Joe Namath Vs Darelle Revis

[Warfish]

I'd love to see a poll of NFL Fans in General (not Jets specific) asking who the "Worst QB's in the NFL HOF" are.

I googled some quickly, couldn't find anything like it having been done.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

By the way, you know who the act was in between Hendrix and Floyd?

Paul Simon, solo, Pre-big-hits Simon and Garfunkel.  In fact, I'm pretty sure he's in the picture above too.  

Paul Simon might be there but it’s definitely not pre hits Simon & Garfunkle

[extmenace]

I never saw Namath play but if you look at his stats, Namath is probably one of the most over rated players in the history of the NFL. Namath had more TD’s than ints just one time in his entire career and his completion percentage is very low, even in the era he played in. I know about the knee injury in college that killed his athleticism but if the guy basically wasn’t the the first sports celebrity, his name wouldn’t be nearly as it is.

revis was a much better player than Namath. Namath was a much more popular athlete than revis. 

[Jet Nut]

11 minutes ago, Greenbloodblitz said:

I honestly don't see Paul Simon dude! I see the dude that people mistake for Lennon and I see the guy that looks like Pete Townsend. It definitely could be them but I still don't see Paul Simon. I do know that Phil Collins and David Bowie sign on TV together when they were teenagers. There's some black-and-white clips floating around on YouTube

There’s a recording floating around of Hendrix & Lennon doing “Day Tripper”

[Warfish]

12 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Paul Simon might be there but it’s definitely not pre hits Simon & Garfunkle

I'll withdraw my claim till I can find my source, I think it was one of my Pink Floyd books, not an online source

[chirorob]

16 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'd love to see a poll of NFL Fans in General (not Jets specific) asking who the "Worst QB's in the NFL HOF" are.

I googled some quickly, couldn't find anything like it having been done.

Brian Griese.

All he is known for is being on the perfect team.   He missed most of the year and threw 8 passes a game.

[Warfish]

5 minutes ago, chirorob said:

Brian Griese.

All he is known for is being on the perfect team.   He missed most of the year and threw 8 passes a game.

Bob.  Not his son.

[THE BARON]

22 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

Great. and all that maneuvering is why I despise him.  Gronkowski ran his career well  and he is beloved in New England, there is no split amongst the fans. Fukk Revis, he was a hold out, whose word and signature  meant SHlT!  I would argue Gronk will get more HOF votes than Revis 1st year of eligibility. 

Professional sports run on money.  Fans pay. The league earns, The players sacrifice to earn.  The media pays to earn.  

[JetsMetsRangers]

25 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'd love to see a poll of NFL Fans in General (not Jets specific) asking who the "Worst QB's in the NFL HOF" are.

I googled some quickly, couldn't find anything like it having been done.

George Blanda.......

[southparkcpa]

5 minutes ago, THE BARON said:

Professional sports run on money.  Fans pay. The league earns, The players sacrifice to earn.  The media pays to earn.  

and I am in the office commando today.  

[Warfish]

19 minutes ago, JetsMetsRangers said:

George Blanda.......

Yeah, he's an odd one, QB and Kicker, played from 1949 to 1975, played in more postseason years than Namath played actual seasons, had a few very good (for the era) seasons, 3,300 yards, 36 TD and 22 INT in 1061 being probably the best, but no shortage of clunker years too.  QB-specific career was pretty short really.

With that said, from his wiki page "Blanda played 26 seasons of professional football, the most in the sport's history, and had scored more points than anyone in history at the time of his retirement." which is probably why he's in.

Yeah, hard to argue he wouldn't be rating in that poll of worst HOF QB's.

[Jet Nut]

21 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'll withdraw my claim till I can find my source, I think it was one of my Pink Floyd books, not an online source

I'm not saying he wasnt there but Hendrix first burst on the scene in London in 1966.  Simon and Garfunkel already were a hit.  The single Sounds of Silence came out in late 1965 and the album dropped in Jan 1966.  Hendrix hit London in Sept of 1966.  Still could well be Simon hanging with the musicians of the day 

[Peace Frog]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

 

But you’re right, there’s a cool doc on Hendrix and Claptons is recalling how when they first heard Jimi they called all the names Beck, Townsend etc and went to whichever club Jimi was playing.  Clapton talked about being blown away

The story I heard was that Hendrix was invited to play before Clapton at some venue and after Jimi played, everyone looked around for Clapton and they couldn't find him.  Finally somebody went to the back dressing room and Clapton was there, head in hand smoking a cigarette and just murmuring to himself "nobody told me he was that good."

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

I'd love to see a poll of NFL Fans in General (not Jets specific) asking who the "Worst QB's in the NFL HOF" are.

I googled some quickly, couldn't find anything like it having been done.

Bob Griese was one right off the top of my head.   Guy shouldn't sniff the HOF and his career overlapped Joe's.  Similar era.  In his 2 SB runs.  AFC Finals 3 for 5 70 yards.  SB 8 for 11 88 yards.  Next year AFC Finals 3 for 6 34 yards, SB an astounding 6 for 7 for 73 yards.  

One of the things that really hurts Joe is he was hired to run the show.  He ran his own plays and was completely unrestrained.  Bart Star who was fantastic didn't wipe his ass with more than 1 sheet unless Lombardi let him.  Joe didn't know what he was doing and they handed him the ball, told him to call the plays and be the circus.  He figured it out when he matured and we won a SB.  Griese, Starr and Dawson had great coaching and were completely scripted and controlled.   Namath with a good OC and a controlled O would have produced much better stats.

[Jet Nut]

22 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

The story I heard was that Hendrix was invited to play before Clapton at some venue and after Jimi played, everyone looked around for Clapton and they couldn't find him.  Finally somebody went to the back dressing room and Clapton was there, head in hand smoking a cigarette and just murmuring to himself "nobody told me he was that good."

Heard that too, later Jimi got Chas Chandler to get him on stage with Clapton to jam and Hendrix pulled everything out of his bag and blew Clapton off the stage.  

[Peace Frog]

11 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Bob Griese was one right off the top of my head.   Guy shouldn't sniff the HOF and his career overlapped Joe's.  Similar era.  In his 2 SB runs.  AFC Finals 3 for 5 70 yards.  SB 8 for 11 88 yards.  Next year AFC Finals 3 for 6 34 yards, SB an astounding 6 for 7 for 73 yards.  

One of the things that really hurts Joe is he was hired to run the show.  He ran his own plays and was completely unrestrained.  Bart Star who was fantastic didn't wipe his ass with more than 1 sheet unless Lombardi let him.  Joe didn't know what he was doing and they handed him the ball, told him to call the plays and be the circus.  He figured it out when he matured and we won a SB.  Griese, Starr and Dawson had great coaching and were completely scripted and controlled.   Namath with a good OC and a controlled O would have produced much better stats.

You’re arguing with “Jet fans” who have an irrational hate for Namath. 

Been happening on these boards for years. 

Pathetic. 

[Peace Frog]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

Heard that too, later Jimi got Chas Chandler to get him on stage with Clapton to jam and Hendrix pulled everything out of his bag and blew Clapton off the stage.  

Ouch. 

[Warfish]

27 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Bob Griese was one right off the top of my head.   Guy shouldn't sniff the HOF and his career overlapped Joe's.  Similar era.  In his 2 SB runs.  AFC Finals 3 for 5 70 yards.  SB 8 for 11 88 yards.  Next year AFC Finals 3 for 6 34 yards, SB an astounding 6 for 7 for 73 yards.  

One of the things that really hurts Joe is he was hired to run the show.  He ran his own plays and was completely unrestrained.  Bart Star who was fantastic didn't wipe his ass with more than 1 sheet unless Lombardi let him.  Joe didn't know what he was doing and they handed him the ball, told him to call the plays and be the circus.  He figured it out when he matured and we won a SB.  Griese, Starr and Dawson had great coaching and were completely scripted and controlled.   Namath with a good OC and a controlled O would have produced much better stats.

I guess I'm not seeing their careers as lopsided in Joe's favor as you do.

From a  few pages back, just so we keep the facts in front of us:

Bob Griese (HOF) - 14 seasons, 7x Playoff Seasons, 8x Pro Bowls, 2x Super Bowl Wins, 1x Super Bowl Loss, 92-56-3 record as a starter, 56.2% Comp., 156 YPG, 192 TD to 172 INT.

Joe Namath - 13 Seasons, 2x Playoff Seasons, 5x Pro Bowls, 1x Super Bowl Win, 63-63-4 record as a starter, 50.1% Comp, 198 YPG, 173 TD to 220 INT.

 

[Peace Frog]

Hahahaaaaaa. Never seen either play, let’s go to the statz. 

[Peace Frog]

28 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Heard that too, later Jimi got Chas Chandler to get him on stage with Clapton to jam and Hendrix pulled everything out of his bag and blew Clapton off the stage.  

How the hell did Rod Stewart sing vocals for Jeff Beck?

So crazy. 

[Warfish]

4 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Hahahaaaaaa. Never seen either play, let’s go to the statz. 

That's right, these are facts, uncolored by bias or half a century old subjective memory.

They also don't take into account who wore panty-hose on TV, hung out with crooners or mafia dons, or rocked the greatest stash' in NFL history.

By all means, though, if you'd like to regale us with your tales of what "your own eyes" saw 50 years ago, feel free to add it to the conversation.

All opinions are welcome, even yours.

[chirorob]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

Bob.  Not his son.

Eff em both.

But yes, my brain is old and you are correct.

[chirorob]

8 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I guess I'm not seeing their careers as lopsided in Joe's favor as you do.

From a  few pages back, just so we keep the facts in front of us:

Bob Griese (HOF) - 14 seasons, 7x Playoff Seasons, 8x Pro Bowls, 2x Super Bowl Wins, 1x Super Bowl Loss, 92-56-3 record as a starter, 56.2% Comp., 156 YPG, 192 TD to 172 INT.

Joe Namath - 13 Seasons, 2x Playoff Seasons, 5x Pro Bowls, 1x Super Bowl Win, 63-63-4 record as a starter, 50.1% Comp, 198 YPG, 173 TD to 220 INT.

 

Namath's top seasons are better than Bob.   Bob is inthe HOF for doing nothing while his team ran the league into submission in the 70s.

[Warfish]

Just now, chirorob said:

Eff em both.

Not rooting for them, just discussing them.  Easy now tiger. 

Just now, chirorob said:

But yes, my brain is old and you are correct.

No harm no foul.

[Biggs]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I guess I'm not seeing their careers as lopsided in Joe's favor as you do.

From a  few pages back, just so we keep the facts in front of us:

Bob Griese (HOF) - 14 seasons, 7x Playoff Seasons, 8x Pro Bowls, 2x Super Bowl Wins, 1x Super Bowl Loss, 92-56-3 record as a starter, 56.2% Comp., 156 YPG, 192 TD to 172 INT.

Joe Namath - 13 Seasons, 2x Playoff Seasons, 5x Pro Bowls, 1x Super Bowl Win, 63-63-4 record as a starter, 50.1% Comp, 198 YPG, 173 TD to 220 INT.

 

As I pointed out in his two SB wins he had a total of 9 completions for a little over 100 yards.  In the one SB loss, in his first SB he put 3 points on the board and was awful.  The two Miami SB teams were absolutely staked and Griese was a nice game manager.  He was asked to do very little on those teams.  Miami was a great running team and occasionally threw a play action pass to a HOF WR in Warfield.  Shula went to the SB with David Woodley.

In Miami's perfect season Griese went down and Earl Morrall at 38 went 9 and 0.  That team was ranked 16th in passing yards and No. 1 in rushing yards.  They had 5036 total yards that year and they threw for a total of 2076 yards. 

You're looking at a big picture.  He was a product of a script created by Don Shula.  A script that Joe Namath balled up ate and shat out all over him.

[southparkcpa]

17 minutes ago, Warfish said:

That's right, these are facts, uncolored by bias or half a century old subjective memory.

They also don't take into account who wore panty-hose on TV, hung out with crooners or mafia dons, or rocked the greatest stash' in NFL history.

By all means, though, if you'd like to regale us with your tales of what "your own eyes" saw 50 years ago, feel free to add it to the conversation.

All opinions are welcome, even yours.

I still use BRUT deodorant because of him.

[GandWFan]

30 minutes ago, Warfish said:

That's right, these are facts, uncolored by bias or half a century old subjective memory.

They also don't take into account who wore panty-hose on TV, hung out with crooners or mafia dons, or rocked the greatest stash' in NFL history.

By all means, though, if you'd like to regale us with your tales of what "your own eyes" saw 50 years ago, feel free to add it to the conversation.

All opinions are welcome, even yours.

"All opinions are welcome, even yours."  Pretty condescending.  Nice...  A real peach of a guy.

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

I'd love to see a poll of NFL Fans in General (not Jets specific) asking who the "Worst QB's in the NFL HOF" are.

I googled some quickly, couldn't find anything like it having been done.

Why some Jets fans continually denigrate the best player to play for the franchise is simply beyond my comprehension.  And this group fits a pattern. 

1. They never saw him play

2. They quote career stats with no context 

3.  They cherry pick stats and rely on "whataboutisms" and false equivalencies - like "how about this game" and "that season" and "look at this QBs stats" 

4. They ignore experts from Namath's era who almost universally praise him for his on the field accomplishments.  I don't recall Namath ever being called "overacted" during his playing days.

[Peace Frog]

51 minutes ago, Warfish said:

That's right, these are facts, uncolored by bias or half a century old subjective memory.

They also don't take into account who wore panty-hose on TV, hung out with crooners or mafia dons, or rocked the greatest stash' in NFL history.

By all means, though, if you'd like to regale us with your tales of what "your own eyes" saw 50 years ago, feel free to add it to the conversation.

All opinions are welcome, even yours.

Facts.  Stats.  Bias.  Color.  Subjective. Mafia.  Regale. Stache. 

Pantyhose. 

Who are you? 

Lol don't care.

 

[Peace Frog]

2 minutes ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Why some Jets fans continually denigrate the best player to play for the franchise is simply beyond my comprehension.  And this group fits a pattern. 

1. They never saw him play

2. They quote career stats with no context 

3.  They cherry pick stats and rely on "whataboutisms" and false equivalencies - like "how about this game" and "that season" and "look at this QBs stats" 

4. They ignore experts from Namath's era who almost universally praise him for his on the field accomplishments.  I don't recall Namath ever being called "overacted" during his playing days.

It's funny these kids that never saw him play think that "stats" are "facts" without context that they cannot or refuse to accept and blindly (or more likely intentionally ignorantly) come to concrete conclusions because they weirdly hate the greatest Jet in history.

My favorite is "and it's not even close".

When discussing opinions. 

It's funny.  Pathetic funny.  

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

For the uninformed:

http://www.footballperspective.com/joe-namath-has-become-footballs-most-misunderstood-quarterback/

https://medium.com/@markmorthier/joe-namath-overrated-or-underappreciated-b90e0a438b0f

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/indexaed6.html?p=6003&cpage=1

[Peace Frog]

57 minutes ago, chirorob said:

Namath's top seasons are better than Bob.   Bob is inthe HOF for doing nothing while his team ran the league into submission in the 70s.

If you think Bob Griese was a better QB than Namath--base purely on "statz", then notwithstanding not having seen them, you're a moron.  

Remember how GREAT Griese was in that undeafeated season?

All those wins.  By himself.  No help.  Did all himself.

Kids don't know the real story without the google.  

Too funny. 

[Peace Frog]

7 minutes ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

For the uninformed:

http://www.footballperspective.com/joe-namath-has-become-footballs-most-misunderstood-quarterback/

https://medium.com/@markmorthier/joe-namath-overrated-or-underappreciated-b90e0a438b0f

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/indexaed6.html?p=6003&cpage=1

That's just subjective stuff.

Look at the STATZ.  The FACTS.

Lol pathetic. 

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

File this under "if the shoe fits"

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/422910-why-joe-namath-is-completely-deserving-of-his-hall-of-fame-bust

Some key portions of this article:

His swagger, his ability, his charm, and his love for the game was so pure. Joe Namath had that confidence about him that just rubbed off on people. Just watching him play was amazing. Every architect of the passing game that we know of wanted him as their quarterback.

From Sid Gillman to Al Davis to Bill Walsh, Namath's ability was realized.

Isn't it strange how none of those who doubt, and I mean really doubt, Namath's Hall of Fame status ever watched him play? I have yet to see a senior citizen on this website say anything negative about Joe Namath. Isn't it odd how the opposition to Joe Namath's legacy isn't even old enough to run for president?

Isn't it peculiar that these men, you know who you are, are at most 30? 22 years after Joe Willie won the Super Bowl is when they were born at best.

Who are they to judge Namath?

Who are they to question the legendary sportswriters that didn't use computers to judge a player but their eyes?

The men such as Paul Zimmerman and Ray Didinger who used a typewriter, and had notepads and pencils to record notes. The iPad wasn't even a thought. Only girls with horrible reputations would dare to wear the outfits that appear in malls and on 12-year-olds today.

Ah, the arrogance and the disrespect of youth.

One of the biggest problems in the world is that the young are always convinced that their elders are complete morons and they, the new age, see things clearly.

Thus, you get a young man that thinks just because he read some numbers in columns on a website or two, that he can tell a person's career in its entirety.

He thinks that 173 touchdowns to 220 interceptions tells the facts and that's that.

I guess that just because a man has tattoos means he's been in the army or a gang?

Its stereotyping. It is pure stereotyping of football players.

To all of you who think that you can judge Joe Namath and deem him unworthy of the praise that real professional writers and great coaches have give him; I'm surprised that you can stand up with those huge heads you have.

You are obviously not detailed thinkers for one. You don't try hard enough in your arguments, and you are incapable of sufficient research.

[More Cowbell]

I was around for Namath, not when he won a SB but towards the end of his Jet career when his knees were a work of science. Back them there was no scoping, he had these massive scars on both. I just knew he was the guy that got us the trophy and he was my favorite player, even when he got traded to the Rams. The thing is the times were so different when Revis was on the team. He was an amazing player. I remember the Revis Island meme's where someone would place a picture of the latest star WR Revis shut out. He literally made guys disappear, even Randy Moss. I would say Revis probably had a greater impact because he came along in the age of internet. Joe was a personal fav but it just didn't  have the same feel.