Are the Jets leadership filled with "yes men"?

[Alka]

Before the Jets drafted Zach Wilson, there seemed to be so many Jets fans that questioned whether Zach Wilson was good enough to be picked by the Jets with the #2 pick.  He came from a small college, the competition wasn't the best, he only played well in his last season, he's not prototypical big enough, tall enough, etc....

Yes, I defended Zach intensely to the end, but before the Jets drafted Zach, I started a thread saying that the Jets should keep Darnold and trade the pick for draft capital.  Before we drafted Zach, I didn't want him, like so many other Jets fans.  Of course, once we drafted him, I was "all in on him", since I bleed green.

What is my point?  My point is, if there were so many fans who didn't want Zach, then "How could every single Jets scout and leader who evaluates players be all-in on Zach Wilson?"  How is it that not one person that we're aware of, who works for the Jets organization in evaluating talent, not say "wait a minute!"  "I don't believe that we should be drafting Zach Wilson?"

Did Zach really dupe every single evaluator on the Jets?  How come so many Jets fans didn't believe in him, but every single Jets scout absolutely "loved" Zach?

That's how it seemed to me, when we all watched the shows submitted to us by the Jets pre-draft and up to the draft.

Are the Jets evaluators lacking the balls to stand up to JD and the consensus?  Great organizations encourage debate, but I just wonder if the Jets organization encourage debate the way other successful organizations encourage debate?

[Joejet]

In the organization I was in we used to have spirited discussions on different issues as they would come up. When we reached a consensus on the direction we were taking everyone presented a united front when we presented it. I believe most organizations operate in the same way. I know I wouldn’t want yes men working for me, those discussions brought in different perspectives that helped us to be successful.

[usapaw]

Yes

[Larz]

Ozzie Newsome has a famous saying about the draft “know what you are looking for and what you are looking at”

JD broke the rule and fell in love with the arm and legs and convinced himself that he could fix or coach up the head and heart. I remember talk about the 49ers taking him at 3 if the jets didn’t but who knows. 

[artemusclyde]

Yeah nah, this is revisionist history. Eagles were trying to trade up for him, and that team is 13-2 now. The truth that Jets fans aren't ready to hear is that Wilson regressed heavily here. Guy went from accuracy being one of his big strengths, to not being able to complete screen pass. I don't know what it is about this team, but they can't develop a qb worth a sh*t. 

[jgb]

You answered your own question OP. You didn’t want him but once he was on the team you immediately switched to “all in” because you bleed green.

Once JD told the staff he was going to be the pick, they did the same.

[TuscanyTile2]

2 hours ago, Alka said:

Before the Jets drafted Zach Wilson, there seemed to be so many Jets fans that questioned whether Zach Wilson was good enough to be picked by the Jets with the #2 pick.  He came from a small college, the competition wasn't the best, he only played well in his last season, he's not prototypical big enough, tall enough, etc....

Yes, I defended Zach intensely to the end, but before the Jets drafted Zach, I started a thread saying that the Jets should keep Darnold and trade the pick for draft capital.  Before we drafted Zach, I didn't want him, like so many other Jets fans.  Of course, once we drafted him, I was "all in on him", since I bleed green.

What is my point?  My point is, if there were so many fans who didn't want Zach, then "How could every single Jets scout and leader who evaluates players be all-in on Zach Wilson?"  How is it that not one person that we're aware of, who works for the Jets organization in evaluating talent, not say "wait a minute!"  "I don't believe that we should be drafting Zach Wilson?"

Did Zach really dupe every single evaluator on the Jets?  How come so many Jets fans didn't believe in him, but every single Jets scout absolutely "loved" Zach?

That's how it seemed to me, when we all watched the shows submitted to us by the Jets pre-draft and up to the draft.

Are the Jets evaluators lacking the balls to stand up to JD and the consensus?  Great organizations encourage debate, but I just wonder if the Jets organization encourage debate the way other successful organizations encourage debate?

 

[Matt39]

Douglas is. I don’t think Saleh is. 

[RutgersJetFan]

2 hours ago, Alka said:

He came from a small college

Terribly small. So small some might consider it...not small.

[Alka]

13 hours ago, Joejet said:

In the organization I was in we used to have spirited discussions on different issues as they would come up. When we reached a consensus on the direction we were taking everyone presented a united front when we presented it. I believe most organizations operate in the same way. I know I wouldn’t want yes men working for me, those discussions brought in different perspectives that helped us to be successful.

My problem is that I don't have a filter.  I pretty much say what's on my mind, and I sometimes offend people with my honesty.  I was on my leadership team, but was removed for not being agreeable enough with the owner of my company.  I never regretted anything I said.  I like people who are like myself.  I do not like "yes people".  They are spineless, and I have no use for them.  I love thinking outside the box.  I come up with solutions that no one else has thought of.  These are the types of people I want running the Jets.

 

[Dunnie]

My problem is that I don't have a filter.  I pretty much say what's on my mind, and I sometimes offend people with my honesty.  I was on my leadership team, but was removed for not being agreeable enough with the owner of my company.  I never regretted anything I said.  I like people who are like myself.  I do not like "yes people".  They are spineless, and I have no use for them.  I love thinking outside the box.  I come up with solutions that no one else has thought of.  These are the types of people I want running the Jets.
 

Part of being a good leader is being able to work with people and elevate their performance .. sh*tting on them is not good leadership.

Yes holding people accountable is part of leadership, but fostering growth and productivity is equally as important. You need your team to want to produce for you ... Fear only goes so far.

Simple as that.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Sperm Edwards]

The cure:

Your new Jets GM + scouts starting in 2023:

I predict great things. 

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

The Jets had to make a pick at 2 or trade the pick.  How do you know how much discussion and disagreement there was over what to do and who to take? I'm thinking quite a bit.  But once the pick was made, what would have been the point to publicly disagree?  

[Dcat]

15 hours ago, Alka said:

Before the Jets drafted Zach Wilson, there seemed to be so many Jets fans that questioned whether Zach Wilson was good enough to be picked by the Jets with the #2 pick.  He came from a small college, the competition wasn't the best, he only played well in his last season, he's not prototypical big enough, tall enough, etc....

Yes, I defended Zach intensely to the end, but before the Jets drafted Zach, I started a thread saying that the Jets should keep Darnold and trade the pick for draft capital.  Before we drafted Zach, I didn't want him, like so many other Jets fans.  Of course, once we drafted him, I was "all in on him", since I bleed green.

What is my point?  My point is, if there were so many fans who didn't want Zach, then "How could every single Jets scout and leader who evaluates players be all-in on Zach Wilson?"  How is it that not one person that we're aware of, who works for the Jets organization in evaluating talent, not say "wait a minute!"  "I don't believe that we should be drafting Zach Wilson?"

Did Zach really dupe every single evaluator on the Jets?  How come so many Jets fans didn't believe in him, but every single Jets scout absolutely "loved" Zach?

That's how it seemed to me, when we all watched the shows submitted to us by the Jets pre-draft and up to the draft.

Are the Jets evaluators lacking the balls to stand up to JD and the consensus?  Great organizations encourage debate, but I just wonder if the Jets organization encourage debate the way other successful organizations encourage debate?

unfortunately, Mike Maccagnan left his personal "How to Draft an NFL QB" diary behind, under a pile of discarded Dunkin' Donut cups and a signed autograph from Christian Hackenberg, and JD  figured he had discovered gold. 

[Dcat]

2 minutes ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

The Jets had to make a pick at 2 or trade the pick.  How do you know how much discussion and disagreement there was over what to do and who to take? I'm thinking quite a bit.  But once the pick was made, what would have been the point to publicly disagree?  

What were the details of the San Francisco offer to move up to #2?  If only we could have a re-do.

 

[Dcat]

15 hours ago, Alka said:

Before the Jets drafted Zach Wilson, there seemed to be so many Jets fans that questioned whether Zach Wilson was good enough to be picked by the Jets with the #2 pick.  He came from a small college, the competition wasn't the best, he only played well in his last season, he's not prototypical big enough, tall enough, etc....

Yes, I defended Zach intensely to the end, but before the Jets drafted Zach, I started a thread saying that the Jets should keep Darnold and trade the pick for draft capital.  Before we drafted Zach, I didn't want him, like so many other Jets fans.  Of course, once we drafted him, I was "all in on him", since I bleed green.

What is my point?  My point is, if there were so many fans who didn't want Zach, then "How could every single Jets scout and leader who evaluates players be all-in on Zach Wilson?"  How is it that not one person that we're aware of, who works for the Jets organization in evaluating talent, not say "wait a minute!"  "I don't believe that we should be drafting Zach Wilson?"

Did Zach really dupe every single evaluator on the Jets?  How come so many Jets fans didn't believe in him, but every single Jets scout absolutely "loved" Zach?

That's how it seemed to me, when we all watched the shows submitted to us by the Jets pre-draft and up to the draft.

Are the Jets evaluators lacking the balls to stand up to JD and the consensus?  Great organizations encourage debate, but I just wonder if the Jets organization encourage debate the way other successful organizations encourage debate?

where did you read that the all the Jets evaluators were "unanimous" pre draft on Zach Wilson?

I never read that anywhere...  must have missed it.  I find it hard to believe.  In fact, I'll bet that pre draft unanimity on Zach Wilson among the Jets evaluators is complete nonsense.

[bitonti]

The conspiracy theory is that jd did not make the Zach pick at all, that it was dictated to him by ownership for marketing reasons 

If Justin fields uncle founded met life, he'd be the pick too 

The simple explanation is that jd is just a moron. Believe what you want but the outcome is still the same 

[TuscanyTile2]

9 minutes ago, bitonti said:

The conspiracy theory is that jd did not make the Zach pick at all, that it was dictated to him by ownership for marketing reasons 

If Justin fields uncle founded met life, he'd be the pick too 

The simple explanation is that jd is just a moron. Believe what you want but the outcome is still the same 

You're not a JD fan, I take it? 

[bitonti]

4 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

You're not a JD fan, I take it? 

I'm a Jets fan 

JD is 20-45 or something like that as the GM of the jets 

I think he's overrated by fans who want him to be great 

[Alka]

39 minutes ago, Dcat said:

In fact, I'll bet that pre draft unanimity on Zach Wilson among the Jets evaluators is complete nonsense.

If you are correct, then I feel scammed.  We got to watch the Jets episodes of 1-5 of the pre-draft and through the draft.  I will no longer watch episodes of "made up" garbage.  I want to see debate, not everyone nodding in agreement on players in the shows we saw.  And if there was debate on Zach Wilson, "wouldn't it be great to really see the behind the scenes debates?"  I know it will never happen, but without seeing it, I just don't know if it really did happen or not.

[TuscanyTile2]

12 minutes ago, bitonti said:

I'm a Jets fan 

JD is 20-45 or something like that as the GM of the jets 

I think he's overrated by fans who want him to be great 

Hard to argue (even though I'm a JD fan).  Though I will say that if we ended up with Trevor Lawrence, JD would be looking like an absolute genius right now.  There is a lot of luck that factors into it.

[Jet Nut]

Now we’re rewriting history.

[Dcat]

Just now, Alka said:

If you are correct, then I feel scammed.  We got to watch the Jets episodes of 1-5 of the pre-draft and through the draft.  I will no longer watch episodes of "made up" garbage.  I want to see debate, not everyone nodding in agreement on players in the shows we saw.  And if there was debate on Zach Wilson, "wouldn't it be great to really see the behind the scenes debates?"  I know it will never happen, but without seeing it, I just don't know if it really did happen or not.

Yeah...    that show, as entertaining to fans as it is, is very carefully screen-scripted.  No way would the truth be disclosed on those who doubted Zach, particularly since the thing was aired well after Zach was drafted.

There is no way under the sun that this staff was unanimous on such a question-mark riddled prospect.  

[bitonti]

1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Hard to argue (even though I'm a JD fan).  Though I will say that if we ended up with Trevor Lawrence, JD would be looking like an absolute genius right now.  There is a lot of luck that factors into it.

Sure. But They did not have to flush the 2 pick on a bad qb though. It felt inevitable at the time but jd had his pick of every other player in the country 

[JiFtheOracle]

13 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Douglas is. I don’t think Saleh is. 

No clue who Douglas is but can’t say this about Saleh, he’s benched the little puke twice 

[billo83]

44 minutes ago, bitonti said:

I'm a Jets fan 

JD is 20-45 or something like that as the GM of the jets 

I think he's overrated by fans who want him to be great 

Tell me this:

How many wins did you expect with Gase as the head coach (not his choice), and a roster inherited from Mr Coffee?

How many wins did you expect last season after a complete teardown of the roster?

How many wins did you expect in the season after a complete tear down of the roster?

That being said, I fully expect this team to make the playoffs next year after the talent that has been acquired and expecting that JD will sign a competent quarterback. 

If that doesn't happen, then I will join the fire JD bandwagon

[maury77]

14 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

 

The Jets fell for that BS when instead they should have been paying attention to the following back to back plays

 

[bitonti]

1 hour ago, billo83 said:

Tell me this:

How many wins did you expect with Gase as the head coach (not his choice), and a roster inherited from Mr Coffee?

How many wins did you expect last season after a complete teardown of the roster?

How many wins did you expect in the season after a complete tear down of the roster?

That being said, I fully expect this team to make the playoffs next year after the talent that has been acquired and expecting that JD will sign a competent quarterback. 

If that doesn't happen, then I will join the fire JD bandwagon

No one asked jd to completely tear down the roster. Jds best moves has been trading assets. 

I don't want jd to be fired but this is kinda what happens when you miss that bad. 

Zach Rosenblatt from the athletic had some damning stats on GMs and hcs that miss that high 

"

Whoever it is, Douglas can’t afford to get it wrong this time. His (and Saleh’s) job depends on it. If Wilson’s Jets career is, in fact, over after this season, the 2021 No. 2 pick will go down as one of the biggest busts in NFL history. And there are no recent instances of a coach surviving long after something like that, and not many for general managers, either.

There are 17 obvious first-round bust quarterbacks from the last 15 years: JaMarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, Josh Freeman, Tim Tebow, Sam Bradford, Christian Ponder, Blaine Gabbert, Jake Locker, Brandon Weeden, EJ Manuel, Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziel, Paxton Lynch, Mitch Trubisky, Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen and Dwayne Haskins.

Eight head coaches were fired during or after the first year those quarterbacks were drafted, five during or after the second season and four during or after their third season. None of the 17 head coaches lasted beyond the third year. General managers had a bit more leeway, though not by much: Nine were fired within the first three years after drafting these quarterbacks; others lasted longer.

The Jets drafted Sam Darnold in 2018, fired head coach Todd Bowles after Darnold’s rookie season, and then fired general manager Mike Maccagnan after the 2019 NFL Draft.

So history is not in Saleh or Douglas’ favor, no matter what happens next."

 

 

[Matt39]

2 hours ago, bitonti said:

I'm a Jets fan 

JD is 20-45 or something like that as the GM of the jets 

I think he's overrated by fans who want him to be great 

13-35 since his first draft and 2-15 in the division. One of the division wins against Skylar Thompson.

[bitonti]

2 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

13-35 since his first draft and 2-15 in the division. One of the division wins against Skylar Thompson.

I mean, I am grateful they got those 2 division wins. That's 2 more than usual 

[jgb]

56 minutes ago, bitonti said:

No one asked jd to completely tear down the roster. Jds best moves has been trading assets. 

I don't want jd to be fired but this is kinda what happens when you miss that bad. 

Zach Rosenblatt from the athletic had some damning stats on GMs and hcs that miss that high 

"

Whoever it is, Douglas can’t afford to get it wrong this time. His (and Saleh’s) job depends on it. If Wilson’s Jets career is, in fact, over after this season, the 2021 No. 2 pick will go down as one of the biggest busts in NFL history. And there are no recent instances of a coach surviving long after something like that, and not many for general managers, either.

There are 17 obvious first-round bust quarterbacks from the last 15 years: JaMarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, Josh Freeman, Tim Tebow, Sam Bradford, Christian Ponder, Blaine Gabbert, Jake Locker, Brandon Weeden, EJ Manuel, Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziel, Paxton Lynch, Mitch Trubisky, Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen and Dwayne Haskins.

Eight head coaches were fired during or after the first year those quarterbacks were drafted, five during or after the second season and four during or after their third season. None of the 17 head coaches lasted beyond the third year. General managers had a bit more leeway, though not by much: Nine were fired within the first three years after drafting these quarterbacks; others lasted longer.

The Jets drafted Sam Darnold in 2018, fired head coach Todd Bowles after Darnold’s rookie season, and then fired general manager Mike Maccagnan after the 2019 NFL Draft.

So history is not in Saleh or Douglas’ favor, no matter what happens next."

 

 

Compared to the previous GMs, JD is a god even with the mega whiff at QB.

He might yet be saved because Woody doesn’t really know what to look for (Korn Ferry ring a bell?).

[Darnold Schwarzenegger]

JD has had 3 drafts. First 1 was atrocious. 2nd one is solid even with the Zach Wilson debacle. (AVT, moore, both carters, Echols etc) 3rd draft has been pretty epic. Possibly the best draft in jets history.

I’d give Douglas another year or 2 to try to right the ship. I like what he is building (obviously minus the Zach Wilson pick). I really think he over thought that one. Fields was clearly the better player. Let’s see what he can come up with. He knows his job is on the line if he doesn’t fix the qb spot.

[AZSOJ]

19 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

 

go back to hets 49s a couple of years ago and watch Sam throw the same pass for a TD to Barrios against then DC - RS.  

[freestater]

Just because you don't see arguments being aired publicly doesn't mean that they don't occur. It means the business is smart enough not to air their internal arguments in front of their customers. 

[Jet Nut]

8 hours ago, bitonti said:

The conspiracy theory is that jd did not make the Zach pick at all, that it was dictated to him by ownership for marketing reasons 

If Justin fields uncle founded met life, he'd be the pick too 

The simple explanation is that jd is just a moron. Believe what you want but the outcome is still the same 

Not a conspiracy theory, just a silly tie by one fan