AZ Cardinals desperate for 3-4 DLine help...and are pretty deep at CB

[peebag]

On 8/11/2019 at 7:14 AM, thshadow said:

Can we please not use more assets to help our *defense*?  If the Redskins want Leo as part of a deal for Trent Williams, great.  But investing even more assets than we already have in defense, at this stage of our team's development, is a losing mentality.

 

So...we just don't play pass defense?

[#27TheDominator]

On 8/11/2019 at 7:46 AM, jack48 said:

I would not trade leo for a backup CB.  Jet fans are the opposite of met fans. They undervalue their own talent

What talent at CB are fans "undervaluing?"  An UDFA is first up on our depth chart.  Our top two CBs are Roberts and Johnson.  After that there is Poole and Kyron Brown.  If all the other guys on our roster are below Kyron Brown, and our GM is picking up try-out players that were cut by two other teams, what would make you think we don't have a depth problem at CB?  

[varjet]

15 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

What talent at CB are fans "undervaluing?"  An UDFA is first up on our depth chart.  Our top two CBs are Roberts and Johnson.  After that there is Poole and Kyron Brown.  If all the other guys on our roster are below Kyron Brown, and our GM is picking up try-out players that were cut by two other teams, what would make you think we don't have a depth problem at CB?  

CB on this team can only get better, because smart teams stockpiled them and will have to cut them.   There are plenty of CBS better than what the Jets have ready to be claimed off of waivers.  They still may not be great, but they will be better than the guys have.  

[Bomberjet]

Trading a proven DL starter with the potential to be a pro-bowler for an unproven 2nd round CB? Boy, this is just pure genius. ?

[jeremy2020]

Who's this d-line that the jets are going to trade them? A reclamation project on a 14 million 1 year contract? That might get you a conditional 7th, bob. 

Jets need all the pass rush they can get. No way you get anything worth trading it away.

[Apache 51]

43 minutes ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

What if I told you they were the same fans???!!?!

 

Most but not all............

[14 in Green]

There’s a team we share our stadium with that just loaded up on CBs in the draft.

I know we don’t like trading with each other, but their D is thin where we have depth, and vice versa.

Barring a trade we might get one of the ones they cut. I’d be very happy with  a backfield of Adams, Maye, Johnson and their Jackrabbit.

(plus I like saying jackrabbit for some reason....)

[jack48]

5 hours ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

What if I told you they were the same fans???!!?!

 

A lot of them are.  But the blogs are different.  Interesting.  The Jets, who have had a more succesful history of late than the mets, still get it form their fans.  I think it is a football and baseball thing.

[jack48]

5 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

What talent at CB are fans "undervaluing?"  An UDFA is first up on our depth chart.  Our top two CBs are Roberts and Johnson.  After that there is Poole and Kyron Brown.  If all the other guys on our roster are below Kyron Brown, and our GM is picking up try-out players that were cut by two other teams, what would make you think we don't have a depth problem at CB?  

who is talking about CBs?  It was a general comment about fans.  Jet fans are always running down their players.  Met fans think some pretty average guys are better than that.

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, jack48 said:

A lot of them are.  But the blogs are different.  Interesting.  The Jets, who have had a more succesful history of late than the mets, still get it form their fans.  I think it is a football and baseball thing.

The Mets have been to two World Series in this century.  Jets fans would kill for 1 Super Bowl appearance in their lifetime.  

[#27TheDominator]

30 minutes ago, jack48 said:

who is talking about CBs?  It was a general comment about fans.  Jet fans are always running down their players.  Met fans think some pretty average guys are better than that.

Always?  I probably read several dozen posts this offseason that, freed from the oppressive overlord Todd Bowles, Derrick Jones and Jeremy Clark were going to warrant slots as starting cornerbacks.  They are both gone now, though Jones was at least picked up on waivers by the Packers. 

I discussed CB, cause that is where people are overvaluing other team's crap.  It is also where, as I have discussed, people have overvalued our crap. 

[Jack Straw]

The main takeaway I took from this article is that the Cardinals sixth round DT/DE has been way more productive than our #3 overall pick, Leonard Williams. 

[Philc1]

No idea why Leo is on the roster we should have traded him for a pick by now

[BurnleyJet]

1 hour ago, Philc1 said:

No idea why Leo is on the roster we should have traded him for a pick by now

I’m hoping because he’s still out with the hip injury. We aren’t re-signing him since we’d have done it already. So I’d trade him, I’ve been advocating this for a while.

Avery Williamson is another I’d punt, with Cashman looking good. 

[jetstream23]

25 minutes ago, BurnleyJet said:

I’m hoping because he’s still out with the hip injury. We aren’t re-signing him since we’d have done it already. So I’d trade him, I’ve been advocating this for a while.

Avery Williamson is another I’d punt, with Cashman looking good. 

Cashman is hurt too.  Also, he's a rookie who has never played in an NFL game and was taken in the 5th round.  I'm not sure I'd pin the middle of my defense on a guy like that quite yet.  Isn't Avery under contract for 2 more years?  If that's the case then keep him for 2019 and plan to trade him in the offseason if Cashman seems like he could step in.

EDIT:  Just to clear, I'm not ragging on Cashman.  He certainly has a chance and we've been hearing good things about him thus far, but we need to see it in real games this year.  For comparison, Zach Thomas who was a Pro Bowl MLB for Miami played at 5'11" and 228 lbs. so I don't think Cashman is too small to get it done.

[jack48]

15 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

The Mets have been to two World Series in this century.  Jets fans would kill for 1 Super Bowl appearance in their lifetime.  

the Jets have performed better than the Mets over the last 30 years in this town.  I think a Super bowl is much harder t get to than a World Series.

[jack48]

15 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Always?  I probably read several dozen posts this offseason that, freed from the oppressive overlord Todd Bowles, Derrick Jones and Jeremy Clark were going to warrant slots as starting cornerbacks.  They are both gone now, though Jones was at least picked up on waivers by the Packers. 

I discussed CB, cause that is where people are overvaluing other team's crap.  It is also where, as I have discussed, people have overvalued our crap. 

a whole dozen?

[#27TheDominator]

17 minutes ago, jack48 said:

a whole dozen?

It says "several dozen."  I know it contradicts board etiquette, but I was being truthful.  Next time I will be sure to return to board hyperbole mode.  Should I edit it to read "a kajillion?"  

[Joe W. Namath]

On 8/11/2019 at 4:44 PM, Spoot-Face said:

Joe Douglas: "Hey, so I hear you guys need some help on the D-line over there in 'Zona. How does Leonard Williams sound to you?"

Steve Keim: "Ok, what were you thinking as a return?"

JD: "Cornerback."

SK: "Which one; we've got..."

JD: "All of them."

SK: "Excuse me?"

JD: "I want all of your cornerbacks."

It would go more like this:

Joe Douglas: "Hey, so I hear you guys need some help on the D-line over there in 'Zona. How does Leonard Williams sound to you?"

Steve Keim: Who?

[More Cowbell]

On 8/11/2019 at 10:21 AM, Barry McCockinner said:

Williams is a free agent next year and hasn't lived up to his draft position. If we could get a starting CB for him it would be a haul.

Yeah, he hasn't  lived up to his draft position because he has had to play under the worst CS in NFL history, a staff that was so bad it was impossible to make a mid season HC change because  the result would worse than keeping Rich Kotite 2.0. 

[More Cowbell]

On 8/11/2019 at 11:31 AM, slats said:

If Leo plays well, he'll break the bank. Somewhere. 

Jets have Quinnen now, and Henry Anderson under contract thru 2021. The problem now is getting them all on the field at the same time, which is either gonna put QW on the nose, or put them in a rotation. That's the sort of thing that ends up with Sheldon Richardson at LB. 

If the Jets can get a quality starting CB in exchange for Leo now, that would be a great move. Because next year, they'll probably be looking at either tagging and trading him (never easy), or just letting him walk for a third round comp pick in 2021. If you can fill a huge hole with an expensive, excess asset, you do it. 

You're not considering the cap hit.

Also the only DB I would want for Leo is Petterson and no way that happens

[slats]

26 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

You're not considering the cap hit.

Also the only DB I would want for Leo is Petterson and no way that happens

If the Jets were to trade Leo for Patterson straight up, there'd be a net cap savings for the Jets. 

[Philc1]

49 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Yeah, he hasn't  lived up to his draft position because he has had to play under the worst CS in NFL history, a staff that was so bad it was impossible to make a mid season HC change because  the result would worse than keeping Rich Kotite 2.0. 

You can only blame Bowles so much

[Philc1]

9 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

I’m hoping because he’s still out with the hip injury. We aren’t re-signing him since we’d have done it already. So I’d trade him, I’ve been advocating this for a while.

Avery Williamson is another I’d punt, with Cashman looking good. 

We are looking putrid at CB go out there and try to get something 

[More Cowbell]

5 hours ago, Philc1 said:

You can only blame Bowles so much

I totally blame Bowles for every deficiency  on this team. He put nobody in a position to win, as a matter of fact he was an anchor around all the players necks. 

[More Cowbell]

5 hours ago, slats said:

If the Jets were to trade Leo for Patterson straight up, there'd be a net cap savings for the Jets. 

Care to share how that works? I thought when a player is traded or cut the bonus and salary for that year accelerates

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Care to share how that works? I thought when a player is traded or cut the bonus and salary for that year accelerates

Bonus yes, the salary is passed on to the new team.  Leonard Williams has a $14+M salary.  I don't think there is any bonus left - that was doled out over the first 4 years.  There is no bonus on the 5th year option.  Peterson gets $11M and $12M next with only about $1.2M of bonus remaining.  

[More Cowbell]

18 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Bonus yes, the salary is passed on to the new team.  Leonard Williams has a $14+M salary.  I don't think there is any bonus left - that was doled out over the first 4 years.  There is no bonus on the 5th year option.  Peterson gets $11M and $12M next with only about $1.2M of bonus remaining.  

Cool. Get it done Joe