mrsaucy21 Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Hello fellow Jet fans. Long time reader first time poster on this site (sounds like a sports radio caller). First off, I really like the coach and GM hire and I believe they have made the right moves up to this point, however I am a little concerned about a possible infatuation with Bud Dupree. As a long time Jet fan I have witnessed some first round blunders and Dupree reminds me of Mr. Gholston and Mr. Robertson (Kentucky). I know we could use a pass rusher but I do not want to reach on Dupree, I would feel much more comfortable with taking Cooper or Scherff if Fowler and Mariota are off the board. These guys, I believe, will be 10 year starters and give the team some flexibility with contracts for other players down the road. Just my $.02. Nice to talk some Jet football since there aren't many in my neck of the woods. Looking forward to Thursday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Where's that poster who always threatens to smash his TV when the Jets pick somebody he doesn't like? I won't smash my TV, but I'd be concerned as well. Awfully high for a guy as raw as Dupree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I would have no problem with Cooper, much less so with Scherff. I don't put any validity into hauling out Gholston as a reason not to draft an olb or Drob as a reason not to pick a kentucky guy. You can virtually pick a monumental bust for every single position in the draft. If we let Gholston affect us forever we will never get that top end pass rusher. I can see people hesitant about Dupree but I want to hear more than just 'gholston or drob' as a reason. Also welcome to the world of posting. Post more often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Mr. Gholston and Mr. Robertson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baamf Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I don't share your concerns for Dupree, I like his upside. But if Cooper is still on the board I'd be all over him, not so much for Scherff. This draft can't get here soon enough... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persiussa Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Is Dupree really raw though? I've heard people say he'll be better on the nfl level because he was often dropping in coverage at Kentucky and was a pass rusher 2nd. Look at guys like Beasley and Gregory. Maybe they could be considered raw because they've dropped back much less and basically just rushed the passer. Often when a 3-4 olb fails it's because they were unable to cover. We know Dupree can do that and while he was asked to drop and cover he still managed to have 12 sacks in the sec this year. The guys who scare me are the beasleys, the Gregory's and the Shane Rays because they remind me of guys like barkevious mingo and deion Jordan who were obviously to thin to play the position but the talent was too attractive and it forced teams to make a mistake. Players who succeed at those light weights like Dwight freeny and Jason Taylor are few and far between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Agreed, he's a laboratory clone of Gholston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persiussa Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I don't share your concerns for Dupree, I like his upside. But if Cooper is still on the board I'd be all over him, not so much for Scherff. This draft can't get here soon enough... Cooper and white I'd take over any pass rusher in this draft. That's what I'm hoping for. If not one of those guys fowler and Dupree are my next guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 The only edge guy I would feel 110% secure with at #6 is Fowler, and he isn't going to be there. Picking Dupree that high is a huge reach . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nycdan Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Is Dupree really raw though? I've heard people say he'll be better on the nfl level because he was often dropping in coverage at Kentucky and was a pass rusher 2nd. Look at guys like Beasley and Gregory. Maybe they could be considered raw because they've dropped back much less and basically just rushed the passer. Often when a 3-4 olb fails it's because they were unable to cover. We know Dupree can do that and while he was asked to drop and cover he still managed to have 12 sacks in the sec this year. The guys who scare me are the beasleys, the Gregory's and the Shane Rays because they remind me of guys like barkevious mingo and deion Jordan who were obviously to thin to play the position but the talent was too attractive and it forced teams to make a mistake. Players who succeed at those light weights like Dwight freeny and Jason Taylor are few and far between. I had to look it up but confirmed that Freeney weighed 270 when Indy drafted him. He's fast, but he's no light-weight. By comparison, Demarcus Ware weighed 250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComfortablyNumb Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Is Dupree really raw though? I've heard people say he'll be better on the nfl level because he was often dropping in coverage at Kentucky and was a pass rusher 2nd. That's the same thing people said about Dion Jordan when he was at Oregon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonehands Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 The comparison between Dupree and Gholston is apt because both guys were combine stars and both seemed to lack instincts on film. Not a great combination for a guy who will be picked in the first half of round 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 The comparison between Dupree and Gholston is apt because both guys were combine stars and both seemed to lack instincts on film. Not a great combination for a guy who will be picked in the first half of round 1. To a point but watching highlights Dupree actually played like an OLB, played the run, dropped into coverage was not a pass rusher DE like Gholston was. It's going to be really interesting to see in what order and where these pass rushers go. I think we will be in for some big surprises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 The comparison between Dupree and Gholston is apt because both guys were combine stars and both seemed to lack instincts on film. Not a great combination for a guy who will be picked in the first half of round 1. Except that the combine events Gholston starred in don't matter and the things Dupree starred in matter a lot. But yeah on the other hand, motor instincts IQ read and react workout warrior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I don't think anybody was surprised with how Gholston performed at the combine. I keep hearing he was a "workout warrior" but he was actually worse than I expected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 To a point but watching highlights Dupree actually played like an OLB, played the run, dropped into coverage was not a pass rusher DE like Gholston was. It's going to be really interesting to see in what order and where these pass rushers go. I think we will be in for some big surprises. I'm getting that feeling too. Some of these guys remind me of Melvin Ingram and that debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Nice to talk some Jet football since there aren't many in my neck of the woods. Looking forward to Thursday! What neck of the woods are you located. I'm in Pa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dupree and Beasley both are a little undersized to be edge guys, they will get manhandled by NFL tackles. Fowler and Gregory are the only ones with enough size to justify top 10 picks (however Gregory's other issues could drop him out of top 10). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetBlue Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Is Dupree really raw though? I've heard people say he'll be better on the nfl level because he was often dropping in coverage at Kentucky and was a pass rusher 2nd. Look at guys like Beasley and Gregory. Maybe they could be considered raw because they've dropped back much less and basically just rushed the passer. Often when a 3-4 olb fails it's because they were unable to cover. We know Dupree can do that and while he was asked to drop and cover he still managed to have 12 sacks in the sec this year. The guys who scare me are the beasleys, the Gregory's and the Shane Rays because they remind me of guys like barkevious mingo and deion Jordan who were obviously to thin to play the position but the talent was too attractive and it forced teams to make a mistake. Players who succeed at those light weights like Dwight freeny and Jason Taylor are few and far between. He is raw from a "technical' standpoint. Especially in how to use his hands or position his body to disengage from a OL. Right now he pretty much trys to either overpower the OLman or run around him with little to no specific moves. He is also not that good at diagnosing plays so is often out of position; those things can be corrected but they take time and no guarantees that he gets it. He is a tremendous athlete and seems like a pretty bright guy who just needs to be coached up. Worth taking if we can drop down a bit but I won't want to reach for him at 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dupree and Beasley both are a little undersized to be edge guys, they will get manhandled by NFL tackles. Fowler and Gregory are the only ones with enough size to justify top 10 picks (however Gregory's other issues could drop him out of top 10). Undersized? Do you have any idea who Dupree is? He has 35 lbs on Gregory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetBlue Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dupree and Beasley both are a little undersized to be edge guys, they will get manhandled by NFL tackles. Fowler and Gregory are the only ones with enough size to justify top 10 picks (however Gregory's other issues could drop him out of top 10). Dupree is undersized? The guy is 270 llbs. Not sure where you are getting your information. The undersized guys in terms of weight are Beasley, 245, Ray 245 and Gregory who is the lightest of them all at 240 but has that huge frame at 6'6 to put on a few more pounds. BTW Fowler is 265. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I'd rather have Shane Ray than Beasley or Dupree, because even though Ray can't play standing up, at least I know I'll get great pass rushing on 3rd down with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dupree is undersized? The guy is 270 llbs. Not sure where you are getting your information. The undersized guys in terms of weight are Beasley, 245, Ray 245 and Gregory who is the lightest of them all at 240 but has that huge frame at 6'6 to put on a few more pounds. BTW Fowler is 265. I know what the official numbers are, I'm talking about what these players play to on the field. Watch the tape, Dupree plays in space, he rarely found himself banging around on the line of scrimmage, which an NFL edge guy needs to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetBlue Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I'd rather have Shane Ray than Beasley or Dupree, because even though Ray can't play standing up, at least I know I'll get great pass rushing on 3rd down with him. And you want to use the 6th pick on the draft for that? Beasley can do the exact same thing on third down; so can Gregory but he can also drop into coverage and do other things. Shane Ray is a DE in LB body; don't feel to excited about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetBlue Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I know what the official numbers are, I'm talking about what these players play to on the field. Watch the tape, Dupree plays in space, he rarely found himself banging around on the line of scrimmage, which an NFL edge guy needs to do. He played all over the field and that points to his versatility and also that coaching staff never really settled on one position for him. But if you watch him engage with any offensive lineman, if you didn't see the power and strength of his 270 body I don't know what you were looking at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 jetscrazey, you ARE crazey! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I would much rather have OLB's who can actually play the position than converted DE's who can't do anything else/ Let the scheme and planning get the sacks. For instance Harris is a good LB he does have some limitations in coverage but he knows how to blitz and play the run ...with that in mind if we can get some OLB's who can cover and also blitz when needed we can get a lot of sacks on third down because the opposition does not know where the pressure is coming from if blitzes are disguised. Having a one dimensional pass rusher who can't do anything else is worthless to a defense IMO. Sign good players and the sacks will come simply due to the pressure our DL creates and opens things up for the guys on the outside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 He played all over the field and that points to his versatility and also that coaching staff never really settled on one position for him. But if you watch him engage with any offensive lineman, if you didn't see the power and strength of his 270 body I don't know what you were looking at. NFL linemen are very different from college linemen. Many of the bigger linemen were able to manhandle Dupree which is why I don't think the #6 overall pick is justified for him. If the Jets had the 12th pick or higher, I'd accept drafting him a lot more. That's all I'm saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetBlue Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 NFL linemen are very different from college linemen. Many of the bigger linemen were able to manhandle Dupree which is why I don't think the #6 overall pick is justified for him. If the Jets had the 12th pick or higher, I'd accept drafting him a lot more. That's all I'm saying. Dude are you serious? What do you think they are going to do to Beasley 6'3 245, and Ray at 6'2 245?? Do you even watch these guys play? What gets them over is great quickness, and power for their size along with good technique. One of the biggest knocks on Gregory is he is thin in the legs and only 235-240. What helps him is how he has very long and powerful arms uses them with great technique to keep lineman off of him and uses his strength, speed and agility to get around them. Also the fact he is 6'6 and has the frame to carry more weight. Beasley played at 235 and only recently bulked up at the combine; Ray is also about as big as he is going to get. Dupree is 6'4 TWO HUNDRED AND SEVENTY POUNDS. His issues are more about Technique and pass rush moves. There are no LBs who are going to consistently beat NFL linemen on brute strength alone. That is a pretty much a given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetBlue Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I would much rather have OLB's who can actually play the position than converted DE's who can't do anything else/ Let the scheme and planning get the sacks. For instance Harris is a good LB he does have some limitations in coverage but he knows how to blitz and play the run ...with that in mind if we can get some OLB's who can cover and also blitz when needed we can get a lot of sacks on third down because the opposition does not know where the pressure is coming from if blitzes are disguised. Having a one dimensional pass rusher who can't do anything else is worthless to a defense IMO. Sign good players and the sacks will come simply due to the pressure our DL creates and opens things up for the guys on the outside That is why I am in favor of drafting Fowler or Gregory over Ray or Beasley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Agreed, he's a laboratory clone of Gholston Was he even projected to be a first rounder 4-5 weeks back? I don't remember. He cannot be a 6. He has become an urban legend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Agreed, he's a laboratory clone of Gholston Then he will have 27 sacks as a rookie and if we don't draft him we will rue the day!!!! Book it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 He will be good a player but #6 is a bit high. We're you hearing about Dupree as early on as you heard about Beasley or Fowler? Bud will be good. We need GREAT at #6 overall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dupree and Beasley both are a little undersized to be edge guys, they will get manhandled by NFL tackles. Fowler and Gregory are the only ones with enough size to justify top 10 picks (however Gregory's other issues could drop him out of top 10). WUT? Dupree is 270 pounds, Gregory is a thin stick that will get sqaushed trying to set the edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 The only edge guy I would feel 110% secure with at #6 is Fowler, and he isn't going to be there. Picking Dupree that high is a huge reach . I don't think Dupree is much different than Fowler if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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