New York Jets, Haason Reddick Contract Saga No Longer About Fines. Game checks are now on the line, to the tune of $852,941 for each game missed.

[Bobby816]

20 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

In an effort to prevent risking his career for $850K/game ($14.5MM, including the workout bonus he didn't get, over 17 games), he's going to instead risk it for $280K/game (albeit for fewer games, of course).

If he can just show up for the last 6 games (at $838K) for $5MM total, and his August fines - which still need to get paid - total about $3.5MM, that means he's going to play 6 games for $1.5MM.

If the Jets still make the playoffs with a lower-tread Reddick playing for a major contract, while his cap number ends up in the $5MM range, and then they recoup a 3rd or 4th rounder in 2026 as a comp pick, they couldn't have drawn it up any better if it was planned to happen this way.

I don't know if it's going to play out that way, but if it is then it's quite arguably better than him playing out the full year under his existing deal.

I'd like to say no player and agent are dumb enough to do that. But nothing is surprising me at this point with Reddick's side.

[slats]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

Every year we see otherwise great teams get boned late in the season when they either can’t get a pressure on a crucial third down or their QB gets rushed on a critical play late in a game. That’s why teams pay dudes like Von Miller and Hasson Reddick. That the Jets want to quibble over a few mil for this guy—who they traded for specifically to win them games in December and January—is absurd.

 

34 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Fair. But now add on the Reddick situation- and where did this exactly get the Jets? Just seemed like this was all avoidable. I don’t get the feeling Reddick is showing up before he has to in order to accrue a season.

Looks like you guys have it figured out. Reddick needs to show up at some point, and he’ll need to play at a high level if he wants to get paid. The later he shows up, the fresher his legs will be and the lower his cap number will be, as well. 

[slimjasi]

4 minutes ago, slats said:

 

The later he shows up, the fresher his legs will be and the lower his cap number will be, as well. 

The fresher he will be, yes. 

However, we have also seen guys holdout and then get hurt. It's a mixed-bag. Concerns will remain about his preparedness to play after holding out all summer. 

[Jack Straw]

24 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

In an effort to prevent risking his career for $850K/game ($14.5MM, including the workout bonus he didn't get, over 17 games), he's going to instead risk it for $280K/game (albeit for fewer games, of course).

If he can just show up for the last 6 games (at $838K) for $5MM total, and his August fines - which still need to get paid - total about $3.5MM, that means he's going to play 6 games for $1.5MM.

If the Jets still make the playoffs with a lower-tread Reddick playing for a major contract, while his cap number ends up in the $5MM range, and then they recoup a 3rd or 4th rounder in 2026 as a comp pick, they couldn't have drawn it up any better if it was planned to happen this way.

I don't know if it's going to play out that way, but if it is then it's quite arguably better than him playing out the full year under his existing deal.

You nailed it.

If I were Reddick and I was going through the whole holdout routine, I’d just play weeks 1-6 and then sit out the rest of the year. Why bother coming back in Week 12, only to play in the playoffs at a discounted rate? If the goal is to do the bare minimum to reach free agency, then skip camp, suit up for the first six weeks, and call it a season.

[slats]

2 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

The fresher he will be, yes. 

However, we have also seen guys holdout and then get hurt. It's a mixed-bag. Concerns will remain about his preparedness to play after holding out all summer. 

Injuries are a concern no matter what. I hope he shows up tonight, but I’m not holding my breath. He needs to play and play well if he wants to get paid next year, that’s the bottom line. This whole holdout defies logic, and it will come to a ****ty conclusion for him if he shows up late and gets hurt. 

[#27TheDominator]

50 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

If the Jets are what they’re supposed to be this year they’ll be playing with a lead in the second half. Retaining Huff in a season that’s must win just seemed like an easy decision. 

I don't see tagging a guy that got an AV like $3M less than the tag on the open market as being any more of a no brainer than taking a swing on Reddick with the equivalent of a 5th round pick.  

I agree that the season is "must win."  I disagree that they should act that way.  Spending like drunken sailors to recreate 2015 seems like it would make the GM look bad.  It seems pretty easy to convince the rest of the league that Woody ****ed them - either forcing them with Wilson and/or Rodgers, or meddling with Reddick or 1,000,000 other ways that board has surmised.  I think Idzik, Maccagnan and Gase are the only ones that haven't succeeded with that.  Edwards, Mangini, Rex, Pettine, Bowles and Tannenbaum all got jobs pretty quickly.  Usually at the same level as when they left.  If you spent 30 seconds watching press conferences it is pretty easy to see which guys were unable to properly point the finger elsewhere and why.  They were horrid. 

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

For one year when you have to win? What’s the downside?

The downside?  

What happens this year remains to be seen.  With or without Reddick. 

Whether these guys all get fired if they don't go on a deep playoff run is still not for certain.  

The one thing that is absolutely certain is that next year is coming.  When it does they will be royally ****ed on Gardner, Hall, Wilson, Johnson and AVT if they fold up and pay either Huff or Reddick.  That is for certain.  The rest is conjecture.

[batman10023]

1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

Every negotiation is different from the others.  People understand the situation.  

Joe is going to have to find a way to keep them and likely will because we still don't have a future QB.

There is a tiny window here and I'm really shocked by Jet fans unwillingness to see it.   

your first statement is wrong.

and your last point - i probably would prefer to spend the 14mm on a WR at the trade deadline.   That's better for us for the playoff push.

[Rhg1084]

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

The downside?  

What happens this year remains to be seen.  With or without Reddick. 

Whether these guys all get fired if they don't go on a deep playoff run is still not for certain.  

The one thing that is absolutely certain is that next year is coming.  When it does they will be royally ****ed on Gardner, Hall, Wilson, Johnson and AVT if they fold up and pay either Huff or Reddick.  That is for certain.  The rest is conjecture.

That’s why I can’t see us getting into a long term contract with Reddick. But who knows what’s goes on with salary cap shenanigans. Look how many guys on SF are getting paid

[Matt39]

6 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

The downside?  

What happens this year remains to be seen.  With or without Reddick. 

Whether these guys all get fired if they don't go on a deep playoff run is still not for certain.  

The one thing that is absolutely certain is that next year is coming.  When it does they will be royally ****ed on Gardner, Hall, Wilson, Johnson and AVT if they fold up and pay either Huff or Reddick.  That is for certain.  The rest is conjecture.

The Jets are without Reddick. Which is why I think a one year tag on Huff, who we know can rush the passer, was the easiest and safest move for the Jets to make here. Unless your position is the team is just better off without him on the roster.

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

Fair. But now add on the Reddick situation- and where did this exactly get the Jets? Just seemed like this was all avoidable. I don’t get the feeling Reddick is showing up before he has to in order to accrue a season.

I don't think anybody is arguing that this is working out well.  

I think the arguments are how big of a deal it is if he doesn't come it.  If they should just fold up and pay him.  I personally don't see the big deal if he holds out and I don't think they should pay him. 

The only true downsides to be argued IMO are if this worth the ugly optics (I don't think it is, but things seem to have gone as badly as possible so far) and how much they will miss dumping JFM.  I think they have a decent number of interesting bodies to play the LB sized DE role with Johnson, McDonald, McKinley and McGregor.  That is more where Reddick slots for me. 

I am more worried about losing the DT/DE tweener.  I am not on board with the Clemons being so overrated that they should have cut him gang, but he is not an exciting option.  Watts seems like he might be lowest on the UDFA totem pole and I think Taylor has just played straight DT.  That leaves Clemons and Solomon Thomas.  Still not sure how much a drop that is from JFM.

[batman10023]

1 hour ago, Doggin94it said:

Sauce absolutely will reset the CB market. He's not going to reset it by 150% of the current top CB contract. And if that's what he wants, then he's only going to see that money after 2 seasons playing on the franchise tag.

The WR market was reset this year by 16.6%; the top contract went from 30M AAV (Hill) to 35 (Jefferson). A similar reset to the CB market would take it all the way to 24.5M. There's no universe where he gets to 35 without an intervening jump to at least 28, which isn't going to happen. More likely, Surtain resets it to ~23-24 and Sauce to 25.

after this season the Jets have sauce for 4 more years right?  (last year, 5th year option and 2 franchise tags).   think that comes out to around 80mm (5, 20, 25, 30) over 4 years.   why would they pay significantly more than this?  

[ncjetman]

I don't think anybody is arguing that this is working out well.  
I think the arguments are how big of a deal it is if he doesn't come it.  If they should just fold up and pay him.  I personally don't see the big deal if he holds out and I don't think they should pay him. 
The only true downsides to be argued IMO are if this worth the ugly optics (I don't think it is, but things seem to have gone as badly as possible so far) and how much they will miss dumping JFM.  I think they have a decent number of interesting bodies to play the LB sized DE role with Johnson, McDonald, McKinley and McGregor.  That is more where Reddick slots for me. 
I am more worried about losing the DT/DE tweener.  I am not on board with the Clemons being so overrated that they should have cut him gang, but he is not an exciting option.  Watts seems like he might be lowest on the UDFA totem pole and I think Taylor has just played straight DT.  That leaves Clemons and Solomon Thomas.  Still not sure how much a drop that is from JFM.

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[batman10023]

8 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

The Jets are without Reddick. Which is why I think a one year tag on Huff, who we know can rush the passer, was the easiest and safest move for the Jets to make here. Unless your position is the team is just better off without him on the roster.

has this been your position all along?

i know many wanted him under long term contract but not sure he would have agreed.

[Augustiniak]

28 minutes ago, slats said:

Injuries are a concern no matter what. I hope he shows up tonight, but I’m not holding my breath. He needs to play and play well if he wants to get paid next year, that’s the bottom line. This whole holdout defies logic, and it will come to a ****ty conclusion for him if he shows up late and gets hurt. 

Unless he really thinks that if the jets d can’t get a pass rush and gets lit up by SF that gives him more leverage.  

[#27TheDominator]

6 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

The Jets are without Reddick. Which is why I think a one year tag on Huff, who we know can rush the passer, was the easiest and safest move for the Jets to make here. Unless your position is the team is just better off without him on the roster.

My position is that he wasn't worth the tag.  I stand by it.  Certainly not for this team and the way they use him.  It is safest if you feel like you need another DPR.  My position is they liked the D just fine.  I don't think they look at Huff as a must have and they saw Reddick as an opportunity to score something special.  The risk is minimal, the pay back could be huge.  It still could.  The optics are awful, but how much does that really matter?  The team seems to be fine with how things are playing out.  They seem to have gotten the majority of the public on board with Reddick and his agent flip flopping on what they promised before the deal, so other than you and a few others it isn't such a big deal, even with the NY press pushing pretty hard.

[#27TheDominator]

5 minutes ago, ncjetman said:

 

 

 

 

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Tell us how you really feel!

[Mogglez]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

The fresher he will be, yes. 

However, we have also seen guys holdout and then get hurt. It's a mixed-bag. Concerns will remain about his preparedness to play after holding out all summer. 

If he shows up and immediately gets hurt he either a) turned it into a hold-in which will, likely, make teams he could get paid by wary about his attitude and commitment or b) legitimately got hurt, which will make teams he could get paid by wary about paying him big money by way of a long-term contract because he will be an older pass rusher, coming off an injury, who probably wasn’t all that productive for the Jets.

This is the part that doesn’t make Reddick’s decision to hold out logical.  As of right now, he has done pretty much everything he can possibly do to make sure that he only sets himself up to receive more 1-year “prove it” deals, that are below market value, after this season.  His best bet was always to show up for the Jets, negotiate sweetening his contract for one season, and parlay it into a big deal from the Jets or some other team next year.  This is likely what Joe Douglas was thinking the player and the agent would see clear as day when they traded for him, but Haason, as well as Dandy, both decided to throw sound decision making to the wind after some time with their own thoughts.  Furthermore, what Reddick really should have realized, going way back to when Howie told him that he would just trade him instead of pay him more money, is that his agent really f*cked him over when he negotiated his current contract, as well as every other contract throughout his career, and he should have parted ways with Dandy.

[FidelioJet]

13 minutes ago, batman10023 said:

your first statement is wrong.

So you believe all negotiations to be the same?  And every player and situation are treated equally?  I guess I disagree with that.  I believe each player and situation are completely different.

14 minutes ago, batman10023 said:

i probably would prefer to spend the 14mm on a WR at the trade deadline.   That's better for us for the playoff push.

I get this.  But I think far too many are taking for granted that we won't need the guy early in the season. 

We're talking about a pro-bowl level player at one of the most important positions in the NFL.   Wins and Losses are going to matter early in the season just like the end.    The reason you want an elite pass rusher is because they help you win games and winning games is the goal.

[Matt39]

2 minutes ago, batman10023 said:

has this been your position all along?

i know many wanted him under long term contract but not sure he would have agreed.

Yes for the most part. Rodgers age being the biggest factor 

[Larz]

Going to be fun to bump this thread after a Reddick strip sack wins a playoff game 

[Gaffneycatch81]

2 hours ago, batman10023 said:

agree 100% with this post.

a hold in - the jets wanted him in the building, hold in more cost effective for him, more distracting etc.  so wierd.

he seems like a reasonable guy from what i read of prior to the hold out.  but maybe he's a jerk at the facilities.

there is no way JD can cave here otherwise we have so many guys up for new contracts.

Unless he and his agent calculated all along that it made more sense for him to skip the first 6 games unless he got a multi-year deal from the Jets. It would be very hard to continue a “hold-in” that long, I think (although I don’t know this — is there any precedent for a player staging a hold in and continuing it into the regular season, resulting in him missing a significant part of the regular season? ).

I think there is a good argument that their position starts to make sense from a financial standpoint if they planned all along for him to play about 10 - 12 games this year, and then try to get a big payday in the off season.

1) Reddick ran out of gas for the last few games last year, and playing well in a shortened season would probably get him nearly as much as the full season.

2) Fewer games played means reduced risk of a substantial injury that would greatly reduce his free agent value or end his career.

3) Even with the fines and lost income this year (roughly 8M if he shows up in week 6), he will make that up with a, say, 3 year 66M deal in the offseason.

4) The only scenario that would net him more money would have been for him to show up to all off season and preseason activities, and play in a dominant fashion for the entire season. They may well have calculated that the chances of that were low … and given that the two other scenarios are either equal or worse, they decided from the beginning this would be their plan.

 

[Chewy and the Jets]

52 minutes ago, Jack Straw said:

You nailed it.

If I were Reddick and I was going through the whole holdout routine, I’d just play weeks 1-6 and then sit out the rest of the year. Why bother coming back in Week 12, only to play in the playoffs at a discounted rate? If the goal is to do the bare minimum to reach free agency, then skip camp, suit up for the first six weeks, and call it a season.

Other teams can understand holding out of games looking for more money.  I do not think many would carry that same sentiment if a player tries to game the system by showing up for the first 6 weeks and then quitting on his season and team.    

[bicketybam]

Maybe getting a fresh Reddick later in the season is the best option because the guy all but disappeared in the last 7 games of the season last year as well as the playoff game. He was much better in the beginning of the year.

[nycdan]

1 hour ago, Jack Straw said:

You nailed it.

If I were Reddick and I was going through the whole holdout routine, I’d just play weeks 1-6 and then sit out the rest of the year. Why bother coming back in Week 12, only to play in the playoffs at a discounted rate? If the goal is to do the bare minimum to reach free agency, then skip camp, suit up for the first six weeks, and call it a season.

While it sounds more practical, it basically amounts to the player 'quitting' on his team mid-season.  Antonio Brown is the only guy I know of who ever did that and it ended his career.   Staying away and reporting late is one thing.  Playing early and quitting in the middle sounds like career suicide to me.

[Barry McCockinner]

Redick may see the Trent Williams signing as some pressure on JD he can take advantage of last minute. I don't know when the last date is he can show up to get credit for week one but he may push that to the limit.

Wouldn't surprise me if we don't see him until later in the season either but something to consider.

[batman10023]

28 minutes ago, Gaffneycatch81 said:

Unless he and his agent calculated all along that it made more sense for him to skip the first 6 games unless he got a multi-year deal from the Jets. It would be very hard to continue a “hold-in” that long, I think (although I don’t know this — is there any precedent for a player staging a hold in and continuing it into the regular season, resulting in him missing a significant part of the regular season? ).

I think there is a good argument that their position starts to make sense from a financial standpoint if they planned all along for him to play about 10 - 12 games this year, and then try to get a big payday in the off season.

1) Reddick ran out of gas for the last few games last year, and playing well in a shortened season would probably get him nearly as much as the full season.

2) Fewer games played means reduced risk of a substantial injury that would greatly reduce his free agent value or end his career.

3) Even with the fines and lost income this year (roughly 8M if he shows up in week 6), he will make that up with a, say, 3 year 66M deal in the offseason.

4) The only scenario that would net him more money would have been for him to show up to all off season and preseason activities, and play in a dominant fashion for the entire season. They may well have calculated that the chances of that were low … and given that the two other scenarios are either equal or worse, they decided from the beginning this would be their plan.

 

i meant do a hold in during training camp.  not in the regular season.  

the whole plan on playing 12 games is interesting concept.     that's a big gamble on his part.

not sure anyone is going to offer him 3 yr 21mm each contract at his age.  i guess perhaps a (real) 2 year contract for 40mm would  be possible.   but still think he ends up giving money up.

would be funny if they franchised him after this year. 

[HighPitch]

2 hours ago, mfmartin said:

 

 

I can’t think of a player ever being traded and holding out. That’s on Douglas


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You cant think of another time something like this happened, so its gotta be jds fault?

[Gaffneycatch81]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I don't know if it's going to play out that way, but if it is then it's quite arguably better than him playing out the full year under his existing deal.

I agree with this … if he shows up an plays well for 10-12 games, and the Jets save $5M in cap space (which they could use on a player they trade for at the deadline, or roll into next year), then they also get a comp pick when Reddick leaves next off season, it could work very well for them. Particularly considering that based on last year, he may only have 10-12 good games in his body. The season is a grind, particularly for a 31 year old  — a fresh Reddick for the stretch run at a lower cap may work out great for the Jets.

[mfmartin]

You cant think of another time something like this happened, so its gotta be jds fault?

He traded for a player that everyone knew wanted an adjustment on his contract and after he declines your initial offer, you trade for him and expect him to honor that contract? Yeah that’s on the GM


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[BornJetsFan1983]

37 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

If he shows up and immediately gets hurt he either a) turned it into a hold-in which will, likely, make teams he could get paid by wary about his attitude and commitment or b) legitimately got hurt, which will make teams he could get paid by wary about paying him big money by way of a long-term contract because he will be an older pass rusher, coming off an injury, who probably wasn’t all that productive for the Jets.

This is the part that doesn’t make Reddick’s decision to hold out logical.  As of right now, he has done pretty much everything he can possibly do to make sure that he only sets himself up to receive more 1-year “prove it” deals, that are below market value, after this season.  His best bet was always to show up for the Jets, negotiate sweetening his contract for one season, and parlay it into a big deal from the Jets or some other team next year.  This is likely what Joe Douglas was thinking the player and the agent would see clear as day when they traded for him, but Haason, as well as Dandy, both decided to throw sound decision making to the wind after some time with their own thoughts.  Furthermore, what Reddick really should have realized, going way back to when Howie told him that he would just trade him instead of pay him more money, is that his agent really f*cked him over when he negotiated his current contract, as well as every other contract throughout his career, and he should have parted ways with Dandy.

Alot of players get bad advice which is crazy to me, for one its not like this is some mysterious process and your choices are somehow unique to only that particular player. There have been so many contracts you can see the process and the best choices to give your self the best chance at a pay day and to get that pay day. It does not make any sense what he is doing and he should realize his agent is costing him $$$. 

I would make sure if I was an NFL player to talk to the guys who have got paid and use thier agent, i woudl hire a finacial advisor etc. These dude are nuts

[mfmartin]

Yeah?  Where are you getting the money for Sauce, Garrett, JJ, MCII, and Breece, who I didn’t even initially mention, if you give Reddick a multi-year deal, worth $25 million dollars per year, with the guaranteed money that he’s looking for?  This math lesson from you should be fun.

I’m not even saying paying Reddick long term (I am talking about this year). However, new money on those extensions wouldn’t kick in until 2027 when the Jets cap is free.


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[nycdan]

2 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Redick may see the Trent Williams signing as some pressure on JD he can take advantage of last minute. I don't know when the last date is he can show up to get credit for week one but he may push that to the limit.

Wouldn't surprise me if we don't see him until later in the season either but something to consider.

I'm fairly confident that Week 1 is a non-starter.  There hasn't even been a peep of any contact at all.  I think he's dug in, maybe out of ignorant pride, or maybe out of some very misguided sense of what he thinks might happen, but it is what it is.  Best guess is he's going to ride this out until the last day to report and get credit for the season because I don't see the Jets making any move off of their position, which I find to be 100% reasonable.  

 

[Mogglez]

2 minutes ago, mfmartin said:

 

I’m not even saying paying Reddick long term (I am talking about this year). However, new money on those extensions wouldn’t kick in until 2027 when the Jets cap is free.


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He doesn’t want a one year deal; he wants a multi-year extension that pays him like a top tier pass rusher (around $25mil per year) that’s the whole crux of the issue here.

[mfmartin]

Reddick in the regular season doesn't really add to the Jets win total in any meaningful way. They're not missing the playoffs because he decides to miss 11 games. He was brought here for the playoff run -- so if he's here by week 13, that's fine by me and worth the draft capital + headache.
Reddick got terrible advice along the way. He's going to cost himself money that he's unlikely to recoup in FA. 

I can’t


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