RutgersJetFan Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 4 hours ago, Patriot Killa said: His overall stats just don’t look good but I see so much hope and promise when I sit down and watch an actual game. I realize that not everyone is big on data, however it's worth noting that when hope and promise do not translate into any sort of data, that's bad. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nico002 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Darnold can make mistakes and has made mistakes and will continue to make mistakes. I just don’t care right now. The kid is working a miracle behind the worst offensive line I’ve ever seen. He’s demonstrated an incredible ability to learn and improve. From fixing his college fumbling issue, to tightening his release, to throwing the ball away more often. He is a baby, he will get to the elite level. He’s already has multiple long game stretches of elite play. Did you know that 43% of Darnolds career INTs have come in 3 games? My issue is that every mistake is magnified to an absurd level. Take the Miami game... a good game by Sam that is talked about as some disaster because he threw an ugly pick. I also don’t think there are “factions”... 90% of people here are on the right side, there are just 10 or so very loud trolls that like to stir things up. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted December 12, 2019 Author Share Posted December 12, 2019 14 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said: I realize that not everyone is big on data, however it's worth noting that when hope and promise do not translate into any sort of data, that's bad. I want to answer this, but first I need to know if you watched the whole video? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted December 12, 2019 Author Share Posted December 12, 2019 12 minutes ago, nico002 said: Darnold can make mistakes and has made mistakes and will continue to make mistakes. I just don’t care right now. The kid is working a miracle behind the worst offensive line I’ve ever seen. He’s demonstrated an incredible ability to learn and improve. From fixing his college fumbling issue, to tightening his release, to throwing the ball away more often. He is a baby, he will get to the elite level. He’s already has multiple long game stretches of elite play. Did you know that 43% of Darnolds career INTs have come in 3 games? My issue is that every mistake is magnified to an absurd level. Take the Miami game... a good game by Sam that is talked about as some disaster because he threw an ugly pick. I also don’t think there are “factions”... 90% of people here are on the right side, there are just 10 or so very loud trolls that like to stir things up. Did you watch the whole video? Also, do you still give us 6 months or did we get an extension yet? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 24 minutes ago, Maxman said: I want to answer this, but first I need to know if you watched the whole video? Yes, worth noting: 1. I wanted Darnold and was happy the Jets lucked into him. I still think you make that pick 10 times out of 10. 2. Greenbean is focusing on the conventional numbers, isolated within one situation. I guess if you want to classify raw numbers as data then that's fine but people who actually track data don't use those numbers for anything more than compiling other numbers that actually say things. DVOA and DYAR are the greatest examples of this. Even more importantly, extrapolating one raw number and interpreting it as the aggregate is problematic for so many reasons. Reality is Darnold's numbers from Sunday didn't move the needle at all. I'm not saying this to be mean and I apologize in advance if it comes off that way, but people who actually know about data and statistics never discuss numbers like Greenbean is discussing them except when explaining how not to discuss numbers. ^Also just a heads up, Greenbean is a nice dude and seems knowledgable otherwise and eloquent and his beard is fantastic. Honestly not saying this to be a dick. 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 34 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said: There's always next time man. /looks at 14 in Green's Posts /looks at my own posts.... Why does he get to be the famous one? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, Warfish said: /looks at 14 in Green's Posts /looks at my own posts.... Why does he get to be the famous one? My guess is @14 in Green either paid @GREENBEAN or its a Senior Citizens thing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibby Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Good job Greenbean! I’m right where you are. My 14 year old son sides with Nico btw. Not that he ever visits the site- but Sam can do no wrong- ever! I still think Sam can be a real good Jet. Not seeing HOF level here - but if Douglas can build the core of the team the right way....Sam will be just fine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 17 minutes ago, Warfish said: /looks at 14 in Green's Posts /looks at my own posts.... Why does he get to be the famous one? Don’t worry, I really want you as part of my faction. We all can’t be a born leader though. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 17 minutes ago, joewilly12 said: My guess is @14 in Green either paid @GREENBEAN or its a Senior Citizens thing. Joe you’re 57? That’s easily AARP eligible, buddy. ? senior discounts are a great thing, embrace them! Quick story. On my 50th birthday, I told my daughter “I guess I’m officially middle aged”. The brat replied, “unless you’re planning to live until 100, you’re not middle aged, you’re old.” 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 21 minutes ago, Gibby said: Good job Greenbean! I’m right where you are. My 14 year old son sides with Nico btw. Not that he ever visits the site- but Sam can do no wrong- ever! I still think Sam can be a real good Jet. Not seeing HOF level here - but if Douglas can build the core of the team the right way....Sam will be just fine. Ah, they can still be so naive at 14, can’t they? ? Actually it’s great that he loves Sam. When I was as old as him and @nico002, I worshiped Namath. He could do no wrong. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losmeister Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, 14 in Green said: Ah, they can still be so naive at 14, can’t they? ? Actually it’s great that he loves Sam. When I was his age I worshiped Namath. He could do no wrong. and i was busy making excuses for Richard Todd.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 24 minutes ago, 14 in Green said: Joe you’re 57? 56 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drums Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said: 56 Did you make it that big so all you old timers can read it? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Just now, Drums said: Did you make it that big so all you old timers can read it? Yes because they always complain when I post an article. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patriot Killa Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 12 minutes ago, joewilly12 said: Yes because they always complain when I post an article. bold strategy cotton, let’s see if it pays off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, RutgersJetFan said: Yes, worth noting: 1. I wanted Darnold and was happy the Jets lucked into him. I still think you make that pick 10 times out of 10. 2. Greenbean is focusing on the conventional numbers, isolated within one situation. I guess if you want to classify raw numbers as data then that's fine but people who actually track data don't use those numbers for anything more than compiling other numbers that actually say things. DVOA and DYAR are the greatest examples of this. Even more importantly, extrapolating one raw number and interpreting it as the aggregate is problematic for so many reasons. Reality is Darnold's numbers from Sunday didn't move the needle at all. I'm not saying this to be mean and I apologize in advance if it comes off that way, but people who actually know about data and statistics never discuss numbers like Greenbean is discussing them except when explaining how not to discuss numbers. ^Also just a heads up, Greenbean is a nice dude and seems knowledgable otherwise and eloquent and his beard is fantastic. Honestly not saying this to be a dick. That's nice and all but let's remember this isn't a statistics message board nor are we scientists who's passion it is to measure the never ending corridors of reasoning and probability. What DVOA and the rest really are is a proxy to what we're really interested in which is a football game. no one really cares about the stats without the game. So the game is what I'm talking about. I've spent countless hours with statisticians in my career and while wonderful and powerful insight has been offered, more often than not, the science creates more questions. Which is fun for the statistics guys and the motivation for the creation of a still deeper more analytical method to be explored. Hence DVOA and DYAR (DYAR???? lol) For context, let's talk about the measurements that get guys into the HOF. Is it Yards? TDs? Tackles? INT's? Championships? Or is it a deeper valuation of the athlete's likely hood to get 6 yards on a second down, in their own territory when down by more than 2 scores? Sure knowing information such as my archaic example here can be helpful when trying to understand specific tendencies etc, but it's not fun for the casual fan of which I am. An obsessive message board fan, but casual fan none the less when comparing to stats guys. A good example is how matt Ryan just became the 10th player in NFL history to throw for 50,000 yards. There were memes and articles and blurbs and tweets all over the place heralding this major accomplishment. It's the yards. It's a big one. It's what fans really care about. So anyhoo... just thought I'd chime in. I'm no scientist to be sure and I'm not even all that smart when it all boils down, but I like football. I know a thing or two about it and I like to talk about it. So that's what I have to offer. And then there's my beard... And to think I thought you'd come around when we stopped driving the car while recording. hahaha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, 14 in Green said: Joe you’re 57? That’s easily AARP eligible, buddy. ? senior discounts are a great thing, embrace them! Quick story. On my 50th birthday, I told my daughter “I guess I’m officially middle aged”. The brat replied, “unless you’re planning to live until 100, you’re not middle aged, you’re old.” hahaha that's awesome! 100 is doable man!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 55 minutes ago, Losmeister said: and i was busy making excuses for Richard Todd.... You and me both. It was really Kenny O for me though. That was my dude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepy Lurker Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Great work man. I really enjoy these. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Maxman said: Did you watch the whole video? Also, do you still give us 6 months or did we get an extension yet? I think he’s withholding judgement until you decide what to do about that crusher guy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Well done Greenbeen. We will get a lot more info on Sam tonight in terms of whether he is progressing in dealing with better teams and national games. I am as always excited. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, RutgersJetFan said: Yes, worth noting: 1. I wanted Darnold and was happy the Jets lucked into him. I still think you make that pick 10 times out of 10. 2. Greenbean is focusing on the conventional numbers, isolated within one situation. I guess if you want to classify raw numbers as data then that's fine but people who actually track data don't use those numbers for anything more than compiling other numbers that actually say things. DVOA and DYAR are the greatest examples of this. Even more importantly, extrapolating one raw number and interpreting it as the aggregate is problematic for so many reasons. Reality is Darnold's numbers from Sunday didn't move the needle at all. I'm not saying this to be mean and I apologize in advance if it comes off that way, but people who actually know about data and statistics never discuss numbers like Greenbean is discussing them except when explaining how not to discuss numbers. ^Also just a heads up, Greenbean is a nice dude and seems knowledgable otherwise and eloquent and his beard is fantastic. Honestly not saying this to be a dick. We want this gentleman in the analytics dept of “The Faction”, @Warfish 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Losmeister said: and i was busy making excuses for Richard Todd.... You’re in “The Faction” also. We will give @JiF a special revolving membership. He gets to be in one week, and out the next. ? He runs our “Bakery” dept full time though 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 13 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said: That's nice and all but let's remember this isn't a statistics message board nor are we scientists who's passion it is to measure the never ending corridors of reasoning and probability. What DVOA and the rest really are is a proxy to what we're really interested in which is a football game. no one really cares about the stats without the game. So the game is what I'm talking about. I've spent countless hours with statisticians in my career and while wonderful and powerful insight has been offered, more often than not, the science creates more questions. Which is fun for the statistics guys and the motivation for the creation of a still deeper more analytical method to be explored. Hence DVOA and DYAR (DYAR???? lol) For context, let's talk about the measurements that get guys into the HOF. Is it Yards? TDs? Tackles? INT's? Championships? Or is it a deeper valuation of the athlete's likely hood to get 6 yards on a second down, in their own territory when down by more than 2 scores? Sure knowing information such as my archaic example here can be helpful when trying to understand specific tendencies etc, but it's not fun for the casual fan of which I am. An obsessive message board fan, but casual fan none the less when comparing to stats guys. A good example is how matt Ryan just became the 10th player in NFL history to throw for 50,000 yards. There were memes and articles and blurbs and tweets all over the place heralding this major accomplishment. It's the yards. It's a big one. It's what fans really care about. So anyhoo... just thought I'd chime in. I'm no scientist to be sure and I'm not even all that smart when it all boils down, but I like football. I know a thing or two about it and I like to talk about it. So that's what I have to offer. And then there's my beard... And to think I thought you'd come around when we stopped driving the car while recording. hahaha I actually felt bad about it because this one was from in your office and I felt responsible for it. So far as the Hall, who knows. Those guys won't vote Klecko in, so screw them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losmeister Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, 14 in Green said: We want this gentleman in “The Faction”, @Warfish Methinks the Factions are Fractionated 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losmeister Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 4 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said: the casual fan of which I am. Knows his Dr Seuss, obviously 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 33 minutes ago, 14 in Green said: We want this gentleman in the analytics dept of “The Faction”, @Warfish Do we get a cool membership card or something? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 I actually felt bad about it because this one was from in your office and I felt responsible for it. So far as the Hall, who knows. Those guys won't vote Klecko in, so screw them.I’m Just playin man. The last few have been without the movement aspect. Like I said before it wasn’t something that we were Married to. It just happened to be what we did. I certainly don’t hold any animosity toward it or you. Just to be clear and all. Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted December 13, 2019 Author Share Posted December 13, 2019 5 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said: Yes, worth noting: 1. I wanted Darnold and was happy the Jets lucked into him. I still think you make that pick 10 times out of 10. 2. Greenbean is focusing on the conventional numbers, isolated within one situation. I guess if you want to classify raw numbers as data then that's fine but people who actually track data don't use those numbers for anything more than compiling other numbers that actually say things. DVOA and DYAR are the greatest examples of this. Even more importantly, extrapolating one raw number and interpreting it as the aggregate is problematic for so many reasons. Reality is Darnold's numbers from Sunday didn't move the needle at all. I'm not saying this to be mean and I apologize in advance if it comes off that way, but people who actually know about data and statistics never discuss numbers like Greenbean is discussing them except when explaining how not to discuss numbers. ^Also just a heads up, Greenbean is a nice dude and seems knowledgable otherwise and eloquent and his beard is fantastic. Honestly not saying this to be a dick. That is a really good post. I asked if you watched the video because I am into data. And I was working on getting an additional view on the YouTube stats lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantasy Island Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 10 hours ago, Maxman said: It plays when I click it, what do you see? This link should work as well. Thank you it works now, unlike our O. Wish Greenbean was in our FO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUM-KNEE Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 I get a "young Alan Alda" vibe from hearing you talk Beanzie. Now I picture Hawkeye Pierce narrating your posts.LMAO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 18 hours ago, Warfish said: /looks at 14 in Green's Posts /looks at my own posts.... Why does he get to be the famous one? BUT YOU ARE ALREADY FAMOUS IN THESE PARTS! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 17 hours ago, GREENBEAN said: hahaha that's awesome! 100 is doable man!!! It will take that long for the Jets to get to a superbowl anyway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losmeister Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 Just came across this. Worth a look, imho. Chris Trapasso @ CBS sports. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/grading-nfls-next-generation-of-quarterbacks-drew-lock-shines-on-the-road-lamar-jackson-does-enough-in-win/ He does an analysis of the young QBs on a game by game basis. Good throw section/Bad throw section/Summary/Grade 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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