Did Bowles hurt Jets/Fitz contract situation?

[section314]

10 minutes ago, Larz said:

nobody made him give revis $17 million for 2016.  c'mon.   overall I like macc, but lets not act like his stance with fitz is about anything other than he doesn't have starter money to offer

Face facts, Woody made that deal. No way in hell any GM would have given that amount to Revis. Was Woody covering his ass with the fans for not getting Revis back two years ago., pure and simple. 

[Il Mostro]

The "career year" cuts both ways.  Fitz has never had as productive a season before last year, so does Macc just throw all the poor performances out the window in contract negotiations?  Does Fitz expect to get the brass ring based on being adequate (and certainly nothing more than adequate) for a year, with nothing in his history suggesting he can do it again?  If so, then 'eff him.  Whether he has been anointed with the starting job is irrelevant when it comes to his contract.  He is not worth paying "on a curve" using wacky contracts for other QB's as the benchmarks. A contract heavy on incentive-based compensation would be both logical and fair based on what Fitz has proven himself to be over his entire career.  I guess they didn't teach him this at Harvard.

[jetrider]

Yeah, that's it, Fitz and Sexton are trying a quick snap for starter money before Bowles can reverse his words. ;rolleyes;

Sorry to let you down, Fitz, but you let us all down.

 

[jetrider]

31 minutes ago, AFJF said:

I think the Jets do want him back and they've said as much.  If they wanted him here and he wanted to be here, knowing he may not start, I think the negotiations go pretty quickly.  I wonder if he dumps the agent if he ends up taking $4-5 million as a backup somewhere.

That could backfire too, if he thought he might not start. He'd be shopping around for a starter gig either way in both scenarios.

[T0mShane]

41 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Agreed, but he's probably already signed if they tell him from day one it's a competition.  

I think Fitz comes back at a much smaller deal than he was hoping for.  Maybe even competing with RG III for the starting spot.

Fitz just threw 31 TDs and went 10-6. That's what he and Sexton are selling. Bowles saying he'd like Fitzpatrick back, IMO, means nothing to other GMs. The alternative is Geno.

[KRL]

31 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

I dont think it was a situation of not researching the market. I think it was a situation of the Jets having the 20th pick in the draft missing out on the top QB's, having Geno and Petty on the roster and probably not wanting to move forward with them. I think the threat of free agency is what they thought would force Macc's hand. Macc responded as a straight gangsta and told them to not only try FA but we're going to actually start looking at free agents ourselves. 

I honestly dont think that they thought that Macc would call their bluff and let them test free agency. 

 

I dont think that they thought the Jets would call their bluff. Im glad this is happening because this will be something that will be known about Macc around the league. He's no pushover and he's willing to lose you than for you to force him to overly pay for you. 

One thing I'm loving about this situation is our front office is not in "reactionary mode" anymore.  Tannenbaum

would've caved by now and given Fitzpatrick 18 million because he would've been afraid of what the media

would say

 

[jgb]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

Fitz and his agent are commanding average starting QB money at $15 million and I'm sure they're using Bowles' naming Fitz the starter as the reason why.

As much as I like Fitz over Geno, I was surprised Bowles didn't say there would be a QB competition next season.

If he does that, Fitz and his agent have to acknowledge the fact that he may be the no. 2 next season, making it far more likely they sign for $8 million.

This isn't just a Fitz thing...no player is going to happily take roughly half of what other similar players are being paid.

Even some of the guys on NFL network who I can't stand were saying last night that offering a starting QB back-up money is a slap on the face.

Kinda wish Jets had said starter next season would be determined next season.

completely agree if that's what they offered it was an insult. of course when i said this before i was called an idiot or knowing nothing about football or whatever. of course when an insult comes from a geno lover it's really a compliment.

[varjet]

I think the model that the Jets are looking to follow is to build a team that is competent in many areas, including mulitple offensive weapons, and not necessarily pay a QB $15+mm.  It is similar to what Denver did, except Denver did pay their QB alot of money, but for what he did maybe that was overpayment.

A Franchise QB can make a big difference in a team, but look at what happened to Dallas when he got hurt.   Fitz gets hurt.  In any event, unfortunately a basic competent QB is probably $10mm.

Fitz is an enigma-one good year, many meh years.  He had a good year because he had a lot of high paid weapons that also need to get paid.   $7mm/year is low, but for what he is and where the Jets need to go, it is not $15mm.  My guess is that the 1st or 2nd round picks are not QBs, and that means one of those is not a LB, OL or DL.   They need to keep what they have together while they build for the future.

[Jetster]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

He didn't have to say anything. Speaking while saying nothing is always an option. 

"Ryan had a terrific season for us and we'd love to have him back. Obviously he's not under contract once March hits so I can't really comment on what might be." If (ok, when) prodded further, then just keep repeating that last line: he's not under contract for next year so I can't say. Again and again: "I'm not naming anyone as anything unless he's under contract with us." They ask again, but what if he was under contract..." Just reply "There is no answer because he isn't. That's Mike's job to work that out, and when he's got me 53 guys I'll pick a pecking order. Nothing more to tell ya fellas."

If there's one thing Bowles has shown he's capable of being, it's a man of few words. This would have been one of those times to  employ that course of action (or really, inaction).

It was one of the things I really liked about Mangini when we first hired him. He kept his mouth shut in contrast to his predecessor. Bowles should do the same (without being a smug douchebag like Mangini), and this is one of those times he should have done it. 

Let's not be totally naive: I'm sure given the contracts floating around, and the numbers he just put up, Fitz would be seeking starter dollars no matter what. But Bowles only made it worse in terms of negotiating specifically with the Jets. 

I don't agree at all. All things being equal which they are now according to the market for Fitz, no one is breaking the bank nor Sextons door down for Fitz. Browns, Rams, Denver, not one team JUMPED IN saying, holy sh*t, I can't believe Ryan Fitzpatrick is available. Do you know the ONLY thing that Ryan knows right now? That Todd Bowles wants him to be the starting QB of the NY Jets in 2016. That he knows! At the end of the day all things being EQUAL, he also wants to be a Jet. We'll see what happens.

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, AFJF said:

Fitz and his agent are commanding average starting QB money at $15 million and I'm sure they're using Bowles' naming Fitz the starter as the reason why.

As much as I like Fitz over Geno, I was surprised Bowles didn't say there would be a QB competition next season.

If he does that, Fitz and his agent have to acknowledge the fact that he may be the no. 2 next season, making it far more likely they sign for $8 million.

This isn't just a Fitz thing...no player is going to happily take roughly half of what other similar players are being paid.

Even some of the guys on NFL network who I can't stand were saying last night that offering a starting QB back-up money is a slap on the face.

Kinda wish Jets had said starter next season would be determined next season.

He said he wanted Fitz back when asked if he wanted him resigned.

They asked if he would be the Jets starting QB.  Well given he ended the season as the starting QB and if signed he would get even the 8 or so million the Jets wanted to pay him, what would anyone expect?  He would get paid to backup?  

Who decided that 15 million was average starting QB money?  Especially a QB who is a holdover QB.  Not a 20something, we want him for 10 years and expect him to improve every season.  Fitz is a completely different story.  Hes not a 15 mil per QB anymore than 8-10 mil is backup money.  Where does anyone believe that a career journeyman should be paid like a top 10 NFL QB off of one season?  A season where he and his team finished 1 game short of the playoffs. 

 

[BowlesMovement]

This has nothing to do with anything Bowles said, the entire free world knows if Fitz comes back he is a starter. This is not like Rex claiming so and so is the best in the league, which his agent could use as leverage, this is Bowles stating what everyone clearly knows, Fitz is better than Geno, and Petty is not ready.

the problem is Fitz wants to be paid starter money, and the Jets want to pay him transition starter money, has zero to do with anything Bowles said

[PatsFanTX]

nobody made him give revis $17 million for 2016.  c'mon.   overall I like macc, but lets not act like his stance with fitz is about anything other than he doesn't have starter money to offer

If Mac had all the money this year that he had last year, does he hand over $15MM to Fitz?

[BurnleyJet]

Lets see who wants to pay Fitz 15 or even 18 per, the list reduces daily not many teams in for his services. if they do bite, we will get a 3rd round comp pick in 2017. 

[joewilly12]

Todd Bowles isn't a man of many words so i wouldn't base anything on anything he says. 

Football coaches and players do their talking on the field, 

[Maxman]

2 hours ago, AFJF said:

Fitz and his agent are commanding average starting QB money at $15 million and I'm sure they're using Bowles' naming Fitz the starter as the reason why.

As much as I like Fitz over Geno, I was surprised Bowles didn't say there would be a QB competition next season.

If he does that, Fitz and his agent have to acknowledge the fact that he may be the no. 2 next season, making it far more likely they sign for $8 million.

This isn't just a Fitz thing...no player is going to happily take roughly half of what other similar players are being paid.

Even some of the guys on NFL network who I can't stand were saying last night that offering a starting QB back-up money is a slap on the face.

Kinda wish Jets had said starter next season would be determined next season.

I get what you are saying and I was suprised when Bowles said that. I think he answered it too honestly actually. Fitz wasn't under contract so he should have just said when we see who we have under contract next season we can determine who the starter is. Something like that.

But as @TomShane said, nobody else offering money to Fitz is the real impact here.

[joewilly12]

24 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

If Mac had all the money this year that he had last year, does he hand over $15MM to Fitz?

God I would hope not then he wouldn't be all that smart of a GM.

[Jet Nut]

25 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

If Mac had all the money this year that he had last year, does he hand over $15MM to Fitz?

No.  I think he's offering Fitz what hes worth.  He's not a FA we're trying to seduce with extra cash.

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, Jetster said:

I don't agree at all. All things being equal which they are now according to the market for Fitz, no one is breaking the bank nor Sextons door down for Fitz. Browns, Rams, Denver, not one team JUMPED IN saying, holy sh*t, I can't believe Ryan Fitzpatrick is available. Do you know the ONLY thing that Ryan knows right now? That Todd Bowles wants him to be the starting QB of the NY Jets in 2016. That he knows! At the end of the day all things being EQUAL, he also wants to be a Jet. We'll see what happens.

Precisely my point. Bowles doesn't owe Fitz the starting job and he doesn't owe the media an answer as to who the starter is. I don't know that it 

At the end of the day, all other things being equal, as you say, he wants to be a Jet. Yes as a STARTER for the Jets. But that presumes all other things are equal, which they are not. If no one else wants him to be the starter - and no one else does (at best someone might settle for him as a temporary starter for 8-16 games) - then all he's left with is the Jets. The same Jets whose HC unnecessarily announced if he's here he's automatically the starter. Well, other starters are getting $16M, $18M, etc. If the Jets re-sign him, he's the starter. And if $16-18M is the minimum starters' salaries, he should get that as well.

If we didn't guarantee him the starting job, and argue in negotiations that he is NOT necessarily the starter, then his demands go down. It'll happen anyway (demands going down) because of the supreme lack of interest in him league-wide) but this dragged it out, and caused his demands to go up, as much as possible. 

All he did was give Fitzpatrick's agent ammunition. It was completely unnecessary, and did nothing but harm our leverage by announcing he's 100% the starter (no competition).

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Precisely my point. Bowles doesn't owe Fitz the starting job and he doesn't owe the media an answer as to who the starter is. I don't know that it 

At the end of the day, all other things being equal, as you say, he wants to be a Jet. Yes as a STARTER for the Jets. But that presumes all other things are equal, which they are not. If no one else wants him to be the starter - and no one else does (at best someone might settle for him as a temporary starter for 8-16 games) - then all he's left with is the Jets. The same Jets whose HC unnecessarily announced if he's here he's automatically the starter. Well, other starters are getting $16M, $18M, etc. If the Jets re-sign him, he's the starter. And if $16-18M is the minimum starters' salaries, he should get that as well.

If we didn't guarantee him the starting job, and argue in negotiations that he is NOT necessarily the starter, then his demands go down. It'll happen anyway (demands going down) because of the supreme lack of interest in him league-wide) but this dragged it out, and caused his demands to go up, as much as possible. 

All he did was give Fitzpatrick's agent ammunition. It was completely unnecessary, and did nothing but harm our leverage.

Where has that ammunition got him. He's a 33 year old journeyman QB without a job. 

[BowlesMovement]

7 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Precisely my point. Bowles doesn't owe Fitz the starting job and he doesn't owe the media an answer as to who the starter is. I don't know that it 

At the end of the day, all other things being equal, as you say, he wants to be a Jet. Yes as a STARTER for the Jets. But that presumes all other things are equal, which they are not. If no one else wants him to be the starter - and no one else does (at best someone might settle for him as a temporary starter for 8-16 games) - then all he's left with is the Jets. The same Jets whose HC unnecessarily announced if he's here he's automatically the starter. Well, other starters are getting $16M, $18M, etc. If the Jets re-sign him, he's the starter. And if $16-18M is the minimum starters' salaries, he should get that as well.

If we didn't guarantee him the starting job, and argue in negotiations that he is NOT necessarily the starter, then his demands go down. It'll happen anyway (demands going down) because of the supreme lack of interest in him league-wide) but this dragged it out, and caused his demands to go up, as much as possible. 

All he did was give Fitzpatrick's agent ammunition. It was completely unnecessary, and did nothing but harm our leverage.

Come on, seriously? Are you suggesting of Bowles did not say this his agent would say, well, we don't know if Fitz can beat out Geno, so maybe we should just take less? Are you seriously suggesting this?

[ljr]

2 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Macc could trade Wilk and cut D'Brick right now and have $18 million for Fitz. 

Macc knows that Fitz isnt worth $18 million. That's the situation. And I wouldnt even call it poker. If Macc thought Fitz was that important of a QB then he's stupid for franchising a DE over his franchise QB. Instead he decided to franchise Wilk and was more than willing to allow Fitz to test free agency. That's not a poker face, thats putting all your chips in, showing your Royal Flush then telling your competition "I dare you do something about this hand" while sipping on his cup of coffee. 

Lol ... Love the "cup of coffee" finish ... Well played sir!

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, joewilly12 said:

Where has that ammunition got him. He's a 33 year old journeyman QB without a job. 

The ammunition means he's been reluctant to sign a maybe-starter/maybe-backup contract (i.e. $5-9M range these days). Why? Because our HC announced he is the sure thing, no competition starter. A sure thing starter gets more than that. 

He also made it tough for an incentive contract because Bowles has announced before the negotiation that he will see to it Fitz reaches those incentives.

He made signing him more difficult. Best case scenario - the very best thing that could happen as a result of him saying it - is for it to do no harm. Worst case scenario is he signs someplace else because if he's going to take $7M he will take it as a backup not as a starter risking injury, being the fall guy, doesn't have to swallow the pride of getting paid so little as the starter and losing negotiations with that same team, etc. Or because someplace else has lower taxes or cost of living or maybe someplace else is closer to family. Or any reason he may have that he has that may not be a factor to a Jets fan. Or the cumulative weight of a bunch of smaller reasons like those. Because they're not reasons to you doesn't mean they aren't factors to him.

If Bowles says nothing, or hints at competition or that we want to get better but like Fitz, then maybe he's signed a deal already for $7M (or a bit above that). Now egos are involved, and maybe that gets worked out and maybe it doesn't.

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

Bowles also made another statement going to dinner last night with RG3

While I agree Bowles should have avoided the comment, I do not think it hurt negotiations, it was Fitz's job to lose and that was clear to anyone paying attention, including Fitz's agents 

Howie "fkn" Roseman doling out 58 million to Bradford and Daniels did much more to hurt the contract situation 

[Sperm Edwards]

34 minutes ago, BowlesMovement said:

Come on, seriously? Are you suggesting of Bowles did not say this his agent would say, well, we don't know if Fitz can beat out Geno, so maybe we should just take less? Are you seriously suggesting this?

No. That is you putting words in my mouth. I neither said nor insinuated any such thing. 

The team can say - in negotiations - any/all of the following:

• We like you and are comfortable if you start initially if necessary, but we really want to upgrade from you.
• You will not be handed the starting job initially, let alone for the whole season or more.
• We will be trying our hardest to relegate you the best backup QB in the league by giving either of our other 2 QBs a shot (whether those other 2 are Geno/Petty, Petty/rookie, Geno/rookie, or whatever else Mac has in mind, like yet another veteran to bring in, which is cost prohibitive with Fitz above $7M/year)
• We think we can win some games with you, but don't have a good enough roster to overcome your shortcomings. Your upside just isn't high up enough against a normal schedule strength. 
• If the season gets away from us we're going to bench you if for no other reason then just to see what one of the younger guys does with the opportunity. 
• In short, you may start and you may not. 

Bowles complicated matters and made such matters unnecessarily difficult - and made such arguments easily waived off by Fitz's agent - by announcing Fitz is the starter no matter what. 

[Sperm Edwards]

All I'm saying is that it hurt negotiations. We may still be able to bang out a deal, and it may still be a deal favorable to the team. There is still a good chance that happens because of the lack of interest others have in him. But all Bowles did was hurt the chances of that happening.

Talking about plans for a player, who isn't even under contract, is not smart. It's as maddening as when Ryan would tell this or that prospect we were going to draft him. Just wait until he's on the team. Then you can say whatever you want. Until then, shut up.

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, Jet9 said:

One more time....he HAD to spend the money or lose it. 

One more time, no he didn't. He had to spend dollars in 2015 and come within x-dollars of the cap in 2015. That doesn't mean he needed to hand out such high priced contracts to so many players and sign us up for a tight cap a year later. He did NOT need to do that.

[jamesr]

3 hours ago, Jet9 said:

One more time....he HAD to spend the money or lose it. 

Plus - just because you have the money doesn't mean you should overpay anyone.

I doubt he's saying to Fitz's camp "it's all we have" - he'll be saying "that's what we value your player at". Big difference.

[BowlesMovement]

55 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No. That is you putting words in my mouth. I neither said nor insinuated any such thing. 

The team can say - in negotiations - any/all of the following:

• We like you and are comfortable if you start initially if necessary, but we really want to upgrade from you.
• You will not be handed the starting job initially, let alone for the whole season or more.
• We will be trying our hardest to relegate you the best backup QB in the league by giving either of our other 2 QBs a shot (whether those other 2 are Geno/Petty, Petty/rookie, Geno/rookie, or whatever else Mac has in mind, like yet another veteran to bring in, which is cost prohibitive with Fitz above $7M/year)
• We think we can win some games with you, but don't have a good enough roster to overcome your shortcomings. Your upside just isn't high up enough against a normal schedule strength. 
• If the season gets away from us we're going to bench you if for no other reason then just to see what one of the younger guys does with the opportunity. 
• In short, you may start and you may not. 

Bowles complicated matters and made such matters unnecessarily difficult - and made such arguments easily waived off by Fitz's agent - by announcing Fitz is the starter no matter what. 

I think this is typical SE, doesn't like Bowles, so will look for anything to make his case. 

You could make the exact opposite argument, if Bowles says we like him, but it will be a competition, maybe he says, screw this, I threw 31 TDs last year, I am a starter, and says let me look for starter money.

Your really reaching here based on your dislike of Bowles.

[Sperm Edwards]

15 minutes ago, BowlesMovement said:

I think this is typical SE, doesn't like Bowles, so will look for anything to make his case. 

You could make the exact opposite argument, if Bowles says we like him, but it will be a competition, maybe he says, screw this, I threw 31 TDs last year, I am a starter, and says let me look for starter money.

Your really reaching here based on your dislike of Bowles.

No, this is typical you of attacking the messenger and deflecting instead of responding to - or even acknowledging - individual points.

I said the same thing on draft days, on the board here, when Ryan was the HC doing the same with the Coples and Milliner drafts, that he should keep his big fat mouth shut, and you think I was in the tank for him as well. So your "SE just doesn't like Bowles" reply is without merit and is just a tactic of deflection. Also I don't at all look back fondly upon Mangini as our HC but that was something he did right. I'm calling it like I see it. Bowles is a grown man who has been around this game all his adult life, and should not be graded on a curve.

Talking about how badly you want something is a no-no if you've ever negotiated anything. I don't care if it's a house, a car, an employee (like in this case), or any deal of any sort. Once the other side knows you want something badly enough the price goes up. 

You want him at non-starter money? Then don't say he's definitely going to start for us before he's signed, before free agency in general is over, before the draft has come and gone, before we even have the training camp team assembled. Especially since, before we know who else will be available between March 1 and minicamp, such an announcement should be premature anyway.

[Mainejet]

4 hours ago, AFJF said:

Fitz and his agent are commanding average starting QB money at $15 million and I'm sure they're using Bowles' naming Fitz the starter as the reason why.

As much as I like Fitz over Geno, I was surprised Bowles didn't say there would be a QB competition next season.

If he does that, Fitz and his agent have to acknowledge the fact that he may be the no. 2 next season, making it far more likely they sign for $8 million.

This isn't just a Fitz thing...no player is going to happily take roughly half of what other similar players are being paid.

Even some of the guys on NFL network who I can't stand were saying last night that offering a starting QB back-up money is a slap on the face.

Kinda wish Jets had said starter next season would be determined next season.

Well, the simple fact is Fitz has a way overblown value of himself. He played WAY better than he did in any season in his career. With that said, he IS a stopgap. He's NOT the Jets franchise QB and money in the range of 15 to 20 million is spent on FRANCHISE QB's.

Personally, I don't care what Todd Bowles has said or continues to say. I agree with Bowles. I want Fitz to be the starter for this team at least until the Buffalo Fitz shows up. If he continues his current play? Then I want him as the starter for next 2 seasons or at least until Bryce Petty is ready.

This is BUSINESS.

I've heard the Jets are offering Fitz 2 years 18 million and personally that's a little MORE than what I would pay him. He deserves a  raise, no doubt. But what Fitz wants is simply ridiculous and one good year is simply not enough evidence to go all in with him.

BTW, I find no substance to this thread. the Jets are WINNING this battle right now. It doesn't appear as though Fitz has many suitors, not for the kind of money he is wanting.

[Scoop24]

Screw Fitz we gave his career life .. Bowles put faith him and he is burning him . 15 mill is the going rate for 3 interceptions in a row as were bounced out the playoffs attempt by the bills?  ..

 

 

i respect and and fully back jets firm stance on this .

[BowlesMovement]

25 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No, this is typical you of attacking the messenger and deflecting instead of responding to - or even acknowledging - individual points.

I said the same thing on draft days, on the board here, when Ryan was the HC doing the same with the Coples and Milliner drafts, that he should keep his big fat mouth shut, and you think I was in the tank for him as well. So your "SE just doesn't like Bowles" reply is without merit and is just a tactic of deflection. Also I don't at all look back fondly upon Mangini as our HC but that was something he did right. I'm calling it like I see it. Bowles is a grown man who has been around this game all his adult life, and should not be graded on a curve.

Talking about how badly you want something is a no-no if you've ever negotiated anything. I don't care if it's a house, a car, an employee (like in this case), or any deal of any sort. Once the other side knows you want something badly enough the price goes up. 

You want him at non-starter money? Then don't say he's definitely going to start for us before he's signed, before free agency in general is over, before the draft has come and gone, before we even have the training camp team assembled. Especially since, before we know who else will be available between March 1 and minicamp, such an announcement should be premature anyway.

Honestly not trying to attack you, sorry if it came across that way. I just don't think there is anything to this at all, and I think this is more of you disliking Bowles than you really believing there is something here. Your a smart guy, your not like a lot of the chuckleheads who post, and I generally agree with a lot that you post, and I think you make a lot of great points.

Fitz and his agent know he threw 31 TD's last year, they know the Jets played him a week after having thumb surgery with his thumb in a cast, they know the reality of the situation, and I think its a huge stretch to say this situation would be any different right now if Bowles said something different, I just don't buy it one bit, and as I said, had Bowles said he is not the automatic starter, and we are here right now, people could criticize and say, if Bowles only said he was the starter, Fitz would not be looking for a starting job somewhere else.

 

 

 

[AFJF]

3 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Damn quote feature

[AFJF]

14 minutes ago, Scoop24 said:

Screw Fitz we gave his career life .. Bowles put faith him and he is burning him . 15 mill is the going rate for 3 interceptions in a row as were bounced out the playoffs attempt by the bills?  ..

 

 

i respect and and fully back jets firm stance on this .

3 interceptions in a row and Bowles names him the starter?

FireToddBowles.com?

[FlaJetsFan]

on a side but related note, i have never thought about this till the Fitz debacle, but how it is that a purported union member (ie, an NFL player) can also negotiate his own rates, the way non union workers, independent contractors or exempt employees do?

Any job I have ever been in involved pay grades and salary ranges for each grade. I know the NFL CBA keeps rookies locked into 3 year (or is it 4?) year agreements, but it seems this does not apply to vets. I don't get it: are members of the NFLPA really union guys, or not? How can you be kept at union scale at one position, but not another, or union scale for the first few years, but then free to negotiate whatever the market will be bear, or have union scale floors (i.e., salary minimums) but no union scale ceilings?

In short, why is there not a labor agreement that specifies pre agreed upon ranges for each position / years of service?

This might have helped keep ticket prices from spiraling out of control... for one thing, and restored the team concept to the NFL, as in back in the day when fans identified and supported players who spent most their careers with one home team, instead of the fantasy league NFL we have today.

In terms of the thread's actual topic, yes, Bowles sorta did make a rookie coach mistake, IMHO, but only an ex equipment manager would have twisted the supportive words of a straight-up, appreciative coach into a major negotiating fiasco.