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A word to the wise on PSL's


AlToon88
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I am not disagreeing with you. But if the Jets were to have a good season, a real big 13 and 3 kind of season with two home playoff games and a Super Bowl win...the fees for that year (tickets to 8 games and 2 playoff games) would be more than the same seat with a PSL for the year with the preseason.

And if I hosted a thirty lesbian orgy in my living room, I could charge $400 bucks per seat on my couch to watch it.

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I am not disagreeing with you. But if the Jets were to have a good season, a real big 13 and 3 kind of season with two home playoff games and a Super Bowl win...the fees for that year (tickets to 8 games and 2 playoff games) would be more than the same seat with a PSL for the year with the preseason.

But that would be a one year loss. And that exact scenario I described has never happened, lol. So I am not waiting up for it.

Me? I am a creature of habit so I am happy with my $2,500 PSL because having the same seats each week is important to me.

The same seats argument is the only one that really stands up.

Ultimately, as you say, us "non owners" could suffer a bad year (which we'd gladly pay for) but that's more than made up for by the many years that they're even just pretty good. A lot better when they stink, which, lets be honest...

Then again, your girlfriend's father could have unreal ticket connections that land you 5 rows off the field on the 45 yard line for free, but hey........

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You overpaying for a game or 2 is a big part of the Jets reasoning for their ticket prices. When they they look at the sale prices on the secondary markets, which they now also get a piece of as well, they assumed their ticket prices were teasonable. F'ing the real fans.

This was the exact argument we used not to buy PSL's, and give up our season tickets that had been in our family for 30 plus years.

It has turned out to be a very wise decision.

Not only did we not pay the PSL, but we don't buy preseason, and we have gotten many of the games below face value.

Plus, when they are 5-9 we can chose not to buy tix for freezing games in late December.

Now with the savings, I have no problem paying a big premium when we get a home playoff game every 15 years if we are lucky.

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You overpaying for a game or 2 is a big part of the Jets reasoning for their ticket prices. When they they look at the sale prices on the secondary markets, which they now also get a piece of as well, they assumed their ticket prices were teasonable. F'ing the real fans.

I have not paid a dollar over face value for a ticket since we moved to the new stadium, and in fact have paid less for almost every game so far for comparable seats to our old season tickets.

If every 15 years when we have a home playoff game, I need to pay a premium for the tickets, so be it, I and many others will still have avoided the ridiculous PSL, and ridiculous pre-season games.

My family had 4 season tickets for over 30 years, to charge us a PSL after paying for a complete crap product for most of those years, including pre-season tickets, was a complete slap in the face.

I hardly think overpaying for a game every 15 years is going to change ticket prices.

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You overpaying for a game or 2 is a big part of the Jets reasoning for their ticket prices. When they they look at the sale prices on the secondary markets, which they now also get a piece of as well, they assumed their ticket prices were teasonable. F'ing the real fans.

I've learned so much on JN about who is a real fan and who is not. New to the list today:

1. Poor People

2. Fiscally Responsible People

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  • 4 months later...

Of course it effects your credit.  You entered into a contract to pay off a note and if you default that is a huge black mark on your credit rating.  I don't know how old you are, but mortgages are tough enough to get with good credit, good luck with a default on your record. Basically, the cost of defaulting will be higher than the cost of a PSL.  The big question is how hard the Jets pursue this.  From a legal perspective they win hands down, but it will be a public relations nightmare.    

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Of course it effects your credit.  You entered into a contract to pay off a note and if you default that is a huge black mark on your credit rating.  I don't know how old you are, but mortgages are tough enough to get with good credit, good luck with a default on your record. Basically, the cost of defaulting will be higher than the cost of a PSL.  The big question is how hard the Jets pursue this.  From a legal perspective they win hands down, but it will be a public relations nightmare.

What if you took tickets out in the name of a PSL that you own for a fan site that you run. How would that impact a person who was in that situation?

Totally hypothetical situation that I am throwing out there btw. I don't know anyone in that situation. :)

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Of course it effects your credit.  You entered into a contract to pay off a note and if you default that is a huge black mark on your credit rating.  I don't know how old you are, but mortgages are tough enough to get with good credit, good luck with a default on your record. Basically, the cost of defaulting will be higher than the cost of a PSL.  The big question is how hard the Jets pursue this.  From a legal perspective they win hands down, but it will be a public relations nightmare.    

 

forgot to quote you see above!

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What if you took tickets out in the name of a PSL that you own for a fan site that you run. How would that impact a person who was in that situation?

Totally hypothetical situation that I am throwing out there btw. I don't know anyone in that situation. :)

Hypothetically speaking, you, I mean they should have swabbed someones back porch in order to get press passes and then the hypothetical PSL would have been unnecessary. 

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Hypothetically speaking, you, I mean they should have swabbed someones back porch in order to get press passes and then the hypothetical PSL would have been unnecessary. 

 

I thought that ship had sailed, then I realized that ship actually sank.

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I just spoke with a manager they said it WILL NOT affect my credit if I default!  They may or may not go after you for the remaining balance!

Think if you apply for a mortgage or a car loan and explain the situation nobody is going to be all that upset about a PSL default.And any NFL team that goes after it's fans for specific performance on a PSL contract is going to face an epic sheetstorm of bad PR.

Edited by Bugg
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Think if you apply for a mortgage or a car loan and explain the situation nobody is going to be all that upset about a PSL default.And any NFL team that goes after it's fans for specific performance on a PSL contract is going to face an epic sheetstorm of bad PR.

 

 

I dont think they will face an epic sh*t storm of bad PR.  There are lots of people who believe you signed up for a PSL, you deserve whatever crap happens to you if you reneg on the contract.  Thats whats wrong with people...  they dont want to be taken at  their word and want to weasel out of their contract because theyre unhappy the team sucks. They dont want to be held accountable for what they do.  And when they dont get their way??  Whine to the media that the big bad Jets want their money.

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I dont think they will face an epic sh*t storm of bad PR.  There are lots of people who believe you signed up for a PSL, you deserve whatever crap happens to you if you reneg on the contract.  Thats whats wrong with people...  they dont want to be taken at  their word and want to weasel out of their contract because theyre unhappy the team sucks. They dont want to be held accountable for what they do.  And when they dont get their way??  Whine to the media that the big bad Jets want their money.

Suing your own  fans wlll be a really bad media story, even worse if you're cutting players and salary with a crappy 2013 season on the way.  Most people simply won't pay another dime and don't expect to get anything back. It  was a scam in favor of the Jets form the beginning.

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I dont think they will face an epic sh*t storm of bad PR.  There are lots of people who believe you signed up for a PSL, you deserve whatever crap happens to you if you reneg on the contract.  Thats whats wrong with people...  they dont want to be taken at  their word and want to weasel out of their contract because theyre unhappy the team sucks. They dont want to be held accountable for what they do.  And when they dont get their way??  Whine to the media that the big bad Jets want their money.

 

Yeah, the Jets could easily get away with it if they really wanted to and the media wouldn't care less.  Those who bought PSL's entered into a contract and failing to pay it is no different than anyone who refuses to pay their car payment or their mortgage.  In those cases the banks aren't exactly like "oh, you don't want to pay for this anymore?  ok, we understand, don't sweat it."  When you consider how much more important those things are to people's lives, the Jets have even less reason to give their customers leeway than anyone handing out loans for essentials like that.  There was nothing driving anyone to buy a PSL outside of their own desire to have it, it was and is a pure luxury.  It sucks for those people that they chose to make what they now consider to be a bad investment, but that was still their decision.

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  • 3 months later...

I dont think they will face an epic sh*t storm of bad PR.  There are lots of people who believe you signed up for a PSL, you deserve whatever crap happens to you if you reneg on the contract.  Thats whats wrong with people...  they dont want to be taken at  their word and want to weasel out of their contract because theyre unhappy the team sucks. They dont want to be held accountable for what they do.  And when they dont get their way??  Whine to the media that the big bad Jets want their money.

 

I hear what you are saying but I am not trying to weasel out of my contract. I did sign up for a contract and I should fulfill it. That being said, the people that gave me my mortgage don't frisk me as I enter my house, yell at me for walking the wrong way on my sidewalk or parking in a particular spot, and they don't threaten me when I'm late on a payment. In fact when I was having trouble paying some years back they called me and asked me sincerely what they could do to help me retain the mortgage with them and arrangements were made. I am paying the Jets and their staff for the privilege of treating me like a jerk, like they own me. On top of that they are playing some incredibly horrible football and these tickets are worth almost nothing.

 

Anyway, I'm stuck with a hard decision here. I would like to keep my PSL's as I do like going to the games but I can go to the same 5 games for a quarter of the price off of stub hub. For people wondering what the Jets stance is on this, here is an excerpt from the letter I received last week, with tomorrow being my cutoff date for defaulting.

 

As you have not made payment, this letter serves as Jets Stadium Development's ("JSD") notice of default ....if you do not cure this default by making payment withen ten days of the date of this letter, your rights under the Agreement will terminate, in which case:

  • JSD will retain all monies you have paid to date related to your PSL
  • Your obligation to pay the outstanding balance of the PSL and any liability under the Club Seat License Agreement shall be accelerated, making the full outstanding balance immediately due and payable, which JSD intends to fully enforce and collect
  • YOU WILL HAVE NO FURTHER RIGHTS UNDER THE AGREEMENT (i.e., you will not have the right to purchase tickets to Jets games at MetLife Stadium); and
  • JSD will have no further obligation to you for the above referenced account

 

So, take the money I've paid so far, sue for the remaining balance, and ban me from buying Jets tickets....awesome.

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Why don't you guys just try to get kicked out of the stadium (during the season; not now of course)?

 

There must be a list of items in your agreement with JSD whereby you lose your PSL.  Nonpayment is of course one of them, but that will mess up your credit.  If you misbehave - like flipping off the security people - that may be enough so they opt out of the contract.  That may - may - leave your credit intact because you aren't defaulting on payment (even though you are still breaching terms of the agreement: behavioral terms).  

 

Check to see if there are any things that will get you kicked out of the stadium - and therefore/thereby kicked out of your PSL - but are not enough to get arrested.  

 

I haven't seen the agreement, and it's possible they accounted for this, but it's also possible they overlooked a loophole.

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I hear what you are saying but I am not trying to weasel out of my contract. I did sign up for a contract and I should fulfill it. That being said, the people that gave me my mortgage don't frisk me as I enter my house, yell at me for walking the wrong way on my sidewalk or parking in a particular spot, and they don't threaten me when I'm late on a payment. In fact when I was having trouble paying some years back they called me and asked me sincerely what they could do to help me retain the mortgage with them and arrangements were made. I am paying the Jets and their staff for the privilege of treating me like a jerk, like they own me. On top of that they are playing some incredibly horrible football and these tickets are worth almost nothing.

 

Anyway, I'm stuck with a hard decision here. I would like to keep my PSL's as I do like going to the games but I can go to the same 5 games for a quarter of the price off of stub hub. For people wondering what the Jets stance is on this, here is an excerpt from the letter I received last week, with tomorrow being my cutoff date for defaulting.

 

As you have not made payment, this letter serves as Jets Stadium Development's ("JSD") notice of default ....if you do not cure this default by making payment withen ten days of the date of this letter, your rights under the Agreement will terminate, in which case:

  • JSD will retain all monies you have paid to date related to your PSL
  • Your obligation to pay the outstanding balance of the PSL and any liability under the Club Seat License Agreement shall be accelerated, making the full outstanding balance immediately due and payable, which JSD intends to fully enforce and collect
  • YOU WILL HAVE NO FURTHER RIGHTS UNDER THE AGREEMENT (i.e., you will not have the right to purchase tickets to Jets games at MetLife Stadium); and
  • JSD will have no further obligation to you for the above referenced account

 

So, take the money I've paid so far, sue for the remaining balance, and ban me from buying Jets tickets....awesome.

We were told that they COULD demand payment, but that they would not at this time sue us. Can say one difference is we made clear 2 of the 3 people in our party had homes damaged in Sandy and as such (along with your very accurate bill of complaints) going to Jets games was no longer a priority and in many ways a pointless expense at a time of great financial difficulty(the words "rebuild" and "supplementary insurance application"-oh,joy!) The rep my friend spoke to was sympathetic and mentioned his sister was also has  serious damage to here home from Sandy. That statute of limitations, which has not been waived in the contract, gives them 2.5 years to sue you in most states from the date of breach. There's nothing legally stopping the Jets from doing it, but if they sue hundreds(thousands?) of their own fans, the PR would be disasterous. IT WOULD BE UNPRECEDENTED FOR ANY FRANCHISE TO SUE IT'S OWN FANS. We were not told we could be precluded from ever purchasing Jets tickets ever again, which seems pretty out there and practically unenforceable.

Edited by Bugg
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We were told that they COULD demand payment, but that they would not at this time sue us. Can say one difference is we made clear 2 of the 3 people in our party had homes damaged in Sandy and as such (along with your very accurate bill of complaints) going to Jets games was no longer a priority and in many ways a pointless expense at a time of great financial difficulty(the words "rebuild" and "supplementary insurance application"-oh,joy!) The rep my friend spoke to was sympathetic and mentioned his sister was also has  serious damage to here home from Sandy. That statute of limitations, which has not been waived in the contract, gives them 2.5 years to sue you in most states from the date of breach. There's nothing legally stopping the Jets from doing it, but if they sue hundreds(thousands?) of their own fans, the PR would be disasterous. IT WOULD BE UNPRECEDENTED FOR ANY FRANCHISE TO SUE IT'S OWN FANS. We were not told we could be precluded from ever purchasing Jets tickets ever again, which seems pretty out there and practically unenforceable.

 

I read it as you would no longer have the RIGHT to purchase tickets (a right which the PSL provides), not that you would be banned from purchasing tickets.

 

But you're a lawyer and I'm sure have read a contract or two in your years; is there anything in your agreement that could get you out of it as I outlined in the post above yours?

 

(If there is I'll take the post down and PM the unhappy people here before the team sees my post, hehehe)

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I read it as you would no longer have the RIGHT to purchase tickets (a right which the PSL provides), not that you would be banned from purchasing tickets.

 

But you're a lawyer and I'm sure have read a contract or two in your years; is there anything in your agreement that could get you out of it as I outlined in the post above yours?

 

(If there is I'll take the post down and PM the unhappy people here before the team sees my post, hehehe)

Was aware we could no longer buy our tickets, but thought perhaps the Jets were now going to refuse future ticket orders form some list of former PSL holders.

 

You cannot get out of it. But realistically very unlikely the Jets would take the step to sue customers. If they did, want to see them go through the expense and headache of the media covering that. They may try to get default judgments and sell them to credit colelction people. But still thye would have to go through the motions of serving you with a court date and giving you the option of defending yourself. PSL does have "binding arbitration" language but the default still has to be litigated.

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I read it as you would no longer have the RIGHT to purchase tickets (a right which the PSL provides), not that you would be banned from purchasing tickets.

 

But you're a lawyer and I'm sure have read a contract or two in your years; is there anything in your agreement that could get you out of it as I outlined in the post above yours?

 

(If there is I'll take the post down and PM the unhappy people here before the team sees my post, hehehe)

 

What about what I outlined above (post #61)? Surely a dick like you could manage to get yourself kicked out of the stadium, but do so without getting arrested.  Don't they then "take away" your PSL from you as a punishment?

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I don't think the media coverage is going to be as bad or hurtful as everyone thinks and I have no doubt that the second not taking action cost them more then suing the defaulters, we will be sued.

 

Oh, and as far as getting myself kicked out, how do you know I won't be forced to pay off the rest of my PSL in the same manner?

Edited by skunkbudz
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Must have been lonely on that island with 90% of JetNation posters.

Haha! The Jets went from having a 10 year waiting list to purchase tickets to having to cold call anyone who bought a Jets' cap in the last ten years to attempt to sell out the stadium. But yeah, all Jet fans but two thought PSL's were an awesome idea.

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 IT WOULD BE UNPRECEDENTED FOR ANY FRANCHISE TO SUE IT'S OWN FANS. We were not told we could be precluded from ever purchasing Jets tickets ever again, which seems pretty out there and practically unenforceable.

Unfortunately lots of teams have sued their fans over tickets but as of now the Jets have never done so:

 

http://consumerist.com/2009/09/03/dont-have-5300-for-season-tickets-the-washington-redskins-will-sue-you-into-bankruptcy/

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/03/nfls-redskins-sue-season-_n_276158.html

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