Chan Gailey just put the nail in the coffin on the 2015 season

[artemusclyde]

Except of course the FACT that he HAS turned crappy QBs into quite proficient QBs, tailoring his offense to their strengths. He made Thigpen. Fitz and Kordell well above average in his system. Geno is not dumb. And he is pretty accurate especially deep. What you refuse to acknowledge is that he was in the worst possible offense for him without any talent around him. As Gailey said, he never had a clean read. He made some mistakes. Made way less last year. But just go on irrationally hating and not allowing for the fact that Gailey just might know what he is talking about. And he is designing the offense for Geno.

 

Come on man, we were saying the same stuff about Mornhinwheg when he got the job two years ago. We brought up how he coached qbs like Favre, McNabb, Vick in his best season etc. to justify how he was going to be different then the last guys. Nearly every oc is going to look like hot garbage if they don't have a good qb. Look at Whisenhunt when he wasn't coaching Rivers or Warner, he was terrible. I don't think Gailey is going to just magically turn Geno into an average starter, even Kelly couldn't turn Sanchez into an average starter and his system is incredibly qb friendly.

[JetBlue]

Come on man, we were saying the same stuff about Mornhinwheg when he got the job two years ago. We brought up how he coached qbs like Favre, McNabb, Vick in his best season etc. to justify how he was going to be different then the last guys. Nearly every oc is going to look like hot garbage if they don't have a good qb. Look at Whisenhunt when he wasn't coaching Rivers or Warner, he was terrible. I don't think Gailey is going to just magically turn Geno into an average starter, even Kelly couldn't turn Sanchez into an average starter and his system is incredibly qb friendly.

 

This is for you.....

 

[Saul Goodman]

There are still people who believe that Geno can be a legitimate starting QB? Fitzpatrick isn't taking us to the Superbowl, but there's no doubt that he'd perform better than Geno and lead us to more wins. After a 4-12 season, and a rookie HC and GM in place, we need to get as many wins as can here in 2015, and try to build momentum for the future.

I'd rather have Fitzpatrick go into camp as the starter. But at the least, the quarterback position should be open, and there should be a competition.

[drdetroit]

All positions should be subject to competition

no more of this coronation BS

they gave the job to Mark they gave the job to Geno

giving the job to guys who didn't earn it will never work

if he can't beat out Fitz in a legit competition he doesn't deserve to start

it's not that hard the best player should play.

Sanchez got the "coronation" because he was by far the best qb on the roster. As crazy as it sounds.

Geno is getting the job because Fitz is coming off a serious injury and petty and Simms aren't starting caliber.

[drdetroit]

There are still people who believe that Geno can be a legitimate starting QB? Fitzpatrick isn't taking us to the Superbowl, but there's no doubt that he'd perform better than Geno and lead us to more wins. After a 4-12 season, and a rookie HC and GM in place, we need to get as many wins as can here in 2015, and try to build momentum for the future.

I'd rather have Fitzpatrick go into camp as the starter. But at the least, the quarterback position should be open, and there should be a competition.

You realize in '13 Geno won more games in a season with a crap roster than Fitz has in any season of his career?

[artemusclyde]

You realize in '13 Geno won more games in a season with a crap roster than Fitz has in any season of his career?

 

Sanchez also has won more playoff games then Stafford and Tony Romo. You taking Sanchez over these guys?

[pdxgreen]

And we want a game manager why exactly ???

Hmmmm. Got to get back to you on that one.

[drdetroit]

Sanchez also has won more playoff games then Stafford and Tony Romo. You taking Sanchez over these guys?

Fitz = Romo

Great argument bro

[JohnnyLV]

Come on man, we were saying the same stuff about Mornhinwheg when he got the job two years ago. We brought up how he coached qbs like Favre, McNabb, Vick in his best season etc. to justify how he was going to be different then the last guys. Nearly every oc is going to look like hot garbage if they don't have a good qb. Look at Whisenhunt when he wasn't coaching Rivers or Warner, he was terrible. I don't think Gailey is going to just magically turn Geno into an average starter, even Kelly couldn't turn Sanchez into an average starter and his system is incredibly qb friendly.

 

Huge differences. First, MM ran an offense completely unsuitable for Geno. Just not a timing, tight window slant type QB. Second, Rex as coach so MM was not really able to run his offense. The wildcat and power running schemes that Rex forced into the offense did not fit MMs scheme at all. It created an offense that had different looks for running and passing and you could guess from alignment what the Jets play was 90% of the time because of this. That put any QB back there at a severe disadvantage. This influence was also evident in Schotty's and Sparano's offense. Gailey's system will be pure. 

 

Gailey's offense will be tailored to Geno where they tried to force Geno into the WC system. Gailey's running attacks and passing game will be in sync, likely with spread concepts and lots of shotgun. Passing will be vertical and simple, "clean" read situations, which means adjusting the target to the man on man matchups, vertical routes and use of seams, stick, comeback, post and corner routes as opposed to timing slants, outs, zone reads and complicated screens other than quick screens. There is no FB position in Gailey's system, but uses a HB (which is usually a receiving TE, but could be a talented receiving FB) Line calls are simpler in Gailey's system as is almost everything.

 

Plus Geno has better weapons at WR, which is an understatement like saying an aircraft carrier is a little bit bigger than a yacht. Seriously, we go from Decker (mostly injured), Nelson, Salas, Kerley Saalim Hakim to Brandon Marshall, hopefully healthy Decker, Devin Smith, Kerley, Owusu and Enunwa/Evans/Hakim. Add in a 2nd year Amaro and we go from one of the worst receiving corps in football to maybe a  Top 10 one. Only thing missing really is the faster receiving back that fits Gailey's system better but he does not seem concerned about that.

 

Also, despite running a 3-4 base, Bowles defense is MUCH different than Rex;s in secondary scheme and favors easy coverage concepts that lead to more turnovers and shorter fields much more often which is another big advantage for Geno.

 

Geno may still fail, but he is set up to succeed under this new regime.

[artemusclyde]

Fitz = Romo

Great argument bro

 

Better argument then your winnar argument. Footballs a team game, and Geno like Sanchez was carried by the team to those wins.

 

 

Huge differences. First, MM ran an offense completely unsuitable for Geno. Just not a timing, tight window slant type QB. Second, Rex as coach so MM was not really able to run his offense. The wildcat and power running schemes that Rex forced into the offense did not fit MMs scheme at all. It created an offense that had different looks for running and passing and you could guess from alignment what the Jets play was 90% of the time because of this. That put any QB back there at a severe disadvantage. This influence was also evident in Schotty's and Sparano's offense. Gailey's system will be pure. 

 

Gailey's offense will be tailored to Geno where they tried to force Geno into the WC system. Gailey's running attacks and passing game will be in sync, likely with spread concepts and lots of shotgun. Passing will be vertical and simple, "clean" read situations, which means adjusting the target to the man on man matchups, vertical routes and use of seams, stick, comeback, post and corner routes as opposed to timing slants, outs, zone reads and complicated screens other than quick screens. There is no FB position in Gailey's system, but uses a HB (which is usually a receiving TE, but could be a talented receiving FB) Line calls are simpler in Gailey's system as is almost everything.

 

Plus Geno has better weapons at WR, which is an understatement like saying an aircraft carrier is a little bit bigger than a yacht. Seriously, we go from Decker (mostly injured), Nelson, Salas, Kerley Saalim Hakim to Brandon Marshall, hopefully healthy Decker, Devin Smith, Kerley, Owusu and Enunwa/Evans/Hakim. Add in a 2nd year Amaro and we go from one of the worst receiving corps in football to maybe a  Top 10 one. Only thing missing really is the faster receiving back that fits Gailey's system better but he does not seem concerned about that.

 

Also, despite running a 3-4 base, Bowles defense is MUCH different than Rex;s in secondary scheme and favors easy coverage concepts that lead to more turnovers and shorter fields much more often which is another big advantage for Geno.

 

Geno may still fail, but he is set up to succeed under this new regime.

 

Gailey has been widely criticized by Bills fans for calling obvious plays and not disguising his offense as well. Wasn't he the guy that rarely used play action?

[drdetroit]

Better argument then your winnar argument. Footballs a team game, and Geno like Sanchez was carried by the team to those wins.

Gailey has been widely criticized by Bills fans for calling obvious plays and not disguising his offense as well. Wasn't he the guy that rarely used play action?

We'll yeah that 2013 jet team was just stacked with talent with Clyde gates and Kellen Winslow at receiver.

Fitz never played with Andre Johnson, Arian Foster and JJ Watt or nothing

[sackdance]

You realize in '13 Geno won more games in a season with a crap roster than Fitz has in any season of his career?

 

 

Numbers say that Geno is the worst QB in football the past two years - but that's just stats.

 

What gets me is that generally, and I've seen it again and again in 2 years with him starting under center, when a single pass rusher hurries him the play devolves into Geno running for dear life, a tactic that served him at WV, but not in the NFL. 

 

Geno is not and never was some kind of shiny new Cadillac QB. He has plenty of gifts, but (like Petty, I assume) would have benefitted greatly from riding the pine behind a Fitz-caliber or better QB.  

 

Is he better today than when he started opening day 2013? I'd say so, but he was woefully unprepared. 

 

DrD - apparently you think Geno is some kind of gift to Jets fans. You need a reality check; when we got Geno his "weapons" in 2014 he burst up to 29th rated passer in the league (that's up from dead-last 37th) but we won only 4 games. QB is a lot more than having a fast guy to throw to. Way more.

 

In summation, he sucks because he routinely tries to be a spontaneous playmaker only to get pissy results. Go as a non-AFC East or non-Giants fan for some unbiased opinion on Geno. Again, there isn't a team in the league that would trade a bag of balls for him. 

[Scoop24]

Numbers say that Geno is the worst QB in football the past two years - but that's just stats.

What gets me is that generally, and I've seen it again and again in 2 years with him starting under center, when a single pass rusher hurries him the play devolves into Geno running for dear life, a tactic that served him at WV, but not in the NFL.

Geno is not and never was some kind of shiny new Cadillac QB. He has plenty of gifts, but (like Petty, I assume) would have benefitted greatly from riding the pine behind a Fitz-caliber or better QB.

Is he better today than when he started opening day 2013? I'd say so, but he was woefully unprepared.

DrD - apparently you think Geno is some kind of gift to Jets fans. You need a reality check; when we got Geno his "weapons" in 2014 he burst up to 29th rated passer in the league (that's up from dead-last 37th) but we won only 4 games. QB is a lot more than having a fast guy to throw to. Way more.

In summation, he sucks because he routinely tries to be a spontaneous playmaker only to get pissy results. Go as a non-AFC East or non-Giants fan for some unbiased opinion on Geno. Again, there isn't a team in the league that would trade a bag of balls for him.

Who are these weapons you speak of ? Decker was hurt in and out majority of the season and when he was on the field Geno played okay . But who else was there ?

[Savage69]

Better argument then your winnar argument. Footballs a team game, and Geno like Sanchez was carried by the team to those wins.

 

 

 

Gailey has been widely criticized by Bills fans for calling obvious plays and not disguising his offense as well. Wasn't he the guy that rarely used play action?

For the last 17 years that I have been reading the boards it's always the fans know better then the coach doing the job.. I just can't figure out why more Pro teams don't scout their message boards and pick coaches from the wealth of talent there?? Fans are especially good at pointing out failed plays after the play failed..LOL

[artemusclyde]

For the last 17 years that I have been reading the boards it's always the fans know better then the coach doing the job.. I just can't figure out why more Pro teams don't scout their message boards and pick coaches from the wealth of talent there?? Fans are especially good at pointing out failed plays after the play failed..LOL

 

I think rarely using play action is a valid concern. Just like how Mornhinwheg ran a pass happy offense was a valid concern. Also, it's not like Gailey was knocking down doors for a job. This was a guy who was 2 years out of coaching football, and not because he choose to be.

[drdetroit]

Who are these weapons you speak of ? Decker was hurt in and out majority of the season and when he was on the field Geno played okay . But who else was there ?

Geno had the immortal Jeff Cumberland and Stephanie Hill.

[artemusclyde]

We'll yeah that 2013 jet team was just stacked with talent with Clyde gates and Kellen Winslow at receiver.

Fitz never played with Andre Johnson, Arian Foster and JJ Watt or nothing

 

Oh please, we won games back in 2013 by having a stout defense and strong running game, much like how we won with Sanchez.

[drdetroit]

Numbers say that Geno is the worst QB in football the past two years - but that's just stats.

What gets me is that generally, and I've seen it again and again in 2 years with him starting under center, when a single pass rusher hurries him the play devolves into Geno running for dear life, a tactic that served him at WV, but not in the NFL.

Geno is not and never was some kind of shiny new Cadillac QB. He has plenty of gifts, but (like Petty, I assume) would have benefitted greatly from riding the pine behind a Fitz-caliber or better QB.

Is he better today than when he started opening day 2013? I'd say so, but he was woefully unprepared.

DrD - apparently you think Geno is some kind of gift to Jets fans. You need a reality check; when we got Geno his "weapons" in 2014 he burst up to 29th rated passer in the league (that's up from dead-last 37th) but we won only 4 games. QB is a lot more than having a fast guy to throw to. Way more.

In summation, he sucks because he routinely tries to be a spontaneous playmaker only to get pissy results. Go as a non-AFC East or non-Giants fan for some unbiased opinion on Geno. Again, there isn't a team in the league that would trade a bag of balls for him.

Wah wah wah. We didn't have sh-t at WR in 2013 and we had a healthy Decker maybe for half a season last year. Geno isn't good but he's the best qb on our roster especially if Fitz still has medical issues.

[drdetroit]

Oh please, we won games back in 2013 by having a stout defense and strong running game, much like how we won with Sanchez.

Oh yeah the starting qb had nothing to do with it his play only counts when we lose.

Why has Fitz never won 8 games in a season with better rosters than what we had last 2 years?

[sackdance]

Oh yeah the starting qb had nothing to do with it his play only counts when we lose.

 

 

I didn't think I was going to have to ask this, but have you ever actually seen Geno play quarterback? 

[Vinny16]

Oh yeah the starting qb had nothing to do with it his play only counts when we lose.

Why has Fitz never won 8 games in a season with better rosters than what we had last 2 years?

 

It's funny how that works, isn't it. 

 

Yes, we won games back in 2013 with a good defense and a good running game.  We now have arguably the best defense in the league, which will keep us in just about every game we play this season.  The running game should be good as well.  Combine that with the fact that the offense has much better weapons surrounding Geno and a coordinator who is willing to tailor his system to fit what his QB can do, then there's no reason why there can't be similar and possibly better results to what we did in 2013 with a far less talented roster.

[56mehl56]

I didn't think I was going to have to ask this, but have you ever actually seen Geno play quarterback? 

Study the QB play in Buffalo this year , then report back on why Geno was so horrible. 

[artemusclyde]

Study the QB play in Buffalo this year , then report back on why Geno was so horrible. 

 

Have a lot more faith in Cassel then I do in freaking Geno Smith.

[jeaniec]

Study the QB play in Buffalo this year , then report back on why Geno was so horrible. 

Bills fan here.  There's a good chance that Tyrod  may be starting for the Bills.  There's been some really good reports on him after mini-training camp.  

[win4ever]

1) entirely possible

2) no, Fitz has very good familiarity with the system they're putting in place

3) I agree that this is likely Gailey falling in love with Geno's POTENTIAL (little does he know...)

4) If you still believe in Geno's potential, then you are justified in saying that.  Personally, I don't think Geno has what it takes.  The intangibles just aren't there in my opinion.  He doesn't handle pressure well, his mental clock gets easily disrupted, he's slow to get rid of the ball, and has MAJOR accuracy issues.  He looks great until game action comes and guys play at full speed.  There he's exposed.

 

3.  I think Geno's potential is alluring because he really has all the tools.  Good arm strength, showed good accuracy in college, mobile, good size.  I think the big problem for him was the adjustment from the spread system to the WC offense, when his options are very limited.   When Decker was healthy last year, we seemed to move the ball pretty well, but as soon as he was limited, our offense went in the tank.  The whole system was based on timing, and all the cast of characters that seemed to come in there last two years throws that off as well.  I would love to see what he does in a different system.  Every other young QB, the team goes out of their way to actually put pieces around him with talent so they could develop but we kept focusing on defense.  

 

4.  This ties into my points on three, but I do think part of it is the team he was surrounded by, because it's hard for any Qb to be good when he has no one good to throw to.  Even Tom Brady looks human when Gronk is out because you have to be exceptional to beat defenses that just have a physical advantage.  Look at the guys on our roster from last two years.   Holmes- No one wants him, nary a team even wants to try him out as a No. 5 type WR, and he was our No. 1.  David Nelson, sitting at home.  Greg Salas, mostly hurt for us, going to be a fringe roster guy at best for the Lions.  Stephen Hill, our defacto No. 2, spent all of last year on the PS and no one even bothered to pick him up.  Clyde Gates, don't even know where he is.  Heck, we actually got excited about Josh Cribbs, and he can't find a job.  TJ Graham, plucked off the streets, ditto with Owusu.  And we got an over-rated Percy Harvin, who made money this offseason partially because Rex is loyal to a fault.  We didn't have one guy besides Decker that actually scared the defense in any sense.  Now, including Decker, we have three.  So I think there will be a decent amount of improvement just by having these guys around.  The question really is, how much?  If Geno can be just a league average guy, we could compete.  

[Powpow]

Gailey didn't have to be so absolute but whats he going to say.  There just isn't a viable option other than this scrub starting.  Fitz cant even practice and probably wont even be in game shape until first quarter of the season.  Whats disappointing is Mac didn't seek a better option than Fitz and has left this putrid POS as the starter yet again, out of necessity rather than virtue.  This will be a mistake he shall regret. Hopefully, he learns his lesson for 2016.  

[BRONX DUDE]

This in not the WAY TO ENGAGE A LOYAL FAN BASE FOR THE UPCOMING SEASON to buy tickets

Galley - hint- do NOT speak to the press. PLEASE.

[56mehl56]

Have a lot more faith in Cassel then I do in freaking Geno Smith.

We saw Cassel under Belicheck , now we get to see him under Rex. 

[Savage69]

We saw Cassel under Belicheck , now we get to see him under Rex. 

You also saw him under Todd Haley when he had his best year with the Chiefs..

[CrazyCarl40]

Gailey didn't have to be so absolute but whats he going to say. There just isn't a viable option other than this scrub starting. Fitz cant even practice and probably wont even be in game shape until first quarter of the season. Whats disappointing is Mac didn't seek a better option than Fitz and has left this putrid POS as the starter yet again, out of necessity rather than virtue. This will be a mistake he shall regret. Hopefully, he learns his lesson for 2016.

You have no clue what options were sought out or explored and you have no idea if those options were any better.

Mac upgraded many positions that were lacking almost as badly as QB. QB is the hardest position to figure out in professional sports. So let's give him more than one offseason to rectify a position that has been mishandled for quite some time.

[flgreen]

This in not the WAY TO ENGAGE A LOYAL FAN BASE FOR THE UPCOMING SEASON to buy tickets

Galley - hint- do NOT speak to the press. PLEASE.

Yeah.  I think Bowles just learned a valuable lesson in why most HC's don't let their coordinators talk to the media

[Powpow]

You have no clue what options were sought out or explored and you have no idea if those options were any better.

Mac upgraded many positions that were lacking almost as badly as QB. QB is the hardest position to figure out in professional sports. So let's give him more than one offseason to rectify a position that has been mishandled for quite some time.

Really? No clue? I do know this team is going NOWHERE  with Smith as the 1st string QB.  They will be better this year. How could they not. And Smith will be better - how could he not. BUT  it will pretty much be for naught.  We'd be lucky to go 7-9, 8-8 tops.  And IMO, Mac has done a great job, with the exception of finding a starting QB NOW.  While the dearth in the QB position is pretty alarming in the NFL these days, Mac really should have addressed the most important position - QB.  Petty wont be ready for at least a year or two.  Fitz is a capable back up - that's his ceiling.  Glennon made perfect sense for this team. And I find it hard to believe he would have cost that much to pry him away especially after the Bucs crowned Winston as their savior. The team mac has assembled has lots of talent BUT many of these guys are going into the late stages of their careers.  We are set up to win NOW - except for the most important position - QB.            

[Powpow]

+1000000000000000000000000000

 

johnnysd, on 22 May 2015 - 12:36 PM, said:Ummm, no. Gailey stated unequivocally that Geno is the starter, and also said that Bowles has stated he is the starter. He also said he would not lose his position as starter in camp, and does not believe in a short hook for the QB because of a couple bad games. He also definitively stated the offense is being built for GENO. He could not have been more clear. There was no PR in this at all. Geno is the Day 1 starter. Period. You may not like it, and want to come up with all these mental gymnastics on how he was unclear but he was crystal. Geno starts. Why anyone would think the Jets would do something else is beyond me. And no competition is better for Geno.

-1000000000000000000000000000

[DaBallhawk]

It is a bit odd that "Dee has to compete for a roster spot like everybody else" and here we are handing a starting job to Geno that he hasn't earned, with almost no chance of losing it in camp or preseason unless he gets injured. I guess maybe because he plays QB it's a different story but still. You can't say everybody has to compete for a roster spot and then Geno, for no reason, is being gifted the starting QB job. We went through that with Sanchez who has been babied by Rex, we don't have to go through that again.

[JohnnyLV]

Really? No clue? I do know this team is going NOWHERE  with Smith as the 1st string QB.  They will be better this year. How could they not. And Smith will be better - how could he not. BUT  it will pretty much be for naught.  We'd be lucky to go 7-9, 8-8 tops.  And IMO, Mac has done a great job, with the exception of finding a starting QB NOW.  While the dearth in the QB position is pretty alarming in the NFL these days, Mac really should have addressed the most important position - QB.  Petty wont be ready for at least a year or two.  Fitz is a capable back up - that's his ceiling.  Glennon made perfect sense for this team. And I find it hard to believe he would have cost that much to pry him away especially after the Bucs crowned Winston as their savior. The team mac has assembled has lots of talent BUT many of these guys are going into the late stages of their careers.  We are set up to win NOW - except for the most important position - QB.            

 

We went 8-8 two years ago, with a much worse coaching staff, harder schedule, a rookie Geno, no weapons on offense and a declining defense. If everything is improved and it is and schedule is easier which it also is no reason we cannot win 10+ games with Geno at QB.