Why we need to continue investing heavily in the defense

[Jetsfan80]

A few JN posters have suggested that, if offense is our biggest problem, we need to devote the majority of our 10 picks in this year's draft on such items as a playmaking RB, a # 2 receiver, a new RT, an interior lineman, and a # 2 TE who can both block and catch.

Seems logical, right?

The problem with this philosophy is the expectation that our two quarterbacks are going to magically become a competent dual-threat under new OC Tony Sparano. If you expect that Sanchez will take the "next step" and that Tebow will be everything the coaching staff wants him to be, then certainly you want to invest in pieces to complement the new system.

However, if they do not do so, then we're merely honoring a sunken cost, and trying to build up a unit that will likely still be a middle-of-the-pack, 17-21 points/game type of offense.

Meanwhile, you can expect the defense to decline, even if only slightly, without a commitment to getting younger. Sure, despite some missing pieces, Rex always coaches a top-5 unit. Why fix something that isn't really broken, you say?

You fix it because its your strongest chance at a Super Bowl. While so many teams in the NFL are building their offenses around a stud QB, we're forced to build around a bottom-3rd QB, and stop these opposing offenses. Want to win a Super Bowl with Sanchez? "Just" Top-5 isn't going to cut it.

In 2009, we were the # 1 defense, and felt that perhaps one day we would have an all-time great defense. Now, 3 of our 4 starting linebackers are long in the tooth, and none of them are fast enough to hang in coverage. We don't currently have a healthy FS, and with Landry's injury concerns, who knows how long it will be until we have to turn to Eric Smith again. And, as has been the case since '09, we still lack a game-changing pass-rusher, despite the surprising resurgence of Aaron Maybin's career.

The bottom line is that we should spend the majority of our draft picks on the defensive side of the ball. We can hang in there for another year with Wayne Hunter at RT, we don't need a # 2 WR with our new focus on ground-and-pound, and its simply not worth it to use a high draft pick on a RB in today's NFL. The offense is probably going to suck regardless, so the ultimate goal should be to build an all-time great defense.

[Greenseed4]

I can dig it.

But at some point our "all-world" defense is going to want a breather. Having a 3-and-out offense isn't going to provide that. I think we can make our current defense better by just adding a couple pieces, and then keeping them off the field.

[RutgersJetFan]

I actually think our D this year is going to be pretty beastly. We're a linebacker or two away from it actually being able to carry the offense to the playoffs. In terms of secondaries and d-lines I'll put us up against anyone in the league. At this point we just need someone coming up who'll be able to take over Scott's occupier position after this year and someone that isn't Maybin on the outside. I'm hoping that Ellis comes around this season but my gut tells me it's going to be 2013. I think Harris rebounds nicely this season too with a full offseason, off-year for him last year.

[Gastineau Lives]

The problem is that we weren't middle of the pack.

I think it's a dangerous game you play when you plan on winning 13-10 every week.

Abandoning the offense because, hey, they suck means that they will continue to do so for years to come.

There must be some semblance of balance, no?

[JustInFudge]

Meh, I dont think you should completely avoid investing in the offense just because our QB's suck. Eventually, the Jets will be either looking for a new Qb or ecstatic that one of these 2 panned out and it would be doing the entire team a disservice to not build the offense. The team still needs to look at WR opposite Holmes and someone to block on the strong side. However, the truth is, it probably doesnt matter if our QB's still suck. But ignoring is the wrong thing to do. Especially because I truly believe Rex is the ultimate difference maker.

That said, I do think the majority of this draft should be used on getting younger and faster at the LB'er position. And its not just because of need, its because of value. You cant teach youth, size and speed so you must draft for it. The Jets have given themselves flexibility in the draft and they have a ton of picks. They need to use those picks to get impact players.

I like the idea of trading up to secure the players you like. There is no reason the Jets shouldnt come away from this draft with 3 impact players. They are in the right position and have enough picks to wheel and deal on draft day.

[bitonti]

You fix it because its your strongest chance at a Super Bowl.

that's what they are gonna do, but the last time a non elite QB won the big one was 2003 Brad Johnson with the Bucs. Before that the Ravens and before that the Redskins in the late 80s.

basically once every 10 year a ball control non elite QB team wins the SB. It's not really a great plan. The offense needs to improve for the Jets to be anything but a long shot.

[New York Mick]

I agree our offense is pretty much sh*t so we might as well get the defense as strong as possible, it's the only chance we have to win.

[BurnleyJet]

Defence "Used" To Win Championships.

[bitonti]

generally speaking, every year the league becomes more about Qbs and scoring. First off you can't run Sportscenter highlights of a 9-6 defensive struggle. Second, look at the billion dollar fantasy football market. These people demand stats. Now a days there's a 2 foot window where defenders can hit the QB and it's all designed to make 38-35 OT contests.

[JetsFanInDenver]

So we have mediocre defense. An offense that struggles with a QB simmering controversy and last season even our special teams were not worth talking about. And yet are so close to the cap. Me thinks we should invest in a new GM that can scout and knows how to negotiate!

[#27TheDominator]

I think the problem is that the D is already pretty damn good. I'm pretty much with RJF on that. With an excellent D, there is no guarantee that even excellent 3rd and 4th round picks are going to start. I'd say add pieces to the D, but the O can use the shotgun approach. There are more slots to be had for offensive players. On D I am good with Maybin as a situational. I'd like to add a decent tier LB and a safety. IMO the main difference between the 2009 D and the 2011 D was the lack of Jenkins in the middle and some extra gambling for turnovers. If Ellis pans out that could make a huge difference.

[stoicsentry]

A few JN posters have suggested that, if offense is our biggest problem, we need to devote the majority of our 10 picks in this year's draft on such items as a playmaking RB, a # 2 receiver, a new RT, an interior lineman, and a # 2 TE who can both block and catch.

Seems logical, right?

The problem with this philosophy is the expectation that our two quarterbacks are going to magically become a competent dual-threat under new OC Tony Sparano. If you expect that Sanchez will take the "next step" and that Tebow will be everything the coaching staff wants him to be, then certainly you want to invest in pieces to complement the new system.

However, if they do not do so, then we're merely honoring a sunken cost, and trying to build up a unit that will likely still be a middle-of-the-pack, 17-21 points/game type of offense.

Meanwhile, you can expect the defense to decline, even if only slightly, without a commitment to getting younger. Sure, despite some missing pieces, Rex always coaches a top-5 unit. Why fix something that isn't really broken, you say?

You fix it because its your strongest chance at a Super Bowl. While so many teams in the NFL are building their offenses around a stud QB, we're forced to build around a bottom-3rd QB, and stop these opposing offenses. Want to win a Super Bowl with Sanchez? "Just" Top-5 isn't going to cut it.

In 2009, we were the # 1 defense, and felt that perhaps one day we would have an all-time great defense. Now, 3 of our 4 starting linebackers are long in the tooth, and none of them are fast enough to hang in coverage. We don't currently have a healthy FS, and with Landry's injury concerns, who knows how long it will be until we have to turn to Eric Smith again. And, as has been the case since '09, we still lack a game-changing pass-rusher, despite the surprising resurgence of Aaron Maybin's career.

The bottom line is that we should spend the majority of our draft picks on the defensive side of the ball. We can hang in there for another year with Wayne Hunter at RT, we don't need a # 2 WR with our new focus on ground-and-pound, and its simply not worth it to use a high draft pick on a RB in today's NFL. The offense is probably going to suck regardless, so the ultimate goal should be to build an all-time great defense.

I see what you mean. Convincing argument.

I think what you can do is sign Braylon to play the #2 and roll the dice there, maybe you draft a 2nd day RB and a couple beasts for the line in the 2nd day too.

That way, first day can be devoted to FS and OLB. Hell, I wouldn't be opposed to taking *2* OLB's on day 1. Safety is a weak class this year, not much out there besides the dude from Alabama.

[faba]

Pass rush and offensive line- build from the foundation- the lines

[stoicsentry]

So we have mediocre defense. An offense that struggles with a QB simmering controversy and last season even our special teams were not worth talking about. And yet are so close to the cap. Me thinks we should invest in a new GM that can scout and knows how to negotiate!

The Jets have a medicore defense? LOL. What are you talking about? Top 5 in the league, 3 years running.

[stoicsentry]

Pass rush and offensive line- build from the foundation- the lines

Jets really don't need any defensive linemen, though.

Wilkerson - young. Pouha - good player, getting up there in age, but has his replacement right behind him in Ellis. DeVito isn't exactly ancient, he'll be 28 this season.

Only spot you can upgrade there is DeVito, but who knows is a drafted DE will take much time from him, he's pretty solid. Would rather draft an OLB who will take Thomas' starting spot. Or an FS, for that matter.

Offensive line though yeah we definitely need an RT.

[CrazyCarl40]

Makes sense. Give the QBs crap to work with and hope for the best.

[Pac]

that's what they are gonna do, but the last time a non elite QB won the big one was 2003 Brad Johnson with the Bucs. Before that the Ravens and before that the Redskins in the late 80s.

basically once every 10 year a ball control non elite QB team wins the SB. It's not really a great plan. The offense needs to improve for the Jets to be anything but a long shot.

Eli was not an "elite" qb when they won in 07'. Big Benhameen is not an elite qb.

Brady and Peyton are about as elite as they come and have won "only" 2 of the last 8 SB's.

[JustInFudge]

generally speaking, every year the league becomes more about Qbs and scoring. First off you can't run Sportscenter highlights of a 9-6 defensive struggle. Second, look at the billion dollar fantasy football market. These people demand stats. Now a days there's a 2 foot window where defenders can hit the QB and it's all designed to make 38-35 OT contests.

Meh, college Football is still about defense hence why the SEC win the National Championships every year. Those teams that score 40pts a game face an SEC D and get shut down.

[JustInFudge]

Pass rush and offensive line- build from the foundation- the lines

Agreed, You win and lose at the LOS.

[Jetsfan80]

that's what they are gonna do, but the last time a non elite QB won the big one was 2003 Brad Johnson with the Bucs. Before that the Ravens and before that the Redskins in the late 80s.

basically once every 10 year a ball control non elite QB team wins the SB. It's not really a great plan. The offense needs to improve for the Jets to be anything but a long shot.

But we don't have an elite QB, so trying to build around Sanchez is an effort in futility.

[stoicsentry]

that's what they are gonna do, but the last time a non elite QB won the big one was 2003 Brad Johnson with the Bucs.

Bessides the obvious cases of Manning, Brady, Rodgers and so on... what makes a QB 'elite'? Winning a Superbowl? The logic is circular.

[bitonti]

Bessides the obvious cases of Manning, Brady, Rodgers and so on... what makes a QB 'elite'? Winning a Superbowl? The logic is circular.

it's like the definition of obscenity you know it when you see it. Eli was elite last year, as was Big Ben, Brees, Warner in their years.

[JetsFanInDenver]

The Jets have a medicore defense? LOL. What are you talking about? Top 5 in the league, 3 years running.

Ahhh.....great defenses are supposed to give up 95 yard game winning drives, and give up 37 pts by a division opponent at home and look clueless as they did against Philly.

[stoicsentry]

Ahhh.....great defenses are supposed to give up 95 yard game winning drives, and give up 37 pts by a division opponent at home and look clueless as they did against Philly.

That's fine but then the problem is what defense isn't mediocre by that definition? Which team has a defense where you can't cherry pick a few bad games?

I mean the Patriots only got 17 pts. against the Steelers and again only 17 pts. against the Giants. Does that mean their offense is mediocre?

[T0mShane]

You give Sanchez a real tight end, a back who can catch and a right tackle that doesn't suck and maybe a WR that doesn't lay down like a dog and he'll be a better QB. The offensive personnel is pathetic on this team. Granted, Sanchez doesn't help matters, but I don't know how many QBs would be successful with POSs like Holmes and Burress comparing THC counts instead of playing football.

[stoicsentry]

it's like the definition of obscenity you know it when you see it. Eli was elite last year, as was Big Ben, Brees, Warner in their years.

If we're just going with "gut feel" here, I can't put Eli and Big Ben in the same category as Peyton and Brady. A truly elite QB like Peyton or Brady make their team a Superbowl contender by their mere presence. Eli and Big Ben don't do that and therefore, aren't elite.

That's why I think QB play is overrated. You don't need an elite QB to win. You just need a solid QB that you can pair with a quality team - maybe an elite defense, or maybe a solid defense with a solid running game. The Giants and Steelers play like this - solid QB + defense. That's what's winning them superbowls, not their elite QB's.

As proof of this, think about the Giants past two titles against the Pats. Did they win because of QB play? No, not really. They won because Eli was "good enough" and their defense held the elite Patriots offense below 20 points each time.

Hm, how about that? Defense wins championships.

[bitonti]

If we're just going with "gut feel" here, I can't put Eli and Big Ben in the same category as Peyton and Brady. A truly elite QB like Peyton or Brady make their team a Superbowl contender by their mere presence. Eli and Big Ben don't do that and therefore, aren't elite.

I wonder how many people know that Eli was the most pressured QB in the league last year, by far... he had almost 100 more pressure situations than Sanchez. He's wildly underrated. His left tackle is basically a guard.

Having an Eli definitely makes the rest of the team step up their game. and he throws outstanding passes, that put his WR in situations where they can make plays.

also should be noted Eli was a 1 overall pick. that's a good first step toward being elite.

[#27TheDominator]

If we're just going with "gut feel" here, I can't put Eli and Big Ben in the same category as Peyton and Brady. A truly elite QB like Peyton or Brady make their team a Superbowl contender by their mere presence. Eli and Big Ben don't do that and therefore, aren't elite.

That's why I think QB play is overrated. You don't need an elite QB to win. You just need a solid QB that you can pair with a quality team - maybe an elite defense, or maybe a solid defense with a solid running game. The Giants and Steelers play like this - solid QB + defense. That's what's winning them superbowls, not their elite QB's.

As proof of this, think about the Giants past two titles against the Pats. Did they win because of QB play? No, not really. They won because Eli was "good enough" and their defense held the elite Patriots offense below 20 points each time.

Hm, how about that? Defense wins championships.

Talk about circular logic. The Giants defense sucked. Bottom of the barrel in points and yards. They came up big at the end, but if the Jets D was mediocre the Giants were atrocious. Or were you being sarcastic?

[T0mShane]

I wonder how many people know that Eli was the most pressured QB in the league last year, by far... he had almost 100 more pressure situations than Sanchez. He's wildly underrated. His left tackle is basically a guard.

Having an Eli definitely makes the rest of the team step up their game. and he throws outstanding passes, that put his WR in situations where they can make plays.

also should be noted Eli was a 1 overall pick. that's a good first step toward being elite.

The Giants are 4-12 last year without Eli.

[JetsFanInDenver]

That's fine but then the problem is what defense isn't mediocre by that definition? Which team has a defense where you can't cherry pick a few bad games?

I mean the Patriots only got 17 pts. against the Steelers and again only 17 pts. against the Giants. Does that mean their offense is mediocre?

As a JETS fan I do not care what other defenses are doing or not doing. But the key is our defense broke down at crucial points in the game last season even in games where they performed well for the most part. Like the game against Broncos and Giants. And in some games they looked outright sloppy.

You can grade them at B-. But definitely not A+.

And when you are near the cap you better be great at some part of the game. Thats the least expectation one can have.

[bitonti]

As a JETS fan I do not care what other defenses are doing or not doing. But the key is our defense broke down at crucial points in the game last season even in games where they performed well for the most part. Like the game against Broncos and Giants. And in some games they looked outright sloppy.

I agree with this the defense does need to get better. but again I think alot of it falls on the offense. For example if they go 3 and out over and over, these guys are spent on defense by the 4th Q.

for example the Denver game teh defense busted their asses all game long, and on the road, in the thin air, on short rest (it was a Thursday night game they played on Sunday previous). they just didn't have anything left. I can't fault the D for giving up 20 points on the road in those conditions. In this league, that's a very good effort. The days of teh doomsday defenses shutting teams out, they are gone. A very good defense needs an offense to have it's back.

the special teams are not blameless either. they had 6 turnovers, conley had some punts so short they were basically turnovers. Sanchez had 26, unless they go directly into a TD that puts them on a short field and puts them under pressure.

[SenorGato]

D's going to be carrying the team next year anyway...anything they get out the offense is gravy...I say sink or swim with this offensive talent plus a couple of mid and late rounders and build an elite defense. There's some really nice mid-round talent at WR anyway...would love Jarius Wright here and he's not even tall.

[CTM]

Eli was not an "elite" qb when they won in 07'. Big Benhameen is not an elite qb.

Brady and Peyton are about as elite as they come and have won "only" 2 of the last 8 SB's.

Big Rape is so elite.. fool

[SenorGato]

Isn't Rivers pretty much the last of the consistently highly productive crop of QBs? Romo, maybe?

[Lizard King]

Eli was not an "elite" qb when they won in 07'. Big Benhameen is not an elite qb.

Brady and Peyton are about as elite as they come and have won "only" 2 of the last 8 SB's.

Interesting example you use there. 07 was defense and 12 was offense