The Bills enter the offseason with $88.5M in cap space

[Jetsfan80]

26 minutes ago, JiF said:

I'm super excited about watching the 2019 Jets do it all over again in 2020!

* With a shiny new WR or 2 and 2-3 new OL

[Jetsfan80]

12 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

And they haven’t won once in this century.  We’re 4-2 since 09

Sure, because that's what FA's look at.  I'm positive that 25-year old free agents care a lot about us winning playoff games when they were 15 years old.  

[#27TheDominator]

39 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Up until lately, they haven't been winning.  This is only their 2nd playoff appearance since 1999.  

Now that they're establishing themselves as a contender, and simultaneously the Patriots are on the cusp of not winning the division for the first time since 2002, we'll see if that has an impact on their FA signings this offseason.

I get that the GM went to UNC-W and all, but let's not get ahead of ourselves.  They were 10-6 and if the Jets didn't have an imploding kicker, they would have been 9-7.  They basically played the same sh*tty schedule as the Jets.  The only playoff team they beat was the Titans, and that was before Mariota, who was 2-4, was benched and Tannehill started winning. 

They were up 16-0 with 1:41 left in the 3rd and managed to choke the lead away with 10 minutes left.  This may be the start of something nice for them, or it might be nothing.  I wouldn't want to be pinning my hopes on the fact that they managed to eke out a 47 yard FG to tie the came.  They were lucky to even get the ball back. 

[Jetsfan80]

5 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I get that the GM went to UNC-W and all, but let's not get ahead of ourselves.  They were 10-6 and if the Jets didn't have an imploding kicker, they would have been 9-7.  They basically played the same sh*tty schedule as the Jets.  The only playoff team they beat was the Titans, and that was before Mariota, who was 2-4, was benched and Tannehill started winning. 

They were up 16-0 with 1:41 left in the 3rd and managed to choke the lead away with 10 minutes left.  This may be the start of something nice for them, or it might be nothing.  I wouldn't want to be pinning my hopes on the fact that they managed to eke out a 47 yard FG to tie the came.  They were lucky to even get the ball back. 

 

I'm just saying that everything you're listing above can both be true but also irrelevant to a free agent looking to sign there.  In a FA's mind, they're building something positive.  We might be also, but its harder to see that.  

[#27TheDominator]

6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

I'm just saying that everything you're listing above can both be true but also irrelevant to a free agent looking to sign there.  In a FA's mind, they're building something positive.  We might be also, but its harder to see that.  

I don't think many WRs look at that team and think "This is where I will flourish!"

[Ken Schroy]

5 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Now I am supposed to believe that the Bills ownership is some great advantage over us?  These are the people that botched the Marrone deal and hired Rex Ryan who really needed some time to learn humility.  It does look like they hired a decent group now, but it they were here everybody would be moaning about some of their moves. 

I guess the Bills are the standard by which other teams are measured now. lol

[Jetsfan80]

9 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I don't think many WRs look at that team and think "This is where I will flourish!"

I mostly agree, but I was more thinking about the Offensive Linemen.  That's a great place to flourish.  OL love cold-weather cities that favor running the ball.

Having said that, paired with Josh Allen, John Brown just had a season where he caught 72 balls (115 targets) for 1060 yards and 6 TDs.  And Cole Beasley went for 67 catches (106 targets), 778 yards and 6 TDs.  Both represent their best statistical seasons since entering the league.  Just saying.

[DonCorleone]

58 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

I met Woody Johnson tailgating.  He used to walk through the lots, meet and talk to fans.  He asked what we wanted to see with regards to the team.

Don't remember Hess doing that.  Never heard of the Mara's or Tisch doing that.

 

Yet the Maras have many rings to show for their efforts. 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, DonCorleone said:

Yet the Maras have many rings to show for their efforts. 

Yep.  I wouldn't care if the Owner went out of his way to verbally insult every fan he interacted with as long as the team wins. 

[kevinc855]

6 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

In a previous thread, I brought up the notion that the Jets' seemingly great cap situation is deceptive.  After re-signing our own, our cap space will be, roughly, $25-40M.

The Bills, meanwhile, enter the offseason with $88.5M per overthecap.com.  Granted, they have a few of their own to re-sign.  But many of them are expendable:

 

Player	Pos.	2019 Team	2020 Team	Type	Snaps	Age	Current APY	Guarantees
Jordan Phillips	43DT	Bills		UFA	52.1%	28	$4,500,000	$2,000,000
Lorenzo Alexander  (RETIRED)	43OLB	Bills		UFA	47.6%	37	$3,750,000	$1,600,000
Kevin Johnson	CB	Bills		UFA	32.4%	28	$3,000,000	$400,000
Shaq Lawson	43DE	Bills		UFA	46.2%	26	$2,569,744	$10,278,976
Quinton Spain	LG	Bills		UFA	99.5%	29	$2,050,000	$200,000
Frank Gore	RB	Bills		UFA	34.9%	37	$2,000,000	$500,000
LaAdrian Waddle	LT	Bills		UFA	0%	29	$2,000,000	$400,000
Julian Stanford	ILB	Bills		UFA	7.2%	30	$1,500,000	$550,000
Mo Alexander	43OLB	Bills		UFA	6.9%	29	$1,000,000	$150,000
Corey Liuget	34DE	Bills		UFA	17%	30	$930,000	$0
Kurt Coleman	S	Bills		UFA	6.7%	32	$930,000	$0
Senorise Perry	RB	Bills		UFA	0.8%	29	$720,000	$0
Dean Marlowe	S	Bills		RFA	10.3%	28	$600,000	$0
Isaiah McKenzie	WR	Bills		RFA	41.6%	25	$600,000	$0
Jason Croom	TE	Bills		ERFA	0%	26	$527,000	$0
Robert Foster	WR	Bills		ERFA	20.1%	26	$525,000	$0
Levi Wallace	CB	Bills		ERFA	76%	25	$525,000	$0

 

 

After they make decisions on the likes of Shaq Lawson, Quinton Spain, and a few others, they'll still have probably double the cap space that we'll be left with. 

Clearly, UNCW grad GM Brandon Beane has done a terrific job at roster building.  And now he'll be able to enter free agency with a lot of funds to play with.  And much like us, the vast majority of their needs are on the offensive side of the ball, as they'll likely look to boost their Offensive Line and find another WR to support Josh Allen.  They could very easily be competing for the same types of free agents that we're looking for.

And unlike the Jets, they're going to be an attractive destination based on their recent success.  Granted, Buffalo is a tough geographical sell for a lot of free agents.  But winning trumps location in most cases.  

right because living in western ny with a running back as your QB is a desirable option

[DonCorleone]

13 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Yep.  I wouldn't care if the Owner went out of his way to verbally insult every fan he interacted with as long as the team wins. 

That would be my bottom line. 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

right because living in western ny with a running back as your QB is a desirable option

 

It's not ideal, no.  But it's a better option than here at the moment.  Buffalo can offer more money and have been winning recently.  Those are the 2 most important factors for a free agent.  Location is a distant 3rd, at best.

[kevinc855]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

It's not ideal, no.  But it's a better option than here at the moment.  Buffalo can offer more money and have been winning recently.  Those are the 2 most important factors for a free agent.  Location is a distant 3rd, at best.

10-6 and knocked out in Wildcard....they played no body tough this year...when they did they lost

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

It's not ideal, no.  But it's a better option than here at the moment.  Buffalo can offer more money and have been winning recently.  Those are the 2 most important factors for a free agent.  Location is a distant 3rd, at best.

The first three reasons are money, money and money.  The rest is window dressing, Mr. Cousins.

[varjet]

22 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

right because living in western ny with a running back as your QB is a desirable option

I think for the most part, during the season football is all business.  

These guys have places in Miami, LA, Texas or where they are from during the offseason.

During the season they make a lot of money, work out, practice, play ball, sleep.  

My guess is that if you went to Miami right now you would see many NFL players whose season has ended having a good time.  I don’t know how many you are going to find in Buffalo now.  The place matters more to the coaches then the players.  

[JTJet]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Up until lately, they haven't been winning.  This is only their 2nd playoff appearance since 1999.  

Now that they're establishing themselves as a contender, and simultaneously the Patriots are on the cusp of not winning the division for the first time since 2002, we'll see if that has an impact on their FA signings this offseason.

You havent established as a contender until you win a playoff game.

They sit at 25-23 in the Beane/McDermont era. Went 6-10/10-6 the last 2 years. Lost their last 4 games and got absolutely embarrassed again in the playoffs (not in a blow out sense, but a futz it up sense)

I will worry when 3 things happen.

1- They have back to back winning seasons. 

2- They win a playoff game. 

3- We are in a FA battle with them for someone, and they actively choose Buffalo when the money is similar or less.

That's when we should worry. 

Read this, it's from last year's FA period and not much has changed since then, other than win a few more games. 

https://theathletic.com/790400/2019/01/29/siberian-stigma-how-the-bills-recruit-free-agents-to-buffalo-and-why-deep-pockets-dont-always-help?source=shared-article

It's an interesting read. 

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, JTJet said:

You havent established as a contender until you win a playoff game.

That's fair.  But let's say you're correct to say this.  That still doesn't help make an argument that players will choose the Jets over the Bills if the money is about the same.  At least the Bills have MADE the playoffs a couple times recently.  We haven't even had a winning season since 2015.

[JTJet]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

That's fair.  But let's say you're correct to say this.  That still doesn't help make an argument that players will choose the Jets over the Bills if the money is about the same.  At least the Bills have MADE the playoffs a couple times recently.  We haven't even had a winning season since 2015.

Wont argue that at all. 

Just read some articles about players and how they view potential teams. 

They are people looking for a job, just like a lot of people. They consider state taxes, nightlife, weather, etc etc, and have families that influence them too. 

If the money is similar, players have historically avoided Buffalo like the plague, compared to almost every team in the league. Its literally thought of as the absolute worst living situation in the NFL. 

Not as a football mind just as a person, do a test on yourself for a minute, if I offered you 80 Million and said Buffalo or NY. Where you going? 100% of people are going NY. The players are no different. If the money is similar, NY at least gives them an option for better endorsements and potential future media gigs. 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Not as a football mind just as a person, do a test on yourself for a minute, if I offered you 80 Million and said Buffalo or NY. Where you going? 100% of people are going NY. The players are no different. If the money is similar, NY at least gives them an option for better endorsements and potential future media gigs. 

 

Its just hard to see it in action.  The Bills have been targeting very different FA's than we have of late.  Mostly because they've been the far smarter organization of late.  There's a lot of truth to what you're saying.  

Did we go after Mitch Morse when he hit free agency?  I can't remember.

 

EDIT:  Evidently we didn't?

 

https://jetswire.usatoday.com/2019/03/16/jets-never-offered-centers-matt-paradis-mitch-morse/

Report: Jets, in desperate need of a center, never offered Matt Paradis, Mitch Morse

[rangerous]

all the cap space in the world isn't going to keep their qb from making dum azz plays in the 4th qtr to lose a game.

[BurnleyJet]

5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Easier said than done.  EDGE rusher has a few guys out there, but we'd have to significantly overpay to get the likes of, say, Bud Dupree.  And the WR market blows.  It's Amari Cooper and a bunch of bums or aging guys.  AJ Green?  Yuck.  

Plenty of available Edge rushers this year.

Agreed after Copper there isn’t a lot about at WR. I think it’s get an Edge even two in F.A and got 3 Oline in the draft.

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, BurnleyJet said:

Plenty of available Edge rushers this year.

More than last year, that's for sure.  Bud Dupree and Yannick Ngakoue would be my top 2.

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Right.  And the Bills have more money and winning of late on their side. 

Location is a distant 3rd, at best.  

And 2nd is just a hair above location.

It all about the money, don't kid yourself.

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

And 2nd is just a hair above location.

It all about the money, don't kid yourself.

Sure, coin is king.  Unfortunately for us, Buffalo has the ability to outbid us on anybody we'd be going after.

Let's hope we're going after different players than the Bills, and don't end up with duds like we did under Macc.

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Sure, because that's what FA's look at.  I'm positive that 25-year old free agents care a lot about us winning playoff games when they were 15 years old.  

No, youre right.  They're lining up for that last playoff win in 1995.

I'm sure youre 100% right, they're more impressed with the last Bills playoff win that came before they were born.

Try again or just say, true and move on already 

[JTJet]

31 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Its just hard to see it in action.  The Bills have been targeting very different FA's than we have of late.  Mostly because they've been the far smarter organization of late.  There's a lot of truth to what you're saying.  

Did we go after Mitch Morse when he hit free agency?  I can't remember.

 

EDIT:  Evidently we didn't?

 

https://jetswire.usatoday.com/2019/03/16/jets-never-offered-centers-matt-paradis-mitch-morse/

Report: Jets, in desperate need of a center, never offered Matt Paradis, Mitch Morse

We didnt even talk to him. But you can chalk that up to slap nuts Macagnan just being an idiot.

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

No, youre right.  They're lining up for that last playoff win in 1995.

I'm sure youre 100% right, they're more impressed with the last Bills playoff win that came before they were born.

Try again or just say, true and move on already 

 

No, they're just looking at the bigger picture:  Buffalo is far closer to contention than we are.  That is indisputable.  No free agent cares about franchise playoff histories.  They care about who looks like the better franchise/destination in 2020.  

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Sure, coin is king.  Unfortunately for us, Buffalo has the ability to outbid us on anybody we'd be going after.

Let's hope we're going after different players than the Bills, and don't end up with duds like we did under Macc.

And 30 mil, maybe more than we have doesn't mean they'll get what they want or that we won't.

 Its not us against them, same FA players.  I'm not getting the doom and gloom here

[Jet Nut]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

 

No, they're just looking at the bigger picture:  Buffalo is far closer to contention than we are.  That is indisputable.  No free agent cares about franchise playoff histories.  They care about who looks like the better franchise/destination in 2020.  

Not really, it's the NFL, you can make up ground pretty quickly.  Its not the SB champ Pats from a few years back we're chasing.  Its a one and done, never won playoff team.  Not an insurmountable mountain here.  We didn't have the most cap room a year ago, signed two big time FAs a year ago, one on each side of the ball, had money left over and wasn't all that hard

[extmenace]

Personally, I think the bills have a nice roster and will make it better by improving their o line and WRers but this team won’t be a serious contender unless allen turns a corner. Allen looks like a decent QB when the bills have a lead and the bills can play conservative on offense. The moment the team needs him to carry the offense, he doesn’t look like an NFL QB. He looks so bad throwing the ball from the pocket. He just finished his second year so the potential is still there to improve but I just don’t see it. The way that guy scrambles and makes plays with his legs, I don’t see how he doesn’t get injured. If his mobility is limited I just done see how he can succeed. 

[New York Mick]

My Jetnation mock is already getting started 

[14 in Green]

6 hours ago, varjet said:

The Pegulas started out as owners pretty bad, and rivaled the Johnsons, Haslams, and Snyders in their ineptitude.  But something happened with them, and in hiring Bean and McDermott they appear to have gotten their act together and are doing the right things.  

Last off season they signed a large number of medium FAs instead of going crazy on first/second day types.  And they have drafted well.  They made the playoffs.   In Josh Allen I think they have a QB who gives opponents problems during the regular season but loses in the playoffs.  We shall see.   The game changes a bit when you have to pay Allen $20mm and not $6mm.  

What happens when the Jets have to do the same thing with their QB, and pay him $20 million? (they're both going to cost a lot more then that btw)

LOL "can give teams a problem during the regular season but loses during the playoffs". Give me a break... 

[BigRy56]

What good is all that money when you have no QB?

[14 in Green]

3 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

10-6 and knocked out in Wildcard....they played no body tough this year...when they did they lost

And we were 6-9. I don't count the win against Buffalo's practice squad You would've loved 10-6 and a wild card loss this year. wouldn't you?

[14 in Green]

9 minutes ago, BigRy56 said:

What good is all that money when you have no QB?

Josh Allen led a 10-4 team to the playoffs. Look it up..