Would you rather be the Jets or the Chargers right now?

[bicketybam]

2 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Here's an interesting test.  

What starting positions would you swap 1:1 with them?

I am not posting the position by position comparison to save us all but here's the summary:

So basically, it comes down to the QB, LT, and maybe the Edge guys.

Herbert yes - on a better team, I think he could be top-3 all day.

Slater probably.  I think a healthy Smith is bit better but Slater is younger and healthier and we don't know what Olu is yet.

Bosa/Mack vs. Reddick, JJ2.  Close.  Mack is 33.  JJ2 is 25.  Bosa/Reddick are similar in age/skill.  Take their guys for 1-year but JJ2 will be playing at a high level in 3 years unlike all the others.  

Safety - James absolutely.  

CB - Samuel is great, but Sauce wins that matchup.  Our other guys are better.

That's really it.  QB, maybe LT, maybe one edge, one Safety.

 

I took the question to be  a roster/coaching swap for the upcoming season. So in my head Rodgers and Herbert are about the same. The last full season Rodgers played he posted about the same passer rating as Herbert did last year and Herbert had an all time great receiver while Rodgers had Lazard.

I take Smith at LT and I take our group of edges over theirs. To me it's really not a hard choice. The Jets have the better roster and swapping it for the Chargers' is a downgrade. I also think Harbaugh is overrated but I wouldn't argue taking his staff over ours. But you can't just take the coaching staff without the roster. Jets all the way.

[RedBeardedSavage]

Jets because of impatience.

After the tear-down phase we had the prebuild phase. Then came the stumble/backslide epoch, and now we're in the Scorcher IV era.

Chargers are just starting. 

Plus, sharing a division with Mahomes? Naa, we just did that for 20 years with Brady. Not tryna go back. 

[UntouchableCrew]

35 minutes ago, bicketybam said:

"good one"

3 minutes ago, bicketybam said:

I took the question to be  a roster/coaching swap for the upcoming season.

I think it's intended to be "going forward." Obviously the Jets are in a better position in 2024. The Chargers are just better set up for long term success with their HC and QB in place.

[TuscanyTile2]

I think people might be forgetting that the Jets are going to run into salary cap trouble once we have to start paying the Sauce/GW/JJ/Breece draft class.  It's difficult to pay everyone and only then have to first find a FQB. 

It feels like it's much easier to build a consistent winner when you only have one guy that you absolutely have to pay (the FQB).  And, again, having Harbaugh over Saleh is a gigantic edge for the Chargers.  We already know that the moment that Saleh has any questions at QB (e.g. if AR8 gets hurt or retires) his immediate reaction is to curl up into the fetal position.

[Dcat]

43 minutes ago, nj meadowlands said:

They have a good HC and a young QB with limitless upside.

We have a crappy-to-mid HC and a 40 year old QB whose best days are long gone. 

Garrett Wilson isn't enough to overcome that chasm.

"Limitless upside".  LOL  It's not just Garrett.  Outside of QB, the Jets roster is way better.  

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, Dcat said:

"Limitless upside".  LOL  It's not just Garrett.  Outside of QB, the Jets roster is way better.  

For the next 1-2 years, the Jets might have the edge at QB.  But after that, we have to start from scratch at the most important (and most difficult to acquire) position in sports.  Plus we're going to have to start paying all the guys we drafted a couple of years ago, which will make things even more difficult.  The Jets are better positioned for 1-2 years but, after that, there are a ton of question marks.

Meanwhile, SD will still have a young QB (who potentially is a FQB) with more experience.  Plus they'll have a team that is probably built in Harbaugh's image by then (e.g. tough, physical team with a great OL, etc).

 

[nj meadowlands]

5 minutes ago, Dcat said:

"Limitless upside".  LOL  It's not just Garrett.  Outside of QB, the Jets roster is way better.  

With some level of competence, NFL rosters can be rebuilt in a year or two, with pretty much the exceptions of HC and QB

[Raideraholic]

2 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Scenario: Genie pops out of a lamp and offers you a choice—You can either keep everyone currently on the Jets payroll (players, coaching staff, personnel dept, marketing and PR dept, ownership *or* you can swap it all for the Chargers payroll (players, coaches, etc). If you choose to swap, no one knows it happened but you, and Harbaugh, Herbert, etc, all take the place of the Jets group in New Jersey. What do you do? 

No one wants to be a charger . They have no fan base whatsoever in La.  Raiders open up in La this year, and it’s a home game for the Raiders.( will be more Raider fans than Charger fans) .    
Chargers have good head coach who loves to run the football - that minimizes having the franchise Qb somewhat.    
 The chargers will have very good offense line - Harbaugh will make sure of that. 
You think the Jets are snake bitten , the Chargers make the jets look like the luckiest franchise .   What can go wrong , always seem to go wrong for the Chargers.

There owner Dean Spanos makes former Mets owner  Fred coupon Wilson look like current Met owner Steve Cohen.    The chargers are one team even the Jets fan would be glad they aren’t.

chargers aren’t winning anything till they get new owners. The chargers aren’t winning anything with Spanos family. 

[slimjasi]

1 hour ago, Asymmetrical said:

there's a chance I move to southern California in the next few years and I've already decided that I'll adopt the Chargers as my second, local team because it's just a different version of what I already know. Idiot owner, annoying all time great QB in the division, incredible creativity when it comes to blowing it. 

I lived in SD for years. That fanbase talks about a curse much like we do. 

The Jets and the Chargers are f*ck ups in different ways. The Chargers have a long history of building stacked teams only to choke in the playoffs or underachieve so badly that they miss them altogether. The Jets usually just suck. 

[TuscanyTile2]

28 minutes ago, Raideraholic said:

No one wants to be a charger . They have no fan base whatsoever in La.  Raiders open up in La this year, and it’s a home game for the Raiders.( will be more Raider fans than Charger fans) .    
Chargers have good head coach who loves to run the football - that minimizes having the franchise Qb somewhat.    
 The chargers will have very good offense line - Harbaugh will make sure of that. 
You think the Jets are snake bitten , the Chargers make the jets look like the luckiest franchise .   What can go wrong , always seem to go wrong for the Chargers.

There owner Dean Spanos makes former Mets owner  Fred coupon Wilson look like current Met owner Steve Cohen.    The chargers are one team even the Jets fan would be glad they aren’t.

chargers aren’t winning anything till they get new owners. The chargers aren’t winning anything with Spanos family. 

The Chargers do kind of have a black cloud hanging over them.  Even the Jets own them in the postseason.  And there definitely are questions about Herbert (even with as talented as he is).  I do think Harbaugh can be a big part of the solution there though.  We'll see.

I wouldn't be surprised if Harbaugh wants to build a team similar to what the Raiders have been building up.  The Raiders are further along but the Chargers have the better QB (at least until AOC proves something).

Quote

Chargers have good head coach who loves to run the football - that minimizes having the franchise Qb somewhat.    

I don't know that I agree.  It never hurts to have balance and it actually might make Herbert a LOT more effective (plus take some of the pressure off of him).  You can tell already Harbaugh wants to build a nasty OL.  

[Sperm Edwards]

18 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

And I know everyone loves Harbaugh but he wants to ground and pound and just took Alt over Nabers/Odunze.

I still can’t believe he did that. I could understand if he didn’t have a long term LT already, but they’ve already got Slater ffs.

After unloading both of his top 2 WRs, this one really shocked me even with him telegraphing it ahead of time, more or less.

Passing up on a cheap, young WR1 in favor of a RT? The Jets just got a RT for a mid round pick, and solid enough ones are available every offseason as veterans or in the draft. The delta between a Moses-like RT and Alt should be dwarfed by the delta between Nabers/Odunze and a Moses-cheap ($5MM) veteran WR.

McConkey had better be almost on par with those two he passed up.

[Jetsfan80]

Simple.  For the next 5 years I’d rather have Harbaugh/Herbert than Saleh/Rodgers.  But I do get why this poll is close.  The rest of the Jets’ roster is that young and good.  

[bicketybam]

1 hour ago, UntouchableCrew said:

"good one"

I think it's intended to be "going forward." Obviously the Jets are in a better position in 2024. The Chargers are just better set up for long term success with their HC and QB in place.

Thank you 👍 

I'm not 100% sold on Herbert. He's regressed every year he's been in the league. This season will be telling.

Long term you say Harbaugh is the better choice. He lasted 4 years in the NFL the last time and then packed up his toys and went back to college. His last year he went 8-8. He lost 3 huge games in the playoffs. I don't see him as a long term coach in this league. He will go back to college once he realizes he can't get past the Chiefs.

[Warfish]

Our window seems very short with Rodgers, the old O-linemen, Williams, Mosely etc.  

One, maybe two years max IMO, before major changes would be required.

We'll have alot of our best young players to decide on (resign or let go), and several key positions, least of all QB #1 and O-Co, OL and WR #2, to fill to remain competitive post-Rodgers.

Chargers window with Herbert/Harbaugh is much larger, it seems.  The two most important spots are locked down for a few years at least.

I'm 100% good with being the Jets and not the Chargers....for 2024.  

Frankly, it's hard to evaluate/judge the Jets post-2024 right now. 

Too many variables, far far too much uncertainty.  It's possible we could be celebrating a great year and planning for another, or entering another full rebuild.  It really could go either way as of now.

[Maxman]

Jets.

Who needs 82 and sunny every day. 

[bicketybam]

55 minutes ago, Dcat said:

"Limitless upside".  LOL  It's not just Garrett.  Outside of QB, the Jets roster is way better.  

 

14 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

The Chargers do kind of have a black cloud hanging over them.  Even the Jets own them in the postseason.  And there definitely are questions about Herbert (even with as talented as he is).  I do think Harbaugh can be a big part of the solution there though.  We'll see.

I wouldn't be surprised if Harbaugh wants to build a team similar to what the Raiders have been building up.  The Raiders are further along but the Chargers have the better QB (at least until AOC proves something).

I don't know that I agree.  It never hurts to have balance and it actually might make Herbert a LOT more effective (plus take some of the pressure off of him).  You can tell already Harbaugh wants to build a nasty OL.  

Harbaugh won't last more than 4 years. Book it.

[TuscanyTile2]

2 minutes ago, bicketybam said:

Harbaugh won't last more than 4 years. Book it.

That wouldn't surprise me at all.  He's so high-strung that he could easily wear out his welcome in 4 years there.  

[bicketybam]

14 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Simple.  For the next 5 years I’d rather have Harbaugh/Herbert than Saleh/Rodgers.  But I do get why this poll is close.  The rest of the Jets’ roster is that young and good.  

Harbaugh won't be in the NFL 5 years from now.

[bicketybam]

4 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

That wouldn't surprise me at all.  He's so high-strung that he could easily wear out his welcome in 4 years there.  

The better Harbaugh coaches in Baltimore.

[Barry McCockinner]

Chargers have their QB for the next 10 years and a much better coach. I think this is an easy decision.

If the question was isolated to one year I would take the Jets though. I think they clearly have the higher ceiling this year.

[slimjasi]

Tough debate. There are a bunch of factors to consider. The Jets have a better roster right now and should be better this year. The Chargers have Herbert and Harbaugh, which should easily beat old Rodgers and Saleh in the long run. The Chargers also share a division with Mahomes and Reid.  Reid is also 66 and there have been some rumblings of a potential retirement sooner than later. Meanwhile, it's unclear how long Harbaugh will be in LA - he's bounced around (but did just stick in Michigan for a decade). The Jets also have Allen in the division and the Bills have won 4 straight division titles. The Chargers also have virtually no home field advantage and no meaningful fanbase in LA (Maybe Harbuagh changes all that). 

I suppose I'd go with the Chargers, mainly because of Herbert's age and overall potential, but it's close. 

[Lith]

Depends.  If being the Chargers comes with moving to the AFC West, no thanks.  We already spent two decades fighting for 2nd place behind the Patriots dynasty.  I would not want to have to deal with the Chiefs as a Division Rival.  Keep our roster, stay in the AFC East and lets take our chances in a more wide open Division.

[T0mShane]

11 minutes ago, Lith said:

Depends.  If being the Chargers comes with moving to the AFC West, no thanks.  We already spent two decades fighting for 2nd place behind the Patriots dynasty.  I would not want to have to deal with the Chiefs as a Division Rival.  Keep our roster, stay in the AFC East and lets take our chances in a more wide open Division.

For this particular exercise, the Chargers rosters/coaches/execs/etc swap places with the Jets roster/etc. So Justin Herbert, in a Jets uniform, playing at MetLife against the AFCE.

[slimjasi]

16 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

For this particular exercise, the Chargers rosters/coaches/execs/etc swap places with the Jets roster/etc. So Justin Herbert, in a Jets uniform, playing at MetLife against the AFCE.

I guess reading the OP would have helped. That makes the Chargers the obvious choice. 

[TuscanyTile2]

1 hour ago, bicketybam said:

The better Harbaugh coaches in Baltimore.

I probably agree with you but it's awfully close.  Worst case, the "worse Harbaugh" is still an excellent HC.  Jim took an NFL team to the SB (barely losing to his brother) and just won the Natty in college football.  

[UntouchableCrew]

1 hour ago, bicketybam said:

Harbaugh won't be in the NFL 5 years from now.

Bobby Salads may not be a HC in the NFL next year.

[UntouchableCrew]

1 hour ago, bicketybam said:

Thank you 👍 

I'm not 100% sold on Herbert. He's regressed every year he's been in the league. This season will be telling.

Long term you say Harbaugh is the better choice. He lasted 4 years in the NFL the last time and then packed up his toys and went back to college. His last year he went 8-8. He lost 3 huge games in the playoffs. I don't see him as a long term coach in this league. He will go back to college once he realizes he can't get past the Chiefs.

The last time Jim Harbaugh was an NFL coach he went 44-19-1. Three playoff appearances with two Division Titles in four years. 5 playoff wins (4 home playoff games.) NFC Championship, made the NFC Title Game three years running. Never had a losing record.

If a Jets coach accomplished this the homer bridge would be worshipping this dude. Would be the greatest four year stretch in team history. We still talk about Rex because his 9-7 team won a couple of playoff games.

The idea that we're better of with Bob Saleh than Jim Harbaugh is, frankly, insane, and something that nobody other than the most ardent Jets homer would think for even a second. Sure, the guy is intense, rubs some people the wrong way and doesn't stay in one place too long (even though he was at his last stop for 9 years). But there's a very real chance Saleh never coaches another NFL game after next year.

[bicketybam]

16 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I guess reading the OP would have helped. That makes the Chargers the obvious choice. 

Obvious choice? Our roster is better at almost every position and equal at others. Harbaugh won't last 4 years in the NFL. Are you assuming that Harbaugh is going to end up drafting players better than Wilson, Hall, Sauce, and Williams? I mean that's a pretty big leap.

[bicketybam]

15 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I probably agree with you but it's awfully close.  Worst case, the "worse Harbaugh" is still an excellent HC.  Jim took an NFL team to the SB (barely losing to his brother) and just won the Natty in college football.  

No it's not. Baltimore Harbaugh is clearly better. And not the giant dick LAC Harbaugh is.

[PS17]

chargers in a landslide. 

[bicketybam]

14 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Bobby Salads may not be a HC in the NFL next year.

This is true but if the Jets just simply play to their ability, he will be the coach for at least 3 more years after this one which is longer than Harbaugh will be in the NFL.

[bicketybam]

39 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

The last time Jim Harbaugh was an NFL coach he went 44-19-1. Three playoff appearances with two Division Titles in four years. 5 playoff wins (4 home playoff games.) NFC Championship, made the NFC Title Game three years running. Never had a losing record.

If a Jets coach accomplished this the homer bridge would be worshipping this dude. Would be the greatest four year stretch in team history. We still talk about Rex because his 9-7 team won a couple of playoff games.

The idea that we're better of with Bob Saleh than Jim Harbaugh is, frankly, insane, and something that nobody other than the most ardent Jets homer would think for even a second. Sure, the guy is intense, rubs some people the wrong way and doesn't stay in one place too long (even though he was at his last stop for 9 years). But there's a very real chance Saleh never coaches another NFL game after next year.

If he managed that record of accomplishments with Zach Wilson as his QB, I'd worship the sweat that dropped off his balls. Not happening.

[EM31]

Dopey poll threads that do not immediately get shut down by management are a good leading indicator that the thread starter is on the cusp of ascending to godhood/management himself.

Let me be the first to congratulate Tom of this long overdue honor and trust that he will be sparing in the future with the use of the rod as he has been with his acerbic tongue during this last little while

@TomShane

Anyone else buying this?

[UntouchableCrew]

2 minutes ago, EM31 said:

Dopey poll threads that do not immediately get shut down by management are a good leading indicator that the thread starter is on the cusp of ascending to godhood/management himself.

Let me be the first to congratulate Tom of this long overdue honor and trust that he will be sparing in the future with the use of the rod as he has been with his acerbic tongue during this last little while

@TomShane

Anyone else buying this?

What's dopey about this thread? It's an interesting conversation for an NFL message board in June.

[jetblue95]

1 hour ago, bicketybam said:

The better Harbaugh coaches in Baltimore.

 

while that may or may not be true, the 2nd best harbaugh is miles better as a head coach than salah.  proven winner at multiple stops.