Why were some of you so ready to panic?

[Y3k]

12 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

So, Dak Prescott put up 30/11/65%/99+ rating last year and couldn’t get a long term deal and had to settle for one year at $36mm. Darnold hasn’t even sniffed that kind of production and certainly doesn’t look primed to do it this year. Are you paying him more than Dak if he can’t even produce Dak numbers? Because you’re not paying him $30+ because you think he might be better whenever the talent improves around him.

yea his season was great, he wasn't great for 16 games

Example:

19/33 215 0 TDs 1 INT

 

[Y3k]

2 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

See what exactly ? The bad mechanics ? The terrible Awareness ? Throwing across your body while rolling in the opposite direction ? Not seeing wide open WR's directly in front of you and running out of Bounds ? 

Hes goes up against San Fran this week one of the most pressure oriented defensive fronts in the NFL. Lets see how Sam handles that pressure. Or do we have to wait to play a terrible defense before Sam plays well ?

It was a bad game. There was no good to mask the bad. I can go through the film of any QB from  1 week and find a play where they missed an open receiver or made a stupid mistake. 

[Skeet Ulrich]

20 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

There's also the belief that he was never a great prospect to begin with. The northeast fell in love with him because of one game.

That Penn State game really warped perception of Darnold. Aside from that game, he was a mistake prone QB in college so it's no surprise he's mistake prone in the NFL.

 

I've long said he's been one of the worst QBs in the NFL since being drafted. Not all of it is his fault but there are some deeply concerning trends if we're to be honest. JD shouldn't be married to this guy, he's done nothing to earn that trust.

[Smashmouth]

4 minutes ago, JiF said:

It was week 1 and overreacting is what everyone does without fail, every single year.

That said, he was that bad.  It was concerning and the reactions are understandable.  Especially when the guy on the other side of the field isnt very good and ultimately the reason why the Bills are pretenders in the AFC and yet he looked 10x better in comparison to the kid we traded up for and passed on him to draft.  Totally justifiable when you put it all together.  

 

 

JIF you are 100 % correct its week one and in that week one we are seeing Sam Darnold make the same mistakes he made the first few weeks of his career, that's whats troublesome. Everyone should understand its going to take some time for 5 new linemen to Adjust, in that time you would like to see your QB get the ball out fast and stop overthinking sh*t. It would also be nice to see the HC adjust as well. Brady made a career of killing teams with 10 yard passes and moving the chains with long sustained drives which negated the rush when are the Jets going to realize this may be the  blue print to winning games and negating the rush and keeping your young QB from thinking too much ?  

[Y3k]

3 minutes ago, Skeet Ulrich said:

That Penn State game really warped perception of Darnold. Aside from that game, he was a mistake prone QB in college so it's no surprise he's mistake prone in the NFL.

 

I've long said he's been one of the worst QBs in the NFL since being drafted. Not all of it is his fault but there are some deeply concerning trends if we're to be honest. JD shouldn't be married to this guy, he's done nothing to earn that trust.

none sense... he carried terrible USC teams into relevancy. His issue in college was fumbling, he solved that in the NFL

[Irish Jet]

Eventually the excuses simply don't matter any more. It's at a point where we have to see something from Sam, some consistency at least. He has to show that he can be a top 10 QB in this league if we're to justify passing on a top QB in the next draft. At the minute he's showing nothing close to that. 

He's been put in a terrible situation that only seems to be getting worse. That sucks for him but he can still only be judged on what he's done on the field - His performance on Sunday was terrible even relative to what was around him - he was one of the worst performers on either team if not the worst.

If right now we had the #1 pick passing on Lawrence in the hope that Sam may someday work out in a better situation would be total insanity. 

[Y3k]

I keep hearing "same mistakes" 

Did you really come into this year telling yourself, jeeze I hope Darnold solved his issue with not throwing the ball away and getting delay of game penalties after time outs?

[T0mShane]

11 minutes ago, Y3k said:

I think this is a somewhat fair and well articulated post. But l disagree with a few things. 

Missing receivers - yea I agree he was off. But this is not normal for Darnold, I don't see how this could be treated as anything other than he had a bad day. Hes typically and supremely accurate thrower... especially on the run. This is not a case of making "the same mistakes"

Missing wide open receivers... he missed crowder on a scramble. We are acting like this was happening the entire day. 

Throwing underneath with no TO. There was no other option there, took the gain to at least come home with some points. You wanted him to chuck it into the end zone off his back foot? 

Missreading blitzes.. I guess blitzes fail against every other QB in the NFL 100% of the time. He "miss read" ONE blitz... was thinking that an all out was coming and throwing to Hogan. The crowder TD was also an audible off a blitz.... 

Day dreaming during a time out. So you're making judgments off 2 seconds of camera time? Thats absurd. 

The pick was dumb. But I saw Brett Farve make mistakes like that his entire career. It doesn't make or break guys. We were down 21-0. It was third down, a defender was in his face (Couldn't have ran). Bad play, but the end of the world? It's been weeks since he made a mistake like that. The guy has clearly cut down the rate of the dumb picks... Why not see if we can limit those to say, 3 this year? Maybe then 2 next year? Then 1? Like is that really a hill to die on?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is 500 words trying to explain Darnold’s many failures on Sunday, but sure, he’s totally on track and everything is fine

[Smashmouth]

3 minutes ago, Y3k said:

It was a bad game. There was no good to mask the bad. I can go through the film of any QB from  1 week and find a play where they missed an open receiver or made a stupid mistake. 

Hey I saw Drew Brees and Tom Brady make dumb mistakes yesterday. Every QB in the NFL makes a few in probably every game but then on the next drive they are lights out. I don't see that with Sam 

[jgb]

Just now, Y3k said:

I keep hearing "same mistakes" 

Did you really come into this year telling yourself, jeeze I hope Darnold solved his issue with not throwing the ball away and getting delay of game penalties after time outs?

No. And, sadly, it now appears that our expectations were too high. Back to basics... again.

[jgb]

26 minutes ago, ECURB said:

Darnold just doesn’t have the mojo... don’t know how else to explain it.

I feel like 60yo Brett Favre would show up on Sunday and accomplish more without reading a playbook.

Reminds me of when they fixated on Sanchez learning the offense in and out instead of just letting him play naturally with some mistakes.

I wonder who on here said the downside comp to Darnold was Sanchez? Hmm.....

[Smashmouth]

10 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

I think Darnold's issues arise from too much "thinking". He's not that kind of player. Gase has a "thinking man's" playbook. That's why Manning liked him so much. A QB only succeeds if the playbook is married to his talents. That is why Gase is the wrong coach. He is trying to make Darnold fit into his generic idea of what a QB does, rather than run a playbook that is tailored to what Darnold does well. 

Darnold needs a playbook tailored to his mobility and accuracy and his free wheeling style. One that is not afraid of risky play calls and challenges the QB to make plays. Rather than one that challenges the QB to dissect the D, identify the target based on coverages, and make an easy throw. That is NOT who Darnold is. Playing style-wise and mental makeup-wise -- he's not Tom Brady or Payton Manning. He's more in the line of Brett Favre, John Elway and Patrick Mahomes when it comes to mental makeup and play style. His an athlete and gun slinger. Let the kid play. 

Good points I would not mind seeing the Jets put this kid in the hurry up offense for a few series (or even mix them in a bit) and see how he plays in that environment keeping him from as you say "thinking too much" 

I always felt this way about Sanchez who seemed to always play well in the hurry but Rex would never allow it because of "HIS" Defense

[jgb]

12 minutes ago, Y3k said:

yea his season was great, he wasn't great for 16 games

Example:

19/33 215 0 TDs 1 INT

 

So what's your point here? Because one of the league's better QBs had a bad game that any QB that has a bad game can be one of the league's better QBs?

[JustInFudge]

2 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

JIF you are 100 % correct its week one and in that week one we are seeing Sam Darnold make the same mistakes he made the first few weeks of his career, that's whats troublesome. Everyone should understand its going to take some time for 5 new linemen to Adjust, in that time you would like to see your QB get the ball out fast and stop overthinking sh*t. It would also be nice to see the HC adjust as well. Brady made a career of killing teams with 10 yard passes and moving the chains with long sustained drives which negated the rush when are the Jets going to realize this may be the  blue print to winning games and negating the rush and keeping your young QB from thinking too much ?  

The boneheaded mistakes and now seeing that he was trigger shy is super concerning.  Broken type concerning. That's why I said all of the reactions are justifiable.  I just know last year I felt the same way and he bounced back.  I'm hoping that adjusting to basically a brand new cast of characters and seeing some of this on tape wakes him up and we start seeing some of what I found be very encouraging just 4 days ago.  After getting a day to see some plays more closely, he routinely makes a lot of the plays he missed, so I'm willing to see if he can get it right Sunday before I completely toss him over the cliff but right now I'm just holding on to the jersey as he looks over the edge.

 

 

[JustInFudge]

7 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Hey I saw Drew Brees and Tom Brady make dumb mistakes yesterday. Every QB in the NFL makes a few in probably every game but then on the next drive they are lights out. I don't see that with Sam 

Honestly, those 2 dudes look completely shot.  lol.  That said, and to your earlier point, Payton makes the game so easy on Brees.  Arians not so much but the way Payton runs screens and uses motions to get easy reads/mismatches in amazing and he's doing that for a HOF'er. 

[Y3k]

9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

This is 500 words trying to explain Darnold’s many failures on Sunday, but sure, he’s totally on track and everything is fine

Not saying that. There is a difference between having a terrible game it and it being some kind of indictment on his career. 

[Y3k]

4 minutes ago, jgb said:

So what's your point here? Because one of the league's better QBs had a bad game that any QB that has a bad game can be one of the league's better QBs?

My point was that the expectation shouldn not be to have 16 GREAT games...

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Y3k said:

My point was that the expectation shouldn not be to have 16 GREAT games...

Gotta assume TS misspoke there.

[TuscanyTile2]

18 minutes ago, jgb said:

You may not agree, but after 27 starts, I wouldn't say the view that Darnold doesn't have "it" is "ridiculous."

People were optimistic on Darnold going into this year.  He's had one bad game this year (in a season with a brand new OL and a short training camp) and suddenly he needs to go?!  He's still younger than the #1 overall pick that was drafted this year (Burrow). 

And let's not forget that the coaching in our division (other than ours) is some of the best in football.  Our CS is the only staff in the division that's a liability.  That just makes everything more difficult for a young QB trying to figure things out.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Y3k said:

Not saying that. There is a difference between having a terrible game it and it being some kind of indictment on his career. 

The indictment on his career is the 27 games he’s started for the franchise already, and the subsequent 15 games he has left to prove himself worthy of QB1 money.

[jgb]

4 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

People were optimistic on Darnold going into this year.  He's had one bad game this year (in a season with a brand new OL and a short training camp) and suddenly he needs to go?!  He's still younger than the #1 overall pick that was drafted this year (Burrow). 

And let's not forget that the coaching in our division (other than ours) is some of the best in football.  Our CS is the only staff in the division that's a liability.  That just makes everything more difficult for a young QB trying to figure things out.

Some people were optimistic. Some were not. I'd agree if you were optimistic before last week, than one game (where he did much of the same he's always done as a pro) should not flip you to pessimistic.

But if you were already not on board, well, then guess what you're still not. Let's not confuse prescience for panic.

[Smashmouth]

3 minutes ago, JiF said:

Honestly, those 2 dudes look completely shot.  lol.  That said, and to your earlier point, Payton makes the game so easy on Brees.  Arians not so much but the way Payton runs screens and uses motions to get easy reads/mismatches in amazing and he's doing that for a HOF'er. 

Yes ! and how many times did you see scheme have receivers running wide open in the middle of the field. I honestly can't remember when ive seen a Jet WR or RB or TE running wide open due to scheme. Obviously thats on the coach and when it does happen the QB's are so shocked they crumble and make a bad throw LOL

[munchmemory]

For me it's simple:  Any third year QB who's supposed to be the franchise savior (what a complete farce) who's still throwing INTs across his body off his back foot is Geno.   Don't put your money on Darnold 'cause he looks nervous on the field and soon to be another in a host of former Jet QBs.

[Smashmouth]

11 minutes ago, jgb said:

I wonder who on here said the downside comp to Darnold was Sanchez? Hmm.....

I wish Darnold had Sanchez footwork

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

Gotta assume TS misspoke there.

I really didn’t. Nothing in his past has shown he’s worthy of an extension, so he has this year to change that. He has to put together 16 games where he looks a lot better than he has at any point prior because he’s up against the clock. His first time out under those conditions was awful. He needs to start looking like an elite QB here the rest of the way or it’s reset time.

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

Some people were optimistic. Some were not. I'd agree if you were optimistic than one game (where he did much of the same he's always done as a pro) should not flip you to pessimistic.

But if you were already not on board, well, then guess what you're still not. Let's not confuse prescience for panic.

Fair enough.  I was (and still am) very optimistic about Sam.  It's way too early to give up on him.  Imagine he ends up in New England under BB?  He'd be absolutely thriving in that situation.  

[slimjasi]

I agree that he is still very young, but the 3rd year is historically considered a big barometer year for starting QBs. Parcells used to say that if your QB doesn't have it figured out by the end of his 3rd year, it's time to start looking for your next QB. So, yes, it was only one bad game, but it was a big red flag.

I would go so far as to say that the next 3 weeks will likely make or break Sam's career here. If he doesn't play a LOT better than he did on Sunday, we are 100% going to start this season 0-4. That means we would have a second consecutive season under Gase that is over well before Halloween. This locker room won't survive that. The team will collapse, Darnold will collapse, and we will be looking for another Head coach and QB for 2021 (If by some miracle we actually have the number 1 pick, then we can just draft Lawrence and start over - but we never get the number 1 pick when a guy like Lawrence is available)

It's not over for Sam here, but things are getting late very quickly. He's gotta ball . . . like now. 

[jgb]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

I really didn’t. Nothing in his past has shown he’s worthy of an extension, so he has this year to change that. He has to put together 16 games where he looks a lot better than he has at any point prior because he’s up against the clock. His first time out under those conditions was awful. He needs to start looking like an elite QB here the rest of the way or it’s reset time.

It's moot anyway. There is almost a 0% chance that with this coaching staff and this team that Darnold can display the requisite consistency this season to justify further investment.

[Beerfish]

Jets try and help Darnold swim by tossing him a boat anchor (Gase)

[TuscanyTile2]

9 minutes ago, munchmemory said:

For me it's simple:  Any third year QB who's supposed to be the franchise savior (what a complete farce) who's still throwing INTs across his body off his back foot is Geno.   Don't put your money on Darnold 'cause he looks nervous on the field and soon to be another in a host of former Jet QBs.

Eli Manning took 3.5 years (including throwing bad INTs off his back foot) before he figured things out. 

And that was with a HOF coach.

[jgb]

4 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Fair enough.  I was (and still am) very optimistic about Sam.  It's way too early to give up on him.  Imagine he ends up in New England under BB?  He'd be absolutely thriving in that situation.  

I can count the number of QBs on one hand who have starts to their career similar to Darnold's and have become even consistent above-average QBs in the league.

Betting on Darnold to get it is the realm of hope at this point and not a good bet. This is why some of us called for legitimate competition in the QB room.

[ScarletKnight89]

The best argument I can make for Darnold right now is that he's only played 4 seasons of football at QB ever. That includes his time in the NFL, college, and high school. He's very young and new to the position.

He has put together many good games but he's never turned the corner. He goes back to being inconsistent. That's a problem.

Gase is clueless but I think it's a cop out to just blame the coaching staff. It's like it has to be everyones fault but Darnold's. Adam Gase wasn't missing receivers on Sunday. Sam Darnold was. At some point there has to be accountability.

If the Jets go on to have a really bad season and get a good draft pick and Darnold is still a question mark, the Jets would be wise to fire Gase (obviously), hire an offensive minded coach, and draft a QB like Trevor Lawrence or Justin Fields instead of trying to find the next head coach that can fix Sam Darnold. 

[shuler82]

It’s Tuesday. I’m finally ready to give this team a pass for what happened against the Bills. They sucked, Sam sucked, Gase especially sucked. I get it. I was ranting all game at my TV like everyone else. You couldn’t ask for a worse or more discouraging start.

Before the game I was telling a friend of mine that I’d be happy with competence this year. The roster isn’t great, the schedule is tough - just give me a team that’s prepared and an offense that has made strides in year two of Gase. 
 

It all came crashing down on Sunday, and the reality is sinking in  that what we saw could be what we’ll get this year. BUT... Then again maybe the Bills are who a lot of pundits thought they were. Maybe this team did need a game to knock the rust off. Maybe Sam just picked the worst possible game to lay an egg.

So onto week two we go. The leash has tightened. Expectations lowered. Do I expect a drastically different outcome? probably not. But I’ve been watching football too long to claim one week will definitively tell the tale of this season.

[SAR I]

36 minutes ago, Y3k said:

I think this is a somewhat fair and well articulated post. But l disagree with a few things. 

Missing receivers - yea I agree he was off. But this is not normal for Darnold, I don't see how this could be treated as anything other than he had a bad day. Hes typically and supremely accurate thrower... especially on the run. This is not a case of making "the same mistakes"

Missing wide open receivers... he missed crowder on a scramble. We are acting like this was happening the entire day. 

Throwing underneath with no TO. There was no other option there, took the gain to at least come home with some points. You wanted him to chuck it into the end zone off his back foot? 

Missreading blitzes.. I guess blitzes fail against every other QB in the NFL 100% of the time. He "miss read" ONE blitz... was thinking that an all out was coming and throwing to Hogan. The crowder TD was also an audible off a blitz.... 

Day dreaming during a time out. So you're making judgments off 2 seconds of camera time? Thats absurd. 

The pick was dumb. But I saw Brett Farve make mistakes like that his entire career. It doesn't make or break guys. We were down 21-0. It was third down, a defender was in his face (Couldn't have ran). Bad play, but the end of the world? It's been weeks since he made a mistake like that. The guy has clearly cut down the rate of the dumb picks... Why not see if we can limit those to say, 3 this year? Maybe then 2 next year? Then 1? Like is that really a hill to die on

Let me be clear-  Sam is allowed to have a bad game.  It happens.  No one is expecting perfection.

But it's Week 1, you've known your opponent for 5 months, you've been quarantined at the facility of your personal quarterback whisperer for 4 months, you've had 5 weeks of training camp with the exact same staff and the identical playbook as the year before, and you.....you......sh*t the bed like that?

Inexcusable.  That's the most focused-only-on-football concentration and specific opponent preparation Sam Darnold will ever have in his entire career and he looked lost and rattled from the opening gun.

SAR I

[TuscanyTile2]

4 minutes ago, jgb said:

I can count the number of QBs who have starts to their career similar to Darnold's and have become even consistent above-average QBs in the league.

Betting on Darnold to get it is the realm of hope at this point and not a good bet. This is why some of us called for legitimate competition in the QB room.

I remember one who won 2 Superbowls, who also happened to play in MetLife Stadium (for the team in blue).