Macc choosing the right path

[BrickTamland]

This list is not complete but I think it has most of McCagnan's major moves. I can't hate on it. I know some people will think I'm being too kind for devin smith and hackenberg, but we'll find out for sure either way.

I think Macs moves this year will be the deciding factor one way or another on Mac's effectiveness.

Positive:

-Leonard Williams

-Brandon Shell

-James Harrison

-FitzPatrick (part 1)

-Robby Anderson

-Charone Peake

-Jordan Jenkins

-Deon Simon

-Brandon Marshall

Not sure yet:

-Devin Smith

-Lorenzo Mauldin

-Darron Lee

-ASJ

-Bryce Petty

-Christian Hackenberg

-Juston Burris

Negative:

-FitzPatrick(part 2)

-Clady

-Forte

-Revis

[southparkcpa]

8 hours ago, ASH1962 said:

Bowltite learning anything from anything - LMAO

Glennon - LOL @ bobblehead man. If he was so great why did TB take a QB the first chance they got?

You guys are dreamers and that's ok. After all, that is really all us Jet fans have to hold on to, our dreams.

My dream is that this team can win a SB again in my lifetime, and we discover alien life on another planet.

 

Wonder which will happen first?

I just saw some spaceships I think......

[varjet]

39 minutes ago, BrickTamland said:

This list is not complete but I think it has most of McCagnan's major moves. I can't hate on it. I know some people will think I'm being too kind for devin smith and hackenberg, but we'll find out for sure either way.

I think Macs moves this year will be the deciding factor one way or another on Mac's effectiveness.

Positive:

-Leonard Williams

-Brandon Shell

-James Harrison

-FitzPatrick (part 1)

-Robby Anderson

-Charone Peake

-Jordan Jenkins

-Deon Simon

-Brandon Marshall

Not sure yet:

-Devin Smith

-Lorenzo Mauldin

-Darron Lee

-ASJ

-Bryce Petty

-Christian Hackenberg

-Juston Burris

Negative:

-FitzPatrick(part 2)

-Clady

-Forte

-Revis

Gilcrist?  Skrine? Jarvis Harrison?  Mo's contract?

[greenwave81]

9 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Just curious, if he's learned so much - and the cutting of B.Marshall is the most recent evidence of this - then why did he (just prior to cutting him) offer this same player an extension?

While I agree for the most part, maybe the 'extension' talk was something like 'we'll guarantee next years salary and throw you another $1 mill to extend one year'.  That would drop Marshall's cap hit next year to $4.25 mill saving 3 million on our cap and Marshall at 2 yrs for $4.25 mill/yr wouldn't be unreasonable.  Maybe, just maybe, it was a way to save face for Marshall?  Who knows.

[HessStation]

Mac is a nerdy dick who can gfh. 

[Charlie Brown]

9 hours ago, Wolfie2144 said:

I absolutely do not want Glennon, but Glennon did show some skills in his limited starts. Glennon wasn't a proven QB so an argument could be made that Tampa Bay took Jameis Winston because he looked like a future star and if you have the #1 pick and there's a potential star QB that you fall in love with, you take him.

While all of the comparisons don't correlate directly, Washington traded their future for RG III and then picked up Kirk Cousins in the same draft because RGIII wasn't a proven commodity. The Jets continue to take a QB every year hoping to hit the lottery because they don't have a proven guy there now. The Colts took Andrew Luck and let Peyton Manning go because Andrew Luck looked like a future star.

While I am not advocating for Glennon, there is a legitimate possibility that he could be a top 32 QB, or even better. The Jets coaches are the only ones that have seen Hack and we've only seen Petty in limited action and maybe their lack of faith in their future potential opens the door to go after a guy like Glennon.

Well I'm advocating Glennon!!!  

And even TB fans are beginning to question Winston and thinking that Glennon should be starting!!  

No not all of them, but enough of them to make me say we need to get Glennon who would be the best QB the Jets have had in over a decade!!

Here is a post from TB fan and listen to the subtext of what he implies...

 

http://www.bucschat.com/topic/40621-glennon-gets-offer/

Gulf Shore Steve

"Truth be told, this is so, after the Bucs finally finish putting an All Pro at every other position on the offense to properly evaluate Winston as seems to be required for some, the Bucs can turn to Jameis and ask "what is it exactly that you bring to the table?" and put Mike in there as deserved."

 

The truth is neither Petty or Hack or ready yet; no one can say that they will turn the corner next year or even in two years.  The risk to go with those two could mean that the Jets could have poor play for another five years or more if they are no good!!  

You simply can't take that risk if you are the GM and you certainly don't want that if you are a fan of the team since the 1960's like me.   

[DJF71]

We had to blow this thing up.  Jets were in cap hell and with aging veterans that were no longer productive or worth the hassle.  Replace with younger , hungrier players and see what you have.  Lets hope Bowles is the right coach for the job and Mac knows what he is doing when drafting and looking at FA's.

[DJF71]

26 minutes ago, Charlie Brown said:

Well I'm advocating Glennon!!!  

And even TB fans are beginning to question Winston and thinking that Glennon should be starting!!  

No not all of them, but enough of them to make me say we need to get Glennon who would be the best QB the Jets have had in over a decade!!

Here is a post from TB fan and listen to the subtext of what he implies...

 

http://www.bucschat.com/topic/40621-glennon-gets-offer/

Gulf Shore Steve

"Truth be told, this is so, after the Bucs finally finish putting an All Pro at every other position on the offense to properly evaluate Winston as seems to be required for some, the Bucs can turn to Jameis and ask "what is it exactly that you bring to the table?" and put Mike in there as deserved."

 

The truth is neither Petty or Hack or ready yet; no one can say that they will turn the corner next year or even in two years.  The risk to go with those two could mean that the Jets could have poor play for another five years or more if they are no good!!  

You simply can't take that risk if you are the GM and you certainly don't want that if you are a fan of the team since the 1960's like me.   

Glennon is the only QB worth signing to anything more than a backup.  He has potential and he is still young.  

[j4jets]

10 hours ago, Pcola said:

Well you're not incorrect but Didn't Macc win executive of the year for what he did.  So yes, in hindsight, the plan didn't work but had we won the Buffalo game, there's no telling how far we could have gone in the playoffs.

I just hope the front office realizes that this offseason to go for broke.  Yes bringing in Jefferson, Minter types will be great because they are young and can be part of the team for a while.  But bringing in a bunch of older, injury plagued vets that won't be part of our long term solutions, will be short lived.  This will tell me that either Woody isn't patient enough and Macc is fearful for his job or Macc doesn't have the long term vision needed to build a consistently great team.

Macc might've won the EoTY first year but even then I kept thinking this dude is blowing up all the cash space the first chance he's getting. Didn't leave anything for the following year and he's going to do the same this year.  Yeah he can dump the players after 2-3 years of their contracts but that doesn't mean he's doing a good job, especially when he dumps every single major FA pickup besides Carpenter. 

[BrickTamland]

2 hours ago, varjet said:

Gilcrist?  Skrine? Jarvis Harrison?  Mo's contract?

So true. Those three guys can definitely go in the negative.

i can live with mos contract for now, will see what happens moving forward. Could end up being terrible or good. First year obviously a bad sign.

[j4jets]

2 hours ago, DJF71 said:

Glennon is the only QB worth signing to anything more than a backup.  He has potential and he is still young.  

And who will he pass to after we release Decker? Enunwa and Anderson don't scare anyone on the outside. This whole clusterfcuk is caused by Macc. 

[BrickTamland]

1 minute ago, j4jets said:

And who will he pass to after we release Decker? Enunwa and Anderson don't scare anyone on the outside. This whole clusterfcuk is caused by Macc. 

Decker is being released?

[j4jets]

Just now, BrickTamland said:

Decker is being released?

Rumored to be. 

[DJF71]

And who will he pass to after we release Decker? Enunwa and Anderson don't scare anyone on the outside. This whole clusterfcuk is caused by Macc. 

Nobody at the moment. Need a stud RB to put the extra guy in the box.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[j4jets]

12 minutes ago, DJF71 said:

 

Nobody at the moment. Need a stud RB to put the extra guy in the box.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

With our OL, even a young Barry Sanders would fail. Macc really needs to hit on several FA and draft pickups this year. He ran out Brick and released Mangold and Clady without a viable backup plan. It's football 101. Games are won in the trenches. He's like the Rex version of GMs. Only sees the defensive trenches. Maybe we'll draft a football player in the 2nd round this time. That might help.  

[thadude]

9 hours ago, Pcola said:

Not at all but the moves he made were applauded by fans and fellow NFL execs. So at the time, the moves were sound and almost got the Jets to playoffs.

No one could foresee Revis's decline and injuries to Mangold, etc.

The Mo Wilk contract was fairly retarded

[thadude]

5 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

How hasn't Mac been good with drafts? Devin smith? Bust. Petty bust, hack bust. Lee way not a 1st rounder, some picks aren't even here anymore 

Mac's drafts have been underwhelming so far

[Powpow]

13 hours ago, Larz said:

lets see what he does with the money and how he handles the #6 pick first

Sorry but he already had that chance. He wasted millions on the savings Idziot created by resigning Harris, Revis and rebuilding the worst secondary in football.  Then wasted his draft picks on a shrimp and a QB suffering from PTSD from being hit more than a Trump piñata on All Saints Day by Mexican kids. Of course, this is America. Where everyone gets a second chance. But this is the NFL. 32 teams vying for the Holy Grail of which perennially, 6 or 7 teams are legit contenders, others are pretenders, and others are downright amateurs. Time to step up or step off. 

[jack48]

21 hours ago, LIJetsFan said:

I'm more optimistic towards Mac than I am Bowles, that's for sure.  However Mac has made a few bonehead moves including the last minute hire of Fitz, the mishandling the Wilk contract, the entire DL situation, and in general overpaying on the defensive side of the ball.  I do blame the "Bowels influence" for many of these moves.

It is now time for Mac to step up and be his own man and use his own judgement going forward.    

Agree on the mistakes, but I still conside the command structure of Woody's to be the gretest mistake of all.  It hampers Macc, who whould be the Number One Guy.

[jack48]

20 hours ago, bealeb319 said:

I truely believe that bringing Fitz back after the first season he gave us was the right move to make. Yes in hindsight it backfired but how do you not bring him back after his first season with us when your best players are lobbying to get the guy back? As for Wilkersons contract we resigned one of our more talented young players, I don't think that a full rebuild was our initial plan for this season so that contract might end up hurting us down the road but when you draft a good player you need to lock them up. Maybe Wilkerson turns into a trade chip down the road who knows.

smart GMs do not htrow a guy out there until he fails.  That is why some teams are perennial winners--and others are perennial disappointments

[Sperm Edwards]

11 hours ago, greenwave81 said:

While I agree for the most part, maybe the 'extension' talk was something like 'we'll guarantee next years salary and throw you another $1 mill to extend one year'.  That would drop Marshall's cap hit next year to $4.25 mill saving 3 million on our cap and Marshall at 2 yrs for $4.25 mill/yr wouldn't be unreasonable.  Maybe, just maybe, it was a way to save face for Marshall?  Who knows.

Sure it's technically possible, but there is no evidence of anything like that. That is a request for a pay cut not an extension, and players don't openly thank teams for locking them in for 1 more year, at the veteran minimum, for a rebuilding team. They tend to get insulted by things like that instead. 

It's more likely the extension was at starter money, to keep him on this rebuilding team that might want to cut Eric Decker shortly, and for us to presume that until we hear otherwise. 

[Villain The Foe]

On 3/5/2017 at 2:10 PM, Jetster said:

I am 100% behind Maccs decision to blow it up & begin the NY Jets resurgence. While Brady & Belichick are up in New England & with the Jets playing in the same division you have to have to plan to build with young hungry players. Guys like Marshall, Decker, Clady, Mangold have been around long enough to know they have zero chance to succeed. Defeated before you even start.

Macc shouldn't even consider any older free agents, why? Build from the inside out, which I've always believed in, when you start with strong offensive & defensive lines you can at least compete. Once you do that you strengthen your defense at the backend. Trading back & getting a safety like Adams or Hooker, is a great start. 

The most important round of this upcoming draft might be the 3rd if we trade Sheldon & end up with 3 third round picks. In a deep draft that the meat of the draft where can build your football team. Hopefully we find that unicorn QB that propels you like the Seahawks did with Wilson. Each & every player the Jets have cut were flawed or long in the tooth. While Marshall played fantastic in 2015, his TD drop in New England forced them to win on the road in Buffalo. When's the last time you saw a Pats receiver drop an open TD in the endzone?

I personally think Macc has been pretty good at drafting & having all of his scouts in place 2017 draft will be our finest yet. Looking forward to seeing a young hungry team with speed compete & develop as the year progresses. We could have a worse year than 2016 & still see more hope for our future. NFL play has deteriorated & competing is easier than ever. Let's build the team that finally ruins the Pats run & their fans remember as the changing of the guard. 

This is sweet and all, but if we go defense again in the 1st round then obviously these guys don't get it. Whether they trade back or not, that first round pick better be an offensive player.

[sourceworx]

3 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

This is sweet and all, but if we go defense again in the 1st round then obviously these guys don't get it. Whether they trade back or not, that first round pick better be an offensive player.

Yep. Draft Mike Williams. Let's give Glennon a big target to throw to.

[CanadaSteve]

13 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

It would be awesome if he did a 180 and suddenly started exercising good judgment more than poor judgment. He's already here, so that is my preference. He just seems so over his head it's difficult to stay positive.

I think he has done some good things and bad things, as we have gone over ad nau seam. My issue is its hard to tell sometimes where are GM stops and Woody Johnson begins.  I still think the Ryan Fitzpatrick II had Woody's hands all over it (especially after Bowles declared him the starter before he was on the team).

The guy is well-respected in the league.  But, we will have to see what another off-season brings.

[Sperm Edwards]

20 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

I think he has done some good things and bad things, as we have gone over ad nau seam. My issue is its hard to tell sometimes where are GM stops and Woody Johnson begins.  I still think the Ryan Fitzpatrick II had Woody's hands all over it (especially after Bowles declared him the starter before he was on the team).

The guy is well-respected in the league.  But, we will have to see what another off-season brings.

The problem with the "he's done some good things and some bad things" is that such a statement would apply to any horrible GM. 

There is absolutely no evidence that he is well-respected around the league as a GM. Frankly I tend to think the opposite.

Also your desire to believe that Fitz II was on Woody is nothing more than that. The only actual evidence out there, directly from Maccagnan, suggests the polar opposite.

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, Sperm Edwards said:

The problem with the "he's done some good things and some bad things" is that such a statement would apply to any horrible GM. 

There is absolutely no evidence that he is well-respected around the league as a GM. Frankly I tend to think the opposite.

Also your desire to believe that Fitz II was on Woody is nothing more than that. The only actual evidence out there, directly from Maccagnan, suggests the polar opposite.

But there is no evidence to that end either. Unless you have some personal contacts.

The only evidence to his stature in either direction is that NFL Executive of the Year award in 2015. Now if other GMs vote for that award, that would be a clue to his standing with other GMs. However, I'm not sure who votes for those

[joewilly12]

7 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

But there is no evidence to that end either. Unless you have some personal contacts.

The only evidence to his stature in either direction is that NFL Executive of the Year award in 2015. Now if other GMs vote for that award, that would be a clue to his standing with other GMs. However, I'm not sure who votes for those

I think I vaguely remember seeing the voting information for that on the side of a toilet paper roll wrapper. 

[UnitedWhofans]

http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2017/03/source_jets_putting_emphasis_on_run_game_this_offs.html

Might not be popular but makes sense given the QB situation

[joewilly12]

This is what lies at the end of the right path. Until this is a NY Jets player lifting the Super Bowl trophy nothing else matters. 

[Jet Nut]

13 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

How hasn't Mac been good with drafts? Devin smith? Bust. Petty bust, hack bust. Lee way not a 1st rounder, some picks aren't even here anymore 

Smith was an injury issue.  That's the GMs fault, he should have known it was going to happen.

Pettys a bust? After 4 games?  For at 4th round pick?  Lol

Hack. Who knows what he is yet?  We haven't seen him attempt an NFL pass yet but he's a bust off of one season.

Lee hasn't shown any promise?  Really looks like a player who shouldn't have been taken where he was in the draft?  

Insightful 

[Sperm Edwards]

27 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

But there is no evidence to that end either. Unless you have some personal contacts.

The only evidence to his stature in either direction is that NFL Executive of the Year award in 2015. Now if other GMs vote for that award, that would be a clue to his standing with other GMs. However, I'm not sure who votes for those

The most likely thing, if the player's side is thanking the team for believing in him enough to offer him an extension, is that it wasn't a phony one. The less likely scenario - the one that would require some sort of evidence - is that offering the team's #1 WR an extension was just a phony year for the league minimum, so he could play at half the price for a team in tear-down mode prior to a rebuild. More believable they still wanted him here for their new QB this year and beyond, as a starter, until someone takes the job from him.

Also that award is purely from sportswriters, and all they care about is big splashy spending and deals that yields an immediate improvement from the prior down year, even if those deals are ultimately bigly stupid long term (or even a year later).

In 2010 Scott Pioli won it, largely on the heels of his splashy/expensive pickup Matt Cassel going to the pro bowl, and his top-5 pick going to the pro bowl as a rookie. Just two years later he was fired and his replacement then won the same award. Was Pioli super-smart and competent one year and super-dumb and incompetent by 2 years later? Of course not.

Nowadays they simply award it to the team that shows the largest immediate returns from the prior year, regardless of the reasons why; not necessarily to the executive that literally did the best & smartest job of executing.

The award certainly has nothing whatsoever to do with his standing in the eyes of other GMs.

[HighPitch]

Haha those bucs fans call Glennon lurch

[UnitedWhofans]

9 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

The most likely thing, if the player's side is thanking the team for believing in him enough to offer him an extension, is that it wasn't a phony one. The less likely scenario - the one that would require some sort of evidence - is that offering the team's #1 WR an extension was just a phony year for the league minimum, so he could play at half the price for a team in tear-down mode prior to a rebuild. More believable they still wanted him here for their new QB this year and beyond, as a starter, until someone takes the job from him.

Also that award is purely from sportswriters, and all they care about is big splashy spending and deals that yields an immediate improvement from the prior down year, even if those deals are ultimately bigly stupid long term (or even a year later).

In 2010 Scott Pioli won it, largely on the heels of his splashy/expensive pickup Matt Cassel going to the pro bowl, and his top-5 pick going to the pro bowl as a rookie. Just two years later he was fired and his replacement then won the same award. Was Pioli super-smart and competent one year and super-dumb and incompetent by 2 years later? Of course not.

Nowadays they simply award it to the team that shows the largest immediate returns from the prior year, regardless of the reasons why; not necessarily to the executive that literally did the best & smartest job of executing.

The award certainly has nothing whatsoever to do with his standing in the eyes of other GMs.

Thank you, I wasn't sure. So we are back to no evidence on either side.

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, UnitedWhofans said:

Thank you, I wasn't sure. So we are back to no evidence on either side.

Inertia leads towards the likely result, not an equal 1 in 2 chance simply because there are 2 options. If you are in a happy marriage, then for the upcoming year you still either have a choice of staying married or getting divorced. While both outcomes are possible, it isn't just as likely you will get divorced.

He wanted his #1 WR to return and offered him an extension that the player clearly didn't find at all insulting. While possible, if that extension was really a pay cut, that is the allegation that needs evidence.

[UnitedWhofans]

38 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Inertia leads towards the likely result, not an equal 1 in 2 chance simply because there are 2 options. If you are in a happy marriage, then for the upcoming year you still either have a choice of staying married or getting divorced. While both outcomes are possible, it isn't just as likely you will get divorced.

He wanted his #1 WR to return and offered him an extension that the player clearly didn't find at all insulting. While possible, if that extension was really a pay cut, that is the allegation that needs evidence.

I wasn't specifically talking about one player. I was talking about Maccagnan reputation among other GMs. I think we were talking at cross purposes