved in getting Mac to cave, rather than being part of the hard line against him. Woody reads the press clippings (OMG! How Can The Jets Let Fitz Get Away!), Mac really doesn't seem to give a crap. 

Nice to see the newest conspiracy theory is already out there. 

It can't be that Macc actually preferred Fitz and felt the price was worth it.

It must be a meddling owner!  That's the ticket!

[NYs Stepchild]

1 hour ago, Rangers9 said:

If that's the case why didn't he get Fitz to sign the 3 year deal they wouldn't budge off of for 7 months. All of this time if he could have been working out at Florham Park with his teammates and preparing for 2016. It's a failed Woody Johnson power play and stupid. And most fans are pissed off about it. 

Fitz managed to get over it. I'm sure most fans will find a way also. 

[Villain The Foe]

30 minutes ago, Maxman said:

Most fans don't seem pissed. The minority is pissed from what we see.

I'm pissed and I account for atleast two people ?

[slats]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Nice to see the newest conspiracy theory is already out there. 

It can't be that Macc actually preferred Fitz and felt the price was worth it.

It must be a meddling owner!  That's the ticket!

Lol. you're the absolute worst. 

I'm responding to someone who's claiming it was a Woody conspiracy that forced the holdout in the first place by saying that if Woody was involved at all, it would've been on the side trying to get him signed. After I said, of course, that I believe he keeps out of things entirely. 

Conspiracy theory. Holy crap. 

[56mehl56]

9 minutes ago, jgb said:

Amazing how some people only need one half of football from that Bills game to say Fitz stinks but then complain we need more time after 3 years to properly evaluate Geno.

One half - what the first 10 years of his career don't count because they weren't played as a Jet. 

[jgb]

Just now, 56mehl56 said:

One half - what the first 10 years of his career don't count because they weren't played as a Jet. 

Those 10 years he never blew as much as Geno has blown and will continue to blow for as long as blowers blow.

[Rangers9]

42 minutes ago, Dcat said:

wrong.  Fitz initial demands were Osweiler money.  Namely, $18 million per.  It was discussed at length.  Yesterday was the first you ever heard it?  OK.  If you are a true Jets fan, I guess you were vacationing or were in the midst of some ADD moment.

That was an unsubstantiated rumor we heard months ago. But it was 16 not 18. That Osweiller rumor was a connect the dots. Because both guys have the same agent. Never any proof of it but you guys jumped all over it because it made Fitz look greedy. 

[Rangers9]

Look I admit the Woody comments are a conspiracy theory on my part no proof. But I believe it. I also think the Revis signing was him telling Mac what to do. Just like Woody told Idzik to get rid of Revis as a condition for employment a condition for employment to Mac two years later to sign him with price as no factor at all. To get everyone off of his case. Again I'm labeling it as just an opinion. But there is one thing for certain in both signings. They have to be approved by the owner. 

[bostonmajet]

1 hour ago, Rangers9 said:

Sorry not a good job by Mac. But imo it isn't him it is the owner. You don't go seven months and disrupt the team and create a Qb controversy and a distraction and basically give him the deal he really wanted. Waiting until the exact last minute to complete something he could have done months ago. It was a failed power play by the Jets FO. Sure Fitz put his career on the line kind of but he wouldn't go for a bad deal. And the Jets actually can save money on this. 

You either get a GM the drastically overpays (like giving Sanchez more money because he was pouting over Tebow), can't sign anyone (like Idzik), or a methodical guy that is willing to pay but not overpay (or get into a really bad deal). Macc is the later. He signed Mo (never thought that was going to happen) and didn't spend 100 million. Fitz hasn't missed a day of TC over this and although clearly isn't the future is a starting QB so 12 million is not out of line (how many starting QBs not on rookie deal are making this?).

His goal is to build the best team possible, not make sure Jets fans don't worry or argue over the season. People say 'pay the man' or 'get it done', but it takes 2 parties and you have to be willing to hold pat if you don't want to drastically over pay. For all of the disruption, we have Mo locked up, Lee signed (yeah I thought that was a little pig-headed by Macc (but maybe he was just pre-occupied with Mo's contract), and Fitz. Lee came to the OTAs and Fitz showed up for the first day of TC. Not sure what else you could want - it is not like he was going to land Luck or Rodgers.

Now, he needs to find the money to pay Fitz (not sure where that is coming from) and if Hack isn't the future, get us the future. I would have preferred to lock Fitz up as a long term backup, but this will do.

[JetsFanatic]

50 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Nice to see the newest conspiracy theory is already out there. 

It can't be that Macc actually preferred Fitz and felt the price was worth it.

It must be a meddling owner!  That's the ticket!

It's amazing how some fans can't just be happy Fitz is signed they have to whine about the process. All I know is that the team is whole at the start of TC and Mo is locked up on a long term deal and not the Franchise tag. 

[joewilly12]

The time to win it all is NOW!!!!!!!!!  

This team is built to win NOW!!!!!! 

Lets hope Ryan Fitzpatrick can win it all NOW!!!!!!!!!

[JetsFanatic]

1 hour ago, j4jets said:

What? Fitz was willing to take this same deal months ago. How did Macc play this just "right"? Had Fitz signed for $11mil, I would agree with you. Mac panicked. Simple. We paid Fitz twice his worth. Could've ended the drama back in May or even earlier. And same with Wilkerson. He offered a deal Mo couldn't resist at the last second. Could've done the same with him too. Mo is worth his contract so I give Mac the credit for not overpaying him. 

It's a deadline league, most contracts are completed at the deadline.  How many Franchised players signed on 7/15? Most of them did. 

[Kleckineau]

Lets just hope he can live up to our high expectations of mediocrity.

[Rangers9]

1 hour ago, bostonmajet said:

You either get a GM the drastically overpays (like giving Sanchez more money because he was pouting over Tebow), can't sign anyone (like Idzik), or a methodical guy that is willing to pay but not overpay (or get into a really bad deal). Macc is the later. He signed Mo (never thought that was going to happen) and didn't spend 100 million. Fitz hasn't missed a day of TC over this and although clearly isn't the future is a starting QB so 12 million is not out of line (how many starting QBs not on rookie deal are making this?).

His goal is to build the best team possible, not make sure Jets fans don't worry or argue over the season. People say 'pay the man' or 'get it done', but it takes 2 parties and you have to be willing to hold pat if you don't want to drastically over pay. For all of the disruption, we have Mo locked up, Lee signed (yeah I thought that was a little pig-headed by Macc (but maybe he was just pre-occupied with Mo's contract), and Fitz. Lee came to the OTAs and Fitz showed up for the first day of TC. Not sure what else you could want - it is not like he was going to land Luck or Rodgers.

Now, he needs to find the money to pay Fitz (not sure where that is coming from) and if Hack isn't the future, get us the future. I would have preferred to lock Fitz up as a long term backup, but this will do.

He's got the money to pay Fitz and always had it. Him and imo Woody were just trying a pull a powerplay. And it didn't work they ended up giving him what he asked for almost 2 months ago. I said it before and I'll say it again. You don't play hardball with a player you want back as your starting Qb. It's dumb. You want the guy in a good state of mind not upset with the organization. I take it from what Fitz said that this 7 months was not a fun golfing vacation for him. He wanted to be back and practicing with the team. He made that clear in his statement. This entire episode did not help the team. 

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

He's got the money to pay Fitz and always had it. Him and imo Woody were just trying a pull a powerplay. And it didn't work they ended up giving him what he asked for almost 2 months ago. I said it before and I'll say it again. You don't play hardball with a player you want back as your starting Qb. It's dumb. You want the guy in a good state of mind not upset with the organization. I take it from what Fitz said that this 7 months was not a fun golfing vacation for him. He wanted to be back and practicing with the team. He made that clear in his statement. This entire episode did not help the team. 

I generally agree with you. Probably didn't help the team, but probably didn't hurt it either. Everyone knows the deal it's a business and he's back by training camp and the team is stoked.

[Rangers9]

Just now, jgb said:

I generally agree with you. Probably didn't help the team, but probably didn't hurt it either. Everyone knows the deal it's a business and he's back by training camp and the team is stoked.

Yeah, let's hope the players are above the owner and the FO. But I'll give them one thing at least at the end they made the best decision for the team. 

[slats]

4 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

He's got the money to pay Fitz and always had it. Him and imo Woody were just trying a pull a powerplay. And it didn't work they ended up giving him what he asked for almost 2 months ago. I said it before and I'll say it again. You don't play hardball with a player you want back as your starting Qb. It's dumb. You want the guy in a good state of mind not upset with the organization. I take it from what Fitz said that this 7 months was not a fun golfing vacation for him. He wanted to be back and practicing with the team. He made that clear in his statement. This entire episode did not help the team. 

He may've always had an idea where he would get it, but right now he's a few million short. He still needs to get it. Just another problem with the one year deal vs. the three year deal. Probably could've gotten the latter done for half the money against the cap this year that the single year deal costs. Hopefully it's fairly painless. 

[Rangers9]

Just now, slats said:

He may've always had an idea where he would get it, but right now he's a few million short. He still needs to get it. Just another problem with the one year deal vs. the three year deal. Probably could've gotten the latter done for half the money against the cap this year that the single year deal costs. Hopefully it's fairly painless. 

There was never a problem. The one year deal created nothing they couldn't handle. They just didn't want to give it to him. They know exactly how they're going to get the cap space. Including NFL rules on when and how to do it. Stuff fans know nothing about.  And next year's cap space not a problem either. We don't know now what that situation is going to be next year. If vets on the roster will be back next year or not. 

[j4jets]

1 hour ago, JetsFanatic said:

It's a deadline league, most contracts are completed at the deadline.  How many Franchised players signed on 7/15? Most of them did. 

How many FAs were signed on the eve of camp?

[jgb]

20 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

There was never a problem. The one year deal created nothing they couldn't handle. They just didn't want to give it to him. They know exactly how they're going to get the cap space. Including NFL rules on when and how to do it. Stuff fans know nothing about.  And next year's cap space not a problem either. We don't know now what that situation is going to be next year. If vets on the roster will be back next year or not. 

One year deal cap hell doth not make.

[cant wait]

2 hours ago, slats said:

Woody Johnson is all about public relations. I tend to believe that with the hiring of Mac & Bolwes, he recognizes that sticking his nose into the business of his team is bad buisiness. However, if he was involved with the Fitz dealings at all, I'd think he was involved in getting Mac to cave, rather than being part of the hard line against him. Woody reads the press clippings (OMG! How Can The Jets Let Fitz Get Away!), Mac really doesn't seem to give a crap. 

Agreed, on the surface this smells like a woody move

[FidelioJet]

3 hours ago, JetsFanatic said:

Totally disagree. I like Fitz, but Mac played it right. He got the contract done on time, and didn't pay anymore than he had to. As a fan you should be happy we have a GM who acts responsibly and is able to sign the likes of Wilkerson & Fitz. No harm done.

He got this deal done way later he should have and immensely overpaid. 

[bostonmajet]

46 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

He's got the money to pay Fitz and always had it. Him and imo Woody were just trying a pull a powerplay. And it didn't work they ended up giving him what he asked for almost 2 months ago. I said it before and I'll say it again. You don't play hardball with a player you want back as your starting Qb. It's dumb. You want the guy in a good state of mind not upset with the organization. I take it from what Fitz said that this 7 months was not a fun golfing vacation for him. He wanted to be back and practicing with the team. He made that clear in his statement. This entire episode did not help the team. 

I am sorry, but if you aren't playing hard-ball just because the guy is important to you, you will ALWAYS get walked on. IOW, if you don't play hardball, you will always overpay.

The Jets wanted Fitz locked up for 3 years, but only paying him cheap starter money for year 1 and backup money for year 2 or 3; they didn't get that. But, had they caved at first, who knows how much they would have had to pay. They didn't want a 3 year 48 million deal (which is what Fitz wanted).

In the end they compromised (which means neither side got what they really wanted). This went down to the last day, because that is normally what happens when the 2 sides don't agree. You can look at it as they caved if you want, but if you don't negotiate hard, you will always loose. This is how Mike T got us into trouble. Fitz isn't there future, so they didn't want to pay him that way.

Maybe this episode didn't help the team (except they are not locked into a 3 year 48 million dollar deal), but it didn't hurt them either. Only impatient fans were really harmed in this process.

[Rangers9]

3 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

I am sorry, but if you aren't playing hard-ball just because the guy is important to you, you will ALWAYS get walked on. IOW, if you don't play hardball, you will always overpay.

The Jets wanted Fitz locked up for 3 years, but only paying him cheap starter money for year 1 and backup money for year 2 or 3; they didn't get that. But, had they caved at first, who knows how much they would have had to pay. They didn't want a 3 year 48 million deal (which is what Fitz wanted).

In the end they compromised (which means neither side got what they really wanted). This went down to the last day, because that is normally what happens when the 2 sides don't agree. You can look at it as they caved if you want, but if you don't negotiate hard, you will always loose. This is how Mike T got us into trouble. Fitz isn't there future, so they didn't want to pay him that way.

Maybe this episode didn't help the team (except they are not locked into a 3 year 48 million dollar deal), but it didn't hurt them either. Only impatient fans were really harmed in this process.

About 2 months ago Fitz said he would sign this deal. He countered the Jets 3 year offer. They said no. And refused to budge off of that deal until yesterday afternoon. 

[bostonmajet]

1 minute ago, Rangers9 said:

About 2 months ago Fitz said he would sign this deal. He countered the Jets 3 year offer. They said no. And refused to budge off of that deal until yesterday afternoon. 

Assuming that is the case (as we have had little, yet conflicting reports from the media); how have things been harmed by the Jets waiting until the end - he didn't miss a minute of TC; and yes maybe 2 months ago he would have taken this deal, but 3 months ago he wanted 18 million a year; and had the Jets not played hard-ball then, we would have signed him to that. Maybe the Jets should have caved earlier, or maybe Fitz wouldn't take the deal earlier (I heard the Jets gave him a take-it-or we are pulling it option - hard-ball, no?); Fitz was playing hard ball too - he wanted more.

Nothing to see here. All is well.

[JetBlue]

4 hours ago, Beerfish said:

The whole crux of this argument is who else other than the limited journeyman.  If you think Geno smith is as good or better then Fitzpatrick then it was a bad move by the Jets.  I've seen more than enough of Geno smith to conclude that he gives us a far worse chance to win games than Fitzpatrick and am still bewildered that people totally dismiss the best over all offense this team has had in years based on last year.

The last straw for me re Geno was the Oakland game last year where he did what he has always done.  Throw some nice passes, put up some nice numbers, look pretty good for a few drives and then just make a few mindbogglingly awful decisions when it counts.

What I don't understand is how so many can hold this view when as a raw rookie with a much worse team, he some how managed to go 8-8. Now sure you might say the team went 8-8 in spite of him or whatever but the bottom line is he led the team to 8 wins.  Why is it so hard to believe that 3 years later on a much better team, he couldn't at least duplicate those results or win 6 games, which is the most Fitz had EVER won in his entire CAREER until last season?   

[Smashmouth]

4 hours ago, Dcat said:

wrong.  Fitz initial demands were Osweiler money.  Namely, $18 million per.  It was discussed at length.  Yesterday was the first you ever heard it?  OK.  If you are a true Jets fan, I guess you were vacationing or were in the midst of some ADD moment.

so you really think Fitz was thinking he would get 18 mil ? Do you understand how negotiations start and finish ? Fitz knew all along what he was going to settle for and he knew all along he was not getting 18 mil. You always go into any negotiation high not sure what's so hard to believe about that.

[Smashmouth]

2 hours ago, slats said:

He may've always had an idea where he would get it, but right now he's a few million short. He still needs to get it. Just another problem with the one year deal vs. the three year deal. Probably could've gotten the latter done for half the money against the cap this year that the single year deal costs. Hopefully it's fairly painless. 

the Jets offer was an Obvious low ball in years 2 and 3 and it made total sense for both parties to do a 1 year deal but more so for Fitz.

Fitz now has to prove last year was not a fluke. If it was not a fluke and Fitz plays better with the obvious added weapons this could cost the Jets more if Fitz plays well enough to get yet another contract from the Jets. Of course there are a lot of variables involved but if Fitz does have a Gannon type Improvement and the Rookies are still no where near ready this could cost the Jets more in the long run. Either way no matter how you slice it I think the deal was the right deal and probably could have been accepted by the Jets months ago

[Rangers9]

4 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

the Jets offer was an Obvious low ball in years 2 and 3 and it made total sense for both parties to do a 1 year deal but more so for Fitz.

Fitz now has to prove last year was not a fluke. If it was not a fluke and Fitz plays better with the obvious added weapons this could cost the Jets more if Fitz plays well enough to get yet another contract from the Jets. Of course there are a lot of variables involved but if Fitz does have a Gannon type Improvement and the Rookies are still no where near ready this could cost the Jets more in the long run. Either way no matter how you slice it I think the deal was the right deal and probably could have been accepted by the Jets months ago

You'd think in years 2 and 3 these guys should be ready to play. Maybe not to be elite but why keep protecting them. They're hired to be Qbs and to know how to play the Qb position. Not that the road won't be bumpy it is for every new Qb. It takes a certain number of starts for them to get better. As for Fitz if the team plays average I'm thinking they go with probably Hack. That I think has been Mac's plan all along. But if we make the playoffs and Fitz is a catalyst they might try to re-sign him. 

[Dcat]

4 hours ago, Warfish said:

Nice to see the newest conspiracy theory is already out there. 

It can't be that Macc actually preferred Fitz and felt the price was worth it.

It must be a meddling owner!  That's the ticket!

I wish you were at the Florham Park Town Hall last year when Woody ridiculed some of Geno's brain-dead decisions and plays from 2014.  I was astonished that he would do such a thing in front of a group of 50 + fans in the room.  

Of course Woody had his input on this.

 

[Dcat]

27 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

so you really think Fitz was thinking he would get 18 mil ? Do you understand how negotiations start and finish ? Fitz knew all along what he was going to settle for and he knew all along he was not getting 18 mil. You always go into any negotiation high not sure what's so hard to believe about that.

I never said that.  I said his first request was for Osweiler money.  Never wrote or said "he was thinking he would get it", but somehow you inferred that, incorrectly of course.

Reading Comprehension 101. 

[Dcat]

19 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

the Jets offer was an Obvious low ball in years 2 and 3 and it made total sense for both parties to do a 1 year deal but more so for Fitz.

Fitz now has to prove last year was not a fluke. If it was not a fluke and Fitz plays better with the obvious added weapons this could cost the Jets more if Fitz plays well enough to get yet another contract from the Jets. Of course there are a lot of variables involved but if Fitz does have a Gannon type Improvement and the Rookies are still no where near ready this could cost the Jets more in the long run. Either way no matter how you slice it I think the deal was the right deal and probably could have been accepted by the Jets months ago

the rest of his career shows that last year was a fluke.  Actually, missing the playoffs due to his horrible play in week 17 was the norm for his career.

[Smashmouth]

18 minutes ago, Dcat said:

the rest of his career shows that last year was a fluke.  Actually, missing the playoffs due to his horrible play in week 17 was the norm for his career.

when a player moves on and improves you forget about the rest of his career because we are currently living in the present.

His play was not horrible in the Buffalo game the team however was horrible and that's what lost the game. I keep hearing this 3 Int bullsh*t when on one of the Ints he was Hit while throwing causing the ball to go way off course and the other Int was a desperation throw with about 7 seconds left in the game. Fitz had 2 nice TD drives in that game with 2 nice TD throws. Obviously the Decker throw is something you want back but you also don't want a receiver out fought for the ball either. As it has been stated Fitz played 5 games in a row before that one where he basically took the team on his back and played extremely well. It would have been nice to see that team step up and crush the Bills but that didn't happen and the team as a whole was to blame.

[Smashmouth]

27 minutes ago, Dcat said:

I never said that.  I said his first request was for Osweiler money.  Never wrote or said "he was thinking he would get it", but somehow you inferred that, incorrectly of course.

Reading Comprehension 101. 

yep your right I totally misunderstood what you were saying ...I basically just skimmed the post.