We aren't rebuilding, we are becoming the Browns

[jgb]

52 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

He sure didn't help out the locker room all that much last year. If Harris was such a leader things may have been different.

Good point how many times did Rex lose the locker room with these "veteran leaders" in the room?

[Powpow]

15 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Are you kidding? I wish we were the Browns.

Bite your tongue. The Browns with ALL those premium draft picks still don't have a QB.  They let Carson Wentz slip right through their fingers which had to be the stupidest football decision made in countless years. In the last 19 years they have 2 winning records and typically finish with 2-5 wins. Talk about AWFUL.  Get your QB and build around him. The Browns are as clueless as Inspector Clouseau.

[j4jets]

16 hours ago, bostonmajet said:

eh; david was getting slower by the year; maybe he had another year, most likely not. Decker has been hurt and is only around for 1 maybe 2 more years. In a rebuild you don't need 'overpriced' vets. you need to build a foundation. If they were trading away Leo or (crap there is nobody else - lol) or Quincy I can understand the uproar, but they are blowing the team up. This is what happens.

1. Decker was not an overpriced vet. Not even close. 

2. When you rebuild, you need a core. Like you said, we have nobody besides Leo. That is the more concerning factor. Who are we rebuilding around? We have no rebuilding foundation blocks. We have sh*t. That's not a rebuild. That's a "no-plan" tear down. Browns do it every year. Hasn't netted them anything at all, whatsoever. So yes, the OP is spot on. 

[Skeptable]

15 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

I got to disagree. You can do a rebuild, it just has to be done properly. Speaking of your comparison with the Browns, Look at what Sashi Brown has done with that team in a season and a half of work as a GM in terms of a proper rebuild. He understood that a rebuild is predicated on drafting players. All he did last year was rack up on picks, all he did this year was rack up on picks through proper trading. Sashi Brown has been the GM since Jan. 2016, and during that time the Browns have had four 1st round picks, two 2nd round picks and four 3rd round picks. Next season the Browns currently have two 1st round picks, three 2nd round picks, and a 3rd round pick. 

From the perspective of "rebuilding" what he's done in regards to picking up top 100 talent over the past 3 seasons is phenomenal. Furthermore, putting himself in position to pick up top 32 talent is even more phenomenal having 6 1st round picks in a span of 3 drafts. 

What Sashi seems to understand is that it is more than just having top talent at the QB position, while at the same time putting himself in a great position to be able to pull the trigger if there is one available. Getting a guy like Cody Kessler (a guy who I thought had a weaker arm than Chad Pennington) seems to have been pretty solid if not for the injury last season. Kevin Hogan showed some promise as well. Now Sashi has 2 1st round picks leading up to a draft where people are saying that this could be one of those great QB draft years.....and he has 2 1st round picks. Oh, and lets not forget Deshone Kizer. 

 

The Browns have put some pieces in place, picking up quality players/depth QB's, legit targets on offense and they've drafted 3 edge rushers the past 2 seasons including one that was considered the best player of this past seasons draft class, and the Browns could be in position to draft a solid QB IF a guy like Kizer shows that he's not up to task. 

 

If the Browns and Jets both hit on QB's next year, the Browns from a team perspective is in a much better situation. The Browns did what needed to be done and now the worst is behind them. The Jets did what they had to do in 2014 with Idzik then they decided to give the team to Fitzpatrick in 2015 then gave him 12 million in 2016. The Browns even knew better than to do that sh*t. 

We're worst than the Browns at this point. The Browns drafted Kizer, a guy who was considered a 1st round/2nd round talent. The Jets drafted Hackenberg in the 2nd, a guy who could have been available in the 4th or 5th round. 

Paul DePodesta started that rebuild.

[Villain The Foe]

Just now, Skeptable said:

Deposta started that rebuild.

Point being though...

[Skeptable]

7 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

Point being though...

Agreed except we don't have a Theo or DePodesta on this team... So I am concerned that they will **** this up... My thoughts are that Bowles is gone and Jim Harbaugh is the Coach/ Front office Exec.  Mac will move to a more scouting director role and Harbaugh gets full control... Just My Opinion.... 

We can argue how good or bad that will be but Harbaugh wants his shot at the FBS Championship and then he is coming back to the NFL...   

[JoJoTownsell1]

16 hours ago, bostonmajet said:

eh; david was getting slower by the year; maybe he had another year, most likely not. Decker has been hurt and is only around for 1 maybe 2 more years. In a rebuild you don't need 'overpriced' vets. you need to build a foundation. If they were trading away Leo or (crap there is nobody else - lol) or Quincy I can understand the uproar, but they are blowing the team up. This is what happens.

Exactly. Who are the morons that think losing Harris and Decker well impact our chances of winning it all in two years??

We didn't even give away Sheldon... Yet. Macc just unloaded overpriced vets that no longer served a purpose. It's just what a rebuild looks like. Out with the vets, in with the kids.

[bostonmajet]

37 minutes ago, j4jets said:

1. Decker was not an overpriced vet. Not even close. 

2. When you rebuild, you need a core. Like you said, we have nobody besides Leo. That is the more concerning factor. Who are we rebuilding around? We have no rebuilding foundation blocks. We have sh*t. That's not a rebuild. That's a "no-plan" tear down. Browns do it every year. Hasn't netted them anything at all, whatsoever. So yes, the OP is spot on. 

everyone said we 'overpaid' for a #2 (or 1a) when he was signed. i personally wouldn't have let him go, but we did. i am not defending the GM/FO, but , we are still not the browns. people begged for a tear-down; maybe we should wait a whole month before we label ourselves the browns. but, whatever, be unhappy.

[southparkcpa]

16 hours ago, HessStation said:

Kevin is obv a half empty kinda guy.

Perfect for this team.... after 47 years of this shlt..... I am too, I think. ?

[southtown24th]

NEWSFLASH: We ARE The Browns.

 

Jets=Browns

Synonymous.

[thadude]

1 hour ago, Powpow said:

Bite your tongue. The Browns with ALL those premium draft picks still don't have a QB.  They let Carson Wentz slip right through their fingers which had to be the stupidest football decision made in countless years. In the last 19 years they have 2 winning records and typically finish with 2-5 wins. Talk about AWFUL.  Get your QB and build around him. The Browns are as clueless as Inspector Clouseau.

Kizer > any Qb on the jets roster

[UntouchableCrew]

The Browns suck every year, have high picks every year, and never turn in them into anything. They haven't won a playoff game since the franchise was resurrected 18 years ago, and have only made it once. We'll need to suck for several more years in a row before we're even in that conversation. 

[rammagen]

nope I think we become the browns if we fire another gm and coach, there needs to be some stability. So in this case if they are prepared to loose and not pull the plug on the rebuild then I support. But half way through you change direction and change gms and staff then we are the browns.

[peebag]

2 minutes ago, rammagen said:

nope I think we become the browns if we fire another gm and coach, there needs to be some stability. So in this case if they are prepared to loose and not pull the plug on the rebuild then I support. But half way through you change direction and change gms and staff then we are the browns.

yea but what if Bowle of Mac is not the right combination for a rebuild - how long do you stick with these guys?

[thadude]

15 hours ago, jeremy2020 said:

look on the brightside, you'll know what defense to play fantasy each week...

I just won my league thanks!

[rammagen]

Just now, peebag said:

yea but what if Bowle of Mac is not the right combination for a rebuild - how long do you stick with these guys?

And you know this how? based on your opinion and that is fine but I think the gm has done a better job then idzick and bowles is not as bad as he appears. By no means does this mean he is a great coach just middle of the road. he appears to defend the correct players. I.E. The Jones release. Is an average coach good enough ?

I do not think as a pair they are as bad as people and the media are making them out to believe. They looked good when they won 10 games the first yr and looked equally as bad the second yr when they lost 11 games.

Allot of this as fans we are desperately wanting to win ad there is nothing wrong with the impatiences but in this case it will take time to do a proper rebuild, I am happy we are actually doing that. Being said it will be hard to watch a game unless they start hack and play through his growing.

I think getting a franchise QB is the goal and then building around him, this is something that the gm is setting up for in next yrs draft if hack is not the answer. And I say because no-one has seen hack play a single live down of football so calling him a bust is a bit premature. Complain the did not play him last yr but also keep in mind they said at the beginning of the yr they told everyone he was not going to play so give them credit to keeping to their plan for him, and avoiding a Geno Smith issue here.

[ZachEY]

1 hour ago, Skeptable said:

Agreed except we don't have a Theo or DePodesta on this team... So I am concerned that they will **** this up... My thoughts are that Bowles is gone and Jim Harbaugh is the Coach/ Front office Exec.  Mac will move to a more scouting director role and Harbaugh gets full control... Just My Opinion.... 

We can argue how good or bad that will be but Harbaugh wants his shot at the FBS Championship and then he is coming back to the NFL...   

Has Harbaugh made any indication he would like to leave Ann Arbor?  Because, seems like you're confabulating your opinion with your wish.

[ZachEY]

18 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Are you kidding? I wish we were the Browns.

The browns will have 2 first round picks again next year.  They appear to have a pass rusher.  They got a potential QB and will get a shot at one of this years top QBs as well.

I sure as hell would rather be the Browns.

[Savage69]

18 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Sometimes keeping a guy who has been around the league for 10 years for the lockeroom is more valuable then on field play.

That's called a Coach..

[ScarletKnight89]

You need a QB to win in this league. We're much closer to finding that guy now than we were a year ago. We'll evaluate Hack this year and if he stinks and isn't the answer we're probably going to be in position for a high draft pick and a potential shot at a potential franchise QB in the draft.

We weren't going to be able to do anything by trying to plug holes when we didn't have a QB. We'd be poised for 6-7 wins again. It' doesn't take 4 years to rebuild in the NFL. The Jets, most likely, are going to have a ton of cap space and a top pick to work with in the next off season. If they can find a QB next off season the Jets could very well be poised to take a huge step forward.

In the meantime, they're trying to build up the defense. I wish they addressed the O-Line but oh well. Hopefully they can do that next off season.

[ScarletKnight89]

1 hour ago, Skeptable said:

Agreed except we don't have a Theo or DePodesta on this team... So I am concerned that they will **** this up... My thoughts are that Bowles is gone and Jim Harbaugh is the Coach/ Front office Exec.  Mac will move to a more scouting director role and Harbaugh gets full control... Just My Opinion.... 

We can argue how good or bad that will be but Harbaugh wants his shot at the FBS Championship and then he is coming back to the NFL...   

What are you basing this off of?

[dbatesman]

7 minutes ago, gEYno said:

The browns will have 2 first round picks again next year.  They appear to have a pass rusher.  They got a potential QB and will get a shot at one of this years top QBs as well.

I sure as hell would rather be the Browns.

SOJF

[Skeptable]

26 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Has Harbaugh made any indication he would like to leave Ann Arbor?  Because, seems like you're confabulating your opinion with your wish.

Yes, He has said numerous times he wants to coach in the NFL again.... Maybe that changes, but I doubt it.

[Skeptable]

21 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

What are you basing this off of?

That I think Harbaugh will come back to the NFL.  He stated as much numerous times.... here is one from December http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/12/24/report-no-jim-harbaugh-return-to-the-nfl-in-2017/

Why would he choose the Jets... Top pick for one of the best QBs in the draft and a very very young team with a ton of FA money... maybe up to 100 Million under the cap.

[ZachEY]

8 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

Yes, He has said numerous times he wants to coach in the NFL again.... Maybe that changes, but I doubt it.

 

4 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

That I think Harbaugh will come back to the NFL.  He stated as much numerous times.... here is one from December http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/12/24/report-no-jim-harbaugh-return-to-the-nfl-in-2017/

Why would he choose the Jets... Top pick for one of the best QBs in the draft and a very very young team with a ton of FA money... maybe up to 100 Million under the cap.

In the link you've posted, what specifically does Harbaugh say about his desire to come back to the NFL?  Because I read this article twice now, and I guess I'm missing it.

[bostonmajet]

41 minutes ago, gEYno said:

The browns will have 2 first round picks again next year.  They appear to have a pass rusher.  They got a potential QB and will get a shot at one of this years top QBs as well.

I sure as hell would rather be the Browns.

If we pick 1st and we are not convinced about Hack, all of the draft picks in the world won't get them in front of us. If by some miracle, Hack is our guy, we are going to get a ton of picks for the #1.

Are the Browns in a better draft situation, maybe. But, since they have finished below 500 for almost 10 years, I would expect so.

[ZachEY]

Just now, bostonmajet said:

If we pick 1st and we are not convinced about Hack, all of the draft picks in the world won't get them in front of us. If by some miracle, Hack is our guy, we are going to get a ton of picks for the #1.

Are the Browns in a better draft situation, maybe. But, since they have finished below 500 for almost 10 years, I would expect so.

So far as I can tell, Darnold is the top QB.  But, two other QBs are considered to be good options at this time, as well.  So, the Browns will either have Kizer, or get a great QB, and likely still have another 1st rounder, a year after drafting two others in the 1st round.

There is also not really a feasible scenario in which we know Hack is our guy and we get the #1 overall pick.

[bostonmajet]

1 minute ago, gEYno said:

So far as I can tell, Darnold is the top QB.  But, two other QBs are considered to be good options at this time, as well.  So, the Browns will either have Kizer, or get a great QB, and likely still have another 1st rounder, a year after drafting two others in the 1st round.

There is also not really a feasible scenario in which we know Hack is our guy and we get the #1 overall pick.

We may not know if he is the guy, but we could know if he is def. not our guy. Either way, we are either going to be in a position to draft a top QB or get enough picks to compensate us for not taking one. The Browns are likely in the same scenario, but after sucking for all of these years, in the end they would be only ahead of us by an extra 1st round pick and a pass rusher. Better, sure. Worth the misery of the last 5 years, I doubt it.

My point is that there is still a decent chance we can be much better in 3 years. The Browns can too, but for them it will be a 12 year turn around, and for us, not so much...

[ZachEY]

Just now, bostonmajet said:

We may not know if he is the guy, but we could know if he is def. not our guy. Either way, we are either going to be in a position to draft a top QB or get enough picks to compensate us for not taking one. The Browns are likely in the same scenario, but after sucking for all of these years, in the end they would be only ahead of us by an extra 1st round pick and a pass rusher. Better, sure. Worth the misery of the last 5 years, I doubt it.

My point is that there is still a decent chance we can be much better in 3 years. The Browns can too, but for them it will be a 12 year turn around, and for us, not so much...

The point being, if we are sitting at #1, there's no way we can pass on Darnold.  If Hackenberg did enough to convince you to pass on Darnold, there's no realistic way we'd be sitting at 1.

Re: the Browns last 5 years... We've sucked the last 5 years too...

[JoJoTownsell1]

4 minutes ago, gEYno said:

The point being, if we are sitting at #1, there's no way we can pass on Darnold.  If Hackenberg did enough to convince you to pass on Darnold, there's no realistic way we'd be sitting at 1.

Re: the Browns last 5 years... We've sucked the last 5 years too...

It's possible the Jets start Mccown. He goes 0-4. We then go to Hack who puts up good numbers, but the defense is terrible and we lose some games 31-28 on the road to a 2 win season. It's a LOOOONG shot but possible. Either way, getting a high draft pick for a team rebuilding is never a bad thing. 

[ScarletKnight89]

29 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

That I think Harbaugh will come back to the NFL.  He stated as much numerous times.... here is one from December http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/12/24/report-no-jim-harbaugh-return-to-the-nfl-in-2017/

Why would he choose the Jets... Top pick for one of the best QBs in the draft and a very very young team with a ton of FA money... maybe up to 100 Million under the cap.

He doesn't state anything in that link though.

I agree that if the Jets have a top pick, tons of cap space, and fire Bowles, that they would probably have a lot of interest in from candidates for the job, especially if the QB class is as good as projected after this season as it is now. But I don't think Harbaugh is seriously interested in leaving Michigan at this point. Maybe after a National Championship.

[kelly]

" We aren't rebuilding, we are becoming the Browns "..

... we are NOT becoming the browns. we are WORSE than the browns   

[August]

So we should continue to retool and do the same thing we've been doing for 20 years? 

[RoadFan]

Ahhhh...  there's kevin90210 with his misguided no such thing as rebuilding theory.

[Jet Life]

Not having a good draft in literally 10 years is why we are currently the Browns. Not because we cut a bunch over 30 year old plus, overpaid players.