“Pitch Was Very Difficult”- Lionel Messi Annoyed With Copa America Playing Conditions

[Bugg]

3 hours ago, bgivs21 said:

Tuned into the game last night and first thing I said was the field looks terrible

It looked like it was patched together. Not sure how they can host the World Cup final there in 2 years without drastic changes. 

You could see points last night where it looked like it had seams. For the  1994 World Cup, and for a few seasons of the NFL after, they have trays of grass they moved in and out depending on wear and tear. Didn't work very well, has no roots, and you can't have 2 NFL teams plus concerts on it and expect it will work. 

[PS17]

2 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

Allen Iverson was a tremendous athlete. And I'm sure you can appreciate that 6'0 is much different than 5'7. Iverson probably could have been an NFL WR if that's what he focused on. Messi isn't a pro in any sport but soccer and table tennis.

 

This is such a stupid take. Messi is arguably the best player ever in the most global sport ever. 

[Jack Straw]

11 minutes ago, GreenFish said:

Not sure why that matters. He’s great at soccer. Doesn’t have to be good at anything else.

What Messi has is great field vision and decision making. Often times QBs fail because they don’t have those traits.

And his soccer specific skills are through the roof. It’s a like a shortstop who has soft-hands. He has great touch on the ball.

The equivalent in football would be Tom Brady. Would Brady be good at anything but QB? No. But he is the arguably the goat because he sees the field well and makes quick decisions. 

Tom Brady was drafted in the 18th round by the Montreal Expos in 1995, so there goes that thesis.

[Jack Straw]

2 minutes ago, PS17 said:

This is such a stupid take. Messi is arguably the best player ever in the most global sport ever. 

I haven't argued otherwise, but hey, do you.

[GreenFish]

Just now, Jack Straw said:

Tom Brady was drafted in the 18th round by the Montreal Expos in 1995, so there goes that thesis.

That’s a weird comeback. There isnt a draft in soccer. And it goes to show how people dont understand what it takes to be a good QB. Hence the reason you are overlooking Messi. 

[bicketybam]

This thread is becoming quite the Messi!

[Jack Straw]

3 minutes ago, GreenFish said:

That’s a weird comeback. There isnt a draft in soccer. And it goes to show how people dont understand what it takes to be a good QB. Hence the reason you are overlooking Messi. 

You're the one who said that Brady wouldn't be good at anything but QB, not me. I'm simply introducing facts that refute your claim (he was an excellent baseball player).

Messi is a great soccer player and a fine athlete for his size but is not one of the greatest athletes on the planet. It's really not that complicated. 

 

[Fantasy Island]

[Sarge4Tide]

Lionel Ritchie agrees 

[CanadienJetsFan]

I know there aren’t many “football” fans here so let me explain just how bad the grass was in golf terms.

It’d be like the Masters greens rolling at 2 on the stimpmeter.  
 

Embarrassing.

[Gastineau Lives]

7 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I’d watch a documentary about the rolling clown show of feckless corruption and failson idiocy that led to MetLife getting built. Could probably do a Cherobyl-like miniseries about it. 

Write it. Cast me.

[#27TheDominator]

2 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

You're the one who said that Brady wouldn't be good at anything but QB, not me. I'm simply introducing facts that refute your claim (he was an excellent baseball player).

Messi is a great soccer player and a fine athlete for his size but is not one of the greatest athletes on the planet. It's really not that complicated. 

 

^ not as excellent as Drew Henson

[HighPitch]

20 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

Yes, Messi's athleticism at 5'7 and 148 pounds make the Lebron's, Jordan's, and Bo Jackson's of the world shiver in fear.

Now ur acting all crazy like. Messi is a god like figure. Soccer players are studs stop hating its very anti deadheadish

[HighPitch]

15 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

 

Messi is a great soccer player and a fine athlete for his size but is not one of the greatest athletes on the planet. It's really not that complicated. 

 

Yes its complicated because youre making it that way.

first off messi is one of the maybe 5 greatest soccer players of all time.

Size doesnt determine athleticism.
 

The dude is jerry rice, walt chamberlain, alex rodriguez level good. Plus, soccer is by far the most popular sport on the planet. So worldwide, he crushes the others mentioned.
 

Dont be a hater. Go find a woman that will be good to you and not hide your whiskey and try to offer tea 

 

[Drums]

17 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

You're the one who said that Brady wouldn't be good at anything but QB, not me. I'm simply introducing facts that refute your claim (he was an excellent baseball player).

Messi is a great soccer player and a fine athlete for his size but is not one of the greatest athletes on the planet. It's really not that complicated. 

 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

23 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

Yes, Messi's athleticism at 5'7 and 148 pounds make the Lebron's, Jordan's, and Bo Jackson's of the world shiver in fear.

Well, that's a stupid comment just about any way you look at it.

[Claymation]

"The pitch was angry that day, my friends, like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli!"

- Lionel Messi

[Jack Straw]

Soccer, like lacrosse, attracts second tier athletes, particularly in the US. The "best" soccer players (especially in this country) stop playing soccer at 12 years old and opt for other sports.

Everyone can cry about this if they'd like, but if the Lebron James' and Bo Jacksons of the world opted for soccer instead of basketball and football/baseball, Messi wouldn't be the top player in the world. He's a great player, but that's because he's not going against the best athletes in the world, who are all playing basketball, football, and baseball -- he's only going against the best athletes that are playing soccer.

NFL stars like Odell Beckham could have been a US National level soccer player, because he's a truly great athlete, whereas Messi could never sniff an NFL roster. 

I'm not debating whether Messi is a great soccer player and athlete -- he obviously is. But his athletic excellence is specific to soccer and  wouldn't translate to other sports. He is not "one of the greatest athletes on the planet." He's just one of the best athletes playing soccer. 

That's a big distinction and one that is quite triggering for people. 

 

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

Jet home games should be played on blacktop in an abandoned parking lot.

A way to honor the mystique of NYC that Woodrow seems so intent on capitalizing on, and probably safer than the MetLife turf anyway.

🤣

[Bugg]

1 hour ago, Jack Straw said:

Soccer, like lacrosse, attracts second tier athletes, particularly in the US. The "best" soccer players (especially in this country) stop playing soccer at 12 years old and opt for other sports.

Everyone can cry about this if they'd like, but if the Lebron James' and Bo Jacksons of the world opted for soccer instead of basketball and football/baseball, Messi wouldn't be the top player in the world. He's a great player, but that's because he's not going against the best athletes in the world, who are all playing basketball, football, and baseball -- he's only going against the best athletes that are playing soccer.

NFL stars like Odell Beckham could have been a US National level soccer player, because he's a truly great athlete, whereas Messi could never sniff an NFL roster. 

I'm not debating whether Messi is a great soccer player and athlete -- he obviously is. But his athletic excellence is specific to soccer and  wouldn't translate to other sports. He is not "one of the greatest athletes on the planet." He's just one of the best athletes playing soccer. 

That's a big distinction and one that is quite triggering for people. 

 

Think that is changing, and that soccer does now attract superior athletes. But the problem it's still a very suburban and  everyone gets a trophy,  parents wrapping their kids in bubble wrap kinda thing. And that's the problem. Lax and hockey are also like that, but the systems in the US in those sports let every kid know it's hard and you have to work. Not that soccer kids get it easy, but it's a bit too casual compared to other sports. Lax and hockey,  the winnowing happens very early. Nobody is gonna indulge kids in any fantasies. And soccer is still a bit soft here. 

 

Messi is an Argentine. If he was born in the US, Mexico or Canada, might very well have become a good hockey , lax or baseball player. Jose Altuve and Martin St.Louis aren't even that tall. 

[Rich Thornburgh]

On 7/10/2024 at 7:45 AM, Jack Straw said:

Yes, Messi's athleticism at 5'7 and 148 pounds make the Lebron's, Jordan's, and Bo Jackson's of the world shiver in fear.

Athletes come in different shapes in sizes and here’s the crazy thing they play different sports that require different skill sets

[Rich Thornburgh]

3 hours ago, Bugg said:

Think that is changing, and that soccer does now attract superior athletes. But the problem it's still a very suburban and  everyone gets a trophy,  parents wrapping their kids in bubble wrap kinda thing. And that's the problem. Lax and hockey are also like that, but the systems in the US in those sports let every kid know it's hard and you have to work. Not that soccer kids get it easy, but it's a bit too casual compared to other sports. Lax and hockey,  the winnowing happens very early. Nobody is gonna indulge kids in any fantasies. And soccer is still a bit soft here. 

 

Messi is an Argentine. If he was born in the US, Mexico or Canada, might very well have become a good hockey , lax or baseball player. Jose Altuve and Martin St.Louis aren't even that tall. 

Every kid who plays soccer gets a trophy? Coulda fooled me

 

Organized soccer is cheaper and easier to play than the other sports. Literally all you need is a field and a ball

[Jack Straw]

2 minutes ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

Every kid who plays soccer gets a trophy? Coulda fooled me

 

Organized soccer is cheaper and easier to play than the other sports. Literally all you need is a field and a ball

Wait until you hear about this crazy sport called basketball -- all it requires is a patch of concrete, a rim, and a ball. 

Three year olds play player soccer because it's the easiest sport to play and requires very little athleticism to participate. If you can jog lightly, you are qualified for soccer.

 

[Rich Thornburgh]

1 minute ago, Jack Straw said:

Wait until you hear about this crazy sport called basketball -- all it requires is a patch of concrete, a rim, and a ball. 

Three year olds play player soccer because it's the easiest sport to play and requires very little athleticism to participate. If you can jog lightly, you are qualified for soccer.

 

So who is a better athlete?  Zach Wilson or Lionel Messi?  Why don’t guys who suck in the nba and nfl just go dominate in FIFA?  Are they too manly?

[Jack Straw]

10 minutes ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

Athletes come in different shapes in sizes and here’s the crazy thing they play different sports that require different skill sets

Yes, you're right. But when one makes the claim "greatest athlete in the world," they are now comparing that athlete to all others across every sport. It's an extraordinary claim and that requires extraordinary evidence. 

Messi certainly doesn't belong in that conversation anymore than Lin Dan. 
 

[Jack Straw]

1 minute ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

So who is a better athlete?  Zach Wilson or Lionel Messi?  Why don’t guys who suck in the nba and nfl just go dominate in FIFA?  Are they too manly?

Because that's not the sport they grew up playing. And you're confusing skill with athleticism. They are not the same. Messi is extremely skilled -- that doesn't make him "the greatest athlete on the planet."

I can find you dart throwers, bowlers, and badminton players who are the best at what they do -- that doesn't make them great athletes. 

[ECURB]

2 minutes ago, Jack Straw said:

Because that's not the sport they grew up playing. And you're confusing skill with athleticism. They are not the same. Messi is extremely skilled -- that doesn't make him "the greatest athlete on the planet."

I can find you dart throwers, bowlers, and badminton players who are the best at what they do -- that doesn't make them great athletes. 

It’s quite clear you have never watched league football (soccer) you are way off base on this

[Jack Straw]

I'm a fan who has watched several hundred games and still regularly watch, so you'll have to guess again.

[Rich Thornburgh]

7 minutes ago, Jack Straw said:

Because that's not the sport they grew up playing. And you're confusing skill with athleticism. They are not the same. Messi is extremely skilled -- that doesn't make him "the greatest athlete on the planet."

I can find you dart throwers, bowlers, and badminton players who are the best at what they do -- that doesn't make them great athletes. 

Not every athlete has to be 6’5 225 lbs and run a 4.2 40.  That’s what your perception is but that’s not reality and I suspect you don’t live in reality you are lost in another planet

[Jack Straw]

Not every athlete has to be 6’5 225 lbs and run a 4.2 40.  That’s what your perception is but that’s not reality and I suspect you don’t live in reality you are lost in another planet

Scroll up and reread what I’ve said. I have never made any such argument. Nice straw man, though.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

1 hour ago, Jack Straw said:

Because that's not the sport they grew up playing. And you're confusing skill with athleticism. They are not the same. Messi is extremely skilled -- that doesn't make him "the greatest athlete on the planet."

I can find you dart throwers, bowlers, and badminton players who are the best at what they do -- that doesn't make them great athletes. 

So I'd love to have seen LeBron James or Michael Jordan play Roger Federer in tennis, even if they spend their entire youth trying to develop their skills. Or playing soccer for that matter. The assumption that because someone is tailor made for one sport they could play any sport is ridiculous. Bo Jackson would be a lousy tennis player, a lousy fencer, a lousy soccer player. And I should add that the pool of soccer talent is global, not just US based. You've got kids in Nigeria, Ecuador, practically anywhere on the planet, trying to make it in soccer. But go ahead and wear the usual American blinders. The three most popular sports in the world are soccer, cricket, and tennis. Think about that. No football, no baseball, no basketball. So I guess youre just another provincial fan ranting on his porch.

[TuscanyTile2]

@SAR I likes MetLife!

[TuscanyTile2]

13 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

So I'd love to have seen LeBron James or Michael Jordan play Roger Federer in tennis, even if they spend their entire youth trying to develop their skills. Or playing soccer for that matter. The assumption that because someone is tailor made for one sport they could play any sport is ridiculous. Bo Jackson would be a lousy tennis player, a lousy fencer, a lousy soccer player. And I should add that the pool of soccer talent is global, not just US based. You've got kids in Nigeria, Ecuador, practically anywhere on the planet, trying to make it in soccer. But go ahead and wear the usual American blinders. The three most popular sports in the world are soccer, cricket, and tennis. Think about that. No football, no baseball, no basketball. So I guess youre just another provincial fan ranting on his porch.

 

Quote

So I'd love to have seen LeBron James or Michael Jordan play Roger Federer in tennis, even if they spend their entire youth trying to develop their skills. Or playing soccer for that matter. The assumption that because someone is tailor made for one sport they could play any sport is ridiculous.

Agreed

Quote

Bo Jackson would be a lousy tennis player, a lousy fencer, a lousy soccer player. And

I have to disagree with you on this.  

 

[Matt39]

13 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

So I'd love to have seen LeBron James or Michael Jordan play Roger Federer in tennis, even if they spend their entire youth trying to develop their skills. Or playing soccer for that matter. The assumption that because someone is tailor made for one sport they could play any sport is ridiculous. Bo Jackson would be a lousy tennis player, a lousy fencer, a lousy soccer player. And I should add that the pool of soccer talent is global, not just US based. You've got kids in Nigeria, Ecuador, practically anywhere on the planet, trying to make it in soccer. But go ahead and wear the usual American blinders. The three most popular sports in the world are soccer, cricket, and tennis. Think about that. No football, no baseball, no basketball. So I guess youre just another provincial fan ranting on his porch.

Dude put fencing in there 

[Matt39]

14 hours ago, Rich Thornburgh said:

So who is a better athlete?  Zach Wilson or Lionel Messi?  Why don’t guys who suck in the nba and nfl just go dominate in FIFA?  Are they too manly?

Who’s a better athlete Novak or Messi? It’s an impossible exercise