It starts with talent

[ZachEY]

7 hours ago, Pac said:

looking forward to your tears when Macc keeps his job more than the next 6 games.

Only you, and I suppose fans of the rest of the AFC East, would be happy that the worst GM in the NFL at identifying and acquiring talent, may remain past this season.

[ZachEY]

5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

 

I don’t even need to make a “cute joke” when you and others say stuff like this. It stands on its own.

 

Our GM has been here 4 years. We’re supposedly in year 2 of a rebuild. Simple math suggests he played a hand in causing this “2 year rebuild” to be necessary.

 

This “rebuild” you’re talking about was necessitated because Macc wasted 2 years on Christian Hackenberg, a QB who couldn’t even complete 60 % of his throws against Indiana despite 4 chances at doing so.

 

You don’t get to eat your cake and have it to. You don’t get to say we’re in a rebuild, and excuse Macc for not only the last 2 years, but the 2 before that too.

 

Macc is out of excuses. His program is 23-35 since he arrived, with 0 playoff appearances. Today his roster got beaten soundly by one of the 3 worst teams in the NFL. And you cannot fully blame that on the Head Coach.

 

Also, when you’re not rebuilding, apparently it’s okay to have the NFLs worst drafts?

Anyway, didn’t Pac predict a wildcard push this year?

[rangerous]

10 hours ago, LionelRichie said:

Yes, Bowles is going to be the much deserving scapegoat for this abortion of a team but the team lacks NFL talent from top to bottom.   The entire roster is in need of an overhaul and our depth is sitting their couches via blown pick after blown pick.   

It's like the NYJ don't realize that the 2nd rd of the NFL draft is a real thing - Maye, Hackenburg, Devin Smith, Jace Amaro, Geno Smith, Vlad Ducasse.    Add in the other misses from '15-'17 with Hansen + Stewart, burris, mauldin, petty and you get an understanding of why they are forced to sign guys off the street to play.   

Johnson, the big FA 'get' has been absolutely terrible this year and for whatever reason Buster Skrine continues to be employed.  

Bad players = a bad team.   It's really not any more complicated than that.   This team needs a Parcells style roster enema and the sooner the better.   For whatever reason Macc is 4 years in and continues to try bandaids and 'value' players.    Other than Darnold, no one should be safe and whoever takes over needs to find players who can play.     

It's not scheme, or emotion, or any of the other things we are so quick to blame.   this team stinks, the talent level stinks, everything about the NYJ is an unprofessional embarrassment right now. 

 

well yes and no , imo.  they need a certain level of talent to be successful but at the same time the team should be creating it's own talent.  by this i mean it's a team game and how any player plays depends on how well the guys next to him play.  but you are right.  2nd round has been a disaster going back to the david harris pick.  i disagree with maye though.  he's much better at his position than the guys he replaced.  but missing on so many players over so many drafts just doesn't work very well.

as for mac, it's hard to tell.  he's certainly had his draft stinkers but he also brought in some solid players and finally got a qb we can believe in.  we don't know how much he was influenced by bowles in his choices. 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

10 hours ago, LionelRichie said:

Yes, Bowles is going to be the much deserving scapegoat for this abortion of a team but the team lacks NFL talent from top to bottom.   The entire roster is in need of an overhaul and our depth is sitting their couches via blown pick after blown pick.   

It's like the NYJ don't realize that the 2nd rd of the NFL draft is a real thing - Maye, Hackenburg, Devin Smith, Jace Amaro, Geno Smith, Vlad Ducasse.    Add in the other misses from '15-'17 with Hansen + Stewart, burris, mauldin, petty and you get an understanding of why they are forced to sign guys off the street to play.   

Johnson, the big FA 'get' has been absolutely terrible this year and for whatever reason Buster Skrine continues to be employed.  

Bad players = a bad team.   It's really not any more complicated than that.   This team needs a Parcells style roster enema and the sooner the better.   For whatever reason Macc is 4 years in and continues to try bandaids and 'value' players.    Other than Darnold, no one should be safe and whoever takes over needs to find players who can play.     

It's not scheme, or emotion, or any of the other things we are so quick to blame.   this team stinks, the talent level stinks, everything about the NYJ is an unprofessional embarrassment right now. 

 

It's a double-edged sword. A better roster gives Bowles the best chance to win, but a better coach could squeeze out a few more wins with this roster. With the current talent on this team, and even with a swiss cheese OL, a good coach has this team at 5-5, and maybe even 6-4. There is no way that a good coach loses against Cleveland, twice to the Dolphins, and once to the Bills. 

[genot]

10 hours ago, JetsYanks13 said:

I agree there is not much talent on offense, but there is no EXCUSE, for the defense. NONE. That’s Bowles side of the ball, he should have take ownership of that group! Instead he remained loyal to Rodgers and will soon find himself unemployed. They have 3 1st rounders, signed trumaine. No excuses there.


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The  defense called in sick. Too many three and outs by the offense will do that.

[ZachEY]

14 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

It's a double-edged sword. A better roster gives Bowles the best chance to win, but a better coach could squeeze out a few more wins with this roster. With the current talent on this team, and even with a swiss cheese OL, a good coach has this team at 5-5, and maybe even 6-4. There is no way that a good coach loses against Cleveland, twice to the Dolphins, and once to the Bills. 

Sure.  But we’re 3-7, so, “a few more wins” and we’re still bad.  So, probably more important to focus on the good players part.

[sec101row23]

I’m not sure what the people who are claiming there is enough talent on this team are looking at.  It’s laughable how little talent there it.  Either they are clueless as to what they are looking at, or are just massive homers who think every player in green who happened to make a play once in their career, is talented.  

[ZachEY]

Just now, sec101row23 said:

I’m not sure what the people who are claiming there is enough talent on this team are looking at.  It’s laughable how little talent there it.  Either they are clueless as to what they are looking at, or are just massive homers who think every player in green who happened to make a play once in their career, is talented.  

It’s the homer thing, even with people who, overall, aren’t homers.  Jets fans know the names of Jets players, so they’re naturally inclined to believe those names are relevant.  Even a guy that’s decent, like Herndon - there’s a Herndon on almost every roster, but suddenly because we have a potentially average TE, many fans think we may be strong at the position.  Add to that that even the bad players make plays once in a while, and quickly many fans think that’s what they should expect - not the typical below average play.

[dbatesman]

7 hours ago, Pac said:

looking forward to your tears when Macc keeps his job more than the next 6 games.

retaining the worst GM in the league to own the SOJFs

[Jetscode1]

8 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Here's 11 good reasons why, as bad as Todd Bowles is, Mike Maccagnan is even worse:

 

* Devin Smith

* Lorenzo Mauldin

* Bryce Petty

* Jarvis Harrison

* Christian Hackenberg

* Juston Burris

* Marcus Maye

* ArDarius Stewart

* Chad Hansen

* Jordan Leggett

* Dylan Donahue

 

And here's a few more:

 

* $39 million guaranteed to Darrelle Revis

* $13 million guaranteed to Buster Skrine

* Marcus Gilchrist

* Percy Harvin

* Matt Forte

* Ryan Clady

* Spencer Long

* Trumaine Johnson

Percy?

[sec101row23]

8 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

It’s the homer thing, even with people who, overall, aren’t homers.  Jets fans know the names of Jets players, so they’re naturally inclined to believe those names are relevant.  Even a guy that’s decent, like Herndon - there’s a Herndon on almost every roster, but suddenly because we have a potentially average TE, many fans think we may be strong at the position.  Add to that that even the bad players make plays once in a while, and quickly many fans think that’s what they should expect - not the typical below average play.

You are right.  Fans typically over-inflate the abilities of their player.  Robby Andersen is the classic example of this IMO.  I’m just not sure how these people can look around the NFL, then look at the Jets and say they have talent.  

[genot]

11 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

retaining the worst GM in the league to own the SOJFs

Your overreacting.

[JetsYanks13]

And now it’s apparent, we need a backup QB as well.


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[genot]

1 minute ago, sec101row23 said:

You are right.  Fans typically over-inflate the abilities of their player.  Robby Andersen is the classic example of this IMO.  I’m just not sure how these people can look around the NFL, then look at the Jets and say they have talent.  

I don't care how many skill players you have. Their skills will not be displayed working with an offensive line that can't block.

[JetsYanks13]

The whole offense needs to be overhauled. With the exception of darnold, winters, Herndon and possibly enunwa at the right price.


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[sec101row23]

Just now, genot said:

I don't care how many skill players you have. Their skills will not be displayed working with an offensive line that can't block.

What you saw yesterday was an offense with little to no talent.  Line is bad, and so are the skill guys.  Even with a bad O line you could still make some plays.  But bad line, bad skill guys you get what we saw yesterday.  The Texans have a horrible O line, yet they still make plays.  

[sec101row23]

2 minutes ago, JetsYanks13 said:

The whole offense needs to be overhauled. With the exception of darnold, winters, Herndon and possibly enunwa at the right price.


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The good thing is that there are only 10 offensive players under contract for next year.  The bad news is that there is only $100 million and not a lot of potential free agents.  

[JetsYanks13]

The good thing is that there are only 10 offensive players under contract for next year.  The bad news is that there is only $100 million and not a lot of potential free agents.  

This is where GM and competant coaching comes into play. We can’t buy a free agent at every position.


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[SR24]

Mac,Bowles,Rodgers and Bates all gotta go

[sec101row23]

Just now, JetsYanks13 said:

This is where GM and competant coaching comes into play. We can’t buy a free agent at every position.


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Exactly.  That’s why all this talk about the cap space is silly.  You can’t build a roster in free agency, it’s foolish.  Great overpay for a bunch of Trumaine Johnsons.   

[Creepy Lurker]

My only hope is that Bowles defends himself and throws Mac under the bus for his terrible drafting and talent that he got him. This is the only way that I can see Chris Johnson blowing it all up. 

[ZachEY]

23 minutes ago, genot said:

I don't care how many skill players you have. Their skills will not be displayed working with an offensive line that can't block.

Very true.  We neither have good skill players nor a quality offensive line.  We have a solid possession WR, a go-route runner, and maybe a QB.

[genot]

20 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

What you saw yesterday was an offense with little to no talent.  Line is bad, and so are the skill guys.  Even with a bad O line you could still make some plays.  But bad line, bad skill guys you get what we saw yesterday.  The Texans have a horrible O line, yet they still make plays.  

The texans can run the football a little bit. We can't. Our O-line can't pass block or run block. It's pathetic. take away the Denver fluke. We havn't done s... on the ground

[Pac]

1 hour ago, TeddEY said:

Only you, and I suppose fans of the rest of the AFC East, would be happy that the worst GM in the NFL at identifying and acquiring talent, may remain past this season.

This is some of the hysteria I'm talking about.  I read the board.  Just because Macc haters are louder doesn't mean there aren't people who want him to stay.  I read posts from them every day.

[genot]

11 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

Very true.  We neither have good skill players nor a quality offensive line.  We have a solid possession WR, a go-route runner, and maybe a QB.

 

11 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

Very true.  We neither have good skill players nor a quality offensive line.  We have a solid possession WR, a go-route runner, and maybe a QB.

I like Herndon, i like Mcguire. We need a complete receiver who can make catches all over the field. Tyrell Williams fits that bill. If Anderson is what you say he is, who's fault is that. At 6'3", he should be running more routes than what the Jets have him doing.

[section314]

40 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

My only hope is that Bowles defends himself and throws Mac under the bus for his terrible drafting and talent that he got him. This is the only way that I can see Chris Johnson blowing it all up. 

Can't see this happening....Bowles is too classy a man to resort to that. He's not like Rex, blaming everyone but himself. He also knows that people in the NFL know what the real story with this organization is, and probably doesn't want to risk a future shot at a spot somewhere else.

[Creepy Lurker]

1 minute ago, section314 said:

Can't see this happening....Bowles is too classy a man to resort to that. He's not like Rex, blaming everyone but himself. He also knows that people in the NFL know what the real story with this organization is, and probably doesn't want to risk a future shot at a spot somewhere else.

I’m just hoping is all because Mac gets way too much of a pass and is just as guilty of this mess as Bowles. 

[Matt39]

44 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

My only hope is that Bowles defends himself and throws Mac under the bus for his terrible drafting and talent that he got him. This is the only way that I can see Chris Johnson blowing it all up. 

Depends how involved he was in the drafting though. You have to think Bowles had a hand in picking guys like Shephard and Maye? Either way, there's little talent and I think both guys are pretty responsible. 

[Creepy Lurker]

1 minute ago, Matt39 said:

Depends how involved he was in the drafting though. You have to think Bowles had a hand in picking guys like Shephard and Maye? Either way, there's little talent and I think both guys are pretty responsible. 

True but Mac needs more heat. The media, fans, whoever need to start criticizing him more so the Johnson morons realize that he is just as much of a problem as Bowles. 

[joewilly12]

Just now, Creepy Lurker said:

True but Mac needs more heat. The media, fans, whoever need to start criticizing him more so the Johnson morons realize that he is just as much of a problem as Bowles. 

Macc and Bowles responsible for all of this.

NO PRISONERS FIRE THEM ALL. 

[Matt39]

3 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

True but Mac needs more heat. The media, fans, whoever need to start criticizing him more so the Johnson morons realize that he is just as much of a problem as Bowles. 

He's done a good job staying behind the scenes. Manish went for Idziks head immediately because he liked Rex and then the rambling presser sealed it.

Maccagnan's best job so far is making the fanbase believe he hasnt been here very long. You'd love to hear the rationale behind picking safeties back to back, interior linemen etc. . We've never gotten it. I dont think I've ever heard Mac or Bowles say anything of significance Year 4- what exactly is the game plan? Hope Darnold cures everything?

[CrazyCarl40]

“Oh look at this hill of a bad GM whose only saving grace is he lucked into a QB who has shown flashes that he could be good. This is where I shall die.” 

If this is your position, please re-evaluate. Good lord. 

[Sonny Werblin]

I disagree with the thread title.

It starts with the lack of talent.

[ZachEY]

28 minutes ago, Pac said:

This is some of the hysteria I'm talking about.  I read the board.  Just because Macc haters are louder doesn't mean there aren't people who want him to stay.  I read posts from them every day.

Only you, and a handful of other dolts, would want the worst GM in the league at acquiring talent to stay.  Better?

[Creepy Lurker]

1 minute ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

“Oh look at this hill of a bad GM whose only saving grace is he lucked into a QB who has shown flashes that he could be good. This is where I shall die.” 

If this is your position, please re-evaluate. Good lord. 

He has done NOTHING good enough to outweight the bad. Not even close. To dispute this is crazy.

No one expects perfection from GMs. We see the crap and mistakes that go on around the league. We do expect basic competence st the position and a vision. What a fraud piece of sh*t Mac has become.