POLL: Given the opportunity, which one of these events in Jets' history would you change?

[sackdance]

20 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Talk about a LONG overdue poll!

The Jets are to this topic what the Yankees are to baseball.

[greenwichjetfan]

21 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

If you are going to do that, than rather than fire Parcells, what makes more sense is keeping Belichick as HC in 1997 and never trading 4 draft picks for Parcells.  This way you have Belichick AND the 4 draft picks. 

Please elaborate. I don’t think you can keep something you don’t have, and we never had Belichick without Parcells. So in order to retain Belichick as HC, Parcells would need to be fired and Belichick promoted.

Once again, I’m good with my original post.

8 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

Easy. Fire the overrated, fat Tuna after ‘97 and promote Belichick.

In this scenario, Hess isn’t looking to sell yet, so Belichick accepts and guarantees the 2nd greatest prospect of all time the #1 overall selection. Peyton and Belichick go on to become the GOATs at their positions just like they did in real life, except in this scenario, they accomplish is all in green and white.

 

[rangerous]

20 hours ago, Savage69 said:

Then how about we leave Bill as the HC as he was in 1997 and not bring in the Tuna? The Tuna said he was only going to coach for 3 years think about how things may have been different.. 

interesting point.  i'm not sure if bellichicken was mentally prepared to be head coach again after he got launched by the browns.  maybe but his note to the jets suggests he needed some hand holding.

[nyjunc]

Marino over O'Brien: I have little doubt we see at least one super bowl.  We had a young, talented team that was just less than 30 minutes from the SB a few months before that 1983 draft.

Favre: I think favre would have struggled here like he did in Atlanta. He went to the perfect situation in GB to help develop him.

Belichick stays: assuming he drafts Brady here the dynasty is ours and we are defending BB and Brady from other fans whining about cheating.  If he doesn't draft Brady he's fired within 3 years.

Jets draft Peyton: we had our most successful run in team history during 1998-2010 which were mostly prime peyton years.  We see a SB and could win a SB with Peyton.

Drafting Brady: same deal as Peyton though we'd have better chances to win SBs as we wouldn't have to face Brady twice a year.

Drafting Wilson: with the inept coaches and GM's we have had Russell would have struggled here.  Fans would have run him out of town within 2 years just like they would have with favre.

Jets draft LT: LT changed the game and the Giants franchise.  The Giants had not made playoffs since 1963, LT willed them as a rookie and could you imagine LT with gastineau and Klecko on the same D?

Draft Rice over Toon: people forget how great Toon was before obrien destroyed him with all the high passes to get him concussions.  I don't think Rice makes a great impact here as far as SBs.

 

[nyjunc]

6 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

Please elaborate. I don’t think you can keep something you don’t have, and we never had Belichick without Parcells. So in order to retain Belichick as HC, Parcells would need to be fired and Belichick promoted.

Once again, I’m good with my original post.

 

Fire Parcells after 97 to promote a failed HC who didn't see success until the greatest QB of all time became his QB?  Ok?

[rangerous]

5 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

Please elaborate. I don’t think you can keep something you don’t have, and we never had Belichick without Parcells. So in order to retain Belichick as HC, Parcells would need to be fired and Belichick promoted.

Once again, I’m good with my original post.

 

the bellichicken was named interim head coach shortly before they hired parcells.  no telling what the contract terms were but he was head coach briefly.

[nyjunc]

20 hours ago, Savage69 said:

Then how about we leave Bill as the HC as he was in 1997 and not bring in the Tuna? The Tuna said he was only going to coach for 3 years think about how things may have been different.. 

The franchise doesn't get turned around, we don't see the best stretch of Jets football in team history.

Do people not realize what BB was like pre Brady?  People that complain about Gase or Rex, do they realize they have better careers as HCs than BB does without the greatest QB of all time?

[JetsFanatic]

8 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

Please elaborate. I don’t think you can keep something you don’t have, and we never had Belichick without Parcells. So in order to retain Belichick as HC, Parcells would need to be fired and Belichick promoted.

Once again, I’m good with my original post.

 

We had Belichick PRIOR to Parcells. He was hired as HC until Parcell's contract with NE expired. The Jets ended up trading 4 draft picks to get him sooner.

 

[nyjunc]

9 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

We had Belichick PRIOR to Parcells. He was hired as HC until Parcell's contract with NE expired. The Jets ended up trading 4 draft picks to get him sooner.

 

You realize the he was never going to coach before BP, right? That was a scam to get BP out of his contract so he could couch here.

No one wanted BB to coach the team and no one was sad when BB quit after the 99 season.  BB didn't become the HC BB we know until the greatest QB of all time became his starter.

[JetsFanatic]

2 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

You realize the he was never going to coach before BP, right? That was a scam to get BP out of his contract so he could couch here.

No one wanted BB to coach the team and no one was sad when BB quit after the 99 season.  BB didn't become the HC BB we know until the greatest QB of all time became his starter.

I agree with you, I'm responding to another poster who claims Belichick was not here prior to Parcells. I don't believe Belichick would have had the success here he had with NE do to Brady.

[nyjunc]

2 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

I agree with you, I'm responding to another poster who claims Belichick was not here prior to Parcells. I don't believe Belichick would have had the success here he had with NE do to Brady.

That was a crazy but fun time that led to the franchise finally being turned around.  I wish BP could have stayed long term but that's not what he was about, he lived turning franchises around and then leaving.  I just wish he let BB know so he could have stayed and drafted Brady here.  Of all the what ifs in our history, we were so close to having this incredible NE dynasty ?

[TuscanyTile2]

3 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

That's a strange and irrelevant take to say the least. Marino was head and shoulders above all three. If you lived those years as I did, it was a no brainer. Marino was HOF. Just a great QB. 

Obviously Marino is worlds better than Eason.  I was just trying to say Eason wasn't a washout, while taking a cheap shot at the Dolphins. 

[TuscanyTile2]

I'm really starting to think Brett Favre is underrated by fans.  The guy was a 3 time NFL MVP and was having great seasons late in his career.

[nyjunc]

19 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I'm really starting to think Brett Favre is underrated by fans.  The guy was a 3 time NFL MVP and was having great seasons late in his career.

Brett was great no doubt but he was a gunslinger who could throw you out of a game.  He wasn't a great postseason QB which Knicks him down for me.

[Alka]

On 5/17/2020 at 12:17 PM, JetsFanatic said:

The obvious answer is Marino, he was on the board and we passed him for a Division II QB. Ridiculous move. 

Of course, you are correct.  I was thinking the same thing.  I kept on hoping during the draft that Marino would fall to us, and he did.  But, the Jets being the Jets, picked Ken O'Brien for goodness sake.  

To this day, I shake my head.

[Jetsfan80]

On 5/17/2020 at 1:14 PM, Nixhead said:

Im not so sure Belichick is as successful without Brady and Im not so sure Brady is as great as he's been without Belichick - it was the perfect storm - so I didn't go with either of those picks. 

Plus cheating.  You would need Ernie Adams too.  That was a triumvirate, not a duo.

[nyjunc]

13 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Plus cheating.  You would need Ernie Adams too.  That was a triumvirate, not a duo.

Ernie Adams:

Patriots 1975-1978

Giants 1979-1985

Browns 1991-1995

 

Isn't it amazing how none of those teams even made a Conference Championship Game?

 

Then Ernie went to NE in 2000 where he's been ever since and amazingly in 2000 and the first 2 games of 2001 the Patriots were 5-13 then something happened week 3 of 2001. I guess that's when the cheating started?

[chirorob]

On 5/17/2020 at 11:50 AM, peekskill68 said:

I wonder what happens with Marino under center in 86 when we start 10-1, lose 5 in a row, back into the playoffs, beat KC and then lose to Cleveland in the Gastineau game?

All things being even, figure they have to at least be in the SB that year.

[chirorob]

On 5/17/2020 at 11:41 AM, Savage69 said:

Really?? He had no game starts and threw just 4 passes that whole season..Next year he was with the Packers..

The story is he was out partying, and not taking things seriously.   You never know, but he needed a good stable HC, which is what he got with Holmgren, and what he would have never had on the Jets.

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

10 hours ago, nyjunc said:

 

Belichick stays: assuming he drafts Brady here the dynasty is ours and we are defending BB and Brady from other fans whining about cheating.  If he doesn't draft Brady he's fired within 3 years.

 

Drafting Brady: same deal as Peyton though we'd have better chances to win SBs as we wouldn't have to face Brady twice a year.

 

 

I think you are giving Belichick too much credit for Brady.  Absent the Moe Lewis hit on Bledsoe, I'm not sure Brady ever sees the field as a starting QB in NE.  If Belichick though so highly of Brady, he would not wait until round 6.  I think the Pats stumbled on Brady.  

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

I think it is pretty guaranteed the Jets win a SB during the Manning era if they drafted him #1 in 1997.  The Jets had some very good teams in 98,99, 02, 04 09, 10 .......  Manning would have led one or more of those teams to a title. No other move is a surer bet to a title than that, in my opinion.

[T0mShane]

Peyton Manning was a massive choke artist and soft-boy whom you all would have excoriated worse than Pennington.

[Ian Fleming]

Drafting Manning or Marino. The rest of the options were players who required various levels of coaching and patience that contemporary  Jet coaching/ FO regimes did not have. These QBs would have been decisive.
 

Farve on a Coslet/ Carrol/ Kotite coached team I doubt would have produced the same result as Holmgren/ Mariucci, etc. LT would have joined the Sack Exchange and likely made a good D likely into merely a very good unit.

Marino paired with McNeil and that great WR corps of the ‘80’s would have been prolific. Manning paired with the Parcells D and run-game emphasis would have given him the team balance he lacked with the Colts.

[Sonny Werblin]

So tired of the Kenny O hate. 

Marino had Shula on his sideline, yet division II Kenny O still managed to lead his dysfunctional jets to a winning record over Marino. Why’s that? Must be because Kenny O sucked? 

I’m not saying Kenny O was better than Marino. He wasn’t. But he was damned good.

[Philc1]

Bill Parcells telling a College Junior Peyton Manning to take a hike 

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

Peyton Manning was a massive choke artist and soft-boy whom you all would have excoriated worse than Pennington.

Huh?

[Ian Fleming]

23 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

So tired of the Kenny O hate. 

Marino had Shula on his sideline, yet division II Kenny O still managed to lead his dysfunctional jets to a winning record over Marino. Why’s that? Must be because Kenny O sucked? 

I’m not saying Kenny O was better than Marino. He wasn’t. But he was damned good.

I liked O’B, but he consistently had what I thought were better teams than the Dolphins and after ‘86, for some reason he lost his ability to play at high levels consistently.

Marino compensated for Shula’s chronic inability to obtain talent and coaching, especially on defense. He likely extended Shula’s career by about 5-6 years.

[Philc1]

2 minutes ago, Ian Fleming said:

I liked O’B, but he consistently had what I thought were better teams than the Dolphins and after ‘86, for some reason he lost his ability to play at high levels consistently.

Marino compensated for Shula’s chronic inability to obtain talent and coaching, especially on defense.

From what I remember those Dolphins teams Marino was on weren’t good

 

Once Jimmy Johnson got there he put together a good roster but Marino was an old statue by then

 

[Ian Fleming]

2 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

From what I remember those Dolphins teams Marino was on weren’t good

 

Once Jimmy Johnson got there he put together a good roster but Marino was an old statue by then

 

Johnson wanted to get rid of Marino both as vestige of the Shula regime he replaced and as trade fodder to get more picks. Team ownership resisted that plan, I believe further disillusioning Johnson, who was in a “win now” through the draft mode. This is probably why Johnson quit after he and Marino were humiliated in thier 62-7 playoff destruction in Jacksonville 

[nyjunc]

13 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

I think you are giving Belichick too much credit for Brady.  Absent the Moe Lewis hit on Bledsoe, I'm not sure Brady ever sees the field as a starting QB in NE.  If Belichick though so highly of Brady, he would not wait until round 6.  I think the Pats stumbled on Brady.  

My point was if BB has his same staff in place here then he drafts Brady and the NE dynasty is ours.

13 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

I think it is pretty guaranteed the Jets win a SB during the Manning era if they drafted him #1 in 1997.  The Jets had some very good teams in 98,99, 02, 04 09, 10 .......  Manning would have led one or more of those teams to a title. No other move is a surer bet to a title than that, in my opinion.

He definitely increases our chances but in both his SB winning runs his D's were great. Would that have happened here?  1998 was our best year and he was a rookie plus Vinny played well in Denver.  Wouldn't have mattered

I think 1999 was the big year, plug him in and we are 12-4/13-3.  The question though is could be get it done in January? It took him so many years to win a playoff game.

2000 same deal, we make the playoffs with Peyton.

2001 Vinny wasn't good and we win more with Peyton but the playoffs loss they allowed 38.

2002 Chad was great.

I think our best chances would have been 99, 00, 08-11.  We get at least one in those years

[nyjunc]

10 hours ago, Ian Fleming said:

Johnson wanted to get rid of Marino both as vestige of the Shula regime he replaced and as trade fodder to get more picks. Team ownership resisted that plan, I believe further disillusioning Johnson, who was in a “win now” through the draft mode. This is probably why Johnson quit after he and Marino were humiliated in thier 62-7 playoff destruction in Jacksonville 

Remember that Jimmy quit after 1998, he had to be convinced to come back and I think his 99 season was like favre 08 for us- he didn't want to be there.

Marino was expected to retire after 99, I don't think he did it never of the loss.

[Jet Nut]

On 5/18/2020 at 7:59 AM, greenwichjetfan said:

Yes. In case you don’t understand the thread, the basic idea is what would we change in history after having the added benefit of knowing what we know now. Doesn’t matter what the situation was at the time.

Knowing today that Parcells didn’t do anything worthwile in the NFL after ‘97 except blow a 10 point lead in the AFCCG, and knowing that Peyton turned into a GOAT QB and Belichick into a GOAT coach, and going back in time to pinpoint the one event that could have landed us both, I’m very happy with my original post.

Well then why not just hire Belichick and hand him the keys?

Why would you waste your time with Parcells at all?  Why give away draft picks to bring Parcells in only to dump him for a coach who was available at that time instead of one who had a HC gig?

[nyjunc]

11 hours ago, Sonny Werblin said:

So tired of the Kenny O hate. 

Marino had Shula on his sideline, yet division II Kenny O still managed to lead his dysfunctional jets to a winning record over Marino. Why’s that? Must be because Kenny O sucked? 

I’m not saying Kenny O was better than Marino. He wasn’t. But he was damned good.

He was drafted to a young, talented team that was less than a half from the SB months earlier and he never won a single playoff game.  His backup did win a playoff game though.

I don't hate Kenny, he was one of my favorites as a kid but looking back with more knowledge as an adult he just wasn't very good and held the team back in most years.

He played well against Miami, if only he played as well against other teams.

[nyjunc]

On 5/18/2020 at 7:59 AM, greenwichjetfan said:

Yes. In case you don’t understand the thread, the basic idea is what would we change in history after having the added benefit of knowing what we know now. Doesn’t matter what the situation was at the time.

Knowing today that Parcells didn’t do anything worthwile in the NFL after ‘97 except blow a 10 point lead in the AFCCG, and knowing that Peyton turned into a GOAT QB and Belichick into a GOAT coach, and going back in time to pinpoint the one event that could have landed us both, I’m very happy with my original post.

It was Belichick's D that blew the 10 point lead in the 1998 AFC Championship which is something BB D's have been known for through the years.  Unfortunately for BB and us he didn't have Brady to save the day after that defensive choke.

[JetsFanatic]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Well then why not just hire Belichick and hand him the keys?

Why would you waste your time with Parcells at all?  Why give away draft picks to bring Parcells in only to dump him for a coach who was available at that time instead of one who had a HC gig?

I made that exact same point.