124 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 For all you moronic Preseason stat loving losers, here you go: KC: 28 of 39, 352 yards, 4 TDs BR: 29 of 43, 451 yards, 3 TDs Keep in mind Clemens went against 2ND STRINGERS while Ratliff went against 3RD STRINGERS AND UPS TRUCK DRIVERS. And then you bash Kellen for his 2007 production on a **** team. So what would the great Ratliff do? In the end, it all doesn't matter because its... PRESEASON!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Thank you. I've tried to drive this point home, too, but Ratliff-to-Clowney has blinded everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vudu Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Ok 124 we understand you hate Ratliff and have a man crush on Clemens. We get it. It still won't change the fact that Clemens blows. Good o-line or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 Ok 124 we understand you hate Ratliff and have a man crush on Clemens. We get it. It still won't change the fact that Clemens blows. Good o-line or not. Says the one who is the EXACT SAME WAY, but with Brett Ratliff. A guy who has proven less than Clemens and can't pass Clemens for 2nd string. But he is the next great QB. Gotcha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vudu Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Says the one who is the EXACT SAME WAY, but with Brett Ratliff. A guy who has proven less than Clemens and can't pass Clemens for 2nd string. But he is the next great QB. Gotcha. We dont know until training camp & the QB competition goes underway. So you going off on Ratliff this early is asinine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 We dont know until training camp & the QB competition goes underway. So you going off on Ratliff this early is asinine. But we know about Kellen Clemens after EIGHT starts on a crap team? Stupid Giants. Should've dumped Eli years ago. Honestly I don't think either Clemens or Ratliff is the starter in 2009, but if it does come down to those two, Clemens will blow him away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFuture Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 this thread is smart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor99 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 With the loss of Nugent, 124 needs a new penis for sucking. Kellen is the lucky man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I really don't understand this love/hate for Ratliff/Clemens. Why does it have to be, "I love Ratliff, so Clemens sucks" and vice versa? It's the Zero-sum gain mentality of in order to elevate someone another person must be brought down. Clemens performed well in the 2007 preseason and not so well in the season. That does not automatically mean that what Ratliff did in 2008 preseason should be diminished. By the same token, being bad in preseason doesn't mean a QB will be bad in the regular season (look at Cassell's 2008 preseason). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Props to SMC. Lets just see who we have in training camp. Lets get a killer running game, top 5 defense and let the QB be a plug and play. I have seen KC and from what I have seen in real games, I am not sure he has it. Maybe a better line would help, maybe more time, who knows. Ratts looks good in pre-season and I would like to see what another year and a few rounds with the starters would look like. His size and pocket presense look better than KC. BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMaynard Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I really don't understand this love/hate for Ratliff/Clemens. Why does it have to be, "I love Ratliff, so Clemens sucks" and vice versa? It's the Zero-sum game mentality of in order to elevate someone another person must be brought down. Clemens performed well in the 2007 preseason and not so well in the season. That does not automatically mean that what Ratliff did in 2008 preseason should be diminished. By the same token, being bad in preseason doesn't mean a QB will be bad in the regular season (look at Cassell's 2008 preseason). Exactly. I just hope one of them surprises. I personally think it will be Ratliff. But if Clemens turns out great, I will be glad to say I picked the wrong guy and enjoy the Clemens era. This is a tough concept for some people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 The benefit of Clemens and Ratliff in being young is that improving as players is not unusual. If they were in their late 20s or early 30s, then you can say, "this is all you going to get." Right now, we don't know what we're going to get from either. Is Clemens circa 2007 & pre-season 2008 good enough? Of course not. But guess what? Clemens knows that. It's not like Clemens is pulling a Mangini and believing he's done everything right. How will Clemens and Ratliff's body fill out with another offseason in the conditioning program? Are they retaining more information now in studying the playbook so it becomes second nature? Have they improved their film review? We don't know the answer to those questions. But we'll see as we read the OTA reports leading up into the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain_the_foe Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 For all you moronic Preseason stat loving losers, here you go: KC: 28 of 39, 352 yards, 4 TDs BR: 29 of 43, 451 yards, 3 TDs Keep in mind Clemens went against 2ND STRINGERS while Ratliff went against 3RD STRINGERS AND UPS TRUCK DRIVERS. And then you bash Kellen for his 2007 production on a **** team. So what would the great Ratliff do? In the end, it all doesn't matter because its... PRESEASON!!! So your point is that Ratliff performance doesnt "matter" because it was preseason. Your post is kinda cute in a simple minded kinda way. But there's a big ass problem here. You forgot to put up Kellens Season numbers. In 10 games Kellen went 130 of 250 Passing, 52% Passing, 5 TD's and 10INT's & QB Rating of 60.9. Now, you conveniently mentioned that us Jet fans have to "Keep In Mind" that Kellen was on a sh!tty team, so on and so forth, however you conveniently dont keep in mind that Kellen played worse than the dude that he replaced. Remember this. When Kellen took over this team let me show you the type of respect he has amassed with his "regular season performance that counts".... Brett Favre was brought in to spearhead, leaving Kellen in the Cold. Chad Pennington (the guy he tried to replace but couldnt) went to a division team, won a division championship, and was second in the NFL in MVP voting as well as the Comeback player of the year. Brett Ratliff (The Jets new Starting QB) put on a performance for his first preseason appearance while Kellen Pretty much stunk it up in his latest preseason appearance, basically continuing off from his season a year ago. Granted, there were some plays in the preseason that was good from Kellen. I remember him throwing one of the most perfect passes in between double coverage to Dustin Keller. One of the prettiest balls (no homo) you would ever see,...however, that was about it from Kellen this year. I guess my question is...whats YOUR point with this post? Its not like you presented a credible opinion on why Ratliff shouldnt start or be in competition for the job. It only seems like you're comparing Ratliffs preseason success to Clemens (though you then turn around and state that it "means nothing" yet you use it to prove a point) but at the same time give excuse after excuse for Kellen and his rough season last year. Now dont get me wrong, Im not saying "give" Ratliff the job, what Im saying is dont just "give" Clemens the job because (as stated above) he obviously hasnt deserved it. You also take a cheap shot at Ratliff and put the question out there of "what would the great Ratliff had done", as if Ratliff and Clemens situation is the same. Ratliff isnt a second round prospect like Clemens, Ratliff didnt fail at securing a starting position, Ratliff didnt come to preseason looking like "since Favre is hear there's not sense of me of going out there and trying". Ratliff did none of those things. You know what Ratliff did, he put himself in position to have people like yourself make Indirect, semi-hating threads about him. He's made you talk about him, but most of all, He made Clemens less relevant because everytime you say Clemens you think Ratliff. Look, Kellen Clemens has impressed no one. If he did then this conversation/thread wouldnt exist. (Before anyone decides to mention that I was actually going for the change from Penny to Kellen last year....let me say that it was very simple, Chad wasnt performing here).The reason why this thread exist is because of Brett Ratliff. So in otherwords, he's more the face of this team then Clemens is right now...bottomline. Oh, and to respond to the dumb comment about "3rd stringers and UPS truck Drivers". It just goes to show you that Ratliff (And Clowney) arent 3rd string players or UPS truck drivers....they're NFL players for the NY Jets and maybe they should get a look at getting a crack at starting. They may just suprise a person like yourself.... Dont walk around surprised if this happens like I didnt mention it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New York Mick Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Until one does something during the regular season it doesn't matter. I could careless which one plays better then the other as long as one does. If they both suck we're back to square one again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Until one does something during the regular season it doesn't matter. I could careless which one plays better then the other as long as one does. If they both suck we're back to square one again. I think that is the point. We saw what KC can do in the regular season and it wasn't great. So now, lets see if Ratty can do some magic in the pre-season and earn the right to show us what he has in the regular season. Either way, I am wearing my Mangold jersey all year! (just like I bought to wear last year, but in came #4) BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Neither have proven anything. That's just the truth. Clemens had a rough deal in his regular season action. Anyone who thinks they are fair conditions to judge a QB's ability is pretty insane. He had nothing to work with. No protection, no running game, no defense, no WR's. It was always going to be tough. Ratliff has done absolutely nothing, like Clemens he'll have to earn the starting the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECURB Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Says the one who is the EXACT SAME WAY, but with Brett Ratliff. A guy who has proven less than Clemens and can't pass Clemens for 2nd string. But he is the next great QB. Gotcha. Chad Pennington is a winning QB who is also one of if not the most accurate of all time and averages the same yards per throw as all the best. See what stats will tell you??? Take your stats and shove them up your ass! Seriously though... to do a silly stat line comparasin is silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Chad Pennington is a winning QB who is also one of if not the most accurate of all time and averages the same yards per throw as all the best. See what stats will tell you??? Take your stats and shove them up your ass! Seriously though... to do a silly stat line comparasin is silly. Aren't those same "silly" stats the same one you used arguing in defense of Pennington for like 3 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECURB Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Aren't those same "silly" stats the same one you used arguing in defense of Pennington for like 3 years? #-o#-o#-o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Honestly, I'm not sure I get the mentality of needing it to be one guy over another. Now granted, I was amongst the most ardent of Chad bashers, but this was a seasoned veteran who proved again and again to have the same debilitating problems that plagued him for years. Even then, I would have absolutely LOVED to be proven wrong (although I knew I wasn't going to be) and for him to become a legit playoff / big game QB. In this case, who really cares who it is? I'm sure the coaching staff can decide who gives them the best chance to win and I'm all for that. I don't care if its Kellen Clemens, Brett Ratliff, Eric Ainge, a rookie or a free agent. All I want is the Jets to have a starting QB who wins them some games and doesn't hold them back. At this point, none of these guys have done enough either way to prove much one way or another, so picking a side or making definitive claims seems unreasonable. Now I know this is a message board and obviously a place for debate, but I guess its just the extreme opinions on all of these guys who have had very limited opportunities to show anything good or bad having such forceful decisions made on one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Honestly, I'm not sure I get the mentality of needing it to be one guy over another. Now granted, I was amongst the most ardent of Chad bashers, but this was a seasoned veteran who proved again and again to have the same debilitating problems that plagued him for years. Even then, I would have absolutely LOVED to be proven wrong (although I knew I wasn't going to be) and for him to become a legit playoff / big game QB. In this case, who really cares who it is? I'm sure the coaching staff can decide who gives them the best chance to win and I'm all for that. I don't care if its Kellen Clemens, Brett Ratliff, Eric Ainge, a rookie or a free agent. All I want is the Jets to have a starting QB who wins them some games and doesn't hold them back. At this point, none of these guys have done enough either way to prove much one way or another, so picking a side or making definitive claims seems unreasonable. Now I know this is a message board and obviously a place for debate, but I guess its just the extreme opinions on all of these guys who have had very limited opportunities to show anything good or bad having such forceful decisions made on one way or another. Exactly right. It's tough to have anything for or against either right now. They are unproven, both of them and it's anyones guess as to how the coaching staff or organisation as a whole feels about them right now let alone in September. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Honestly, I'm not sure I get the mentality of needing it to be one guy over another. Now granted, I was amongst the most ardent of Chad bashers, but this was a seasoned veteran who proved again and again to have the same debilitating problems that plagued him for years. Even then, I would have absolutely LOVED to be proven wrong (although I knew I wasn't going to be) and for him to become a legit playoff / big game QB. In this case, who really cares who it is? I'm sure the coaching staff can decide who gives them the best chance to win and I'm all for that. I don't care if its Kellen Clemens, Brett Ratliff, Eric Ainge, a rookie or a free agent. All I want is the Jets to have a starting QB who wins them some games and doesn't hold them back. At this point, none of these guys have done enough either way to prove much one way or another, so picking a side or making definitive claims seems unreasonable. Now I know this is a message board and obviously a place for debate, but I guess its just the extreme opinions on all of these guys who have had very limited opportunities to show anything good or bad having such forceful decisions made on one way or another. Dude if I'm right, I can TELL people I was right in the future. That'll level me up some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Honestly, I'm not sure I get the mentality of needing it to be one guy over another. It's a pretty simple one actually; since we know that Clemens sucks, it'd be nice if the other guy doesn't. Of course, it's not a "need" per se, but it sure would help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemehl Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 For all you moronic Preseason stat loving losers, here you go: KC: 28 of 39, 352 yards, 4 TDs BR: 29 of 43, 451 yards, 3 TDs Keep in mind Clemens went against 2ND STRINGERS while Ratliff went against 3RD STRINGERS AND UPS TRUCK DRIVERS. And then you bash Kellen for his 2007 production on a **** team. So what would the great Ratliff do? In the end, it all doesn't matter because its... PRESEASON!!! OK, white flag! what, it;s "The Clemmens Gang" vs. "The Ratliffs" we get it! It's the Outsiders performed at Jetsnation. We don't have o hate. We also have other topics(none near as big, big how bout, your boy, Nugent, I like him, I say we go with him. Feely's a good solid guy, but Nugent was "Nuge", he was special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemehl Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Exactly. I just hope one of them surprises. I personally think it will be Ratliff. But if Clemens turns out great, I will be glad to say I picked the wrong guy and enjoy the Clemens era. This is a tough concept for some people. Coming from one of the most unstable voices on the forum, you are always the voice of reason. Dito your whole post! That's exactly it. It's not a kill or be killed war between the Ratliff guys and Clemens guys. We have two. I, like you, think Ratliff can be the guy. But, he sucks, you better believe I don't want two scrubs, pass me the Clemmens Jersey and the Crow, geez! It's not rocket science. You have your favorite team, then your favorite players on that team. But you root for your team. BTW Do you really think KC and Rat don't want the other guy snuffed out? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirlancemehlot Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Passing Statistics 2008 preseason Player....Att...Comp...Yds...Comp %...Yds/Att...TD...TD %...INT...INT %...Long...Rating Ratliff....47.....32......499.....68.1.......10.6........4....8.5.......1.....2.1........71.....122.6 KC........38......21.....195.....55.3........5.1........0.....0.0.......0.....0.0........34.....69.5 Favre....18......14.....144.....77.8........8.0........1.....5.6.......0.....0.0........30.....118.5 Ainge....16......10......131....62.5........8.2........1.....6.3........0.....0.0.......39.....109.1 Line statistics can be fun! Also, Ratliff was throwing to UPS drivers and burger flippers, that is, when he wasn't starting over KC. Most importantly--every QB on our roster outperformed KC. Even Favre who had all of a week to learn the playbook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justincredible Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I agree that this arguing back and forth about Ratliff and Clemens is retarded. I honestly don't care who the next QB is, I just don't want them to suck. The bottom line is neither one has proved jack s##t. I can't tell if that makes these pissing contests hilarious or sad. Probably a little bit of both, but mostly annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 With the loss of Nugent, 124 needs a new penis for sucking. Kellen is the lucky man. I just spit out my orange juice...lol. I was thinking of posting something similar but showed a little restraint. Thanks Thor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 My main issue with Clemens is that when he was in there in 2007, some of his passes were just horrible to watch. There was one rollout in particular where he was throwing on the run and the ball went like 10 feet right into the ground in front of the receiver by a good 5 feet when the receiver was open. There were other passes that just came out so wobbly it was hard to imagine the receivers catching them. I understand our OL was **** that year, so I'm willing to give him a pass. But if he comes out throwing wobbly passes when he has time in the pocket to set his feet, I won't be thrilled with him. That being said, whoever performs the best should get the job. I have no love, or hate, for any of the QB's so whoever shows he's the best should play. I'll cheer on whoever is in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neckdemon Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Props to SMC. Lets just see who we have in training camp. Lets get a killer running game, top 5 defense and let the QB be a plug and play. I have seen KC and from what I have seen in real games, I am not sure he has it. Maybe a better line would help, maybe more time, who knows. Ratts looks good in pre-season and I would like to see what another year and a few rounds with the starters would look like. His size and pocket presense look better than KC. BZ great....plug and play the most important position on the field. ought to be a fun year to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I really don't understand this love/hate for Ratliff/Clemens. Why does it have to be, "I love Ratliff, so Clemens sucks" and vice versa? It's the Zero-sum gain mentality of in order to elevate someone another person must be brought down. Clemens performed well in the 2007 preseason and not so well in the season. That does not automatically mean that what Ratliff did in 2008 preseason should be diminished. By the same token, being bad in preseason doesn't mean a QB will be bad in the regular season (look at Cassell's 2008 preseason). /endthread I'm so glad we have another six and a half months to keep going in circles on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor99 Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I just spit out my orange juice...lol. I was thinking of posting something similar but showed a little restraint. Thanks Thor Restraint? What's that? I don't care who it is, I just want one of them to win the job and leave no doubt about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green DNA Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 If either Ratliff or Clemens steps up and becomes a quality starter I will be doing cartwheels. I don't really care which one it is. Of course, given the Jets luck one of them will become a quality starter after they are cut and sign with another team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdropOFvenom Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I really don't understand this love/hate for Ratliff/Clemens. Why does it have to be, "I love Ratliff, so Clemens sucks" and vice versa? It's the Zero-sum gain mentality of in order to elevate someone another person must be brought down. Clemens performed well in the 2007 preseason and not so well in the season. That does not automatically mean that what Ratliff did in 2008 preseason should be diminished. By the same token, being bad in preseason doesn't mean a QB will be bad in the regular season (look at Cassell's 2008 preseason). What he said. I don't really care which QB it is, I just hope one of them step up and prove capable of being that guy for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNJet Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 I cant wait til Ratliff stinks it up in camp and a few preseason games,then what will all the Ratsuckers say then? Remember folks the Rat is human as well and can make mistakes. hahahaha,Clemens>Ratliff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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