Il Mostro Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 The deal was horrible...The ONLY reason that deal was done was because of public pressure. Not that Harvin is a bad player and he's certainly worth the value they gave up in the trade....But to make that move, after the season was lost...and simply dump $7mm is pressure cap money makes absolutely no football sense. The only logical reason for a move like that was to fold to public pressure. Based on what I saw of Idzik...I honestly believe this move was forced on him by Woody... So then he contacted Seattle, who promptly decided they would either cut or trade Harvin. Right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 So then he contacted Seattle, who promptly decided they would either cut or trade Harvin. Right. He was clearly on the trading block for quite some time and once the sh-- started hitting the fan and the public outcry to fire Idzik became national news this move was made. The season was OVER - Jets weren't going to the playoffs, they knew their QB of future wasn't the guy...just throwing away $7mm in salary cap is an absolutely awful move. It's moves like this that make this franchise a consistent disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j4jets Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Has there been any update? Last I read was that he left on crutches...I wonder what that means for his future with this team Good news for the Jets I believe. We get to lose out, and hold all the cards in having him restructure. If he declines a paycut (likely so with our QB situation), we release him, save the 4th round pick, save the $ and spend it on possibly Craptree or Maclin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j4jets Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 The deal was horrible...The ONLY reason that deal was done was because of public pressure. Not that Harvin is a bad player and he's certainly worth the value they gave up in the trade....But to make that move, after the season was lost...and simply dump $7mm is pressure cap money makes absolutely no football sense. The only logical reason for a move like that was to fold to public pressure. Based on what I saw of Idzik...I honestly believe this move was forced on him by Woody... Oh yeah, Woody had a dream Harvin would be cut. Is it just half the Jets fans or is it all over the league that has half the fans with these conspiracy theories? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 So then he contacted Seattle, who promptly decided they would either cut or trade Harvin. Right. Harvin was to be cut if no trade OK'd Updated: October 19, 2014, 7:17 PM ET By Chris Mortensen | ESPN 5K+ 1K COMMENTS339 EMAIL PRINT Carter: Harvin Not A Bad Person Cris Carter discusses what is valued in NFL locker rooms and why Pete Carroll would decide to trade Percy Harvin. Tags: NFL, Percy Harvin, New York Jets, Seattle Seahawks NEXT VIDEO Seahawks Would Have Cut HarvinThe Seattle Seahawks had reached a point of no return with Percy Harvin. If they had been unable to trade him, they would have released him outright, according to league and team sources. The Seahawks had until the NFL's trade deadline of Oct. 28 to move Harvin, but the desire to cut him loose was no longer a debate within the organization, the sources said. Contrary to speculation, Seahawks quarterback Russell Wilson was not among the players who pushed for Harvin to be jettisoned. According to sources, Wilson wanted to be part of the solution, helping Harvin with the anger management and trust issues that created numerous incidents and tension in the organization. The staff and organization disagreed with Wilson and wanted him to focus on playing quarterback and not be distracted by Harvin's high maintenance. Before trading Harvin to the New York Jets for a conditional draft choice, Seahawks general manager John Schneider was "fully forthcoming and transparent" with teams they engaged in trade discussions, according to sources. "We made a bold move in acquiring him [from the Vikings in 2013]," Schneider said Sunday on the 710 ESPN Seattle pregame radio show. "But it became apparent that things weren't going to work out, and it wasn't a good fit. "We have to prepare this team for moving forward all the time, and I'm not just talking about this week or next week. I'm talking about 2015 and 2016. We constantly have to look at how we improve the team. This was the appropriate move at the appropriate time." http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11727394/if-no-trade-percy-harvin-was-cut-seattle-seahawks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Oh yeah, Woody had a dream Harvin would be cut. Is it just half the Jets fans or is it all over the league that has half the fans with these conspiracy theories? What conspiracy theory? There's no conspiracy theory here. Teams do it all the time (it's not a good football move but teams do it) They make moves for short term PR gains and not necessarily what's best to help the team win in the long run... This is a case where the Jets made a move to bring in a good player at the wrong time - spent precious cap money on a wasted year. PR move, not a football move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 He was clearly on the trading block for quite some time and once the sh-- started hitting the fan and the public outcry to fire Idzik became national news this move was made. The season was OVER - Jets weren't going to the playoffs, they knew their QB of future wasn't the guy...just throwing away $7mm in salary cap is an absolutely awful move. It's moves like this that make this franchise a consistent disaster. Agree here. Especially if the guy is cut - To bring a guy in when your pretty much done for the season, pay him 6-7m when he will likely be cut is a terrible move. Re: Cut - With his contract theres no way anyteam including us is paying him 10m per year. Chances are he would likely see FA for the first time rather then rework his contract with us which is understandable - which will lead him to being cut before the draft this year or whatever date they made with Seattle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j4jets Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 What conspiracy theory? There's no conspiracy theory here. Teams do it all the time (it's not a good football move but teams do it) They make moves for short term PR gains and not necessarily what's best to help the team win in the long run... This is a case where the Jets made a move to bring in a good player at the wrong time - spent precious cap money on a wasted year. PR move, not a football move. Jets are not concerned with the cap this yr...or next. Harvin was cheap (in terms of trade compensation) so they struck the deal. Jets owe Harvin $0 next yr if they release him, or they can keep him if they feel he's worth it and still owe him nothing in the future if he becomes a headache. Does it also help PR? Not in your case (or mine) so u can make the judgement better I guess. Lets not put every bad move on Woody. The only thing he wanted was to retain a HC that took over a sh*t team and took it to two straight AFCCGs with the worst QB play in the NFL over that time. I don't blame Woody for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Jets are not concerned with the cap this yr...or next. Harvin was cheap (in terms of trade compensation) so they struck the deal. Jets owe Harvin $0 next yr if they release him, or they can keep him if they feel he's worth it and still owe him nothing in the future if he becomes a headache. Does it also help PR? Not in your case (or mine) so u can make the judgement better I guess. Lets not put every bad move on Woody. The only thing he wanted was to retain a HC that took over a sh*t team and took it to two straight AFCCGs with the worst QB play in the NFL over that time. I don't blame Woody for that. If this is the case then the Jets are in worse shape than I thought. All teams must ALWAYS be concerned with the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j4jets Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 If this is the case then the Jets are in worse shape than I thought. All teams must ALWAYS be concerned with the cap. Not what I said and you know exactly what point I was making...unless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Not what I said and you know exactly what point I was making...unless. I gotcha...And maybe I'm a little more salary cap conscience than most but $7mm goes a long way in cap dollars - having $51mm in cap space is still much better than having $44mm. Just seemed to me no good reason to bring him on...If it was done a month prior I would have loved the move, if he was under a reasonable long term contract I would have loved the move...I like Harvin as a player and don't even care about the character issue... From a straight positives and negatives - the negative of losing $7mm in cap space FAR outweighs the positives of bringing him in after the season was already lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Look forward to Idzik bring in more injury prone players. DeSean Jackson before week 1, or Harvin mid-season at the cost of a pick? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 they need to keep harvin. only gamebreaker on offensive side of ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesr Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I gotcha...And maybe I'm a little more salary cap conscience than most but $7mm goes a long way in cap dollars - having $51mm in cap space is still much better than having $44mm. Just seemed to me no good reason to bring him on...If it was done a month prior I would have loved the move, if he was under a reasonable long term contract I would have loved the move...I like Harvin as a player and don't even care about the character issue... From a straight positives and negatives - the negative of losing $7mm in cap space FAR outweighs the positives of bringing him in after the season was already lost. I guess a point comes where there's simply more cap space than you can actually spend ... if we have $51m and we have to spend the majority of that we'll end up in a situation of diminishing returns, where you're paying players just because you have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derp Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 they need to keep harvin. only gamebreaker on offensive side of ball. I see the arguments for getting rid of him, but would like to see them retain him because he's the only player defenses actually have to pay attention to on our offense. Think he's a nice piece to have if they add another receiver and an NFL caliber quarterback. Would be nice to see the line beefed up a bit too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I see the arguments for getting rid of him, but would like to see them retain him because he's the only player defenses actually have to pay attention to on our offense. Think he's a nice piece to have if they add another receiver and an NFL caliber quarterback. Would be nice to see the line beefed up a bit too. Yes I agree with this- Harvin can break long plays- you need someone like that if not him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Look forward to Idzik bring in more injury prone players. He does seem to have a preference for oft-injured players. You get what you pay for. I don't want Harvin retained for 2015. Well maybe. If, and only if, Harvin brings his salary/cap hit way down from the $10 million his contract gives him. He is NOT worth it. One receiving TD in the last 2 years, always injured and a bad character (per Vikings and Seahawks fans). Lose-lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 He does seem to have a preference for oft-injured players. You get what you pay for. I don't want Harvin retained for 2015. Well maybe. If, and only if, Harvin brings his salary/cap hit way down from the $10 million his contract gives him. He is NOT worth it. One receiving TD in the last 2 years, always injured and a bad character (per Vikings and Seahawks fans). Lose-lose. What would you want to pay him? I would say you pay a guy like him $4mm to $5mm a year...with incentives...I wouldn't go much higher than that though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rillo Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 A bruised vag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Had Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 So he picked up a quick 10 mil... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munchmemory Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 A bruised vag? Lacerated. Or at least it looked like some sort of gash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 $4M for Harvin? Are you people ******* insane? This team paid Jeremy Kerley $4M per and the board rejoiced at the "value." 1 receiving TD in 2 years? I saw Harvin have 3 TDs called back in one game, through no fault of his own. Can't wait until we go into 2015 with Decker and Shaq Evans. Mariota is going to tear it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56mehl56 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 He was clearly on the trading block for quite some time and once the sh-- started hitting the fan and the public outcry to fire Idzik became national news this move was made. The season was OVER - Jets weren't going to the playoffs, they knew their QB of future wasn't the guy...just throwing away $7mm in salary cap is an absolutely awful move. It's moves like this that make this franchise a consistent disaster. I have to laugh at this statement. They threw away 7mm in cap how: for a playmaking Wr that has speed and is versatile. Yet the same crew here wanted Revis resigned at 16mm or some other CB. Idzik didn't spend the 20mm , yet when he gets a steal at 7mm its a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rillo Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 How is this guy a steal? When was the last time he played a full season? Talented but not worth it IMO. Stupid meaningless trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56mehl56 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 How is this guy a steal? When was the last time he played a full season? Talented but not worth it IMO. Stupid meaningless trade. What other player do the Jets have on offense that can stretch the field - right they don't. Put Harvin in a system that values a passing offense and his numbers skyrocket. We can only hope Rex is gone and an offensive minded HC is named for the first time in over a decade. Then we wil see how much of a steal this trade was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
win4ever Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 He's not worth 10 million, I'd say he's worth around 6.5 million because he still has very good upside when on the field. However, he's not a great fit because he's much better from the slot where his his lateral and vertical agility is much harder to defend. But having Kerley here creates a problem, with the slot WR. Maybe next year, we can go spread with 4 WRs more often and bring in a No. 1/2 type guy. But that won't happen unless Harvin negotiates down to around 6.5 million, because he's just not worth 10 million a year right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embrace the Suck Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 He was clearly on the trading block for quite some time and once the sh-- started hitting the fan and the public outcry to fire Idzik became national news this move was made. The season was OVER - Jets weren't going to the playoffs, they knew their QB of future wasn't the guy...just throwing away $7mm in salary cap is an absolutely awful move. It's moves like this that make this franchise a consistent disaster. Maybe earlier in the season Seattle wanted more for Harvin, and as time went by no one met their price so their price dropped. It isn't as if Idzik traded the farm for the guy in a knee jerk reaction. Once the price got low enough the Jets pounced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Maybe earlier in the season Seattle wanted more for Harvin, and as time went by no one met their price so their price dropped. It isn't as if Idzik traded the farm for the guy in a knee jerk reaction. Once the price got low enough the Jets pounced. Pounced for what reason though? The season was lost. He cost us cash and a draft pick and can walk (assuming he doesn't break his leg) at the end of the season. Why not instead sign DJax during last off season without and loss of draft picks? Better player ,the season was not yet lost and we would have him under contract for a few years. Anyone who thinks that this was not a cave to bad press is nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 So he picked up a quick 10 mil... Between last year and this year I think he received 20 million and a Superbowl win and all those bonuses for playing in about 12 games or so. In those 12 games he totaled under 600 yards and no scores. He got paid over 1.5m per game played. Thats like over 33,000 dollars per yard. People that want him back at that price tag are crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I have to laugh at this statement. They threw away 7mm in cap how: for a playmaking Wr that has speed and is versatile. Yet the same crew here wanted Revis resigned at 16mm or some other CB. Idzik didn't spend the 20mm , yet when he gets a steal at 7mm its a bad thing. Any cap space (that could be rolled over) on a 1 and 6 team is thrown away. The crew here wanted to pay an NFL CB money to play in 16 games before the season was a struggle for draft position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 A bruised vag? Mo Wilk has that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 "Hey, we added a 25-year old former Rookie of the Year and all it took was a sixth round pi.." Jets fans: "CONSPIRACY!" You are all Mehta drones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 "Hey, we added a 25-year old former Rookie of the Year and all it took was a sixth round pi.." Jets fans: "CONSPIRACY!" You are all Mehta drones. No one is saying it's a conspiracy....Just that it was made primarily for PR. I think that's almost indisputable. no matter what anyone says here - ask any GM in the NFL if $7mm (no matter how much you have) isn't a lot of cap money. It is! To waste $7mm on a guy that was about to cut - especially when the next year there will be multiple quality FA WR's available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I am not as worried about the fact the Seahawks might have cut him so much as the $7M on a lost season. If they don't want him back next year at $10M the move seems even shakier to me. Harvin doesn't return punts, so I don't think that was the purpose. I guess that was the idea with the 165 lb draft pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I am not as worried about the fact the Seahawks might have cut him so much as the $7M on a lost season. If they don't want him back next year at $10M the move seems even shakier to me. Harvin doesn't return punts, so I don't think that was the purpose. I guess that was the idea with the 165 lb draft pick. There are a number of ways this deal could have made sense but none of them happened. It was an illogical move made by a poorly run franchise. No other way to see... Deal could have made sense, if... They believed he was worth $10mm and were prepared to pay him (not saying he is but if they believed that then at least there's logic behind it) They were able to do sign and trade (or be VERY, VERY confident they could renegotiate) They did it a month earlier If they end up NOT resigning him there would be no way possible you could look at this move in any positive light....they simply threw away $7mm in cap money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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